Good point! Glass (fused silica) is physically classed as a "super-cooled liquid". Think of glass as a really slow "silly putty". Neither has any crystalline structure - which is why both goo down to a shapeless blob if left alone long enough (several thousand years in the case of unmolested glass), and both will randomly shatter when sharply struck - no crystalline matrix, therefor no cleavage lines along which to separate.
Except the "stuff" was me pushing a new car through rush-hour traffic with people yelling at me out their windows. It was a very dangerous situation as I could have been hit from behind. What if I had been driving along the interstate when the car decided to turn itself off? I'd rather not think about that. I know, I should be grateful that my on-board computers didn't "commit suicide". If I had been injured or killed in the process, at least the computers would have survived.
Of course the old design cars broke down. The point is that my Toyotas didn't...and I put over 100,000 miles on each of them. Were the Honda's at the time just as reliable? I don't know as my '05 is the first. Do the new Toyotas turn off if the battery is bad? I don't know. Incidentally, I never needed an engine overhaul either. They never leaked or burned oil.
Honda is paying the towing fee and providing a coupon for one free service. I'm grateful, but frankly, that the least they should do.
On any modern car if the battery voltage drops below a certain point, the engine management computer will not / cannot function. Also a defective battery will not allow proper alternator charging to keep voltage up. Laws of physics will apply. I'd guess (just a stab) that anything under 10 volts would freak out the computer on any car.
"Most of today's automotive engine design is being driven by exhaust emission legislation. A modern vehicle must be efficient to minimize pollutant production, and this level of efficiency is only achievable under the guidance of a computer-controlled engine management system."
I suppose I was really aware of this all along. Being a network computer specialist, I understand that the range of DC voltages for computers and electronic components is very narrow.
I still believe that this trend is dangerous and can put the driver and passengers at risk.
My almost new 1979 Toyota Celica decided to stop running one night on The Nimitz Freeway in Oakland CA. Not a nice place to have trouble. I was in the center lane, in traffic. I think it was the igniter that failed.
Talk about a fun night...I won't describe the fun I had.
Anyway, it got fixed and I drove that Celica another 100,000 troublefree miles.
I had a very similar popping and cracking on my 2005 Accord V-6.I finally found it. It was where the headliner meets the windsheild on the drivers side.I pushed the headliner in a couple of times and found that the headliner had a gap between it and the windsheild.After I pushed it in a couple of times it made the exact noise I heard every time I hit a bump.It went away either on its own or by me pushing it in a couple of times.I have not heard this popping and creaking noise since.
When I start my 2002 Honda Accord ( 40000 miles, I smell unburnt gas. Not much, but it makes me worry. Is it normal or Oxygen sensor is bad? Or something else? Check engine light is not on. Thanks.
I saw that you posted this very same message regarding a Toyota 4Runner that you also own. It seems highly unlikely that both vehicles would develop the same problem at the same time. Is there an external factor that could be causing the smell? Is one vehicle leaking anything? Anything else in your garage (if your vehicles are parked in the garage) that could be causing the gas smell?? ie. lawnmowers, riding mowers, snow blowers, that sort of thing??
from what I remember the service manager telling me is that the 2004 trans doesn't have a trans filter to replace nor does it have a separate differential to drain and refill (all housed in the transmission he said). Do others here confirm this information? thanks
Hi! Neumie. It is not the smell in my garage. I smell it wherever I start my cars. I took out the spark plugs, they are OK ( I changed the spark plugs ( Platinum) 25000 miles ago). Thanks.
How does this mileage compare to your last car, under the same driving conditions? Where do you drive - city, suburban, highway? How long is your average trip - 5 minutes, 30 minutes, an hour? Do you warm up your car before driving? More info will probably get you better responses here.
Well, your comment on pure highway trips and getting only 24 mpg is troubling. You should be getting easily over 30 mpg.
Things I would think of would be possible vacuum leak (causing the ECU to increase the fuel), bad coolant sensor (telling the computer that the engine is still cold), possibly a stuck thermostat (same as previous reason). But I'd say that all are rare in a car that's so new with so low of mileage.
Is this an automatic transmission? Do you feel it upshifting as you increase road speed? Is it going up through all the gears?
