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Comments
$25,000 truck. Any one who paid sticker(almost
$30,000) or over in the early days got suckered."
I couldn't agree more with this statement. The problem is that some people have more money than patience. Originally, I walked away from the Toyota dealers shaking my head at their unabated price gouging. I shopped for a Silverado, but couldn't bring myself to buy one after test driving the Tundra. So, having more patience than money, I waited.
Best in class - Silverado
Next best - F150
third - (only if you consider a Tundra in the full size class, which most don't) Tundra.
Last in mileage - Ram.
I don't care what a magazine article claims in a specific one time test. We all know the facts coming from owners and daily driving. Even Toyota themselves rate the Tundra at lower fuel economy than Chevy or Ford and real life experiences prove it true as well.
robbie - what was the difference in mileage between the sierra and silverado? only thing i can think of is different brands of gas. or maybe different driving conditions. if it was more than 1 mpg i'd be surprised if it was a controlled test.
what kind of mileage you been getting with your tundra? at almost 12k miles, i've been pulling down just over 15 mpg overall. more commuter driving than anything else though. i've peaked at 18+ on long trips averaging 75+ mph...
kyle
a 4 mpg difference. Wierd i am not saying anything towards you RWELL that your wrong or anything i did hear something about this but i am just wondering why such a huge difference.
at 5000 mls now on my silverado i have been getting 13-14 mpg but this is 95% city driving. Highway is about 16-17. You have to take in account i am 20 yrs old and i blast off at each stop light haha its kinda hard not to with this powerful engine.
Ryan
I didnt buy my truck for MPG that was the last thing on my mind.
Ryan
2) The Tundra did not take any sales away from the Tacoma. The Tacoma had one of its best months in July. Fact.
3) The fact that it was end of model year does not affect the fact that Tundra did better. The Tundra was hurt just as much clearing out old models as the Big3.
4) Big3 trucks can be had just a cheaply as Tundras right now. They have nationwide rebates as well as financing incentives which the Tundra does not. A 15% drop in sales tells me that Chevies and Fords should both be very cheap right now.
5) I was just using DBhull as an example of someone with very poor judgement - He unloaded a perfectly good Silverado and bought an F150. That is going from bad to worse IMHO. Hell - he could have bought a Dodge Ram and got a better truck. Now, if Dbhull is reading this post - he is perfectly capable of defending himself. If not, I don't think he cares.
Tundra - great truck, great quality and reliability.
Silverado - average truck, lousy quality and reliability.
Dodge - so, so truck, average reliability and quality.
F150 - no truck, average quality and reliability.
Ford has to face facts - they have been passed up big time by Tundra. Tundra will gain market share against the Big3, but it will take a long time before they are equal in sales to any of the Big 3. I predict Tundra will pass up the GMC Sierra next year.
Once Silverado gets its quality and reliability together in a couple more years, Ford sales will get passed by Chevy. (If Ford does not improve its truck).
1) What is a pentroof combustion chamber? What are its advantages?
2) What advantages (if any) does a DOHC engine have over an OHV engine? A SOHC engine?
3) What is an oversquare engine? What are its advantages?
4) Are forged connecting rods constructed of vanadium steel an advantage? Why?
5) Is a forged steel crankshaft an advantage?
6) What advantages do 4 valve/ cylinder engines have over 2 valve / cylinder engines?
7) How many camshafts does the Tundra have. How many are chain driven? How many are belt driven?
8) Define included valve angle. Is it better in general to have a greater or lesser included valve angle?
And no, F150, these questions did not come out of the Tundra owners manual.
reliability.
Silverado - average truck, lousy quality and
reliability.
Dodge - so, so truck, average reliability and
quality.
F150 - no truck, average quality and reliability"
Thats just an opinion.
Best sales in July haha well thats impressive what about Jan,Feb, March, Apr, May, and June?????
YOu have to take 12 months to compare not just 1 month that doesnt mean a damn thing.
Ryan
Harry
This isn't to say that month to month trends aren't important. If you have a 10% decrease in sales each month and that trend continues for a year - your business is going to be in a heap of hurt.
As an extreme example, if present sales trends continue - the big3 trucks would be out of business by the end of the year, but toyota would be more profitable than ever. Everyone knows this is absurd, but I am just trying to make my point clear.
The only reason to bring up this subject is that at the start of this thread someone posted that Tundra sales were going down the tubes. I knew this to be foundless - so I posted the correct sales information.
I think that most truck buyers could care less about sales increases or decreases unless the company is going out of business. I don't think that this is likely with the Tundra. Toyota just spent 750 million on a new truck plant. They must be confident.
- Tim
(yes that's right....1-8 a month)
It is true though that the big 3 sales are down in june-aug because of the nerw model yr trucks coming out. Most of these people have ordered a late 2000 and they stopped making them so they have to wait for a 2001. Just watch the sept and other months to come sales. They will go up once again.
I doubt any of the 4 truck makers will be outta business anytime soon. If that happens something major had to have happened.
