You only got a six pack and a T shirt? I got a whole case of Bud and they offered me a position as a Vice-President in the company. I guess you're just not much of a negotiator.
Shipo - I too love the looks of the Mini and it's supposed to be a great handler too. I'd love to take one out for a spin when they get to the showrooms in the Spring. BTW, Automobile mag had the new SL500 on its front page and that car is absolutely stunning!!! They claim that amazingly, it approaches the 911 in terms of handling and man, what a looker!! See if you can get those patents off the ground and put an SL500, a Cooper S and an M6 in your garage )
I was just thinking yesterday that I'm so glad I got the steering retrofit. The steering tightens up significantly above 85-90 mph and it makes the car very agile. You just turn the steering wheel 30 degrees and boom - you're two lanes over just like a race car. It is very responsive and reassuring - I only wish there was even more of that feel at 60-70 mph. I guess that's why I end up driving above 85-90 mph most of the time ;o)
Recently, you commented that the BMW (three series, I believe) was priced competitively relative to Japanese cars in the same class. I was initially skeptical but became convinced after spending time comparing specific vehicles. Essentially, BMW designs a car that is well engineered and incorporates the latest safety and engine management systems. In the US, many of the standard features such as ABS and DSC are either expensive options or not available on the Japanese counterparts. We recently purchased a Japanese car for essentially the same cost as our three series BMW. Whereas the Japanese car is well equipped with GPS and power seats, the car does not corner, brake, or maneuver nearly as well as the BMW. With many Japanese cars, improved handling features are not an option. With the BMW, it is always standard, at least in the US.
for taking the time to understand that ! Once you can see it from that enlightened perspective most every car falls into focus - you know what I mean! Thanks!
I had my Auxiliary Fan replaced about a month a go.I just received a letter from BMWNA telling me to bring it back in even though I already had the original part replaced. Has anyone else received a new recall notice after having their Auxiliary Fan replaced? I alos have noticed that after I shut my car off it sounds like the fan is still winding down for a few seconds. Has anyone else noticed this?
Is this fan recall thing something with '01 models? Because if it is it seems that '01 is a model year to stay away from considering this issue and the steering modification issue. Any comments? Consumer Reports will almost definitely take note of this in evaluating the '01 for aftermarket purposes. Seems like you may as well buy a used '00 model, or just stack your pennies and go for the '02.
How does the 3-series rate relative to the Jetta? Here's my sense:
The Jetta is a great design on paper but the concept all starts to fall apart when it gets assembled in Mexico. The fact you'll never hear reference to the made in Mexico thing from VW itself confirms that even the company concedes it's nothing to be proud about, to say the least. Mexico has never been known to produce any quality product and they haven't rehabilitated their reputation with the Jetta. (Cars often come with spare fuses. But don't take a Jetta off the lot without a $4,000 spare parts kit of things like electric window regulators that blow regularly.) To plagiarize a comment I read elsewhere, reading the Jetta-related message boards with the endless litany of mechanical and quality problems reminds you of the carnage of bombed out vehicles discarded by the Iraqis when they hightailed it out of Kuwait.
Bottom line: if you get a Jetta why not re-badge it yourself with some spell-it-yourself stickers as the "Burrito". It'll look pretty crappy at first but soon that's the perception you'll have of the whole car.
As to the BMW, it's astounding how much mileage a car can get simply by having a well-balanced chassis and good brakes. There's no doubt the car earns high points for those aspects - at least in dry weather. (In the snow, it's a relative nightmare and you'll wish your probation officer made you buy a Daewoo instead.) But beyond a good-weather chassis balance, the 3-series is pretty modest stuff. Watch out for Grandma in her new Altima - she can smoke you at the lights if she wants and might even do it without trying - and she doesn't wear $300 designer sunglasses like most 3-series drivers. The pretence to performance - what with the talk of "ultimate driving experience" - sounds rather hollow when you find out that the performance in many ways is pretty mediocre. Why is a 330i - for which you can spend over $50,000 - speed-governed to 126 mph, less than many fleet cars peddled by GM to rental agencies? And the lowest Honda comes with more standard equipment. Moreover, and here's the real crunch, a patient and thoughtful review of BMW owner's experiences confirms that BMW reliability and assembly quality is really not magnitudes better than the Jettas - the frequency of problems is somewhat less, the repair cost is a lot higher, and altogether it falls miles short of where Lexus is in terms of assembly quality.
Bottom line: you're paying for solid gold, but getting something that's merely electroplated.
Absolutely spot on. You must know quite a lot about cars! Thanks for that eye-opening analysis. I'm chopping mine in for an Accord with more standard features tomorrow! Can't wait.
I agree with you about the Jetta. I think the German engineering of those cars is nullified by its assembly in Mexico. As for your analysis of the 3 series, I think you have a point about amenities, and the fact is, BMW does exploit, to a certain extent, its German lineage and reputation. However, a reputation is acquired after years and years of producing quality driving machines. Now, I for one, am convinced that the Japanese will eventually surpass the Germans in automobile production and quality--they just have so much more upside potential. But as for right now, they just aren't there yet. But they are getting really close.
Well Ed, we were all on the edges of our seats in anticipation of another insightful post and you didn't let us down. Do you have any friends? Do us all a favor and go away.
Isn't it amazing how some people get their kicks from trying to make others feel bad. Here we have a group of people who are all relatively happy with their purchase of a BMW 3 series and who are sharing their enjoyment about them. And then someone comes in to tell us that we're all wrong to be so happy and that we really should feel bad about it. So,I must bring up the question, is that the purpose of his comments; to make others feel bad? So my advice is that we all ask rantfx to refrain from such further comments.
are a sad bunch of people. Espically the BMW trolls. They have so much BMW envy, the only way they can feel better about themselves is to bad mouth BMW.
The ironic part is, if they don't have to pay, they'll drop their current car in a second, and jump into a BMW.
Maybe we should start a BMW envy fund, so we can send these poor people to therapy.
I love Bimmers...really, but you comments about BMW envy is what turns people off and gives a bad rep for Bimmer owners. It also probably encourages folks to rank on your choice of vehicle. Just a thought. :-)
"Mexico has never been known to produce any quality product..." ?!? You've obviously never tasted good tequila, especially Don Julio ;o) As far as Jettas, my '97 Jetta VR6 assembled in Mexico ran without a single problem (mechanical or cosmetic) for 55K miles when I got rear-ended. I sold it at nearly 100K miles with the original clutch and front brakes.
rantfx (son of v_tech), even though you're probably only 16, sweeping generalizations like that are sure to make you popular with old-timers )
C&D tested the new 180-HP Jetta 1.8T at 7.2 0-60 and 15.7 at the quarter mile. The 325's numbers are 7.0 and 15.4 respectively. Pretty good for a 20K car, eh? they even proceeded to call it the "Mercedes of the bunch..." tested referring to its build quality, as well as soft suspension. And speaking of passing power on twisty mountain roads, I passed 8 cars at once on the Mohawk Trail yesterday with our 1.8T Quattro - all it takes is having it in the right gear, getting an early running start, and shifting gears quickly while passing. The 180-HP engine may make that even a little easier.
