Kia Sedona (2005 and Earlier)

fezo · October 2001

On the Ody being more trouble prone. Of course the Sedona hasn't been out in these parts long enough to have a track record, but I'd put the Ody up against the MPV on reliability any day, Of course in my case the MPV was too small so it wasn't an issue. I've driven a couple of MPVs - they're nice vans.

Actually the resale value is more of an issue up front. Hondas typically have insanely good resale value. There are still 99s out there selling for what they sold for new. Insane. The issue there is "we have it right here right now."

drew_ · October 2001

I see that you recently swapped to a '02 Odyssey! Congrats!

Drew
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pjd58 · October 2001

Check out the MPV problem board, nary a problem. So I agree to disagree with you.

I'm sorry Sedonna owners for taking up your time. I'm totally impressed with the Sedonna, good luck with your new vans.

Pjd58

dwharper · October 2001

I'm in the process of closing the deal with CarsDirect for an EX with ABS, Leather, and two-tone paint. MSRP $23,230. CarsDirect price $21,891. Total out the door price (actually delivered to my door price) $23,004.

So far my experience with CarsDirect has been a dream. They found the car I wanted in just one day. This is in stark contrast with my experiences with dealers. When I first became interested in the Sedona, I couldn't find one to test drive. I was on the local dealerships call list. Two or three times they called saying they had one to test drive. By the time I got there (usually within 30 minutes), the van had sold and I wouldn't be allowed to drive it. On the last day of 1.9% financing, I found one at an out of town dealership. My wife and I drove the hour and half with three kids to test drive the van. Miracle of miracles it was still there. It drove like a dream, but it was not equipped the way we wanted. I think, no problem, just get 'em to find me one. Wrong. They won't sell me one unless they can find it that day and have VIN in hand. Tick-tock the clock was running out on the 1.9% financing. Bzzzt, time ran out. I couldn't believe they wouldn't sell me a van.

I wait a while. I get an unexpected windfall that makes financing a lot less important. I head back to the local dealership. I tell 'em exactly what I want. Sorry, they don't have that on the lot. Duh, I know that. I ask them to find one. They say they can check their "promised list," but wait a minute Mr. So- and-so has the list and he's going to be on vacation this week. Dumbfounded that they don't seem to want to make the effort, I leave.

I pack up the wife and kids and head to yet another out-of-town dealership thinking somebody surely wants to sell me a van. Before going I call the dealer up and the salesman assures me that they can get whatever I want. They have "special pull" with Kia. I get there and the salesman starts asking me a bunch of questions about my present van. He's writing it down. I interrupt him and said I wasn't sure I wasn't even going to trade the van in. He said that he needed to know how much I needed for the van. For example, if you want $2000 for the van, he'd have to tell his manager $3000, so I'd have a better chance to get what I was really wanting. This should have been my first clue.

Anyway we give him our 3 choices on color and the options we want. He has someone start a search for the vehicle. I think, "wow, someone who finally wants to sell me a van." Searching for the van takes forever. While waiting I start looking at the Sedona's on the lot. Hum, pin stripping $400. ADM $1300. Protection package $600. I mosey back into the salesman office and casually ask, "what's ADM." He replies that's After Dealer Markup. I say that I'm paying for that. He said, "yes you will." I asked if they were willing to deal off that at all, and he said no. I told him he was wasting my time, and I pick up my briefcase and start out the door. He stops me, but we proceed to get into an argument. He goes on and on about how any company with a hot product will get as much as they can for it. He gives the song and dance of how that was the way with the PT Cruiser. He tells me how dealerships are making so little profit on cars. I point to the graph on a poster in his office showing the dramatic growth in Kia dealerships. I tell him I was able to buy a 1991 Miata at MSRP. He says their dealership has yet to take off the ADM. I said the world was full of stupid people, but I wasn't one. He said all the dealers were putting the markup on. Having checked the sticker prices at other dealerships, I knew he was lying. I told him that unless he was willing to deal, I was walking. He said only his manager could do that. I said fine, then I'd deal with him. He said, and I quote, "no, you deal with me only." "Really" I said. I packed up my briefcase yet again. I walk over the manager's office, knocked on the door, reached out and shook the hands of the first two people and said, Hello, my name is D. Harper and I'd like to buy a Kia van. About this time, tomfool salesman follows me in looking flustered, so I add, "and this gentleman won't sell me one." Salesman explains they are looking for a van on the computer now. And tells me he'll give me a price as soon as the results come in.