Ryan
"As you predicted, the Ford has the best torque (if you can believe the manufacturer's rating)
The Chevy and the Tundra are very close. For a truck engine I would give the Tundra the nod because although it has 10ft/lbs less - it is at a lower RPM."
Considering the figures that you are showing shouldn't the Ford be the better truck engine. Even more torque at LESS RPM. Your oversquare comments are correct but don't have as much impact with 4500 rpm motors. Some of the longest lasting, most durable TRUCK engines have been long stroke under square engines.
The Tundra is a good truck but please don't think it can haul or tow with the big boys. I really don't care about V6 manual minimum ratings. The fact is the Tundra tows about 1400 pounds less then the Ford and 1900 less then GM at their max ratings.
First off, I would like for you to find one post that even remotely indicates that I find myself to be a mechanical genius. I will leave that to Robbie. He seems to be good at that as do you.
Second, is this the way you avoid my questions...by posting similar questions to me?
You are a joke. I can answer the questions on a high level basis, but I never claimed to know mechanics at any level. It is you that claims the Tundra all superior, yet, never post anything factual to support your claim and constantly avoid questions presented to you.
You think you have caught me at something, but really you continue to show how rediculous you are. I have posted numerous times that I am not a mechanic. I only asked you the questions I did, because you and Robbie claim to know so much about mechanics but post so little to support that claim.
You first, of course you have only had, what, almost a week to research the questions I asked you. How many books and how many mechanics did you track down to be able to post the questions above.
You fool nobody. After all, if you were all that smart, you wouldn't claim a Tundra can keep up with the real full size trucks. Tundra == Tacoma with full size envy.
It's funny how in initial posts you tell everyone that the Ford F150 was your second choice to a Tundra and you were going to buy one till you drove the lesser truck you have, now you claim it's worse than all the trucks out there. Again, you show how you lack any credibility with anything you say. You post only what will benefit your thought of the day, which is very little with your 25 point IQ.
And again, it is extremely funny how you now slam the truck that Toyota so desparately tried to copy the design of and emulate the quality fit and finish of.
Your posts speak of your stupidity and lack of credibility themselves.
Your recess time is almost up. Better run along now. You don't want to miss watching the Electric Company and Sesame Street.
credibility themselves."
Personal attacks and name calling gets old real fast. You can reply in a civil manner and/or choose to ignore as you've accused some of the Tundra owners of doing. The only thing you are accomplishing with the name calling posts is to ensure that you are following Mr. Hull's example of how to get banned from Edmund's. Just an opinion.
"I was involved in a crash with my beloved Tundra. It looks like a crushed aluminum can. I was rear ended on the freeway by a full-size van at about 45 mph and forced into the back of a Ford F150. I have no idea at what speed the impact forced me into the Ford but it was strong enough to involve 5 vehicles in all. Unfortunately my truck bore the most damage. Front, rear, and drivers side. My hood is buckled up about 1 1/2 feet and the bed is shortened by about 1 1/2 feet but no airbag deployment. I was thrown around inside the cab violently even with the seatbelt on but still no airbag. Makes me wonder what type of collision is needed to release it.
Does anyone know what speed is required to release the airbag? I was hit hard enough for the seatbelt to leave a bruise on my chest. If I didn't have my seatbelt on, I am sure I would have hit the windshield.
The good news is the cab is relatively untouched and held up well. The bad news is the truck is destroyed with less than 7K miles and haven't even made the third payment. Time to let the lawyer go to work."
-------------------------------
that's three different failures of airbag deployment in three different situations for 2000 toyota tundras. this does NOT bode well. besides adversely affecting the reliability/safety ratings, it more importantly could very well end up getting somebody hurt or killed. fortunately, the integrity of the cab was NOT compromised in any of the situations i read about...which is good news for those involved. food for thought...
bco
I hope you can see the tongue firmly implanted in cheek.
As far as the Tundra towing or hauling goes - as long as we are talking 1/2 ton trucks - the Tundra is right there with the "big boys".
For example the biggest, baddest Chevy Silverado 1500 extended cab 4wd with the 5.3L and 4.1 gears is rated to tow 8000 lb. The Tundra V8 tows 7200 lb. 800 lb. is not enough to get excited about.
As far as hauling goes the GVWR of the Tundra V8 is 6050 lbs. The Chevy is 6400lb. I would be willing to bet that the Tundra is more than 350lb. lighter than the Chev.
I just noted how bamatundra likes to fit the news with whatever point he is "attempting" to make at the time. In several posts he states that he likes Fords and even states that he almost bought one until he decided he liked the smaller Tundra better for some odd reason. His slams and arguments had always been pointed to the Silverado. I guess maybe because he was getting so much crap from the rado owners. Now he claims that Fords are the bottom of quality. Hmmm. I don't think he ever has a real point.
He clearly has no followers of his unfactual, yet, very humorous posts. Another funny thing is that my posts of the Tundra started out and still are mostly subjective opinions. I was asked the reasons I don't think the Tundra matches up to the big three. I stated them and still have the same opinion. I don't ride the fence like bamatundra. Robbie and bamatundra come back stating their opinions "as facts" and then start name calling and insulting people. I don't think I ever started any crap here. Only when my opinion of their Tundra hurt their feelings that they got all defensive. If they can't take the criticism, they shouldn't have bought a Tundra.
