I DID NOT buy a 2010 GMC Yukon because of my 2003 Yukon. I bought a 2010 Mazda CX-9 instead.
Just out of curiosity, if you still needed the size/cargo/towing capacity of the Yukon and wanted a more direct replacement (Sequoia, Armada, Expedition, etc) what do you think you would have gotten?
I will fess up that one reason I hold on to my aging (and none-too-well) '85 Silverado, rather than replace it with a newer GM truck, is that I've heard horror stories about that 4L60E transmission that the half-ton models use. And I see how my uncle's '97 Silverado is aging. My '85 is getting rust pretty bad in the body, but the frame and major structural stuff is still solid. In contrast, the body on my uncle's truck has very minor rust, but underneath, it's getting kinda scary looking. Plus there's the two transmissions it ate, the $900 fuel pump (I think that's what it cost, but memory's getting fuzzy), several coolant leaks, major brake work, etc. More money has probably been sunk into his '97 over the 14 years he's had it than what's gone into my '85 over the 26 years that it's been around passed down from my Granddad, through Grandmom to my Mom, and then on to me.
I guess, if I found a used Chevy/GMC of newer vintage, that seemed well taken care of and was a reasonable price, I might be willing to take a chance. But I'd probably be leery until it proved itself.
Just out of curiosity, if you still needed the size/cargo/towing capacity of the Yukon and wanted a more direct replacement (Sequoia, Armada, Expedition, etc) what do you think you would have gotten?
The Sequoia. Neighbor had one and was very pleased. We need the seating capacity and the CX-9 was the best perfomer for 7-seaters for the money.
Your story hits home to me as I am not convinced trucks are such high quality at GM. Makes sense that the F150 outsells GM PU's. My Dad bought a '79 1/2 ton which my 'Bro still has but never uses anymore. Had to throw in a rebuilty engine/tranny in the '90's sometime. After my Yukon experience, water pump/A/C compressor/Air shock/MAP sensor/Air Bag sensor/Battery drain/Speedometer Issue, why not try ANY OTHER BRAND? Not to mention when I traded it (92K miles), heard a hint of trouble brewing in the front differential! :surprise:
I don't know what I'll replace my '85 Silverado with when the time comes. I've actually toyed with the idea of simply retireing it without replacement. It's not all that often that I really need a truck anymore, and if I did, I could probably just rent one. Plus, not having a truck would get me off the hook in some situations. For example, this morning, I took an old deep-freezer, barbecue grille, and some trash to the dump for a friend's mother. If I was truck-less, I wouldn't get called on for that kind of stuff! :P
...I'd much rather support a plant in the north or midwest where workers are still beaten up for the sins of decades ago. You know what they say about reality lagging perception by twenty years.
I'm not about to start favoring one state vs. another. IMHO it's a great strength of this country that states can compete with each other through their tax and labor policies. It keeps the entire country on its feet, and provides internal competition which strengthens us all. If the north or midwest can't compete with the south, then perhaps some policy changes are in order.
Are you suggesting another Period of Unpleasantness like during the 1860s?
Of course not. Look, I'm in California and I think it's great that adjacent states have lower taxes and people are fleeing CA because of that. Perhaps that will get CA to wake up and realize their policies are sending them into the third world.
Similarly, Michigan (as an example) should really be asking why nobody wants to ADD auto manufacturing business in their state. If they can't be competitive, then they aren't going to do well. As with any other state.
Ever see a bumper sticker on the back of a pick-up that says: No I Will Not Help You Move! I had an '01 Tundra and found that most of the stuff I carry needs to be out of the rain/elements. But for the dirty stuff, hauling refuse to the dump, going to Home Depot, etc., nothing's better than a truck.
General Motors said Friday it has re-hired auto veteran Bob Lutz as a consultant.
Lutz, a well-traveled "car guy," retired from GM last year, but GM says he has been offering advice "informally" since then.
No word of what he'll be paid.
Seems an odd move. GM's sales and earnings suggest it's doing pretty well. But hiring a consultant suggests things aren't going well and you need some help.
I always knew some viruses were lingering....not that Lutz doesn't have viruses from the past...just that the structure of GM management is not set up for SPEED!
Interesting but at least he IS A CAR GUY and I respect him for that. Here is the formal statement:
"General Motors today announced the retention of former Vice Chairman Robert A. "Bob" Lutz to provide counsel to the senior leadership team of the company.
"Lutz will be available to executives on a part-time consultancy basis effective immediately. He brings a wealth of experience built over the course of more than 40 years in the industry, including two stints at GM. He has also been a senior executive at Ford, Chrysler, BMW and was CEO of Exide Batteries.
"Lutz has been providing advice to GM executives informally since retiring from the company in 2010."
Something I was surprised at: Traverse sales are pretty damned good!
Odd, you left out a comlimentary part of the unattributed quote from your source:
"Edmunds.com CEO Jeremy Anwyl says it is "a good thing for GM. Even with his depth of experience, Bob can always be counted on as a source of fresh ideas."
I think that pretty much explains why they are happy to put him back on the payroll since he's been helping GM all along informally consulting with various GM personnel.