Finally, an hour or so later, they find a van. There best price $22,635 (MSRP $23,230). Hmm, guess he was lying about the discounting. At this point the man had so pissed me off, I wouldn't buy it from him at invoice. I tell him my wife and I need to line up the finances and will contact him the next day. Now he goes on and on about how hard these things are to find (a direct contradiction to what he said on the phone to get me down) and that it may be gone. I told him we'd take that chance.

I go back to the local dealership and tell 'em about the ADM. They laugh and say that they don't do that. I tell, I need 'em to find me a van as I was hot to buy. Okay, they say, they'll look tomorrow. Well tomorrow comes and they haven't even looked. All they say is, well, we have 15 coming on Friday, but we won't know what they are until Wednesday. Oh brother.

Thank God for CarsDirect. One day and they find me exactly what I want and they beat the dealership by $744 to boot.

dwh

stever · October 2001

Nice story, dwharper. Be sure to check out the current poll at the bottom of the main Town Hall page :-).

Steve
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Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

ronfrat · October 2001

dwharper, interesting story. I have had the exact same problems with some dealers in my area. Like you, I am not stupid and refuse to give my money to someone who lies to or tries to deceive me this way. I would be very interested to know with which dealer it was that you had this difficulty.

I tried Cars Direct.com, all they could offer was MSRP. Which is still better than this 'Add On' fee, but not quite good enough. I guess my search continues.

sglisson · October 2001

DW, I had the same type of experience with dealers. Mine wanted to add $1400 as a "Port Charge" aka "Fooled-you-into-putting-more-money-in-my-pocket charge". I couldn't get them to budge more than $500 off the total price. That's crazy! I then went to carsdirect and got the exact color/features on my EX and was driving it in 3 days. They also delivered it right to my house! The best part is that I got it for lots less than I could get it at the dealer!
I'll use carsdirect.com again.

fezo · October 2001

I've played with carsdirect to get the lay of the land and had always ended up getting a dealer to match it come so close I went with the dealer (just to have a local person to bring questions/problems to). Glad to see it in action.

On the MPV vs Ody problems I was going to rebut with "well, there are more posts in the MPV problems than the Ody problems"), but then I went looking and in both cases I'd say the majority of posts aren't about problems anyway. I'll even admit this is probably more true in the MPV topic.

To all you new Sedona owners - may you have the same satisfying experience.

mariners · October 2001

Help me.

I am trying to get hold of a 2001 Dodge Durango, but I can't find the car that I want.

I have tried CarsDirect.com, but I don't know how it works. How does it work? Do they find the car I want near my area, so I could test drive it? Or do they just sell them to me?

The best deal I've got is a 24,770 US dollars on a Dodge Durang SLT (!! CHEAP !!), and I am willing to buy, but I am hasitant about CarsDirect.com.

Thanks in advance.

sglisson · October 2001

HW, Most likely the carsdirect agent won't tell you what dealership your car is at. However, autobytel.com gives you the name of the dealerships that they work with and you could call them to see if they have one you could test-drive. I definitely would not buy a car without a test-drive. About the location, they will first search in your area for your desired car and then if they can't find it they will expand their search. This does not effect the price and they can even deliver it to your house if it has to come from a long distance. Happy hunting.

martib · October 2001

Too much shopping, now's the time to take the plunge. I'm picking up a Sedona EX today. I was able to knock off $1,100 from the $27,500 MSRP. They also gave me slightly better for my 96 Windstar that the other dealers were willing to do. It did take 2 weeks to get the color that I wanted and the dealer didn't have a real good handle on the timing of the delivery, but it's ready for pickup today. I'll let you know how the transfer goes and what the prep is like. P.S. the dealer is located in Ottawa Ontario.

jlngwr · October 2001

Hope you didn't pay too much!! My understanding is that the EX fully loaded tops out at around $24,500 USD. It sounds like your dealer is using fancy accounting - giving you so much off of the MSRP and more for your trade than usual. I had a similar experience when I bought the LX. On the phone I was quoted a price $500 below MSRP (to get me in there?). Once the deal was made, a trade value agreed upon, all of a sudden they couldn't sell me the car for the price agreed on the phone, but back up to the MSRP. I was ready to walk, but in the end the paper work was written up with the MSRP and $500 more on my trade. It all comes out in the wash, but I guess it made management happy. How do these people sleep at night?

seanej · October 2001

Dear Friends,

My wife is very interested in the Sedona but I am not familiar with Kia at all. How does their reputation stack up with other manufacturers? Yes, the longer warranties are nice but it's still a hassle to have to take the vehicle back to the dealer and it's even worse when you have to argue with them to do the work under the warranty.