Cornering with the 1.8T will never come close to the 325i's but I do love the way the turbo glues you to the seat once it kicks in (especially above 3K RPM's)!!
most of the anti-BMW posters I've seen on the Edmunds' boards always seem to post something about how if they don't have to pay, they'll own one. I know if I truely don't like something, I'll never own one even if it's free. So the only conclusion I can draw about these trolls is envy.
...did you see the latest Road and Track review of the 10 affordable (sub-$25k) cars including your honorable Subaru WRX? I'm sure you must have, since you have been trolling around with your WRX buddies suggesting that it can run with the likes of an M3 or S4. Or at least with the 330xi.
Well, just to prove I have an open mind, I read the article. Seems as though the WRX does indeed have some oomph. Managed to beat 7 of the other 9 from 0 to 60. Unfortunately, it came in at #9 out of 10 in handling with an Isuzu Trooper like 0.76 lateral g's. This, mind you, amoung such worthy competitors as the $18,000 Dodge Neon (0.79 g's) and the $18,500 Mazda MP3 (0.84 g's). Don't like those damn "G" numbers, well it came in DEAD LAST in slalom speed and only beat 2 of ten in braking from 60 to 0.
Yeah, the WRX sure is going to get me to "save a buck or two" and forget about the M3. As long as I don't decide to save a few more bucks and get the MP3.
"most of the anti-BMW posters I've seen on the Edmunds' boards always seem to post something about how if they don't have to pay, they'll own one"
Although I never said that, in a way you're right - I'd regard the 3-series in a somewhat different light if I didn't have to pay these things:
(1) $48,000 plus (Canadian) for a car that gives performance much the same as a whole host of cars costing half that amount; and
(2) repair and maintenance costs that are well in excess of the industry leaders, like Lexus or Honda.
At no point did I suggest that I "don't like" the product, much less to the point that I wouldn't take it if it was given to me. Not that such a juvenile query means anything.
I can assure you it's hardly a case of envy, though that instinctive response from BMW owners is quite common, and tends to prove that to them their car are all about status rather than performance.
I happen to be considering the purchase of a "sports sedan" but am sincerely disappointed at how the category is largely taken up by vehicles more suited for status posing than for optimized performance. When "the ultimate driving experience" does 0-60 in the 7's, is speed-governed to 126 and is whipped by a bunch of econoboxes, I have to wonder what the engineering and marketing priorities of the manufacturer are.
I suppose the idea of a "sports" machine raises my expectations more than yours. As a recreational indulgence, I'm quite familiar with open-class sportbikes, and currently ride a Honda 929 which, completely stock, has a performance level comparable to World Championship racing bikes about 7 years ago: a power:weight ratio of about 2.5 lbs/hp, 175 mph top speed, 0-60 in 2.4 seconds, etc. Riding one of these is truly and genuinely a "sporting" proposition, and would never be compared with an "econo-bike" in any respect whatsoever. In contrast, BMW 3-series share the same dimensions of power performance as many econo-boxes, and I'm absolutely confounded as to how that's deemed acceptable by the marketplace. With routine family sedans having in the order of 200 - 250 hp, my recipe for a "sports sedan" would start where BMW's ends - at the M3 level. Heck, even that car has a power:weight ratio of little better than 10 lbs/hp - hardly earthshattering. Currently – and needlessly - it's at the price of an exotic, and beyond the means of me at least. No doubt if the market demanded it, BMW could make a 333 hp engine standard in every 3-series for about the same cost as a 330i. But they don’t, because people like you are quite content with mediocre power levels. I’m not.
You (representing I suppose the thoughts of 3-series owners generally) and I simply have different definitions of what a "sports" sedan is, and should be. You think it's fine if the power performance capabilities are the same as those of an econo-box. I don't.
As an aside: my earlier post was condemned for spoiling the party being held here by a "group of people who are all relatively happy with their purchase of a BMW 3 series and who are sharing their enjoyment about them." Well, too bad, if I'm not just another drone in the self-congratulatory chanting, blindly endorsing the company’s marketing gameplan. If you can't stand different perspectives being advanced about your pride and joy, maybe you should stick to reading the slogans and taglines in BMW's promotional material instead.
Finally, with all the complaints about dubious reliability and shoddy workmanship on this thread, I wouldn't quite agree with your characterization of 3-series owners here as "all relatively happy ... sharing their enjoyment."
I couldn't have said it better. One thing that we Americans and Canadians enjoy is free speech, open discussion, and the right to disagree. I think some of the Bimmer fans who post on this thread need to be reminded of that. As I said before, I think the Bimmer is an excellent car, but there are some issues surrounding it regarding costs, reliability, and performance that I think at least MERIT discussion. I am a fan of the car, am thinking about getting one, but find it odd that those who already own one are so defensive when certain questions/issues are raised. Extremely odd to me.
I don't think you get it. Your post leads me to believe you've never actually DRIVEN a 3-series. Certainly on paper, there are a number of cars out there that compare well or handily beat the 3-series in terms of HP, performance, price and other criteria. If I bought a car based on ON PAPER specs, I'd be driving a TL-S or signing up for an Altima 3.5 RIGHT NOW! It's the intangibles that make the difference, and I (and most of the contingent here, I'd wager) certainly feel the price premium is more than justified.
If you're looking for pure performance, the word SEDAN shouldn't fit into your vernacular. By definition, a SEDAN has already conceded some aspects of performance to other considerations, such as space, utliity, and occupant safety. Taken a step further, for true on-ground performance, the word CAR should be abandoned as well: what 4-wheeled vehicle can come within an order-of-magnitude of the performance-value function offered by today's superbikes?
My point is that the 3-series is not the BEST in any given category, be it safety, performance, space, or comfort. But it is ONE OF THE BEST in ALL of these aspects simultaneously, which, in turn, justifies the premium owners are willing (in great numbers, I might add) to pay.
Boy, very insightful, especially coming from a Honda Accord owner who had to make his vehicle "tight as a drum" by sticking in some piece of rubber weatherstripping between the dash and A pillar to stop unwanted noise.
According to you, all sedans labled "sport" should go at least 140 mph, I'd like to know where you would drive 140 mph in a so called in your opinion sport sedan day in and day out in Canada?
I am very much in favor of freedom of expression. and I will defend rantfx's rights to say what he pleases. However, I do question the purpose of his negative comments. If you look at any board on Edmunds regarding any cars, you will undoubtedly find complaints of repair problems, unreliability etc. It is no different in this topic area but that is to be expected. Consumer Reports is very clear on the track record of BMW 3 series cars as to reliability and performance. I too agree with a previous post that the numbers have very little to do with the actual driving experience. I do not drive at excessive speeds but I love the feel of the car, the way it takes turns, the sound of the engine and the entire driving experience. It cannot be quantified in terms of numbers. I use to drive a Lexus 300 GS which is as mechanically perfect and reliable as you can find. And you know what, to me it was a boring car. It never put a smile on my face to start it up like the BMW does. The 3 series are expensive cars and it does not make the people who drive them any better or worse than anyone else. Certainly we can judge the value of a human being on things much more important than the type of car they drive. These are great fun cars and to those who choose to spend their hard earned dollars on them I think they will be rewarded. To others who don't see the value, I certainly understand their point of view.