But the twist was to try to make it sound like there was some dark problem and reason for asking hiim to come back to GM.
People are always trying to "hate" GM. Lutz covered it pretty well in his book how the older company gets all the "hate" from media and others.
Lutz has been a part of GM for a long time....part of the historical diseases. You can call it a twist. I did not make the news. I posted the official announcement.
I'll start posting some of the quotes he made in the old GM that should show some huge twist, that's for sure. Here is a fresh idea from Lutz in 2007:
Over lunch during a GM product reveal/review I asked Bob Lutz to comment on the 35-mpg CAFE future as envisioned by our House of Representatives. "I think anything in high volumes that falls well outside of 35 mpg is out of the question," was his immediate response. Simply stated, it’s difficult enough to achieve 35 mpg in cars that mainstream Americans are willing to pay for that the idea of building 240,000 40-mpg econocars to offset 100,000 23-mpg V-8 Camaros appears borderline impossible to do profitably–unless, of course, gasoline is priced to drive genuine consumer demand for these 40-plus mpg wonders. But aren’t the auto companies supporting the plan? "Well, sometimes when faced with a choice between being drawn and quartered and being beheaded, you can make a case for drawing and quartering."
Hate is such a strong word, don't you think? I simply do not think GM is all that great of a company.
Lutz was part of the problem and also had some good ideas as well. Just not great follow through over the years as far as effective management goes. Far from a visionary, that's for darn sure!
Here is the rest of the interview back then. You can be the judge.
Ford gets a free pass on so much stuff because they didn't take TARP money. Their bread-and-butter sedan is built in Mexico, and they are IMHO far guiltier of the old GM sin of building identical cars across more than one make...look at the Lincoln that is absolutely, positively a Fusion..no hiding it.
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But Ford can always do the bragging because they sell theirs under one nameplate, not two like GM. Dumb, dumb, dumb...but I guess the Buick dealers do need something else to sell.
I believe vaunted CR in 2010 picked the Silverado as their pickup of choice.
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I liked the comment from the politician who happened to see an instant readout of 32 mpg on her Lucerne's display and thought "we're already so close". Shows how out-of-touch the gov't can be...and these are the people trying to run this country?!
FWIW though, the 16/25 and 19 combined is the window sticker figure, not the raw CAFE laboratory number which is what they use for those averages. The V-6 Lucerne, when it used the 3.8 at least, had a raw rating of 21.8 city, 38.6 highway, and 27.1 combined.
Oddly, the newer Lucernes, which used the 3.9, did slightly better on the window sticker figures (17/27 and 21 combined), but slightly worse on the laboratory ratings (21.7 city, 37.3 highway, and 26.7 combined)
Ford gets a free pass on so much stuff because they didn't take TARP money. Their bread-and-butter sedan is built in Mexico, and they are IMHO far guiltier of the old GM sin of building identical cars across more than one make...look at the Lincoln that is absolutely, positively a Fusion..no hiding it.
I have to disagree. GM builds plenty of vehicles in Mexico as well. Their Aveo was from Korea. Some engines were from China.
Ford could never be as guilty as GM of rebadging because they didn't have so darn many stupid divisions in the first place. Take the Traverse/Acadia/Outlook/Enclave. FOUR vehicles that are rebadges of each other!
But Ford can always do the bragging because they sell theirs under one nameplate, not two like GM. Dumb, dumb, dumb...but I guess the Buick dealers do need something else to sell.
Let me get this straight. In the previous message GM is better because they don't rebadge so much. Then in this post GM doesn't get enough credit because their trucks are really the same rebadges so they should be counted as one? :confuse: :P
Let's be honest though, all this push toward hybrid type technologies to up mileage is going to end up a big battery disposal and pollution problem down the road even if it does help up the mpg figures.
I think Lutz makes some valid points here. I don't want some dinky Euromobile, nor problem prone not ready for prime time computer and electronics to hit some arbitrary EPA figure. Why not just up the tax a bit on gasoline and let consumers decide where they want to spend their money? Some will downsize, some will rearrange their expenditure composition. Use the gas tax increase to fix highway and bridge infrastructre. Also, this EPA stuff is going to have some sticker price impact on consumers. As car prices go up, it takes a higher income to buy a new car. The people with higher incomes tend to buy bigger cars, so part of this "let's regulate" is going to have an opposite effect on sales segments. I also think he's right that GM had to eat the new EPA numbers because of the gov bailout.
Reread the entire post. This isn't MSN...the whole story must be taken into account. What's dumb, in my own words (and I'm able to say it) is that GM builds two lines of trucks, and has for decades. This is not a new thing. Can you name one current car line where the GM cars are identical, as the Fusion and Lincoln mentioned? I didn't think so.
The main point of my last post was that GM trucks often outsell Ford, but that fact is lost on most people.
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As my old Algebra teacher used to say, "R.T.F.Q." on a test....except here, read the quote.
Surely you don't think the Traverse/Acadia/Outlook/Enclave look like each other, do you? I doubt a single piece of exterior sheetmetal, and I mean a single piece, would interchange.