I dunno...I'm at a loss. Have you had it in for this problem? Have they checked for problem codes on the car?
assuming you have the vehicle's tires inflated properly, you're driving without a heavy foot - on the hwy you're maintaining speed 55-60, i'd consider the following: stuck injector bad/mis-calibrated MAF Sensor (Mass AirFlow) causing car to run unnecessary rich fuel/air mixture, maybe this is called a MAP sensor? bad/mis-calibrated O2 Sensor(s) catalytic convertor that is clogged or defective idle-learn procedure not done before vehicle delivery
there must be other possibilities (can you tell if the transmission is locking up the torque convertor?)
perhaps another shop may be willing to do some diagnostics, and swap a part or two. perhaps the ECM could be re-programmed.
if i had to start somewhere, i'd verify the torque convertor is locking up and your vehicle is turning the proper RPMs at 55 or 60. i'd ask if they performed the idle-learn (if it is necessary for your model year..don't know). i'd ask if there is any ECM program upgrades they could perform. those should cost nothing.
i'd ask if they'd be willing to swap out your MAF (or is it MAP)? sensor for another.
"from what I remember the service manager telling me is that the 2004 trans doesn't have a trans filter to replace nor does it have a separate differential to drain and refill (all housed in the transmission he said). Do others here confirm this information?"
From my experience with a '96 Accord, which had NO servicable fluid filter from the factory, I posted that fact in response to a recent Edmunds post from a new or prospective new Accord owner about the placement of the ATF filter on new Accords. Another member corrected me that starting with the 2004 models, Honda had begun installing a spin-on filter on their automatic transmissions. As to the differential question, I'm unaware of any other front wheel drive Japanese car other than Toyota that uses a seperate drain plug for the final drive. If you are able to confirm the opposite from what I was told regarding the filter question, PLEASE post back. (My '96 Accord had a fine mesh screen internally. It could only be serviced in the event the split transmission case was opened during deep internal work.)
If you're in the habit of topping off your gas tank at fill-up to get every "last" ounce in, that may also explain why both your vehicles are exhibiting the same gasoline odor when started. Topping off can also saturate the charcoal filled canister that's part of the emissions control vapor-recovery system beyond its ability to hold gasoline vapor that will normally be drawn off and burned in the engine during normal operation.
I've poked my head around the tranny on my '04 Accord 4 cyl, and I haven't seen any signs of a trans filter on it. If there is, I would also be very ingerested in it's location.
I always like to do as much as I can myself, then to bring the car in, so it would be a good thing to find out.
I've had a problem with my 2004 Accord Coupe, windows making grinding noises, now scraping and rattling. This is the 8th time I'm back at the dealership? Any suggestions?
I have a 1992 Honda Accord, It stopped on me suddenly with no warning llights It just hesitated and then stops but wouldn't start after. It finally started but then it stopped again. what would cause this.
I recently bought the 2006 Accord with automatic V6 engine. When I let the car slow down to 25mph (by rolling, not braking), it feels as if someone taps the brakes. Sometimes I actually go forward a little in my seat. If I am in stop and go traffic, I also feel resistance driving at around 20-25mph unless I accelerate very quickly to 30mph Has anyone else noticed this? Is it the transmission or the VSC?
I have a 1992 Honda Accord and just recently the engine died on me while driving, without any warning what so ever. i got it towed back to my house tried to start it again and it started, unfortunately it made some weird noise as if it were reving normally in idle then it dies down then revs then dies down, i tried to drive it and the engine just shutdown again. as i was talking to the tow truck driver he said it might be the fuel pump or the oxygen sensor? but recently i have changed the oxygen sensor and the EGR unit i believe it was, for the car to pass an emisions certification test...what else could be wrong? and also my transmission occassinaly does not gear shift down (automatic tranny) must i replace the tranny as well?
It is automatic transmission. Sometimes I feel like lack of pressure compare to other Accord that we have during increase in road speed.
During the the first oil change I had actually called Honda and Honda had directed dealer to check the car. But end of the day they said everything is fine and wait till break in period. So I waited till now but I do not see any improvement.
yeah, I had two 1994 camrys and they both had the pan trans with filter inside. My new 2005 also has the same design and the 1994 and 2005 models have that differential drain plug separate from the trans.