...if you really can't tell the difference between a Honda Accord and a BMW 3-series, then congratulate yourself on getting exactly the right car for you.
I happen to be driving a 1995 Nissan Maxima SE with 115k trouble free miles under its belt. Knock on wood, I am finalizing a business deal that would enable me to trade up to virtually anything I want (assuming I decide to). So I've driven quite a few cars. Several two or three times. Pretty much everthing made in Europe or Japan. From under $30k to quite a bit more. I am looking to impress no one but myself (and maybe my two young daughters). As much as have appreciated the Maxima, I would never suggest it can compete with the overall handling and performance of a BMW 5-series. And although the Accord is a great no-nonsense commuter (I've owned two Honda's), I find it hard to believe that anyone who considers themself a "sport" enthusiast would fail to see an enormous driving difference between a BMW 3 or 5 series and an Accord. After all, I'm driving a seven year old car that can still kick the butt off any stock Accord ever made, and I can tell!! Damn, sorry about that. Anyway, to each their own. I used to think the "Ultimate Driving Machine" was excessive marketing hype. Until I drove several. They are pretty close.
P.S. I shoved a wood shim between the passenger side A pillar and dash to stop an annoying squeek and rattle in my Maxima about 4 years ago and it has worked beautifully ever since. While I am not the least bit embarrassed to point out this feat of owner-engineering to curious passengers, I sincerely hope it is not required by my next purchase.
I really wish trolls would at least get some facts right. If someone truly believes a vehicle is problematic, why would you want it, even if it's free.
Some people have valid reasons for not wanting a BMW, and I respect that, but trolls, I shouldn't even waste my time with them.
Edward5555: Slanderous, and liable remarks, among other things are not covered under freedom of speech.
One thing that we Americans and Canadians enjoy is free speech, open discussion, and the right to disagree.
Easy Ed, I have a nice .PDF file of some of your previously deleted posts if you care to review the tasteful comments you've made here under the guise of "free speech" LOL...
I think some of the Bimmer fans who post on this thread need to be reminded of that.
And apparently trolls who insist on repeated flamebaiting comments, and who then fall back to "just kidding" or "just being provocative" when they're called on it, need to be reminded to take their comments elsewhere.
As I said before, I think the Bimmer is an excellent car, but there are some issues surrounding it regarding costs, reliability, and performance that I think at least MERIT discussion.
And the information you have which backs up your claims of "issues" is where? As someone who is about to buy a 3er, I would like nothing more than to have a discussion of this car's issues backed up by verifiable facts. Please share!
I am a fan of the car, am thinking about getting one, but find it odd that those who already own one are so defensive when certain questions/issues are raised. Extremely odd to me.
If you would raise issues without trolling and have SOMETHING backing them up, perhaps people would take you seriously. Hearsay ain't gonna cut it here, laddie. What's odd to me is that you're somehow under the delusion that your posts are the height of objectivity and innocent curiosity.
As for this fella...
Finally, with all the complaints about dubious reliability and shoddy workmanship on this thread, I wouldn't quite agree with your characterization of 3-series owners here as "all relatively happy ... sharing their enjoyment."
rantfx, I'll ask the same of you. Where are all these complaints? I've read through the whole 9000+ post thread perhaps twice and I've yet to see all these complaints that you're referring to. Sure, there's the odd bad experience mixed in there--I'd be suspicious if there weren't. But I see nothing of the magnitude you're implying. Must be some kind of conspiracy to keep potential BMW buyers in the dark, eh? Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to take my Grandmother to the Nissan dealer to pick up her new Altima, and then it's off to the mall to get my new pair of Maui Jim's because these Oakleys are sooooo "August 2001".
...What's LOL stand for? I had guessed "Lot's of Luck", but that doesn't seem to fit. I usually try to be as polite as reasonably possible, but just in case I want to LOL somebody, I should know what I'm saying. If it can't be repeated, give me some "rhymes with" hints. Thanks.
“Certainly on paper, there are a number of cars out there that compare well or handily beat the 3-series in terms of HP, performance, price and other criteria.”
My point is that even on “paper” a sport sedan should look different – very different – than ordinary family sedans.
I agree with you that “it's the intangibles that make the difference” at least if you’re talking about the mechanical aesthetics of a machine (a finely balanced 3-series no doubt is in a different realm than an Altima or Accord). And I give BMW full credit for its actual accomplishments in the 3-series (chassis, brakes) although I note in passing that they are softening even those factors to appeal to a larger and lower common denominator of status-seeking posers (making the steering lighter, for example).
Having said all that, I still maintain that an essential prerequisite to a sport sedan is a measure of power performance that’s well beyond the ordinary family sedan – in addition to the rarified handling and the “intangibles” of sophisticated engineering. The whole thing falls flat when there isn’t the power to back it up – in other words, if you get smoked by Aunt Mable in her Altima.
There’s really no difference in the application of these principles to sedans instead of 4 seater coupes, at least in the cars we’re talking about here.
You observe that “what 4-wheeled vehicle can come within an order-of-magnitude of the performance-value function offered by today's superbikes”. By referring to bikes I was not suggesting that a sports sedan could ever compete with a superbike. My point was that in the Japanese bike market power performance is taken very seriously in a way its not in the 3-series/IS300/A4 “sport” sedan market. Honda couldn’t get away with marketing a 600 “sport” bike that had power performance no better than competitors’ offerings in lesser categories, but this is exactly what BMW is getting away with in the 3-series, and it’s doing so with the cheering consent of its customers like you.
I can assure you that if the purchasers of 3-series insisted that all 3-series had M3 levels of power, and all at the current price ranges for the 325 and 330, BMW would provide it. It’s the fact that 3-series customers don’t demand it that I lament.
Again I am criticized for “negative” comments about the 3-series. But I’m not so much criticizing the car, or the company, but rather the customers who are defining what the market for these cars is. By my comments, saying I’m a prospective customer but I want more power, I’m doing my part to express what my little speck of the marketplace demands, and I’m doing my part to influence what sport sedans are all about.
It’s the customers, not the company, that defines the car.
The more people there are like me, the more likely it’ll be ordinary 3-series will have M3 levels of power.
The more people there are like you, the more likely 3-series cars will be whipped by Altimas.
So it’s my turn. I ask all of you why ~you~ are being negative about the 3-series’ future – by failing to insist that the car have truly sporting levels of power.
By the way, I never suggested an Accord was a better car than a 3-series (though it actually is in terms of reliability – sorry). But since one of you raised the fact that I have an Accord (I gather by tracing my posts on other threads) I invite you to share my perspective for a moment.
I actually have two Hondas. Each has 150 hp. One weighs 3200 lbs, the other weighs 375 lbs. Is it really worth it to spend twice as much on the 4-wheeler when the power only gets up to 186 or 225? I don’t think so. It wasn’t even worth it to me to get the 200 hp Accord. If you want to attract ~my~ attention with something you call a “sport sedan”, well, it better have some serious power. So far, 325 and 330 BMWs don’t. I’d like to see that change. You don’t seem to care. That’s our difference.
