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Comments
Really? It's made in Mexico.
I am not aware of a single GM automobile (although some trucks are) that are built in Mexico. The Aveo, their bottom-line econobox, is made overseas but they have advertised it as such. I'm told the next Aveo will be made in Michigan.
So far I'm having a lousy track record with my domestic vehicles. By 60k miles, I've spend over $1k in repairs on my last two.
Of course, GM/Ford/Chrysler import all sorts of foreign cars from Canada.
Wouldn't a three-year old vehicle have been under warranty? I'm sorry you apparently had a crappy vehicle and a crappy dealer. I believe GM is doing more for customers now than ever, but even twenty years ago my dealer (and I've bought from two) would have offered to do something out of warranty if I was over the mileage limit but below the three-year threshold.
Lots of Suburban's and Yukon's are. My Suburban was from Mexico and when I was shopping for a new Suburban/Yukon XL in 08, I couldn't find one made in the US. I have no idea what the percentage of US/Mexico manufactured Suburban are.
And have for decades. I remember looking at Canadian-built Monte Carlos and Monzas, new, in the '70's. They're UAW there.
I do think there's a difference between 'built in Canada' in 'built in Mexico'. And I am not doubting in the least that quality vehicles are built there. But you never saw that happen, pre-NAFTA. I think they are most likely paying third-world wages there. And I would rather not reward the manufacturer for that by buying a model of theirs that is built there.
Same with my 07 Expedition, I was within the 3 year threshold on the 36k mile warranty, but was at 59k when the coil pack died. Granted the coil pack was only like $80, but it was the hours of labor pulling the damn spark plugs that was costly. They offered nothing other than telling me not to let the new plugs stay in for more than 60k miles.
I have to admit, that the idea of the Fusion being built in Mexico just doesn't sit well with me. Even if it's a perfectly fine car. All things being equal, I'd rather buy an Altima made in the United States than a Fusion made in Mexico.
As for all the talk of where the profits go? Well, I guess I could buy some Nissan stock, so that profits would go to ME! :shades:
I'll be seeing him in a few weeks and I am looking forward to taking the Fusion for a spin.
Andre, I'd think just about anything in the Altima category will seem a bit small and definitely more firm. What did you think of the CVT?
Yeah, I think if I had gone right from my Intrepid to something like an Altima, Fusion, or Malibu, there wouldn't have been as much of a shock, but I got used to the Park Ave and it spoiled me a bit. The Intrepid was wide inside...seemed wider to me than the Park Ave, and the back seat seemed like it had more legroom. But the Park Ave's front seat goes back a lot further, sits up higher, and is much better padded.
I didn't get a chance to drive my Mom and stepdad's Altima; only rode in it. And really didn't notice the CVT, one way or another. I actually prefer a transmission that shifts crisply, but that's not what most people think of as "refinement". I should go test drive an Altima though, to see if the CVT is something I'd get used to.
If your 6ft or taller, the Altima rear is going to be really useless for you. I'm 5ft 9in and my head, without wearing a ball cap or having my hair up, was just about touching the rear ceiling!
I don't think there's any meaningful difference betweeen buying a car built in one foreign country versus another. Canada, Japan, Mexico, South Africa, Poland, etc. are all the same to me.
I was in San Francisco yesterday and I saw a yellow painted Ford Fusion taxi.
Whereas I would ask why those first two parts are having problems at under 100K in the first place. No car properly maintained should have transmission problems at under 100K (and yes, I know Honda had transmission issues).
My Acura TL has 96K on it right now and I've done tires, battery, brakes, a piece of door handle trim, and one recall for the outside air temp sensor. That's it.
The 2010 Genesis Coupe is a purpose-built rear-wheel drive sports coupe featuring two performance-focused engines - a 212-horsepower 2.0-liter turbocharged four-cylinder engine and a range-topping all-aluminum 306-horsepower, DOHC 3.8-liter V6 engine.
Regards,
OW
The problem is the UAW. If you are Ford or GM and you are barely on the edge of existence and your average labor/benefits rate for a US worker is say, $100K/year, and in Mexico it is $25K/year (totally guessing at all of those numbers), then what would you do? If the UAW was willing to turn that $100K into say, $60K then maybe the job stays. But if it does not budge then you move your production out of the country.
Just read an article that the UAW is actually the union where the Boeing C-17 is made in Long Beach, CA. This is the LAST Boeing manufacturing in the state. Well the union is striking for benefits! Their ship is sinking but they want more. Boeing is opening up a 787 manufacturing line in South Carolina to get away from the union influences in Washington. The last union strike cost them $billions.
No company is going to put up with labor acting like that. The company's job is to be profitable. The companies that put up with it (GM) go bankrupt.
It might be more due to a good dealer than GM. I think a lot of times when we bash brands or praise brands regarding service (as opposed to the vehicle itself), we are reacting to a particularly good or particularly bad dealership. Although there are makes that are well known to have good service (Lexus, Cadillac) and poor service (VW).
The reverse of this political move in the 80's to save Harley/Davidson was to slap an high tax on Asian bikes for a 5yr period, since Harley was down to producing only 50,000 bikes/yr..bleeding badly..I know I was selling them cable assemblies, throttle,clutch, and brake produced by a Japanese mfgr located in Battle Creek, Mich, a div of Nippon Cable..100% supplier of all Mercury Marine cables starting in 1981..I left after 2yrs, 1984..From 1985 to 2002 was involved the forging and casting sales to auto, trucking, and military..no sales to Asian car companies..no money in it..