The Lincoln IS a Fusion. I bet every piece of sheetmetal would interchange.
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Ever wonder how many conventional car batteries have already made that problem a reality?
Greener Pastures for Car Batteries
The carmakers are waiting in the wings. Toyota and Honda place decals with a toll-free number on their hybrid battery packs. Toyota offers a $200 bounty to ensure that every battery comes back to the company. In a press release, Toyota states, "Every part of the battery, from the precious metals to the plastic, plates, steel case and the wiring, is recycled." Honda collects the battery and transfers it to a preferred recycler to follow their prescribed process: disassembling and sorting the materials; shredding the plastic material; recovering and processing the metal; and neutralizing the alkaline material before sending it to a landfill.
Honda, Toyota and the entire auto industry are pumping millions of dollars into research regarding lithium ion batteries for tomorrow's cars. Their primary motivation is to reduce the cost and increase the potency of hybrid batteries. Fortunately, supplanting lead and nickel batteries with rechargeable lithium batteries is also promising from an environmental perspective. Instead of clogging landfills with more toxic chemicals, hybrids—especially future hybrids powered by lithium ion batteries—may represent greener pastures for car batteries.
Call me crazy, but as a customer, and not an industry insider, I consider incentives to be a positive thing....which is why I paid $9,900 for a new '08 Cobalt and $19K for a new '11 Malibu LT.
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I'm obviously not a sophisticated driver, as I rode quite a bit in a friend's '05 Benz (don't know the numbered model but supposedly $95K new) this weekend and although it did ride well and was solid, I wasn't all that bowled over. The interior was the color of a chamois...really...the gas pedal is way stiff, and it needs a tire pressure monitor sensor on one wheel, same as my daughter's Daimler at the other end of the spectrum, a PT Cruiser.
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The Aveo was never marketed as a domestic Chevrolet and was always marketed as a captive import...unlike the Fusion. Yes, some trucks (but not all) are built in Mexico. Frankly, I hate that.
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If it was that expensive new, it was likely an S500, which would have been 6 years into its lifespan in 05, and was phased out in 06. It's a boat, and beats any 1999 GM design at any price point. Although they had some teething issues when new, those W220 S-class were still one of the most advanced cars on the planet when introduced. Stiff throttles are a MB hallmark, they have done it for years. My E55 is the same way, I think it keeps you from laying into it too hard - because if you do, you'll get arrested in due time. Go [non-permissible content removed]! :shades:
I find the stiff throttle no more offensive, and even less so, than typical old school GM throttle tuning and gearing, which was to give the car awesome 0-30 performance with neck snapping response with a feather touch to the pedal, then have it wheeze and do nothing when hitting the gas past 45 or so.
Interior color on the other hand - personal choice when new, the cars were offered in several.
But what about incentives that cause the cars to be sold at a loss simply to keep volume flowing?
Regarding imports, I don't recall seeing an Aveo ad touting it as one...to be fair, I don't recall any Aveo ads at all. Another name which in classic GM fashion will fade away into the history books, while some other brands keep names and lineups active for generations.
No tears lost for the Aveo here...and I'm able to admit it.
Thankfully it is to be replaced by the Sonic, which is built in Michigan. Some here would probably prefer the Aveo to it for that very reason. Go America!
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I don't think anyone will mourn the loss, it wasn't a very lovable or even memorable car. Sonic has to be better, and indeed built in the USA is a positive - I don't recall the Aveo shining in any quality measures.
I don't know why, but whenever any manufacturer ever offered a captive import at the bottom end (Metro, Aveo, Aspire, Cricket) the cars always looked like a bunch of clowns should be getting out of it...always weirdly-proportioned.
Back to my friend's Benz (I do remember it saying "4MATIC" on the trunklid), it's not that I didn't like it, I'm just such a practical guy I can't imagine anyone spending that kind of money on any automobile (friend bought it "pre-owned" a couple years back). I like offbeat-from-mainstream/non status-symbol stuff. Even with a Cobalt, I got a base model with ABS and 5-speed--dealer had to go six hours to get one. I regret hugely getting silver though, as I meet myself at every intersection.
I have posted here that at retirement time we've talked about buying a new Corvette. I think of that as probably the best-bargain of any car in its class. There is absolutely no way I'd get red or yellow--too stereotypical. I'd have to get some subdued color with subdued wheels...probably a base model.
I guess when I want to stand out, I'll do it in my old car...'66 Studebaker. No one in my family ever had one, and my Dad wouldn't have been caught dead in a Studebaker! It'd be considered a yawn by some old-car buffs, but if I see another Mustang or Camaro at a car show I'll pass out.
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Speaking of Camaro, I will say that I love the new Chevy commercial where the old guy picks up his old date in a new Camaro. The minute they get into the car they become thirty-year-olds. A very "base" emotion, but one Chevy has often lacked in their commercials for the past thirty years.
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Reread the entire post. This isn't MSN...the whole story must be taken into account. What's dumb, in my own words (and I'm able to say it) is that GM builds two lines of trucks, and has for decades. This is not a new thing. Can you name one current car line where the GM cars are identical, as the Fusion and Lincoln mentioned? I didn't think so.