If anyone has feedback about Kia reliability, (I realize the Sedona is a new model so there can't be any data) please let me know.

Thank you,

Sean

tboner1965 · October 2001

Martib is in Canada, so he paid like $2.49 USD (j/k) his van.

The 27500 $CDN is about 17515 $USD using todays rates.

I dunno what taxes are added to that, but the Kia may be an even better bargain north of the border.

TB

mariners · October 2001

Mwhahahaha. O% financing, third-row seating. I wonder why anyone would want to buy a Sedona when you can have a Durangon

Thanks!

I think I'll just hunt for a Durango in my area instead..

jlngwr · October 2001

Tboner1965 - I considered that possiblility but thought NO WAY would it be selling for that price. If true, I wish I'd known before I bought mine, I'm not that far away from Canada. Could've made a nice weekend out of it too.

tboner1965 · October 2001

yes you could buy it there, but there is a good chance you would have to take it back to Canada to have it serviced under the warranty.

I think some folks who purchased Odysseys found this out. Honda America and Honda Canada are two different "companies"

Probably the same for Kia. So any costs savings would be negated in hassle and possibly real money. (Or even Canadian looney money 8^) )

TB

jasdmw · October 2001

An article in todays Toronto Star stated that every month about 1700 used vehicles from Canada head south, representing the cream of the used car inventory. Dealers down there recognize the profit margins they can make from buying up here and shipping south so they pay higher prices at auction than the local dealers can. There are even brokers up here making a living shipping cars south; new and used. Some Canadian franchised dealers have been threatened with loosing their franchise because new cars destined for sale in Canada only ended up in US dealer lots. It's a massive business and warranties are not an issue. The free trade agreement has made it easy to get cars to the States. I have a Sienna. In the regular and the extended warranty, it explicitly states that the warranty is good anywhere in North America.

Also adding to the mix is the fact that cars are priced less for the same thing here than in teh States. Seems you folks have more disposable income and are charged accordingly.

dreadedrummer · October 2001

Isn't the warrenty less in Canada than the US? I was pretty sure I heard that that was the case for Hyundai's, so I'm guessing that it's the same thing with Kia's.

groth12345 · October 2001

I have test driven 3 Sedonas (LX and 2 EX) and they are all very nice. Quiet ride, powerful engine, smooth transmission. Like a much more expensive car. The heck with paying Toyota or Honda $10K more for the same features and nearly equivalent ride.

However, what's the concensus on RESALE VALUE? I hope to keep the car for say 8 years, or 96K miles (keep it under 100Kmiles). I hope that the car won't cost me any more than $2000/yr in depreciation costs. Is it possible that if I pay $22K for an EX now and take off $16K for depreciation and use, that I could possibly get $6K for my Sedona in 2008?

I just sold my 93 Olds Silhouette for $4K with 129K miles and it cost me $20K originally. I put in at least $2K over the years on top of that so I figure it cost me $2K/yr in depreciation and use. I hope that the Sedona would be similar (though the cost of minivans today are obviously higher than in 1993).

Opinions?

carleton1 · October 2001

Our experience in buying and trading in has indicated the dealers want AT LEAST $3000 for their margin between trade-in and suggested selling price.
How much interest would be paid for the extra $10,000 extra cost at purchase?
Buy the vehicle you personally prefer. We were as impressed with the ride and drive of the Sedona as with the Odyssey and Sienna.
Hypothetical resale can change in 8 years. If you like the Odyssey or Sienna more than the Sedona, bite the bullet and pay the extra $10,000.
Remember that the Sedona does not have ABS as standard equipment. The Sedona also has much poorer EPA fuel guestimates than the Odyssey and Sienna. However, the price difference does make a person look seriously at the Sedona.

groth12345 · October 2001

In response to Carlton1: Thanks for the input...further comments....