Have you bought or shopped for a 3-Series BMW, C-Class Mercedes, Jaguar X-Type or other small sports sedan since Sept 11? If so, your comments are of great interest. Please get in touch with me via jfallon@edmunds.com.
After owning my new 325 for 2 weeks and putting on 600 miles, I feel that this car is worth every penny in terms of looks, refinement, excitement and pure exhilaration.
I have owned Honda's, Acura's, and driven a Lexus and infinity several times to know that they do not even compare in overall performance to the BMW.
Now, even I understand why the owners on this page love their cars so much and go to extreme lenghts to defend them.
The more people there are like me, the more likely it’ll be ordinary 3-series will have M3 levels of power. Thanks, I'm happy with the 3-series as-is without your input as a non-owner. How about redirecting that energy to Subaru and convincing them to make the WRX a little less ug..ummm, I mean, more attractive? Or asking Honda to add a little spice to the Accord? Personally, I'm thinking that the 330 might have TOO MUCH power if anything, and wondering if I could have made do with a 325i.
The more people there are like you, the more likely 3-series cars will be whipped by Altimas. Lots of people don't worry about "getting whipped". In fact, I enjoy cruising with the top down so much in my SLK that I occasionally go the speed limit so as to prolong the driving pleasure. Imagine that!
So it’s my turn. I ask all of you why ~you~ are being negative about the 3-series’ future – by failing to insist that the car have truly sporting levels of power. You might think it's clever to turn it around like that, but that's an answer to a question no one is asking. Would the rest of us sit here and conclude you're being negative about the Accord's future because you're not insisting that Honda give it handling characteristics equal to a 3-series? I doubt it.
Edward5555, if you would care to make just one argument based on fact or merit, many here would be happy to debate. But you haven't! Understand that "LOTS of people tell me that..." doesn't count as fact or merit. Instead, you troll. And not only that, you don't even excel at trolling which is evidenced by the fact that many of your old posts were deleted--and I certainly do treasure them
Now to get back on topic, doesn't anyone have a picture of the '02 330i sport package yet?
I guess horsepower and torque mean everything to you.
You have probably never driven a 3 series for any extended period (no a 30 minute test drive does not count) of time so your comments are not credible.
What is your thoughts on why it is that the 3 series continues to hang with cars with more HP in straight line tests and out performs them in the other tests?
There's more to getting to point B in less time, how you get there is just as important.
I'm still waiting for you to enlighten me as to where I can drive 100 mph let alone 140.
As most of you know, you are very welcome to debate the merits of vehicles and the merits of arguments for and against principles involving the vehicles. You are not welcome to call each other names and/or get into any sort of personal flame wars.
Let's keep this conversation on the right track, please.
“Personally, I'm thinking that the 330 might have TOO MUCH power if anything, and wondering if I could have made do with a 325i.”
The last thing I would want to do is challenge someone like you who is no doubt a reasonable, responsible and thoughtful motorist. You enjoy the car – and there is much to enjoy about it – and if 225 hp might be too much, 186 hp would likely do you fine. For that matter, unless you’d be using the full rev range of a 325, I bet 130 hp would do you proud. That’s great, you should be delighted, as you are exactly the driver the 3-series is marketed to, and you have just the car you want.
But that doesn’t make it a sport sedan in my book, and the kind of gentle cruising you describe isn’t sport driving either.
So I guess you and I just have different priorities when we look for a sport sedan. Guess what? You win! Because there are a lot more prospective 3-series drivers with your views than mine. That’s why the cars have the levels of power – and no more – that they do. That's my complaint.
To shawn325:
You ask where I can drive 100 mph, much less 140. I live in Ontario. There are lots of such roads. I can and do string together several hundred miles of backcountry roads that are brilliant courses for a day’s sporting driving. Allowing not just the opportunity for high absolute speeds, but for exploiting all of a very high performance machine’s power in speeds that are high relative to the terrain, but not necessarily in absolute terms.
One of the best in Ontario is one of the longest – the 700 km roller-coaster between Ste. Sault Marie and Thunder Bay. I know many better ones in B.C. but no longer get the chance to get out there.
A lot of others I know and love in Ontario I won’t tell you about. I don’t need perfect gentlemen motorists like derprofi or perhaps you adding to the traffic by cruising along at a sedate pace “so as to prolong the driving pleasure”.
Both of you must realize that life is full of compromises, and diversity.
If you want power and speed (like rantfx), well then get a Ferrari or a Porsche GT2. Can't afford it? Well then you'll have to stick to your superbikes. If you want affordability, speed, and power, then the WRX is for you. But if you want it all or a good balance of everything, including looks, handling, and luxury, then you'll have to consider a BMW 3-series or the S4. And if you think the 3.5L Altima can "smoke" a 330 at the stoplights, just wait till you take the first turn at a good speed and you'll experience major understeer and ho-hum driving dynamics. And don't even get me started on the cheap interior.
ed5555, before you get overly ecstatic over the "02 Lexus IS 300 glowing reviews", just remember that only a full-fledged comparison test will let us know how it stacks against other sport sedans. And this has been mentioned before, the interior and exterior design of the IS300 is not what some of us would consider part of a luxury sports sedan - it's too much of a "boy-racer" style.
To sum it all up, each of us as individuals have different preferences, and when it comes to cars and driving, then some factors to consider are: power, speed, handling, driving dynamics, ride, luxury, looks, affordability, versatility, roominess, quality, reliability, etc. It is OK to have different preferences. It is OK to be different and drive different cars. No amount of your postings are going to change any of our preferences, and vice-versa...
Hey, fellow bimmerites. It's been some time since I last posted here, but I've been busy enjoying driving/cleaning/waxing Lena (my steel gray metallic 325Ci w/ SP). She's been amazing, and now with 5K miles, she's running more and more like a dream as the days progress.
First of all, I have some questions about snowtires, for both me and a friend w/ a 540i Sport. We've been looking around for some decent tires that will fit on our existing rims. Does anyone know about the Bridgstone Blizzak MZ-01s vs. the LM-22s? How do these differ, as they are about $100/set difference. Also, does anyone know how well the Michelin Pilot Alpins perform in the snow? How about Hakkapeliittas? Any advice would be helpful
I had the chance to use a co-worker's G-Tech Pro this past weekend on my 325Ci. If anyone doesn't know what this is, it's a device that measures 0-60 times, lateral grip, 1/4 mile times, and 60-0 braking distance and horsepower. I don't know how accurate it is, but it seems to work pretty well. for 0-60, you have to be on a flat road that's even and straight. I took Lena out and got a 6.89 the first time, which seemed true to the stats that have been posted for the 325Ci (mine's a manual, btw). The second time, I scored a 7.33. Choppy start. Well, the third time, I revved the engine to about 4000 rpm, let out the clutch quickly, and Lena just bolted w/ minimal wheel slippage. I scored at 6.34! I was shocked. I will try to replicate that or better it soon.