The main point of my last post was that GM trucks often outsell Ford, but that fact is lost on most people.
OK, so you were limiting the rebadge discussion to trucks. GM did rebadge a lot of cars, but thankfully with the BK and shedding of divisions, that is gone. I commented in these forums for many years about the stupidity of having so many divisions with (relatively) few actual vehicles other than rebadges. Some posters would insist that more divisions brought in more people than only having one vehicle with one division. Just seems kind of dumb to me. Is it really fooling anybody? And I agree with your comment on the trucks for the same reasons.
Seems to me that a division should only exist as some sort of product differentiator. Pre-BK GM had divisions that supposedly had a purpose, but in actuality had little to differentiate themselves. Hence the four rebadges of the same SUV (Traverse).
In today's GM, I still think there should be a different reason for GMC to exist. Either put all the unique professional-only vehicles in that division, or get rid of it. As an example, if the Impala is fleet-only, then make it a GMC! Don't taint the Chevy division with rentals if they aren't cars that would "sell" the merits of Chevy to auto renters. And how is an Acadia really any different than a Traverse, other than exterior trim and option levels, as an example? Why does GM have the same trucks in Chevy and GMC? If GMC is "professional grade" then I don't see how that means anything extra if Chevy has the exact same vehicles. At least with the shedding of Pontiac and Saturn, two divisions of rebadges have been eliminated.
The Aveo was never marketed as a domestic Chevrolet and was always marketed as a captive import...unlike the Fusion.
I guess I don't understand how something is "marketed". You can tell where either car is built by reading online or looking at a sticker. They're both marketed with their company name "Ford" or "GM". I don't really see a difference here. Are you saying that we hear "USA Fusion" yet only "Chevy Aveo" or "non-domestic Chevey" or something like that? (honest question)
Captive import, bottom of the line, answers itself. Cheapo cars from other markets, a guarantee for awkwardness. Really, that ideal should pass - it just lowers brand equity, but we can't count on our corporate overlords to think ahead like that, especially those in the big 2.5.
S500 4Matic would be right, an AWD variant. Handy in the snow, and uncommon on such a tank. It could be had now for what you paid for that Malibu , they depreciate strongly, and being a late run car doesn't help. Of course, maintenance will be killer compared to the Malibu, even though the bugs were mostly worked out by 05.
I like odd cars too. I live in a conspicuous consumption area, so a 6 year old S-class wouldn't be a status symbol here...I like my E55 because it is very uncommon - maybe a couple dozen imported that year with the exact option and color combo, it is fairly solid, fast, and not too much of a wallet breaker to run. Enthusiasts know what it is, others...I don't care. A Corvette has appeal for speed, economy, and relatively cheap price...interior finish might annoy me, they seem like good used deals but I suspect some are abused...but bang for the buck, hard to beat. GM has had a winner in that car for most of its life.
And I know what you mean re: the Studebaker...I have a Studebaker era MB, and that thing attracts more attention, especially positive feedback, than a 100K+ new car. It's also very uncommon, like your Studey, the tri-Chevy and Mustang etc crowd don't care for it, but that's no matter to me. I appreciate it for what it is.
Thankfully it is to be replaced by the Sonic, which is built in Michigan. Some here would probably prefer the Aveo to it for that very reason. Go America!
Absolutely have no fondness for Aveo. The girl next door has had one for a few years. I always wondered what possessed them to buy that car as opposed to a lot of others, but I never asked. I'm also glad the Sonic is being built in the U.S. Hope it is as good as the early reviews are indicating!
I saw that commerical this morning and I think it's perfect! I really want a Camaro in the garage, however I drove my friend's SS and I could hardly see out of it due to thick A pillars and gun-slit windows. Still, I love the way it looks (as well as the Mustang and Challenger). Trying to get the wife into the mood to buy a pony car (I just bought a new Jeep GC) but she still loves her Mazda6. We recently brought home a white German Shepherd puppy (Go [non-permissible content removed], just kidding) and the wife takes him to work daily. This dog will hit 100 lbs pretty quick and she'll probably have to trade the sedan for a wagon or crossover. There goes my vision of a pony car in the garage!
I guess I am not aware of any domestic-nameplate automobile, except those bottom-feeder models mentioned by me, that were made exclusively in (basically) a third-world country, as the Fusion is. I expect a bottom-feeder to be a captive import...I knew the Aveo was from Korea before I ever set eyes on one; can't say that about the Fusion and Mexico...I mean, Aveo, Metro, Cricket, Aspire--but name anybody else's car that's above that class--that is built in Korea or Mexico exclusively. You won't be able to do it.
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I want to say without checking, that Aveo brochures said something like "Built for Chevrolet by Daewoo". Something akin to the Fusion's situation would be if 100% of all Malibus were built in Mexico. Not a bottom-feeder car.