As for the accords, my drive shaft leaked at 6K or so and we took it in. he said that the trans doesn't have a separate differential so when you change the trans fluid, you don't have to do a separate differential as it's all housed together. I'm almost certain that he said there isn't a filter to change either as I was suprised cause this is my first honda (loyal toyota person) and the camrys did have one. I bought that $87 shop manual for my car but can't read it till weekends (at home and I travel during the week). I'll look at it more closely and get back. Another way is to check the autozone and advanced auto websites for the 2003-2004 model years (they're the same as the 2005 I believe) and if they don't list a trans filter, then there isn't one. I'll get back after I look at the book this friday/saturday. Thanks for your reply. I really doubt it has a outside filter like an oil filter. that would be easy to spot.
yeah, like I just posted, I'd be shocked to see one outside the trans but maybe I'm used to the camry model being inside. Can't remember my two grand ams I had in the 80's. But then again, lots of manufacturers are going the way of canister oil filters (the european makes and hyundai is too). I don't understand that cause the spin ons are great - easy off and on and not too much mess cleaning up the housing and putting a new gasket on etc... What I don't like is that you really have to do 4X drain and refills at $5 a quart. But then, the camry filter was $15 and that's avoided. I never did that procedure with the camrys and I'm sure it had fluid hung up in the torque converter and I used dex III instead of this new syn blend ATF. I might just do two drops and get to 76% new fluid and do that every year or so. Trying to avoid what my brother in law did with his trooper and $4K trans rebuild cause he didn't change the fluid yet on a 3-4 yr old vehicle even though it had less than 60k miles I think. And if it's just drain and refill, that's a piece of cake vs. taking the pan off, draining the fluid, taking off the filter and putting on a new one and then putting the pan and gasket on. what a mess but I'll have to do that with my '05 camry.
yikes, it looks like it's inside?? I'll have to look this weekend and check the shop manual I have. Thanks. Wonder if anyone changed it yet??? wonder why the shop manager said no filter??? thanks for the post. confused!!!
Hi I live in TORONTO specifically Scarborough. I need a good body shop hopefully cheap that will give me a deal on painting and installing a rear bumper for a 97 accord. Anybody can help that would be appreciated.
Hey astrix, I just came to the forum looking for info on this exact issue.
I have an Accord 2005 EX I4 Automatic that's down to around 23 MPG (about 75% highway miles, 25% light traffic). I've been keeping an eye on it the last few tanks, and it seems to be getting worse each time I fill it up (25 > 24 > 23). It's only got a few thousand miles on it. The tire pressure is normal. It seems to drive pretty normal, but it's all new to me (I've been driving an Acura Integra manual for the last fifteen years).
The car is running fine with approx 60K miles and the engine light and TCS lights come on, sometimes for a day or two and then go off. Any suggestions before I take it in to Honda?
I just bought 2005 Honda Accord EX-V6 2 months ago and has 5K mileage on it. After I bought the car, I notice a engine vibration when I start to accelerate from the stop, at the 1st gear 1500rpm -2000rpm and 2nd gear same rpm range. The vibration and noise starts to happen after the temperature rise to the normal. I don't think it's normal to me and it really bugs me a lot. Especially when the car go uphill, the vibration and noise becomes very obvious and. This issue also make the acceleration not go smoothly.
I wend back to dealer and let them test drive the car and they told me Honda claims it's normal and about 60% of the Accord V6 engine has this issue. It results from the engine try to mix the gas and air(not sure what he was talking about). When the engine is cold the engine oil is not operating in the normal temperate that's why you can't feel it. A technician told me that after 10K this issue MIGHT go away.
I just felt very disappointed and frustrated after spend so much money and had a high expectation on this car but the engine design has a flaw. I don't know if you have the same problem and please let me know how do you response to it and is there is any way to fix it. I read some messages about engine thump at the front end but I don't know we are talking about the same thing. Thanks.
I asked my question on the car talk website asking about the differential in the accord and the filter and fluid changes. Here's what some master transmission certified mechanic said. I'm assuming he won't mind me copying and pasting his message below the line here. thanks
The Honda 3 shaft transmissions do have a filter but it is sealed inside the transmission case. The ONLY way to access the filter is to remove and disassemble the transmission. Front wheel drive transmissions such as these have the differential assy built into the transmission case. The differential is lubricated with the transmission fluid inside the transmission. What you can do if you want, is drain and refill (One time) every 6000 miles or so (Every other oil change). Honda fluid is expensive, but you need to use ONLY HONDA FLUID in this transmission. Draining and refilling one of these transmissions is actually much easier than changing your engine oil and filter. I have several customers where I have rebuilt their Honda transmissions who service their transmissions this way.