I was considering private sale, not trade in, as the dealer will rip you off as best as he can. You are correct, there is a substantial savings in interest over the course of time by not spending the extra $10K. With regard to differences, I have driven the Sienna, and find it just a tad better than the Sedona, not worth anywhere near the difference. I have yet to drive the Honda since I refuse to pay over sticker, as some dealers impose. I don't like ABS anyway, and according to people in this forum, you can expect 24 MPG on the highway with regular gas (compared with premium on the Honda).

I would still like to know by % loss what the difference would be between the Honda, Toyota and Kia over about 8 years. That, to me, is a factor.

groth12345 · October 2001

I have been looking over the difference in prices between Canada and the US, and it is significant given the exchange rate. According to a prior poster, he paid about $28K Canadian for an EX, which is about $18K US. That's about $4-5K less than here in the US. What would the duty be to buy the car in Canada and drive it back to the US? Any other factors or costs to consider?

Thanks.

fezo · October 2001

on the Sedona - anything is going to be a guess.

Kias historically (short history) have terrible depreciation but I wouldn't necessarily bet on that continuing for 8 years.

I'm not always known to be in agreement with carleton1, but this "Buy the vehicle you personally prefer. We were as impressed with the ride and drive of the Sedona as with the Odyssey and Sienna.
Hypothetical resale can change in 8 years. If you like the Odyssey or Sienna more than the Sedona, bite the bullet and pay the extra $10,000."

We tried a lot of things and couldn't get off of wanting the Odyssey so we bit the bullet and bought one. Love it. Best of luck with your choice!

DTKWOK · October 2001

I'm currently getting 24 to 26 mpg using regular gas on my Honda Ody. Premium is only needed if you want the extra torque.

As for MSRP, I can not understand why people are so fixated about paying for it? It is just a number thought up by bean counters, I'd rather be the one who judges what the car is "worth" not someone trying to maximize profit. For example, say vehicle "A"'s MSRP is $12,000 and vehicle "B"'s MSRP is $10,000. A $1,000 discount is given for vehicle "A" while you have to pay $1000 over MSRP for "B". Price wise, they're identical, but since vehicle "B" costs more than MSRP, it is bad, while paying less than MSRP, automatically makes "A" the better buy, right?????? Of course not. You should let how much you're willing to spend and what you want dictate your decision.

jimjps · October 2001

Most minivans are significantly cheaper in Canada. There is discussion on this on MPV and Odyssey sites, you can go back and find a lot of info. The reason I think is that Canadians are a little more frugal and the car mfg's just can't charge as much up there if they want to sell cars. Honda really frowns on this practice and suposedly will drop Canadian dealers selling to the US and they do not honor the warranty. Mazda supposedly thinks a sale is a sale, so they do honor the Canadian warranty in the US if the right paperwork is filled out. I don't know what Kia's stance is. As for resale, Kia has a few things going for it compared to Odyssey - The actual price you pay for an Odyssey is dropping (less dealer mark-up). This is detrimental to resale if it continues. If you bought an Ody for $4K over MSRP a year ago and you can get it for MSRP now, you lost more than 4K already. Also, Ody's run about 5K more than equivalently equipped Sedonas. If you put the $5K into a good investment you can still get 5% plus and this will put you way ahead of the game. Also, Sedona is priced so low that if sales are robust and the economy picks up, they would raise the price if anything, this would be good for resale. The 100K warranty is another plus. Also, Sedona has been around in some form for 2 years so I doubt it has any big reliability issues like the Sportage did. Korean auto makers seem to be fast on the learning curve. I own a Honda, but I think the Odyssey does not have any significant advantage over the Sedona when you figure in all these factors.

mcperr · October 2001

The MSRP of the EX we bought with leather and sunroof was C$29,565. This is equal to about US$19,220 at $0.65 to the Canabuck. We found a local dealer with a "no dicker sticker" price of $28,300 and we bought.

Keep in mind that all Ex's in Canada come with ABS and 2-tone paint. We also get the automatic windshield wipers that I am not sure are offered in the US.

Many things are prices less in Canada than the US using equivalent currencies. The artificially low exchange rate of the C$ against the greenback means that manufacturers just cannot charge the same margins here if they wish to sell any product.

I believe that under current Canadian law, vehicles must be registered in Canada for at least 6 months before they can be exported. New vehicles cannot be exported. The auto manufactures have also managed to coerce the customs people on both sides of the border to enforce non-tariff barriers such as safety and emission regulations to stem the flow of vehicles south.