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Well, it's only the window switches not working!!! It could have been something major like the transmission. Oh, wait. That might be next: "It's a Honda," as the TV commercials say with that breathless allusion to past reputation. :P
This is after the 96,000 recall: "Honda will recall 97,201 model years 2009 and 2010 Fit vehicles in the U.S. to replace the lost motion springs, components within the engine valvetrain. The lost motion springs, which are compressed by rocker arms in normal engine use, may bend or break over time resulting in abnormal engine noise and potentially causing engine damage or stalling. No crashes or injuries have been reported related to this defect."
And there's the Jan 2010 recall for fires from window switches: "Honda announced the voluntary recall of over a half a million Fit compact cars for a faulty part that has the potential of catching fire.
The company said that 646,000 of their 2007-2008 Fit compact hatchbacks would be called back to dealerships so the company can examine window switches. If exposed to liquid, the faulty switches could smoke, melt or catch fire.
"There have been 7 confirmed cases in the U.S.," said Honda spokesman Chuck Schifsky. "In two cases those have involved fires."
Speaking of Chevy commercials....When i was a young lad back in the mid 90's Saturn commercials were always advertising dent resistant doors......were these doors any special or just regular old doors.
I guess I am not aware of any domestic-nameplate automobile, except those bottom-feeder models mentioned by me, that were made exclusively in (basically) a third-world country, as the Fusion is. I expect a bottom-feeder to be a captive import...I knew the Aveo was from Korea before I ever set eyes on one; can't say that about the Fusion and Mexico...I mean, Aveo, Metro, Cricket, Aspire--but name anybody else's car that's above that class--that is built in Korea or Mexico exclusively. You won't be able to do it.
So I'm still confused. Isn't GM manufacturing some trucks in Mexico? Or are you limiting this discussion to just cars for some reason? Isn't the HHR Mexican made? The Suburban, Caddy SRX?
If you're limiting the discussion to "car" as opposed to SUV or Truck, I guess I wouldn't understand why that would be an important distinction, anyway. Or is somehow the word "exclusively" meant to mean that it's ok as long as some of the parts come from the U.S.? I just don't see the point. GM does it just like Ford does.
There is not a single GM automobile made in Mexico. There are some trucks. I feel like I'm talking to my kids. I hate that they build some trucks (and Ford builds all Fusions, their bread-and-butter passenger car line) there. As mentioned previously, that kept me from buying an HHR. Why reward them for that?
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It's just that the lack of balance on this board is totally comical. Caddy recalls of under 4K units get brought up again and again, and '12 Impala recall when the cars weren't even in the field yet were, yet not a single negative comment about these very-major Honda recalls from a single one of the GM-bashers on this board. The simple question is: Why? And don't say it's because it's a GM board. You guys constantly mention your preference of anything-but-GM here.
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Honda (HMC) is also recalling cars from its CR-Z compact hybrid line that are equipped with a manual transmission. A software bug could allow the motor, under some conditions, to rotate in the opposite direction from the transmission's gear -- allowing the car to, for example, roll backwards when the transmission is in forward gear. No injuries have been reported. Honda plans to fix the problem with a software upgrade. The recall affects 26,000 vehicles worldwide, including 5,626 cars in the United States.
This is the second major recall for Honda in recent weeks, and a further setback for the Japanese carmaker as it struggles to recover from a run of bad news and sluggish sales. Honda recalled 1.5 million cars in the U.S. in early August to fix a transmission issue, and drew a scathing Consumer Reports review for the 2012 model year of its ultra-popular Civic compact car.
When a car company begins to suck big time, they deserve the attention. Hope they change before they go bankrupt.
>Surprising that people talk about users coming in to the GM forum to complain about GM, but anti-Honda is somehow on topic
Indeed it is. Even Lutz mentioned the media bias that was continued repeated, over-and-over: foreign, good; GM, bad. Why not ask your host for an interpretation about pointing out shortcomings of the other vaunted brands in the GM discussion? This points out the effect on GM market share of the halo from the "believers" from some foreign car's earlier days.
And do your anti-GM points from long ago fit as news? 20-years old is not news. Is it about new models? Nope. Is it about market share? Nope.
"GM News, New Models and Market Share" is the title.
Actually this discussion had different GM title a few back, but a host changed it to make the title more positive toward the company to evoke a less negative group of posts.
Comments
So far, Honda gets maintenance from me and has 51K and no issues.
Mazda has 5K, no issues.
Kia has nothing yet but only 2K miles.
Regards,
OW
I bought a 2010 Mazda CX-9 instead.
Just out of curiosity, if you still needed the size/cargo/towing capacity of the Yukon and wanted a more direct replacement (Sequoia, Armada, Expedition, etc) what do you think you would have gotten?
I will fess up that one reason I hold on to my aging (and none-too-well) '85 Silverado, rather than replace it with a newer GM truck, is that I've heard horror stories about that 4L60E transmission that the half-ton models use. And I see how my uncle's '97 Silverado is aging. My '85 is getting rust pretty bad in the body, but the frame and major structural stuff is still solid. In contrast, the body on my uncle's truck has very minor rust, but underneath, it's getting kinda scary looking. Plus there's the two transmissions it ate, the $900 fuel pump (I think that's what it cost, but memory's getting fuzzy), several coolant leaks, major brake work, etc. More money has probably been sunk into his '97 over the 14 years he's had it than what's gone into my '85 over the 26 years that it's been around passed down from my Granddad, through Grandmom to my Mom, and then on to me.