Comments
Of course the old design cars broke down. The point is that my Toyotas didn't...and I put over 100,000 miles on each of them. Were the Honda's at the time just as reliable? I don't know as my '05 is the first. Do the new Toyotas turn off if the battery is bad? I don't know. Incidentally, I never needed an engine overhaul either. They never leaked or burned oil.
Honda is paying the towing fee and providing a coupon for one free service. I'm grateful, but frankly, that the least they should do.
http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/General/Glass/glass.html
http://dwb.unl.edu/Teacher/NSF/C01/C01Links/www.ualberta.ca/~bderksen/florin.html
I suppose I was really aware of this all along. Being a network computer specialist, I understand that the range of DC voltages for computers and electronic components is very narrow.
I still believe that this trend is dangerous and can put the driver and passengers at risk.
You are making a big deal out a small,yes, small thing compared to what life can dish out.
Have you considered the possibility some punk with a pellet gun could have caused this to happen?
Relax and move on with life...
Talk about a fun night...I won't describe the fun I had.
Anyway, it got fixed and I drove that Celica another 100,000 troublefree miles.
" Stuff" does happen!
Thanks.
It is not the smell in my garage. I smell it wherever I start my cars. I took out the spark plugs, they are OK ( I changed the spark plugs ( Platinum) 25000 miles ago).
Thanks.
I have Accord 2005 four cylinder for over a year now with 9000 miles on it.
But it still gives average of 18-20MPG without AC on.
Could someone tell me what are my options now?
IF i go to dealer what should I be getting checked under warranty?
Thank You.
Edited on suggestion:
My family have other Accords but this one gives low mileage.
I used to drive Civic 97 that gave around 30-33MPG with AC on.
It is driven mixed in DFW area. Morning and evening trips each 10 miles or 15 minuts. And do warm up the car for 30 seconds.
To approximate avg., I also drove on pure highway trips of 300+ miles but max I got was 24MPG.
The last V4 automotive engine produced that I can think of was in the old Saab 95.
Check here for details: http://automobiles.honda.com/models/specifications_full_specs.asp?ModelName=Accord+Sedan
Well, your comment on pure highway trips and getting only 24 mpg is troubling. You should be getting easily over 30 mpg.
Things I would think of would be possible vacuum leak (causing the ECU to increase the fuel), bad coolant sensor (telling the computer that the engine is still cold), possibly a stuck thermostat (same as previous reason). But I'd say that all are rare in a car that's so new with so low of mileage.
Is this an automatic transmission? Do you feel it upshifting as you increase road speed? Is it going up through all the gears?
I dunno...I'm at a loss. Have you had it in for this problem? Have they checked for problem codes on the car?
stuck injector
bad/mis-calibrated MAF Sensor (Mass AirFlow) causing car to run unnecessary rich fuel/air mixture, maybe this is called a MAP sensor?
bad/mis-calibrated O2 Sensor(s)
catalytic convertor that is clogged or defective
idle-learn procedure not done before vehicle delivery
there must be other possibilities (can you tell if the transmission is locking up the torque convertor?)
perhaps another shop may be willing to do some diagnostics, and swap a part or two. perhaps the ECM could be re-programmed.
if i had to start somewhere, i'd verify the torque convertor is locking up and your vehicle is turning the proper RPMs at 55 or 60. i'd ask if they performed the idle-learn (if it is necessary for your model year..don't know). i'd ask if there is any ECM program upgrades they could perform. those should cost nothing.
i'd ask if they'd be willing to swap out your MAF (or is it MAP)? sensor for another.
From my experience with a '96 Accord, which had NO servicable fluid filter from the factory, I posted that fact in response to a recent Edmunds post from a new or prospective new Accord owner about the placement of the ATF filter on new Accords. Another member corrected me that starting with the 2004 models, Honda had begun installing a spin-on filter on their automatic transmissions. As to the differential question, I'm unaware of any other front wheel drive Japanese car other than Toyota that uses a seperate drain plug for the final drive. If you are able to confirm the opposite from what I was told regarding the filter question, PLEASE post back. (My '96 Accord had a fine mesh screen internally. It could only be serviced in the event the split transmission case was opened during deep internal work.)