There are a large number of late-model used vehicles going into the US from Alberta weekly. There are brokers willing to find the vehicle of your choice up here and deliver it south for you.

dwharper · October 2001

Well, the dream has continued. My EX was trucked to my door on Saturday. Original deliver had been setup for Monday. My representative called and asked if I'd mind getting it early. I said that I'd love to get it early, but that I hadn't gone to the bank to get the certified funds. No problem she says, I can overnight the check Monday (today). They paid for me to have the car hand washed to remove the road dirt from trip.
I highly recommend carsdirect.com. Lisa Hoyer of Kia of Union City has been just great. -dwh

dwharper · October 2001

I'm wanting to install a hitch on my new Sedona. So far, all I've been able to find on the Internet that is specifically designed for the Sedona has been a Hidden Hitch from www.etrailer.com.

Does anyone know of any other hitch designed or suited for the Sedona? -dwh

dwharper · October 2001

I've found myself having to rely more on my side mirrors when backing up than I did in my Mazda MPV. I discovered that removing the third-row-seat head rests helped quite a bit.

Anyone tried a fisheye? -dwh

martib · October 2001

Van is great, small scratch on the body side molding, dealer told me he is replacing,not repairing, nice change from my ford dealer. When all was said and done with my trade and financing and taxes it came to just shy of 30.000. that's with 15% tax and 4.9 financing. they gave me 7,000 for my 96 Windstar with no air compressor, rear wipe not working and a list of other small things. That 7,000 is consistent with 4 other dealers so there was no fudging of the numbers there. All in all I'm happy and that's all that really matters in the end. the warranty is 5 year 100,000 KM for power train and bumper to bumper as well as road side assist. This is going on too long so I'll stop here have a good one.

bmaige · October 2001

Did I understand correctly, martib, that the warranty in Canada on the Sedona is 5 years or 100,000 km for bumper to bumper AND drivetrain? If I remember my conversions correctly, a kilometer is about 3/5 of a mile, which would mean that is only the equivalent of the 5 year 60,000 mile warranty offered in the U.S., but there is a 10 year 100,000 mile warranty on the drivetrain here.

As to those who are concerned about resale value at high mileage, I must say I drive a vehicle until I get the "good" out of it, meaning until it begins having substantial problems, and don't expect a high resale for it. I figure I only get the most for my money if I drive it almost as far as it will go, and have never really gotten what I felt a car was worth to me if I sold it while it was in good shape.

cookie22 · October 2001

is not eaesily done in our area. I can't order one to meet my specs. They want to sell you whatever they have on the lot. None of them ever come in with leather, and to get the color you want is impossiable. They won't budge from the MSRP and have the attitude that if you don't buy it then step aside so the next guy can. To Hell with them !!! I'll wait They'll come around sooner or later.

mcperr · October 2001

bmaige is correct. The warranty in Canada is 5 years, 62,500 miles (1.6km/mi) bumper to bumper with Roadside Assistance. We also get one year warranty on adjustments. We also do not get the First Aid kit.

This is indeed less than the Kia warranty offered in the US. However I understand that the last five years of the powertrain warranty is quite limited. Still vastly better warranty than on anything else. Our goal is to sell ours before the warranty period is up.

Kia likely had to delete something to make up for the pummelling that they are taking on the Canadian Dollar.

Regarding resale value. We carefully analyzed the lifetime cost of the Kia against the Windstar and Caravan. Given that the Kia was (at that time) the only 2002, had low-interest financing and was priced about $6k below the others, even with a very conservative estimate of resale value in 5 yrs it was cheaper to own. The only vehicles close were 2001 lease-return Windstars with 30,000 km and vastly fewer options.

If you can drive a spreadsheet it is quite simple to figure out. Take your cash down payment, add the market value of your trade, add the total of all your payments (say for 5 years) and subtract a conservative estimate of the resale in 5 yrs. All minivans seem to depreciate greatly. I used the bluebook (blackbook in Canada) value of 5-yr old base-model domestic vans. The result is the lifetime ownership cost of the vehicle. This will probably frighten you, but provides a good method of comparing all the various financing schemes on the market.

dwharper · October 2001

Carsdirect.com

bmaige · October 2001

I was curious as to what the Kia warranties actually have in them, as the literature merely refers to them, and the dealer I went to only had a copy available in the owner's manual, so I went to kia.com online and found it there in its entirety. It is umpty umpty pages long, but includes all the warranties as well as specific state lemon laws. The bumper to bumper and extended drivetrain warranty are a small portion of that, written in simple language and appear to be pretty complete in their coverage.