I guess, if I found a used Chevy/GMC of newer vintage, that seemed well taken care of and was a reasonable price, I might be willing to take a chance. But I'd probably be leery until it proved itself.
The Sequoia. Neighbor had one and was very pleased. We need the seating capacity and the CX-9 was the best perfomer for 7-seaters for the money.
Your story hits home to me as I am not convinced trucks are such high quality at GM. Makes sense that the F150 outsells GM PU's. My Dad bought a '79 1/2 ton which my 'Bro still has but never uses anymore. Had to throw in a rebuilty engine/tranny in the '90's sometime. After my Yukon experience, water pump/A/C compressor/Air shock/MAP sensor/Air Bag sensor/Battery drain/Speedometer Issue, why not try ANY OTHER BRAND? Not to mention when I traded it (92K miles), heard a hint of trouble brewing in the front differential! :surprise:
Regards,
OW
I'm not about to start favoring one state vs. another. IMHO it's a great strength of this country that states can compete with each other through their tax and labor policies. It keeps the entire country on its feet, and provides internal competition which strengthens us all. If the north or midwest can't compete with the south, then perhaps some policy changes are in order.
Are you suggesting another Period of Unpleasantness like during the 1860s?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Of course not. Look, I'm in California and I think it's great that adjacent states have lower taxes and people are fleeing CA because of that. Perhaps that will get CA to wake up and realize their policies are sending them into the third world.
Similarly, Michigan (as an example) should really be asking why nobody wants to ADD auto manufacturing business in their state. If they can't be competitive, then they aren't going to do well. As with any other state.
I had an '01 Tundra and found that most of the stuff I carry needs to be out of the rain/elements. But for the dirty stuff, hauling refuse to the dump, going to Home Depot, etc., nothing's better than a truck.
Lutz, a well-traveled "car guy," retired from GM last year, but GM says he has been offering advice "informally" since then.
No word of what he'll be paid.
Seems an odd move. GM's sales and earnings suggest it's doing pretty well. But hiring a consultant suggests things aren't going well and you need some help.
I always knew some viruses were lingering....not that Lutz doesn't have viruses from the past...just that the structure of GM management is not set up for SPEED!
Interesting but at least he IS A CAR GUY and I respect him for that. Here is the formal statement:
"General Motors today announced the retention of former Vice Chairman Robert A. "Bob" Lutz to provide counsel to the senior leadership team of the company.
"Lutz will be available to executives on a part-time consultancy basis effective immediately. He brings a wealth of experience built over the course of more than 40 years in the industry, including two stints at GM. He has also been a senior executive at Ford, Chrysler, BMW and was CEO of Exide Batteries.
"Lutz has been providing advice to GM executives informally since retiring from the company in 2010."
Something I was surprised at: Traverse sales are pretty damned good!
Regards,
OW
"Edmunds.com CEO Jeremy Anwyl says it is "a good thing for GM. Even with his depth of experience, Bob can always be counted on as a source of fresh ideas."
I think that pretty much explains why they are happy to put him back on the payroll since he's been helping GM all along informally consulting with various GM personnel.
But the twist was to try to make it sound like there was some dark problem and reason for asking hiim to come back to GM.
People are always trying to "hate" GM. Lutz covered it pretty well in his book how the older company gets all the "hate" from media and others.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I'll start posting some of the quotes he made in the old GM that should show some huge twist, that's for sure. Here is a fresh idea from Lutz in 2007:
Over lunch during a GM product reveal/review I asked Bob Lutz to comment on the 35-mpg CAFE future as envisioned by our House of Representatives. "I think anything in high volumes that falls well outside of 35 mpg is out of the question," was his immediate response. Simply stated, it’s difficult enough to achieve 35 mpg in cars that mainstream Americans are willing to pay for that the idea of building 240,000 40-mpg econocars to offset 100,000 23-mpg V-8 Camaros appears borderline impossible to do profitably–unless, of course, gasoline is priced to drive genuine consumer demand for these 40-plus mpg wonders. But aren’t the auto companies supporting the plan? "Well, sometimes when faced with a choice between being drawn and quartered and being beheaded, you can make a case for drawing and quartering."
Hate is such a strong word, don't you think? I simply do not think GM is all that great of a company.
Lutz was part of the problem and also had some good ideas as well. Just not great follow through over the years as far as effective management goes. Far from a visionary, that's for darn sure!
Here is the rest of the interview back then. You can be the judge.
Lutz on 35 mpg Future
Regards,
OW
I believe vaunted CR in 2010 picked the Silverado as their pickup of choice.
FWIW though, the 16/25 and 19 combined is the window sticker figure, not the raw CAFE laboratory number which is what they use for those averages. The V-6 Lucerne, when it used the 3.8 at least, had a raw rating of 21.8 city, 38.6 highway, and 27.1 combined.