I've never heard of this. How often do you use this on your car? How much does it cost? And where can I get it? I love dark colored exteriors, but keeping them looking good has always been a problem, except on when I had my Black '98 Explorer Sport (I think the dirt hid in the orange peel). Thanks!
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
LOL means Laughing Out Loud, not lots of laughs. Same idea, though.
Someone had asked a couple of weeks ago how to clean the exterior rubber molding from wax. Well, I tried Vinilex and it worked like a charm. It washed the wax right off.
OK, can't hold it off any more: got my first win at the kart race tonight and I felt like a kid at Christmas!! We do three rounds. The last round I started 4-th and was running 2-nd about halfway into the race. I got stuck behind a slightly slower driver and someone from behind passed me with a great maneuver. I passed him back a lap later. Then we passed each other 2 more times and I managed to eke out a half-car length at the finish. What a rush!! We started talking after the race and it came out he owned a Porsche 911 (a '91). Great guy!! We happened to leave the parking lot at the same time and started driving on the highway behind each other. This time no passing, just a gentleman-like drive together. It's a special feeling I had not experienced... A 911 and a 325 in a friendly drive at 80-90 mph right after the drivers battled fiercely at the track. Needles to say I still have a huge smile on my face as I am writing this.
I know that i can't afford a BMW right now, but went out with a friend who can, and test drove it. We took out a 325 manual, no SP, for a long-ish spin. And I DO NOT have enough words to desribe the experience. I'm getting the feeling someone got the "Ultimate Driving Machine" quote precisely right.
Yes, we also test drove a Audi A4, Subaru WRX, an VW Jetta (V6 and 1.8T, both sport), Acura TL and TL-S, Lexus IS300 and Nissan Altima V6. He finally semes to have decided to get the A4 (1.8T, Quattro, Manual), for the intangibles that distinguish it from the 3-series, but NONE of the other were even contenders. The IS300 might have been, but the looks, quality and interior were a HUGE turn-off.
The 325 did not feel like it had merely 184 HP. And the torque just laid on so smoothly (the only real competitor in terms of engine and driving feel, the A4 turbo). And the handling - better than superlative. Its a pity the A4 was more like what my friend was looking for, not to mention the great deals available on them. Maybe I can still get him to change his mind!
Also, people - I don't know how accurate this is, and my friend doesn't agree with me or believe me, but I could FEEL the fact that this was RWD, and loved the steering feel and driving dynamics even more so because of this. Anyone else relate to that?
So, shawn325i, even a 30-minute test-drive CAN do the trick :-)
And I'm going to hold off on buying a new car at my approx 20K budget (currently planned for) early 2002, and wait a few more months and take the plunge for a 325i SP. And the wait is going to be tough!
Different strokes for different folks, but if the WRX (or any other toy-car) does it for you - more power to you! But its going to be the 'BMW-thing' for me, no doubt.
Can anyone recommend a BMW dealership in the Chicago area. I've decided to take the plunge and purchase a 2002 330i, but I'm not getting a good feeling from my nearby dealer.
I would like to negotiate the lowest price possible, and it appears that some dealerships are inclined to "hold the line" on pricing despite empty showrooms. I plan to do the European Delivery Program, which in my opinion requires nothing more than the dealer "pushing paperwork".
What has been a reasonable "over invoice" price recently. Have dealers been passing on the 4.9% financing offered by BMW?
I just ordered a set of 205/55-16 Dunlop Winter Sport M2's for my 325Ci. Got them with a set of steel wheels. The wheel covers are pretty ugly, but who's gonna care when the roads are covered with slush and sand. The whole package from Tire Rack cost about $680 shipped.
I had orginally ordered Blizzak MZ-01's, but this is what the tirerack guy told me. He said that the Blizzaks are for the ultimate ice/snow grip short of studded tires. However they are very squirmy on dry pavement and wear out like crazy. The Dunlops are much better all round tires, with good dry performance, good ice/snow performance, and good wear. He said the Tire Rack's owner used them on his M5 and loved them. The Dunlop's have a great score on Tirerack evaluation table. Check them out.
Comments
Easy Ed
Recently, you commented that the BMW (three series, I believe) was priced competitively relative to Japanese cars in the same class. I was initially skeptical but became convinced after spending time comparing specific vehicles. Essentially, BMW designs a car that is well engineered and incorporates the latest safety and engine management systems. In the US, many of the standard features such as ABS and DSC are either expensive options or not available on the Japanese counterparts. We recently purchased a Japanese car for essentially the same cost as our three series BMW. Whereas the Japanese car is well equipped with GPS and power seats, the car does not corner, brake, or maneuver nearly as well as the BMW. With many Japanese cars, improved handling features are not an option. With the BMW, it is always standard, at least in the US.
Thank you for the thought provoking post.
Thanks!
Easy Ed
The Jetta is a great design on paper but the concept all starts to fall apart when it gets assembled in Mexico. The fact you'll never hear reference to the made in Mexico thing from VW itself confirms that even the company concedes it's nothing to be proud about, to say the least. Mexico has never been known to produce any quality product and they haven't rehabilitated their reputation with the Jetta. (Cars often come with spare fuses. But don't take a Jetta off the lot without a $4,000 spare parts kit of things like electric window regulators that blow regularly.) To plagiarize a comment I read elsewhere, reading the Jetta-related message boards with the endless litany of mechanical and quality problems reminds you of the carnage of bombed out vehicles discarded by the Iraqis when they hightailed it out of Kuwait.
Bottom line: if you get a Jetta why not re-badge it yourself with some spell-it-yourself stickers as the "Burrito". It'll look pretty crappy at first but soon that's the perception you'll have of the whole car.
As to the BMW, it's astounding how much mileage a car can get simply by having a well-balanced chassis and good brakes. There's no doubt the car earns high points for those aspects - at least in dry weather. (In the snow, it's a relative nightmare and you'll wish your probation officer made you buy a Daewoo instead.) But beyond a good-weather chassis balance, the 3-series is pretty modest stuff. Watch out for Grandma in her new Altima - she can smoke you at the lights if she wants and might even do it without trying - and she doesn't wear $300 designer sunglasses like most 3-series drivers. The pretence to performance - what with the talk of "ultimate driving experience" - sounds rather hollow when you find out that the performance in many ways is pretty mediocre. Why is a 330i - for which you can spend over $50,000 - speed-governed to 126 mph, less than many fleet cars peddled by GM to rental agencies? And the lowest Honda comes with more standard equipment. Moreover, and here's the real crunch, a patient and thoughtful review of BMW owner's experiences confirms that BMW reliability and assembly quality is really not magnitudes better than the Jettas - the frequency of problems is somewhat less, the repair cost is a lot higher, and altogether it falls miles short of where Lexus is in terms of assembly quality.
Bottom line: you're paying for solid gold, but getting something that's merely electroplated.
Your choice.
The ironic part is, if they don't have to pay, they'll drop their current car in a second, and jump into a BMW.
Maybe we should start a BMW envy fund, so we can send these poor people to therapy.