It appears the "limit" in their 10 year 100,000 mile drivetrain "limited warranty" is who it is transferrable to if the vehicle is sold. The original owner is covered by it, and if he sells the vehicle to a member of his immediate family, it is transferred to the new owner, or if it is a lease vehicle and the person who leased it buys it, it transfers to him. Any other buyers of a used Kia will have only the 5 year 60,000 mile warranty.

I printed it and read over it fairly carefully and it appears to be a great warranty, covering "all internal parts," even seals and gaskets. It excludes damage caused by abuse by the owner, such as using the wrong fluids, but I wouldn't expect them to cover things like that.

Of course, as an independent mechanic told me when we were discussing rebuilt engines offered by two companies, one of which has a 3 year 100,000 mile warranty and the other only a 12 month 12,000 mile one, "I'd rather have a good engine than a good warranty." Turned out when I read the actual warranty of the company that appeared on the surface to be the best it wasn't even a good warranty, as it limited the amount the remanufacturer would be liable for to half of what you paid for the engine. The thing is, I'd rather have a dependable, long lasting vehicle than a great warranty. You would think manufacturers would focus on that first rather than the convenience factors like "magic seats" and power sliding doors. I guess they come in handy sitting beside the road waiting for a tow truck, though.

cookie22 · October 2001

I took a look at carsdirect.com and I think you are probably right. I could order a Van from there. My hang up is that I have a problem buying a Van sight unseen. Has it been a pleasnt experience for you ? How far does the Van come from? What was your total price? My e-mail address is: wecook@ozarks.net

DTKWOK · October 2001

" You would think manufacturers would focus on that first rather than the convenience factors like "magic seats" and power sliding doors. I guess they come in handy sitting beside the road waiting for a tow truck, though."

You would think so wouldn't you? But the fact is, product features are usually driven by the customers. What people want, is what engineers focus on. As for the power sliding doors and the magic seat, yes they are nice conveniences, so please don't knock on them until you've actually lived with them. Yeah, the first thing to probably break on my Ody would be the power sliders (have no problems yet), but for the convenience I have no regrets. I can argue the same for power locks and power windows can't I?

If you want convenience up the wazoo, look at the DC vans, no one can beat them on that!

carleton1 · October 2001

"If you want convenience up the wazoo, look at the DC vans, no one can beat them on that!" AMEN.
It is difficult to choose among minivans for that very reason. We were greatly impressed with the Odyssey's exceptional flexibility of seating (2nd row adaptability and 3rd row Magic Seat), the overall feeling of spaciousness, the "twice as much space behind 3rd seat", and most powerful standard engine.
We got a very well equipped 99 GC SE even though the Odyssey excelled in some areas. We are enjoying the separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger; the complete overhead console with outside temp/Compass, and Trip Computer; the built in child safety seat; the 10 speaker 200 watt Infinity sound with Cassette and CD capability; alloy wheels; heating coils at base of windshield; movement actuated power door locks; and great service of an excellent Dodge dealer just over 1 mile from home.
We continue to examine minivans with Odyssey, Sienna, Sedona, and DC minivans each having excellent reasons for purchase.
The Sedona was very comfortable, quiet, and smooth.It has the best foot and leg room of all minivans (for me as a driver and my wife as a front seat passenger). I find it incredible that Kia can sell the well equipped Sedona EX for only $21,590 MSRP (slightly more if ABS is added)....and the nearest Kia dealer is selling The Sedona at $700 BELOW MSRP.

groth12345 · October 2001

I just took delivery of my Sedona EX. I test drove quite a few minivans and believe me, this car moves! I truely think that this Mitsubishi designed 3.5 liter V6 has much more than the 195 HP advertised. It is more like 230 or so. Perhaps its the right combo with the excellent and smooth 5 spd automatic transmission, but it always has torque and throttle response whenever called upon. I drove mine back from the dealer and couldn't believe that I was doing 90 MPH and the car was hardly even breaking a sweat. GM, Ford and Chrysler...eat your hearts out! Also watch out Odyssey, MPV and Sienna!