Oddly, the newer Lucernes, which used the 3.9, did slightly better on the window sticker figures (17/27 and 21 combined), but slightly worse on the laboratory ratings (21.7 city, 37.3 highway, and 26.7 combined)
I have to disagree. GM builds plenty of vehicles in Mexico as well. Their Aveo was from Korea. Some engines were from China.
Ford could never be as guilty as GM of rebadging because they didn't have so darn many stupid divisions in the first place. Take the Traverse/Acadia/Outlook/Enclave. FOUR vehicles that are rebadges of each other!
Let me get this straight. In the previous message GM is better because they don't rebadge so much. Then in this post GM doesn't get enough credit because their trucks are really the same rebadges so they should be counted as one? :confuse: :P
The main point of my last post was that GM trucks often outsell Ford, but that fact is lost on most people.
Surely you don't think the Traverse/Acadia/Outlook/Enclave look like each other, do you? I doubt a single piece of exterior sheetmetal, and I mean a single piece, would interchange.
The Lincoln IS a Fusion. I bet every piece of sheetmetal would interchange.
Greener Pastures for Car Batteries
The carmakers are waiting in the wings. Toyota and Honda place decals with a toll-free number on their hybrid battery packs. Toyota offers a $200 bounty to ensure that every battery comes back to the company. In a press release, Toyota states, "Every part of the battery, from the precious metals to the plastic, plates, steel case and the wiring, is recycled." Honda collects the battery and transfers it to a preferred recycler to follow their prescribed process: disassembling and sorting the materials; shredding the plastic material; recovering and processing the metal; and neutralizing the alkaline material before sending it to a landfill.
Honda, Toyota and the entire auto industry are pumping millions of dollars into research regarding lithium ion batteries for tomorrow's cars. Their primary motivation is to reduce the cost and increase the potency of hybrid batteries. Fortunately, supplanting lead and nickel batteries with rechargeable lithium batteries is also promising from an environmental perspective. Instead of clogging landfills with more toxic chemicals, hybrids—especially future hybrids powered by lithium ion batteries—may represent greener pastures for car batteries.
Regards,
OW
Just because Ford are Knight at cloning doesn't get GM (The King) off the hook....or any other car maker for that matter.
Just Like GM leads sales as well as incentive spending. Imagine if they matched some of their stiffer competition on incentives.
Regards,
OW
I find the stiff throttle no more offensive, and even less so, than typical old school GM throttle tuning and gearing, which was to give the car awesome 0-30 performance with neck snapping response with a feather touch to the pedal, then have it wheeze and do nothing when hitting the gas past 45 or so.
Interior color on the other hand - personal choice when new, the cars were offered in several.
Regarding imports, I don't recall seeing an Aveo ad touting it as one...to be fair, I don't recall any Aveo ads at all. Another name which in classic GM fashion will fade away into the history books, while some other brands keep names and lineups active for generations.
Thankfully it is to be replaced by the Sonic, which is built in Michigan. Some here would probably prefer the Aveo to it for that very reason. Go America!
Back to my friend's Benz (I do remember it saying "4MATIC" on the trunklid), it's not that I didn't like it, I'm just such a practical guy I can't imagine anyone spending that kind of money on any automobile (friend bought it "pre-owned" a couple years back). I like offbeat-from-mainstream/non status-symbol stuff. Even with a Cobalt, I got a base model with ABS and 5-speed--dealer had to go six hours to get one. I regret hugely getting silver though, as I meet myself at every intersection.
I have posted here that at retirement time we've talked about buying a new Corvette. I think of that as probably the best-bargain of any car in its class. There is absolutely no way I'd get red or yellow--too stereotypical. I'd have to get some subdued color with subdued wheels...probably a base model.
I guess when I want to stand out, I'll do it in my old car...'66 Studebaker. No one in my family ever had one, and my Dad wouldn't have been caught dead in a Studebaker! It'd be considered a yawn by some old-car buffs, but if I see another Mustang or Camaro at a car show I'll pass out.
The main point of my last post was that GM trucks often outsell Ford, but that fact is lost on most people.
OK, so you were limiting the rebadge discussion to trucks. GM did rebadge a lot of cars, but thankfully with the BK and shedding of divisions, that is gone. I commented in these forums for many years about the stupidity of having so many divisions with (relatively) few actual vehicles other than rebadges. Some posters would insist that more divisions brought in more people than only having one vehicle with one division. Just seems kind of dumb to me. Is it really fooling anybody? And I agree with your comment on the trucks for the same reasons.
Seems to me that a division should only exist as some sort of product differentiator. Pre-BK GM had divisions that supposedly had a purpose, but in actuality had little to differentiate themselves. Hence the four rebadges of the same SUV (Traverse).
In today's GM, I still think there should be a different reason for GMC to exist. Either put all the unique professional-only vehicles in that division, or get rid of it. As an example, if the Impala is fleet-only, then make it a GMC! Don't taint the Chevy division with rentals if they aren't cars that would "sell" the merits of Chevy to auto renters. And how is an Acadia really any different than a Traverse, other than exterior trim and option levels, as an example? Why does GM have the same trucks in Chevy and GMC? If GMC is "professional grade" then I don't see how that means anything extra if Chevy has the exact same vehicles. At least with the shedding of Pontiac and Saturn, two divisions of rebadges have been eliminated.