Stephen
rantfx (son of v_tech), even though you're probably only 16, sweeping generalizations like that are sure to make you popular with old-timers
Well, just to prove I have an open mind, I read the article. Seems as though the WRX does indeed have some oomph. Managed to beat 7 of the other 9 from 0 to 60. Unfortunately, it came in at #9 out of 10 in handling with an Isuzu Trooper like 0.76 lateral g's. This, mind you, amoung such worthy competitors as the $18,000 Dodge Neon (0.79 g's) and the $18,500 Mazda MP3 (0.84 g's). Don't like those damn "G" numbers, well it came in DEAD LAST in slalom speed and only beat 2 of ten in braking from 60 to 0.
Yeah, the WRX sure is going to get me to "save a buck or two" and forget about the M3. As long as I don't decide to save a few more bucks and get the MP3.
Happy reading.
"most of the anti-BMW posters I've seen on the Edmunds' boards always seem to post something about how if they don't have to pay, they'll own one"
Although I never said that, in a way you're right - I'd regard the 3-series in a somewhat different light if I didn't have to pay these things:
(1) $48,000 plus (Canadian) for a car that gives performance much the same as a whole host of cars costing half that amount; and
(2) repair and maintenance costs that are well in excess of the industry leaders, like Lexus or Honda.
At no point did I suggest that I "don't like" the product, much less to the point that I wouldn't take it if it was given to me. Not that such a juvenile query means anything.
I can assure you it's hardly a case of envy, though that instinctive response from BMW owners is quite common, and tends to prove that to them their car are all about status rather than performance.
I happen to be considering the purchase of a "sports sedan" but am sincerely disappointed at how the category is largely taken up by vehicles more suited for status posing than for optimized performance. When "the ultimate driving experience" does 0-60 in the 7's, is speed-governed to 126 and is whipped by a bunch of econoboxes, I have to wonder what the engineering and marketing priorities of the manufacturer are.
I suppose the idea of a "sports" machine raises my expectations more than yours. As a recreational indulgence, I'm quite familiar with open-class sportbikes, and currently ride a Honda 929 which, completely stock, has a performance level comparable to World Championship racing bikes about 7 years ago: a power:weight ratio of about 2.5 lbs/hp, 175 mph top speed, 0-60 in 2.4 seconds, etc. Riding one of these is truly and genuinely a "sporting" proposition, and would never be compared with an "econo-bike" in any respect whatsoever. In contrast, BMW 3-series share the same dimensions of power performance as many econo-boxes, and I'm absolutely confounded as to how that's deemed acceptable by the marketplace. With routine family sedans having in the order of 200 - 250 hp, my recipe for a "sports sedan" would start where BMW's ends - at the M3 level. Heck, even that car has a power:weight ratio of little better than 10 lbs/hp - hardly earthshattering. Currently – and needlessly - it's at the price of an exotic, and beyond the means of me at least. No doubt if the market demanded it, BMW could make a 333 hp engine standard in every 3-series for about the same cost as a 330i. But they don’t, because people like you are quite content with mediocre power levels. I’m not.
You (representing I suppose the thoughts of 3-series owners generally) and I simply have different definitions of what a "sports" sedan is, and should be. You think it's fine if the power performance capabilities are the same as those of an econo-box. I don't.
As an aside: my earlier post was condemned for spoiling the party being held here by a "group of people who are all relatively happy with their purchase of a BMW 3 series and who are sharing their enjoyment about them." Well, too bad, if I'm not just another drone in the self-congratulatory chanting, blindly endorsing the company’s marketing gameplan. If you can't stand different perspectives being advanced about your pride and joy, maybe you should stick to reading the slogans and taglines in BMW's promotional material instead.
Finally, with all the complaints about dubious reliability and shoddy workmanship on this thread, I wouldn't quite agree with your characterization of 3-series owners here as "all relatively happy ... sharing their enjoyment."
Easy Ed
If you're looking for pure performance, the word SEDAN shouldn't fit into your vernacular. By definition, a SEDAN has already conceded some aspects of performance to other considerations, such as space, utliity, and occupant safety. Taken a step further, for true on-ground performance, the word CAR should be abandoned as well: what 4-wheeled vehicle can come within an order-of-magnitude of the performance-value function offered by today's superbikes?
My point is that the 3-series is not the BEST in any given category, be it safety, performance, space, or comfort. But it is ONE OF THE BEST in ALL of these aspects simultaneously, which, in turn, justifies the premium owners are willing (in great numbers, I might add) to pay.
According to you, all sedans labled "sport" should go at least 140 mph, I'd like to know where you would drive 140 mph in a so called in your opinion sport sedan day in and day out in Canada?
I too agree with a previous post that the numbers have very little to do with the actual driving experience. I do not drive at excessive speeds but I love the feel of the car, the way it takes turns, the sound of the engine and the entire driving experience. It cannot be quantified in terms of numbers. I use to drive a Lexus 300 GS which is as mechanically perfect and reliable as you can find. And you know what, to me it was a boring car. It never put a smile on my face to start it up like the BMW does. The 3 series are expensive cars and it does not make the people who drive them any better or worse than anyone else. Certainly we can judge the value of a human being on things much more important than the type of car they drive. These are great fun cars and to those who choose to spend their hard earned dollars on them I think they will be rewarded. To others who don't see the value, I certainly understand their point of view.
I happen to be driving a 1995 Nissan Maxima SE with 115k trouble free miles under its belt. Knock on wood, I am finalizing a business deal that would enable me to trade up to virtually anything I want (assuming I decide to). So I've driven quite a few cars. Several two or three times. Pretty much everthing made in Europe or Japan. From under $30k to quite a bit more. I am looking to impress no one but myself (and maybe my two young daughters). As much as have appreciated the Maxima, I would never suggest it can compete with the overall handling and performance of a BMW 5-series. And although the Accord is a great no-nonsense commuter (I've owned two Honda's), I find it hard to believe that anyone who considers themself a "sport" enthusiast would fail to see an enormous driving difference between a BMW 3 or 5 series and an Accord. After all, I'm driving a seven year old car that can still kick the butt off any stock Accord ever made, and I can tell!! Damn, sorry about that. Anyway, to each their own. I used to think the "Ultimate Driving Machine" was excessive marketing hype. Until I drove several. They are pretty close.
P.S. I shoved a wood shim between the passenger side A pillar and dash to stop an annoying squeek and rattle in my Maxima about 4 years ago and it has worked beautifully ever since. While I am not the least bit embarrassed to point out this feat of owner-engineering to curious passengers, I sincerely hope it is not required by my next purchase.
Happy motoring.
Some people have valid reasons for not wanting a BMW, and I respect that, but trolls, I shouldn't even waste my time with them.
Edward5555: Slanderous, and liable remarks, among other things are not covered under freedom of speech.
Easy Ed, I have a nice .PDF file of some of your previously deleted posts if you care to review the tasteful comments you've made here under the guise of "free speech" LOL...
I think some of the Bimmer fans who post on this thread need to be reminded of that.
And apparently trolls who insist on repeated flamebaiting comments, and who then fall back to "just kidding" or "just being provocative" when they're called on it, need to be reminded to take their comments elsewhere.