jondot · October 2001

I just completed a 4500 mile trip in my new Sedona EX and offer my impressions of the vehicle. First the good stuff. I was surprised to find features not covered in the manual. The odometer, for example, has a trip A and a trip B. You use one to track the mileage between fill-ups and the other for monitoring the over all trip progress, a nice feature when using AutoPilot (http://freetrip.com/). The trip computer seemed to accurately measure miles to empty, pretty much matching up gas used at fill-up. Gas mileage ranged between 21 and 23 mpg with one 24.9 rate, and this was at speeds averaging about 75 mph and maybe a little more. My around the city mileage before the big trip was 15, and that was with total mileage under 600 on the van. Seating was comfortable, almost matching my previous van, a '96 Grand Caravan in support. Suprisingly, my lower back was much more comfortable than in the Dodge. I now have leather seats, if that means anything. The Kia seemed to require more attention on the highway, but I suspect that is because the front end alignment is a tad off-- a slight pull to the right which I suspected prior to the trip but had not had enough highway miles to be fully aware of the problem. We'll see what the dealer has to say about it tomorrow. Other than that, driving was a pleasant experience. Always had plenty of power; love the speed control with the one mph up or down per click feature which took off pressure in maintaining spacing on the road. The tranny is, plain and simple, excellent! I love the braking even in 5th, which helps maintain speed down hill and the overdrive button which was excellent in long steeper decents. The old Caravan always tried to get away on hills. Brake feel is far superior in the Sedona compared to the Chrysler product, and that is with out ABS. Same thing with head lights-- much, much better! Now the cons. I miss the space especially behind the rear seat of my old Grand Caravan; but ther is probably more space than in the short Caravan. The dash displays and radio read-outs are difficult to see in normal daylight and durn near impossible in real bright light. Kia need to work on that. Wind noise, tire noise, seem somewhat worse compared to the Dodge at the upper highway speeds. Also, the ride seems somewhat harsher on road defects. All and all, I think I made the right decision in switching brands. Time will tell the true story as milage builds up. Too much went bad in my two previous Chrysler products for me give them another chance.

carleton1 · October 2001

The MPV is the 2nd most underpowered minivan now sold with VW Eurovan holding the distinction of being the sluggard (and with the poorest EPA ratings).
That little 2.5L in the MPV is just too anemic for a modern minivan.
I agree with you and jondot that the Sedona is a very nice, comfortable, quiet minivan with good performance. It has better leg and foot room for driver and front passenger than our 99 GC SE but lacks many of the nice little extras we enjoy on our GC (But also has an MSRP that is much lower than our GC had).

brenice · October 2001

Chicagoland Sedona owner; Love the van, hate the gas mileage. Sedonas are hard to come by in this area, particularly if you don't want to pay msrp. After a week of phone and internet searching I located two dealers willing to sell for $500 over dealer invoice, my prize was an EX with sunroof, spoiler, and two-tone paint after taxes for aprox 23,500. Which is a darn good price for a van that is as well equip as the Sedona. Other minor quirks lack of two key remotes, the way you have to lock the doors on the passenger side; Love the features, storage nooks, CD/Cassette player, auto lights,full size spare with alloy rim,the upperclass look with the wood trim (yeah its fake but so what), ENJOYING THE DRIVE.

cookie22 · October 2001

Did you get ABS brakes or are they disc? Leather or cloth? Did you try Carsdirect.com ?

bmaige · November 2001

Been out of town for several days so I haven't been back in to see how things were going.

I wasn't knocking the conveniences or those that want or need them, DTKWOK, just making the point that putting them into a vehicle that isn't reliable as a basic product distracts customers from what they should focus on, and that is a reliable basic vehicle. Instead of working on reliability to increase sales manufacturers seem to just add a convenience people really want, at additional cost to the customer, and accomplish the same thing. Shame on us as consumers for being so easily deceived.

It is just that when I spend $20,000.00+ for a product that I expect it to either be reliable or if faults are discovered the first things addressed in new units. And I would also expect manufacturers to lead the charge to fix the faults without charge to the customer. Not that they would just be ignored and the product still sold with the same fault.

Unfortunately, we the customers get carried away with the conveniences and buy "extended warranties," which are nothing more than insurance against poor reliability, as well as an additional cost to drive a vehicle, instead of refusing to buy the product.