I guess I don't understand how something is "marketed". You can tell where either car is built by reading online or looking at a sticker. They're both marketed with their company name "Ford" or "GM". I don't really see a difference here. Are you saying that we hear "USA Fusion" yet only "Chevy Aveo" or "non-domestic Chevey" or something like that? (honest question)
S500 4Matic would be right, an AWD variant. Handy in the snow, and uncommon on such a tank. It could be had now for what you paid for that Malibu , they depreciate strongly, and being a late run car doesn't help. Of course, maintenance will be killer compared to the Malibu, even though the bugs were mostly worked out by 05.
I like odd cars too. I live in a conspicuous consumption area, so a 6 year old S-class wouldn't be a status symbol here...I like my E55 because it is very uncommon - maybe a couple dozen imported that year with the exact option and color combo, it is fairly solid, fast, and not too much of a wallet breaker to run. Enthusiasts know what it is, others...I don't care. A Corvette has appeal for speed, economy, and relatively cheap price...interior finish might annoy me, they seem like good used deals but I suspect some are abused...but bang for the buck, hard to beat. GM has had a winner in that car for most of its life.
And I know what you mean re: the Studebaker...I have a Studebaker era MB, and that thing attracts more attention, especially positive feedback, than a 100K+ new car. It's also very uncommon, like your Studey, the tri-Chevy and Mustang etc crowd don't care for it, but that's no matter to me. I appreciate it for what it is.
Absolutely have no fondness for Aveo. The girl next door has had one for a few years. I always wondered what possessed them to buy that car as opposed to a lot of others, but I never asked. I'm also glad the Sonic is being built in the U.S. Hope it is as good as the early reviews are indicating!
2012 Land Rover Range Rover Evoque
http://www.insideline.com/land-rover/range-rover-evoque/2012/2012-land-rover-ran- - ge-rover-evoque-first-drive.html
This...pup...is a real looker, huh? Nice.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Well, it's only the window switches not working!!! It could have been something major like the transmission. Oh, wait. That might be next: "It's a Honda," as the TV commercials say with that breathless allusion to past reputation. :P
This is after the 96,000 recall: "Honda will recall 97,201 model years 2009 and 2010 Fit vehicles in the U.S. to replace the lost motion springs, components within the engine valvetrain. The lost motion springs, which are compressed by rocker arms in normal engine use, may bend or break over time resulting in abnormal engine noise and potentially causing engine damage or stalling. No crashes or injuries have been reported related to this defect."
WOW.
And there's the Jan 2010 recall for fires from window switches: "Honda announced the voluntary recall of over a half a million Fit compact cars for a faulty part that has the potential of catching fire.
The company said that 646,000 of their 2007-2008 Fit compact hatchbacks would be called back to dealerships so the company can examine window switches. If exposed to liquid, the faulty switches could smoke, melt or catch fire.
"There have been 7 confirmed cases in the U.S.," said Honda spokesman Chuck Schifsky. "In two cases those have involved fires."
http://autos.aol.com/article/honda-fit-recall/
Honda must learn slowly on window switches as they've done on transmissions.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
So I'm still confused. Isn't GM manufacturing some trucks in Mexico? Or are you limiting this discussion to just cars for some reason? Isn't the HHR Mexican made? The Suburban, Caddy SRX?
If you're limiting the discussion to "car" as opposed to SUV or Truck, I guess I wouldn't understand why that would be an important distinction, anyway. Or is somehow the word "exclusively" meant to mean that it's ok as long as some of the parts come from the U.S.? I just don't see the point. GM does it just like Ford does.
Plus they had no haggle pricing, at least at first, eventually I think they may have offered rebates, something they did not do in the beginning.
Eventually Saturn was just another division and the rebadging went on.
Or like the Cruze steering wheel!
Or like the Dexcool engine failures!
:P
There we go again with those Honda transmissions! Is this like, number 30 or so?
Surprising that people talk about users coming in to the GM forum to complain about GM, but anti-Honda is somehow on topic. :surprise:
This is the second major recall for Honda in recent weeks, and a further setback for the Japanese carmaker as it struggles to recover from a run of bad news and sluggish sales. Honda recalled 1.5 million cars in the U.S. in early August to fix a transmission issue, and drew a scathing Consumer Reports review for the 2012 model year of its ultra-popular Civic compact car.
When a car company begins to suck big time, they deserve the attention. Hope they change before they go bankrupt.
Regards,
OW
Indeed it is. Even Lutz mentioned the media bias that was continued repeated, over-and-over: foreign, good; GM, bad. Why not ask your host for an interpretation about pointing out shortcomings of the other vaunted brands in the GM discussion? This points out the effect on GM market share of the halo from the "believers" from some foreign car's earlier days.
And do your anti-GM points from long ago fit as news? 20-years old is not news. Is it about new models? Nope. Is it about market share? Nope.
"GM News, New Models and Market Share" is the title.
Actually this discussion had different GM title a few back, but a host changed it to make the title more positive toward the company to evoke a less negative group of posts.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,