With the Govt involved with GM and Chrysler and being a supplier in this day and age has got to be a real pain, no money in it..
Love the Mustang, and the Shelby GT is still sitting in the showroom waiting for me..It isn't the fastest nor the best handling, probably doesn't really excel in any area, but it's ALL-AMERICAN, loud, and a real bang on the road..Sorry, the Genesis coupe is just too cute..I pass..
Or dealer cost parts and free labor if you run the place
Actually, forget good, it was amazing. Like glass, not a single swirl mark, bit of orange peel or hint of non-uniformity.
It didn't reeally surprise me tho becuase every year I attend the Auto Show curcuit I get a laugh at the quality of a 20 thousand dollar Hyundai and one of the worst paint jobs on the entire floor is a 90 thousand dollar Z06 or it's lesser bretheren. Orange peel city!
Who does the paint jobs in Bowling Green? MAACO? Or does the crew who clean the bathrooms over there multi-tasking.... :P
I'll tell you what really surprised me...at the DC auto show this past winter, I was really impressed with the paint quality on the Dodges and Chryslers! They had seemed to be slipping in the past few years, but this time around they had mirror-smooth finishes that would give a Lexus a run for its money! I know the production models can't be like that, though. I'm wondering if they had specially-prepped vehicles for the show circuit, this time around?
I've also noticed that Benz and BMW don't really have those smooth-as-glass finishes like they used to, while GM and Ford actually do seem to be improving.
Yes. Canadians buy what they build, AND what we build. Mexicans are lucky to afford an old Beetle that's been rebuilt 10 times over.
I grew up a Ford guy and that is one of the only things about Ford products that irked me was their paint quality. Even brand spanking new they had no lustre and were always swirled and chipped.
Seems to me that our CR-V and Pilot required tranny service every 30K miles. But I may be wrong on that.
If true and if your friend missed both of them and the car was at 70K, that could be a reason. It could also be a crooked dealer that got paid by Honda but wanted a little more. Maybe the car was 8-9 years old and Honda figured it was past any responsibility of theirs. Maybe he bought it used and Honda didn't feel any need to absorb the entire bill. And maybe it was exactly as your friend says and maybe the car was just a few years old. I wasn't at the dealer with him, maybe you were.
I do know that my experiences with Nissan and Honda have been great. The experiences I have had driving domestics since 1957 have been mixed as far as reliability goes but when the warranty ran out I always had to dig deep or do it myself. Chevy didn't pay for my son's Suburban Tranny and Ford didn't pay for my mother's Explorer trannys at 60K or at 90k.
Mazda replaced my MPV tranny free, at 51K miles.
In my opinion the domestics tend to ride better and be a bit quieter when new. But the reason I've gotten rid of each domestic is due to reliability and rattles. I got rid of my 03 Pilot because after 7 years of driving it I decided to get a light duty Pickup. Thus the Ridge Line. My wife drove her 95 Maxima for 8 years but developed knee problems and it was hard for her to stoop to get in and out of it, thus the CR-V.
With one exception (see below), we got to where we didn't keep domestics past the 3/36 warranty because it tended to get expensive fast.
FWIW I still have a 1978 Chevy G20 van. I hang on to it because of sentimental reasons. It has become a rattle trap and the engine, tranny, and rear end have all been replaced. Chevy didn't pay for any of those. :lemon:
We got a freebie a few weeks back. Toyota modified the 09 RAV4's gas pedal.
WHOOPEE!
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
My coworker's Honda was bought new and is a 2005 model-year, same as my Chevy van.
Even my service manger friend said stay far away from them, go for the 80.
link title
Even my service manger friend said stay far away from them, go for the 80.
That's an understatement. I know people who've had 3 rebuilds in 100k miles with the 4l60e. I think that trans is worse than the Chrysler trans axle back in the late 80's. I won't own another vehicle with that trans in it.
The car was never the same after that but the transmission was never an issue.
Not sure why your scratchng your head, the Genesis looks great (in person too), and it is RWD performance at a fair price!
Nothing FWD about the Genesis.
That makes sense, the Tiburon was and is a girl's car. I think the Genesis is more of a man's car, though women are free to enjoy it as well.
I don't know one guy that owns a Tiburon.
I'm glad you're enjoying your stay here. That's what buying American means these days. Go for the best not the junk of the past!
Regards,
Call me crazy, but could this have anything to do at all with the Corvette being fiberglass, and the cars you are comparing it to for paint, not? Since the dawn of history, it's been said it's nearly impossible to get the same-quality paint job on a fiberglass car as a steel-bodied one.
Regards,
OW
Here's a pic of it...can't actually link it because it would mess up Edmund's margins.
Seriously though, if Chrysler could get a finish this nice 31 years ago when they were begging for a bail-out the first time around, you'd think most auto makers could do better today. Unless that's one of Chrysler's tricks...right about the time they're about to go bankrupt, they suddenly get serious about good paint quality! :shades:
That's a beautifully we kept car? How often does it get waxed and washed?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Well 20 years ago, many of Chrysler's paint jobs peeled faster than a banana. My wife's uncle had a '92 or so Dakota that was down to the primer by '95.
I wonder if that was some of the better chemistry brought to us by the green folks and EPA? I know that there used to be three layers in a paint system with a primer, then a coat that would adhere to the primer and to which the color coat would strongly adhere. PPG, I believe it was, determined they could use a certain primer and cover it with a color coat and skip one of the bonding layers. Voile. Colors coats that started letting go after some time and temperature and sun aging.
I believe that mistake occured about the period of time you're talking about.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,