No, I have nothing against conveniences, it's just that I expect them in a reliable vehicle and feel I have the right, as a customer, to expect that when I spend my hard earned money on a major purchase.

sthurow · November 2001

I have been reading this message board for several weeks and have found it most helpful. My saga started in late August when the Sedonas were first on the market. I live in the Chicagoland area and was unable to get a Sedona EX w/ ABS & leather. This continued for nearly 2 months despite reassurances from the dealer (who had $1000 of our money as earnest money to do a search & swap with another dealer) that one would be coming in a couple more weeks. After reading about carsdirect from this board, I called them and had my car delivered to my door w/i ten days! (Took my $1000 back!). Carsdirect found the van in Georgia. Even with a $600 delivery fee the van was $500 under MSRP, so we were happy. Lisa Hoyer at the dealership in Union City GA has been wonderful & arranged everything for us. The van was of course dirty and the gas tank empty for it's journey, but Lisa is reimbursing us for the 1st tank of gas and the detail. I wish I had known about carsdirect earlier and I could have been enjoying the Sedona 2 months ago without the hassle of going to dealerships, except of course for a quick test drive! P.S. Apparently Kia is not distributing the ABS/Leather package in our area.

DTKWOK · November 2001

I understand what you're saying, coming from a '83 Civic with power nothing (doors, locks, steering), no A/C, and no radio, reliability was inherent. Yes, you are right in that we, the customers, are encouraging this trend in product release, more so in domestic vehicles.
In design theory, there is a model known as Kano's Model of Customer Satisfaction where it says that there are 3 quality levels in a product: basic, performance, and excitement. Basic quality are those things that customers come to expect from a product, when it's there, people are neutral about it, but if it's not, people are dissapointed. Performance quality is what people have said that they wanted in a product, the better the performance, the better the product according to the customer. Excitement quality are things that the customer doesn't expect, but if received in a positive way, gives the product a higher chance of success in the market ("wow" requirements). Designers go for the excitement quality, unfortunately, like you said, I don't think reliability is in that type of product quality. Okay, better get off my soap box now.

mom23girls · November 2001

I'd love to get my hands on a Sedona EX with leather and sunroof, of course the dealer in our region has none and has no idea when he will, even though they continue to advertise them in the newspaper as though they had a lot full of them. Any advice? If I went to Carsdirect would I be able to take it to our local dealer for any warranty work even though I didn't purchase it from them? Has anyone had any problems with theirs yet? If I paid cash for the vehicle(if the dealer ever gets one)should they be more likely to budge from the sticker price? Thanks

brenice · November 2001

I couldn't find a van in this area that had abs nor did it have leather. I even had one sales person say that that the brakes weren't even an option, even after I showed it to him in the brochure (Duh). In response to STHUROW comments, one dealer Dave Miller in Matteson Il. claimed to have EX's right off the truck that had abs, which for me was one week to late. Williams Kia in Oaklawn had five (three ex's and two lx's, no leather and no abs, all the exs where two-tone and had sunroofs, spoilers, and Homelink) No I didn't use Carsdirect, I used Edmunds to get the base invoice price and CarQuote to locate a dealer affliated with my credit union (I ended up with another dealer), I did all of my shopping over the phone and via the internet. At one point I had five dealers attempting to earn my business. The problem was supply, few had any real inventory (it reminds me of the Odyssey) you almost have to be there when the truck unloads, and demand (the dealers are becoming like vultures on a fresh kill) they can sense a winner and are asking full MSRP, and in some cases I'm told extra. (So MOM23GIRLS I would say go for broke I did, because I had cash in hand, the dealer brokedown first) My concern is that the dealers are going to take advantage of this a make a really good bargain into their own personal piggy bank. That would be a shame. I still a little concerned about how well the van will hold up in the long term. The suprising thing is that I still have only seen three other Sedonas on the street in Chicago. One question to anybody out there with an answer, does Kia include its dealer holdback and ad fees in the base invoice price or on the top as an extra fee?

carleton1 · November 2001

We got a discount on our insurance with USAA because of the ABS on our new 1991 Astro CL. A few years later, USAA discontinued the discount with the notice that more research indicated vehicles were NO safer with ABS.
Our 99 GC SE has ABS and, as with the 91 Astro, a test on a corner on a very slippery road (with no vehicles present and at a low speed)proved to me that with ABS it is almost impossible to skid while applying the brakes. I like ABS but can't argue with USAA. I would have NO worry about a vehicle without ABS. Kia could not include all options on the Sedona and still sell it for a remarkably LOW price.

Kia Sedona (2005 and Earlier)

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