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Comments
Your #3. I am going to buy four Yokohama Avid TRZs. My existing 15" spare will stay as it is.
I absolutely did not have any problems driving on three Bridgestone B380 225/60R17 and one Kumho 225/70R15. As far as I remember, I used this spare for about a week.
I now keep my spare behind the third row at all times. It goes inside a wheel well, which is shown in the manual and on the diagram included with the jacking tools on AWD models. I bought threaded post which is designed to hold spare in place from the Toyota dealership. There is threaded hole in the center of the spare tire well behind third row. The hole is covered by carpet. A small cut in the carpet is required to gain access to this threaded hole.
When going on trips which require a lot of luggage, the spare goes on my hitch mounted bicycle carrier (between the post and rear hatch, while bicycles go on the cantilevered beam mounted on the opposite side of the post). I attach spare to the vertical post of the bike carrier using big U-bolt which I bought for $10.00 form the marine trailer place. This U-bolt is used to attach spare tires for boat trailers.
This towing issue seems--IMO--to be yet another drawback to PAX. And it certainly seems as though Honda and Michelin need a crash course in eachother's product.
Actually, I'm a member of an on-line community that focuses on popup campers, and you might be surprised how many people use minivans to pull popup campers.
The issue of towing with a minivan that uses run-flat tires is fairly new. I'm used to new popup owners being told to get a full-size spare for their minivan, so I was curious as to how run-flat tire manufacturers were addressing the issue. If leaving the trailer at the side of the road is their best solution, it does seem that run-flat tires are still an immature technology that only addresses limited needs.
By 'rare,' I just meant that there probably aren't that many 'Touring' owners pulling popup campers at the moment, because: 1)it's a new model, 2)it's a small percentage of Odyssey production in-general, and 3)only a small percentage of THOSE would have any towing experience with PAX.
I myself have never really considered a minivan as a tow vehicle, but I'm sure it's more than adequate for light popups and small watercraft.
If you haven't already bought this van, I'd go for the EX-L instead.
Good luck.
A related problem with many minivans (inlcluding non-Touring Odysseys): The spare tire storage area isn't large enough for a full-size spare (the donut spare isn't rated to tow a trailer, either).
In many ways, minivans are ideal tow vehicles: A low center of gravity (most SUVs fall short in this area) and short rear-axle-to-hitch-point distance makes for a very stable, controllable tow platform. Sadly, most minivans are designed around car-based front-wheel-drive components, and simply don't have the drivetrain for heavier loads.
I understand some of the complaints regarding premature tire wear with the conventional run-flats. That being said, I've not been unhappy with mine-- we've even bought an additional set of RFT winter tires. They have performed reasonably well (the winter tires are AMAZING in the snow), but I'm not expecting 50K out of either set. If you're one of those people who judge the quality of a tire strictly by the number of miles you get from a set, then you probably won't be happy with the RFT's. Keep in mind, ANY tire that can go 50K is beyond the limits of being very safe long before that point anyway.
The AWD Sienna has been wonderful. If you don't like the RFT's, then replace them with conventionals when they wear out.
Keep in mind, this is an expensive and capable vehicle. You can't expect to get off cheap with the tires.
Also, conventional tires for any bigger SUV you may be considering will cost as much or more per tire.
Don't let this tail wag your dog. Buy the AWD Sienna-- you'll love it.
I know some have advocated replacing the run-flats with conventional tires. But, what does one do when it is time to sell or trade in the van? A buyer or dealer may not appreciate the fact that there is a spare tire taking up room behind the thrd row seats, and removing some seating versatility.
I never considered the trade in. I expect to have the van through at least a couple of tire changes so that isn't really a concern for me. Hopefully by the time I trade it, RFT technology will be more mainstream and MUCH cheaper.
Long-Term Test: 2005 Honda Odyssey
Steve, Host
Eventually, I concluded the safety margin PAX offers in the event of a freeway blow-out, when added to its other plus, tipped the scales in favor of PAX.
One aspect of PAX that has not been discussed here concerns the fact that the wheel has little protection against damage in the event of bumping a curb while parking on a street. Conventional tires have a bit of a bulge and will contact the curb before the rim. With PAX, there is barely any such protection. Fortunately, I rarely street park.
Remember curb feelers? I wonder if anyone still makes them.
Steve, Host
It will be interesting to see if Edmunds' test Odyssey Touring experiences any curbing problems.
One other point about PAX - the van rides just great - if a person didn't know, they would never guess it's equipped with run-flats.
Steve, Host
I am really surprised that you had a problem laying full size spare flat behind the third row (driver side). Mine fits right in, with a bit of a squeeze. What size did you get? Mine is 225/70R15
The following link to tirerack.com provides additional info on tire sizing: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/general/size_information.jsp
Am I just lucky? I'm honestly trying to remember the last time I had a flat tire and I can't!
As a 60 year old female who is on the road quite a bit, alone and far from home, the trouble and expense is worth my peace of mind.
I wouldn't trust bungie cords to secure a heavy spare in the event of a panic stop.
"During a serious car crash, anything that is not bolted down or securely tethered becomes a dangerous projectile." (link)
This includes 80 pound sand bags, the Club, laptops, spare tires, rear seat passengers, etc.
Steve, Host
My point for run flats "weak point" is that if one of them disintegrates (while hitting pothole) you are left without spare. No good.
Another point is that knowing that run flats are stronger it would mean that they pass more energy, in the case of impact, to the rest of the car. Really bad for suspension.
Krzys
How much are they to replace when I need new tires?
Do I really need Wheel Locks on the tires?
Thanks
IMO, there are more negatives than positives, including proprietary technology and no available winter tires.
Replacement cost is debatable. PAX proponents will tell you they will (eventually) cost no more than a standard tire (a difficult claim to predict or prove, if you ask me). Those of us that view PAX of dubious value will argue that the proprietary nature of the technology--and the limited number of models (two) currently sold in this country that require them--will keep prices high.
I've always felt wheel locks are a waste of effort. There are only so many patterns of locks for your vehicle, and I believe any professional thief probably already has them all.
Call me crazy, but my wife really wants black/black, and that only comes on the Touring. Life is to short, she needs to be happy!
The most that [replacing a Touring tire/wheel] would cost you according to Honda is $635.00. That would be for the whole deal. Tire, Wheel, Sensor, and Mount and Balance. If you need just the tire you would be looking at about $180.00, sensor about $35.00, and wheel would be $385.00.
Sounds like you might have to eat a PAX sandwich to keep the wife happy.....
Steve, Host
Wheel locks also make tire rotation a pain. And make sure you don't lose the socket.
Steve, Host