As I said before, I think the Bimmer is an excellent car, but there are some issues surrounding it regarding costs, reliability, and performance that I think at least MERIT discussion.
And the information you have which backs up your claims of "issues" is where? As someone who is about to buy a 3er, I would like nothing more than to have a discussion of this car's issues backed up by verifiable facts. Please share!
I am a fan of the car, am thinking about getting one, but find it odd that those who already own one are so defensive when certain questions/issues are raised. Extremely odd to me.
If you would raise issues without trolling and have SOMETHING backing them up, perhaps people would take you seriously. Hearsay ain't gonna cut it here, laddie. What's odd to me is that you're somehow under the delusion that your posts are the height of objectivity and innocent curiosity.
As for this fella...
Finally, with all the complaints about dubious reliability and shoddy workmanship on this thread, I wouldn't quite agree with your characterization of 3-series owners here as "all relatively happy ... sharing their enjoyment."
rantfx, I'll ask the same of you. Where are all these complaints? I've read through the whole 9000+ post thread perhaps twice and I've yet to see all these complaints that you're referring to. Sure, there's the odd bad experience mixed in there--I'd be suspicious if there weren't. But I see nothing of the magnitude you're implying. Must be some kind of conspiracy to keep potential BMW buyers in the dark, eh? Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to take my Grandmother to the Nissan dealer to pick up her new Altima, and then it's off to the mall to get my new pair of Maui Jim's because these Oakleys are sooooo "August 2001".
“Certainly on paper, there are a number of cars out there that compare well or handily beat the 3-series in terms of HP, performance, price and other criteria.”
My point is that even on “paper” a sport sedan should look different – very different – than ordinary family sedans.
I agree with you that “it's the intangibles that make the difference” at least if you’re talking about the mechanical aesthetics of a machine (a finely balanced 3-series no doubt is in a different realm than an Altima or Accord). And I give BMW full credit for its actual accomplishments in the 3-series (chassis, brakes) although I note in passing that they are softening even those factors to appeal to a larger and lower common denominator of status-seeking posers (making the steering lighter, for example).
Having said all that, I still maintain that an essential prerequisite to a sport sedan is a measure of power performance that’s well beyond the ordinary family sedan – in addition to the rarified handling and the “intangibles” of sophisticated engineering. The whole thing falls flat when there isn’t the power to back it up – in other words, if you get smoked by Aunt Mable in her Altima.
There’s really no difference in the application of these principles to sedans instead of 4 seater coupes, at least in the cars we’re talking about here.
You observe that “what 4-wheeled vehicle can come within an order-of-magnitude of the performance-value function offered by today's superbikes”. By referring to bikes I was not suggesting that a sports sedan could ever compete with a superbike. My point was that in the Japanese bike market power performance is taken very seriously in a way its not in the 3-series/IS300/A4 “sport” sedan market. Honda couldn’t get away with marketing a 600 “sport” bike that had power performance no better than competitors’ offerings in lesser categories, but this is exactly what BMW is getting away with in the 3-series, and it’s doing so with the cheering consent of its customers like you.
I can assure you that if the purchasers of 3-series insisted that all 3-series had M3 levels of power, and all at the current price ranges for the 325 and 330, BMW would provide it. It’s the fact that 3-series customers don’t demand it that I lament.
Again I am criticized for “negative” comments about the 3-series. But I’m not so much criticizing the car, or the company, but rather the customers who are defining what the market for these cars is. By my comments, saying I’m a prospective customer but I want more power, I’m doing my part to express what my little speck of the marketplace demands, and I’m doing my part to influence what sport sedans are all about.
It’s the customers, not the company, that defines the car.
The more people there are like me, the more likely it’ll be ordinary 3-series will have M3 levels of power.
The more people there are like you, the more likely 3-series cars will be whipped by Altimas.
So it’s my turn. I ask all of you why ~you~ are being negative about the 3-series’ future – by failing to insist that the car have truly sporting levels of power.
By the way, I never suggested an Accord was a better car than a 3-series (though it actually is in terms of reliability – sorry). But since one of you raised the fact that I have an Accord (I gather by tracing my posts on other threads) I invite you to share my perspective for a moment.
I actually have two Hondas. Each has 150 hp. One weighs 3200 lbs, the other weighs 375 lbs. Is it really worth it to spend twice as much on the 4-wheeler when the power only gets up to 186 or 225? I don’t think so. It wasn’t even worth it to me to get the 200 hp Accord. If you want to attract ~my~ attention with something you call a “sport sedan”, well, it better have some serious power. So far, 325 and 330 BMWs don’t. I’d like to see that change. You don’t seem to care. That’s our difference.
Have you bought or shopped for a 3-Series BMW, C-Class Mercedes, Jaguar X-Type or other small sports sedan since Sept 11? If so, your comments are of great interest. Please get in touch with me via jfallon@edmunds.com.
You may also drop by the Smart Shopper discussion at this link to respond: prlady1 "Talk to the Press" Oct 8, 2001 1:48pmThanks as always,
Jonathan Welsh
The Wall Street Journal
I have owned Honda's, Acura's, and driven a Lexus and infinity several times to know that they do not even compare in overall performance to the BMW.
Now, even I understand why the owners on this page love their cars so much and go to extreme lenghts to defend them.
Thanks, I'm happy with the 3-series as-is without your input as a non-owner. How about redirecting that energy to Subaru and convincing them to make the WRX a little less ug..ummm, I mean, more attractive?
The more people there are like you, the more likely 3-series cars will be whipped by Altimas.
Lots of people don't worry about "getting whipped". In fact, I enjoy cruising with the top down so much in my SLK that I occasionally go the speed limit so as to prolong the driving pleasure. Imagine that!
So it’s my turn. I ask all of you why ~you~ are being negative about the 3-series’ future – by failing to insist that the car have truly sporting levels of power.
You might think it's clever to turn it around like that, but that's an answer to a question no one is asking. Would the rest of us sit here and conclude you're being negative about the Accord's future because you're not insisting that Honda give it handling characteristics equal to a 3-series? I doubt it.
Edward5555, if you would care to make just one argument based on fact or merit, many here would be happy to debate. But you haven't! Understand that "LOTS of people tell me that..." doesn't count as fact or merit. Instead, you troll. And not only that, you don't even excel at trolling which is evidenced by the fact that many of your old posts were deleted--and I certainly do treasure them
Now to get back on topic, doesn't anyone have a picture of the '02 330i sport package yet?
You have probably never driven a 3 series for any extended period (no a 30 minute test drive does not count) of time so your comments are not credible.
What is your thoughts on why it is that the 3 series continues to hang with cars with more HP in straight line tests and out performs them in the other tests?
There's more to getting to point B in less time, how you get there is just as important.
I'm still waiting for you to enlighten me as to where I can drive 100 mph let alone 140.
Let's keep this conversation on the right track, please.
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
“Personally, I'm thinking that the 330 might have TOO MUCH power if anything, and wondering if I could have made do with a 325i.”