Stupid Honda powertrain engineers, Abbotso & Costelloru - can't even figure out how to make a V4 right...
I always like to do as much as I can myself, then to bring the car in, so it would be a good thing to find out.
Mrbill
2004 Accord ATF Filter
I've had a problem with my 2004 Accord Coupe, windows making grinding noises, now scraping and rattling. This is the 8th time I'm back at the dealership? Any suggestions?
SueR
wouldn't start after. It finally started but then it stopped again. what would cause this.
I did a search and did see a reference to a trans filter, but could not find a pic ot it's location.
Mrbill
It is automatic transmission. Sometimes I feel like lack of pressure compare to other Accord that we have during increase in road speed.
During the the first oil change I had actually called Honda and Honda had directed dealer to check the car. But end of the day they said everything is fine and wait till break in period. So I waited till now but I do not see any improvement.
I plan to call Honda next week and I would mention your comments.
As for the accords, my drive shaft leaked at 6K or so and we took it in. he said that the trans doesn't have a separate differential so when you change the trans fluid, you don't have to do a separate differential as it's all housed together. I'm almost certain that he said there isn't a filter to change either as I was suprised cause this is my first honda (loyal toyota person) and the camrys did have one. I bought that $87 shop manual for my car but can't read it till weekends (at home and I travel during the week). I'll look at it more closely and get back. Another way is to check the autozone and advanced auto websites for the 2003-2004 model years (they're the same as the 2005 I believe) and if they don't list a trans filter, then there isn't one. I'll get back after I look at the book this friday/saturday. Thanks for your reply. I really doubt it has a outside filter like an oil filter. that would be easy to spot.
I live in TORONTO specifically Scarborough. I need a good body shop hopefully cheap that will give me a deal on painting and installing a rear bumper for a 97 accord. Anybody can help that would be appreciated.
I have an Accord 2005 EX I4 Automatic that's down to around 23 MPG (about 75% highway miles, 25% light traffic). I've been keeping an eye on it the last few tanks, and it seems to be getting worse each time I fill it up (25 > 24 > 23). It's only got a few thousand miles on it. The tire pressure is normal. It seems to drive pretty normal, but it's all new to me (I've been driving an Acura Integra manual for the last fifteen years).
Please post back if you find anything out!
I just bought 2005 Honda Accord EX-V6 2 months ago and has 5K mileage on it. After I bought the car, I notice a engine vibration when I start to accelerate from the stop, at the 1st gear 1500rpm -2000rpm and 2nd gear same rpm range. The vibration and noise starts to happen after the temperature rise to the normal. I don't think it's normal to me and it really bugs me a lot. Especially when the car go uphill, the vibration and noise becomes very obvious and. This issue also make the acceleration not go smoothly.
I wend back to dealer and let them test drive the car and they told me Honda claims it's normal and about 60% of the Accord V6 engine has this issue. It results from the engine try to mix the gas and air(not sure what he was talking about). When the engine is cold the engine oil is not operating in the normal temperate that's why you can't feel it. A technician told me that after 10K this issue MIGHT go away.
I just felt very disappointed and frustrated after spend so much money and had a high expectation on this car but the engine design has a flaw. I don't know if you have the same problem and please let me know how do you response to it and is there is any way to fix it. I read some messages about engine thump at the front end but I don't know we are talking about the same thing. Thanks.
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The Honda 3 shaft transmissions do have a filter but it is sealed inside the transmission case. The ONLY way to access the filter is to remove and disassemble the transmission. Front wheel drive transmissions such as these have the differential assy built into the transmission case. The differential is lubricated with the transmission fluid inside the transmission. What you can do if you want, is drain and refill (One time) every 6000 miles or so (Every other oil change). Honda fluid is expensive, but you need to use ONLY HONDA FLUID in this transmission. Draining and refilling one of these transmissions is actually much easier than changing your engine oil and filter. I have several customers where I have rebuilt their Honda transmissions who service their transmissions this way.
transman
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GM MASTER TECHNICIAN
SR. TRANSMISSION BUILDER