If their insulting posts have ceased, so have mine. If not, it will continue.
How one acts, regardless of what others do, tells you the strength of that person's character. You are entitled to behave anyway that you want. I merely pointed out that your actions are similar to dbhull who is no longer with us...as dbhull anyway.
The fact that this person was pushed in traffic, indicates to me that this was not the sudden impact that you would want to be hit in the face with expanding gasses. The fact that the author of that post is alive, tells me the crumple zones and seatbelt did their job.
Now knock off the garbage posts.
bottom line: only reason i mentioned it was because of the two incidents mentioned on the nhtsa board. or perhaps you would interpret the tale of the stolen tundra as being "pushed" into a concrete bridge abutment and wouldn't want your airbag to deploy in such a petty accident?
as for the "Now knock off the garbage posts." statement, i'll post as i see fit. call it garbage if you like. i should think someone looking into buying a tundra (or owning one for that matter) would be interested in knowing this kind of information. i was VERY interested when robbie pointed out the abs defect in silverados. i went and checked and lo and behold, my truck wasn't on recall. but i'm glad someone pointed it out to me. perhaps your aggressive reaction to my post indicates an over-sensitivity to your purchase...
"most irresponsible post [you] have seen in awhile"??? ok bud...i'll assume from that statement that you JUST got here...
bco
I know facts are played very fast and loose around here. Yours just seemed to cross another line. And no, I didn't just get here. I used to frequent the Tundra topics until they got just too absurd and filled with just your kind of clap trap. It seems everybody knows somebody or has heard of somebody who has had a problem with the Tundra but no body who posts here has ever had them. Very interesting.
Cliffy he was just relaying some info he read to get wheels turning you know? DOnt knock his post down just because it is about the tundra. He brought up a very important point "SAFETY". Please have some constructive criticizm and not this garbage post crap. It wasnt garbage but very informative.
Ryan
Think about it how many people would waste their time to post about an accident they were in.
Let me copy and paste again
"I was involved in a crash with my beloved Tundra.
It looks like a crushed aluminum can. I was rear
ended on the freeway by a full-size van at about 45
mph and forced into the back of a Ford F150. I
have no idea at what speed the impact forced me
into the Ford but it was strong enough to involve 5
vehicles in all. Unfortunately my truck bore the
most damage. Front, rear, and drivers side. My hood
is buckled up about 1 1/2 feet and the bed is
shortened by about 1 1/2 feet but no airbag
deployment. I was thrown around inside the cab
violently even with the seatbelt on but still no
airbag. Makes me wonder what type of collision is
needed to release it.
Does anyone know what speed is required to release
the airbag? I was hit hard enough for the seatbelt
to leave a bruise on my chest. If I didn't have my
seatbelt on, I am sure I would have hit the
windshield."
Dont you think that if this was a false claim it would have been spiced up a bit??? Maybe use some of your "critical thinking" here. Id bet the validity of that is 99.8% true.
No one is stirring the pot.
Also why have you guys not answered BCO's question about the rail things being new on the tundras??? He asked a serious question and no one answered? How come???
Ryan
Here's the problem though. We can't cross examine this witness. This is all hearsay at this point and therefore totally irrelevant. If somebody wants to post something that happened to them to illustrate safety concerns, so ahead. Don't paste something that happened to somebody else where we have no ability to put the issue on context.
Third year eh?
Oh, in answer to an actual question, the bed rail caps are plastic.
All there is here at all is personal experiences. How many people here at Edmunds conduct their own scientific studies with control groups, forming hypotheses or theories?
Maybe you Tundra salesman have that kind of time since you aren't selling any Tundra's. You are awfully defensive. The guy legitimately brought it up to be informative, not add yet another hash mark to the Tundra inadequacies.
haha
I should get creamed for this
ITS A JOKE GUYS CHILL
Ryan
Ryan
You, Ryan and a few others only hang out to bash Tundras and you do so with impunity. Any time you are challenged, you slide into accusations of defensiveness. Yes, I am defensive in this topic. Can you blame me?
Ryan
http://www.toolzone.com/isuite/bin/webchat.cgi?UID=TZ116383&APPID=TruckTalk&LANG=ENGLISH&MODE=LOGIN
I really wanna know how i bash the tundra.
Ryan
Ryan
tundra sales can go from 1-2...wow!!...50% increase!
Fast of the matter is......."Them yuppys be thinkin' they be full size...and thinkin' that an increase in percent means they are awesome!...when the numbers made are a joke for sales!....Tundra equals less truck for more buck!"
Good luck on this one now!
LOL
(I don't think I ever get tired of that line..)
hehhee
- Tim
- Tim
get over it man, i'm not bashing your truck...just trying to enlighten others. next time i'll start a new topic titled, "remote possibility that tundra's airbags may remotely sometimes, kinda sorta, in a roundabout sorta way not deploy...sometimes. and it's not proven yet either..."
better, bud?
bco