The last thing I would want to do is challenge someone like you who is no doubt a reasonable, responsible and thoughtful motorist. You enjoy the car – and there is much to enjoy about it – and if 225 hp might be too much, 186 hp would likely do you fine. For that matter, unless you’d be using the full rev range of a 325, I bet 130 hp would do you proud. That’s great, you should be delighted, as you are exactly the driver the 3-series is marketed to, and you have just the car you want.
But that doesn’t make it a sport sedan in my book, and the kind of gentle cruising you describe isn’t sport driving either.
So I guess you and I just have different priorities when we look for a sport sedan. Guess what? You win! Because there are a lot more prospective 3-series drivers with your views than mine. That’s why the cars have the levels of power – and no more – that they do. That's my complaint.
To shawn325:
You ask where I can drive 100 mph, much less 140. I live in Ontario. There are lots of such roads. I can and do string together several hundred miles of backcountry roads that are brilliant courses for a day’s sporting driving. Allowing not just the opportunity for high absolute speeds, but for exploiting all of a very high performance machine’s power in speeds that are high relative to the terrain, but not necessarily in absolute terms.
One of the best in Ontario is one of the longest – the 700 km roller-coaster between Ste. Sault Marie and Thunder Bay. I know many better ones in B.C. but no longer get the chance to get out there.
A lot of others I know and love in Ontario I won’t tell you about. I don’t need perfect gentlemen motorists like derprofi or perhaps you adding to the traffic by cruising along at a sedate pace “so as to prolong the driving pleasure”.
http://www.e46fanatics.com/phorum/list.php?f=1&t=61032&a=2
If you want power and speed (like rantfx), well then get a Ferrari or a Porsche GT2. Can't afford it? Well then you'll have to stick to your superbikes. If you want affordability, speed, and power, then the WRX is for you. But if you want it all or a good balance of everything, including looks, handling, and luxury, then you'll have to consider a BMW 3-series or the S4. And if you think the 3.5L Altima can "smoke" a 330 at the stoplights, just wait till you take the first turn at a good speed and you'll experience major understeer and ho-hum driving dynamics. And don't even get me started on the cheap interior.
ed5555, before you get overly ecstatic over the "02 Lexus IS 300 glowing reviews", just remember that only a full-fledged comparison test will let us know how it stacks against other sport sedans. And this has been mentioned before, the interior and exterior design of the IS300 is not what some of us would consider part of a luxury sports sedan - it's too much of a "boy-racer" style.
To sum it all up, each of us as individuals have different preferences, and when it comes to cars and driving, then some factors to consider are: power, speed, handling, driving dynamics, ride, luxury, looks, affordability, versatility, roominess, quality, reliability, etc. It is OK to have different preferences. It is OK to be different and drive different cars. No amount of your postings are going to change any of our preferences, and vice-versa...
First of all, I have some questions about snowtires, for both me and a friend w/ a 540i Sport. We've been looking around for some decent tires that will fit on our existing rims. Does anyone know about the Bridgstone Blizzak MZ-01s vs. the LM-22s? How do these differ, as they are about $100/set difference. Also, does anyone know how well the Michelin Pilot Alpins perform in the snow? How about Hakkapeliittas? Any advice would be helpful
I had the chance to use a co-worker's G-Tech Pro this past weekend on my 325Ci. If anyone doesn't know what this is, it's a device that measures 0-60 times, lateral grip, 1/4 mile times, and 60-0 braking distance and horsepower. I don't know how accurate it is, but it seems to work pretty well. for 0-60, you have to be on a flat road that's even and straight. I took Lena out and got a 6.89 the first time, which seemed true to the stats that have been posted for the 325Ci (mine's a manual, btw). The second time, I scored a 7.33. Choppy start. Well, the third time, I revved the engine to about 4000 rpm, let out the clutch quickly, and Lena just bolted w/ minimal wheel slippage. I scored at 6.34! I was shocked. I will try to replicate that or better it soon.
I've never heard of this. How often do you use this on your car? How much does it cost? And where can I get it? I love dark colored exteriors, but keeping them looking good has always been a problem, except on when I had my Black '98 Explorer Sport (I think the dirt hid in the orange peel). Thanks!
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
Someone had asked a couple of weeks ago how to clean the exterior rubber molding from wax. Well, I tried Vinilex and it worked like a charm. It washed the wax right off.
OK, can't hold it off any more: got my first win at the kart race tonight and I felt like a kid at Christmas!! We do three rounds. The last round I started 4-th and was running 2-nd about halfway into the race. I got stuck behind a slightly slower driver and someone from behind passed me with a great maneuver. I passed him back a lap later. Then we passed each other 2 more times and I managed to eke out a half-car length at the finish. What a rush!! We started talking after the race and it came out he owned a Porsche 911 (a '91). Great guy!! We happened to leave the parking lot at the same time and started driving on the highway behind each other. This time no passing, just a gentleman-like drive together. It's a special feeling I had not experienced... A 911 and a 325 in a friendly drive at 80-90 mph right after the drivers battled fiercely at the track. Needles to say I still have a huge smile on my face as I am writing this.
Yes, we also test drove a Audi A4, Subaru WRX, an VW Jetta (V6 and 1.8T, both sport), Acura TL and TL-S, Lexus IS300 and Nissan Altima V6. He finally semes to have decided to get the A4 (1.8T, Quattro, Manual), for the intangibles that distinguish it from the 3-series, but NONE of the other were even contenders. The IS300 might have been, but the looks, quality and interior were a HUGE turn-off.
The 325 did not feel like it had merely 184 HP. And the torque just laid on so smoothly (the only real competitor in terms of engine and driving feel, the A4 turbo). And the handling - better than superlative. Its a pity the A4 was more like what my friend was looking for, not to mention the great deals available on them. Maybe I can still get him to change his mind!
Also, people - I don't know how accurate this is, and my friend doesn't agree with me or believe me, but I could FEEL the fact that this was RWD, and loved the steering feel and driving dynamics even more so because of this. Anyone else relate to that?
So, shawn325i, even a 30-minute test-drive CAN do the trick :-)
And I'm going to hold off on buying a new car at my approx 20K budget (currently planned for) early 2002, and wait a few more months and take the plunge for a 325i SP. And the wait is going to be tough!
Different strokes for different folks, but if the WRX (or any other toy-car) does it for you - more power to you! But its going to be the 'BMW-thing' for me, no doubt.
I would like to negotiate the lowest price possible, and it appears that some dealerships are inclined to "hold the line" on pricing despite empty showrooms. I plan to do the European Delivery Program, which in my opinion requires nothing more than the dealer "pushing paperwork".
What has been a reasonable "over invoice" price recently. Have dealers been passing on the 4.9% financing offered by BMW?
Any advice would be appreciated.
I had orginally ordered Blizzak MZ-01's, but this is what the tirerack guy told me. He said that the Blizzaks are for the ultimate ice/snow grip short of studded tires. However they are very squirmy on dry pavement and wear out like crazy. The Dunlops are much better all round tires, with good dry performance, good ice/snow performance, and good wear. He said the Tire Rack's owner used them on his M5 and loved them. The Dunlop's have a great score on Tirerack evaluation table. Check them out.