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There are some States like CA that not only have a Lemon Law (that does not apply to so many of us) but breach of warranty of mercantability. This only applies to certain States. It allows a vehicle owner a repurchase if the vehicle has so many problems that it does not meet the legal standard for ordinary goods of this type. Check your State and see if this applies to you.
I don't think the dealers can take all the blame. The blame lies with GM as this is a manufacturer defect. It's criminal and has hurt their customers financially, emotionally and with a flooded fuse box your car can just die, thankfully, mine died in my driveway! If I/we were on the freeway it could have been fatal.
I feel so bad for you as I know how blown away you are. Research these pages and be prepared when you talk with GM.
Here is information on the Secret Warranty. As you go down this unfortunate path you will see how this information applies to us all!!
Secret warranties are a multi-billion consumer abuse. Every auto company makes mistakes in building cars. Whether they are design defects that affect every car or whether they are manufacturing defects which affect only some cars, they must be repaired. The only question is who pays for the manufacturers' mistakes, the manufacturer or the consumer. Although the auto manufacturer often establishes a secret warranty to pay for the repair, all too often it is the consumer who pays for the manufacturer's mistake because the consumer never finds out about the secret warranty. That's wrong and the Center for Auto Safety wants to change it.
In a 1987 report the Center for Auto Safety (CAS) created national headlines by identifying 10 exemplary secret warranties covering 30 million vehicles and $3 billion in repair costs. Yet this is but the tip of the iceberg for we estimate that at any one time over 500 secret warranties exist for all auto companies. According to a Toyota whistleblower who provided a complete list in May 1988, Toyota alone had 41 secret warranties at that time.
By exposing secret warranties, CAS forces manufacturers to pay for their mistakes and creates a strong incentive for them to build better cars in the future. once secret warranties are disclosed, consumers will save hundreds, if not thousands, in repair bills on their personal cars. Spurred on by CAS exposes, state legislatures are moving to pass secret warranty disclosure laws that will protect consumers. Until then, consumers must rely on the strategies suggested in our book, Little Secrets of the Auto Industry, to discover and use secret warranties to pay for repairs in their vehicles.
What is a secret warranty?
Auto companies hate the term secret warranties. They call them policy adjustments, good will programs, service campaigns or extended warranties . But whatever they are called, they are a longstanding industry practice. When a car company has a major defect that occurs after its written warranty expires, it establishes an adjustment policy to pay for repairs rather than deal with many thousands, if not millions, of complaints on a case by case basis. But the auto company communicates the policy only to regional offices and not even always to its dealers. The auto manufacturers never notify the consumer; so only the consumer who complains loudly enough gets covered by the secret warranty. Other consumers end up bearing the costs of the manufacturer's mistakes.
Examples of Secret Warranties
CAS has documented case after case of secret warranties since our founding in 1970. one of the first and most famous was Ford's J-67 Limited Service Program which covered rust on 12 million 1969-72 cars and trucks. In this case a bulletin which went out only to Ford regional offices stated, "This is a limited service program without dealership notification and should be administered on an individual complaint basis." Under this program, Ford would pay up to 100% to repair rust and paint damage on its vehicles even if it cost over a $1000.
CAS has uncovered secret warranties on all auto companies with little differences between them. A 1972 Mazda secret warranty bulletin doubled the coverage for rotary engine damage but cautioned, "Since this is a temporary program which may be terminated at [any] time, owners are not to be informed of the extended coverage." Honda had secret warranties on head gaskets and rusting fenders in the mid-1970's; Chrysler had rusting fenders on Volares and Aspens in the late 1970's; GM had the transmission secret warranty caused by a ban on sperm whale oil as a lubricant; Peugeot and Subaru both covered defective head gaskets; and VW covered valve stem seals.
Secret warranties soared after 1980 when the federal government dropped all efforts to ban them. GM had a 5 year/50,000 mile secret warranty covering repair of defective rack and pinion power steering systems on all 16 million of its 1981-88 front wheel drive cars. Toyota covered pulsating brakes on its 1983-86 Camry in a $100 million secret warranty. Ford never told owners of its 1985-92 F-series pickups that America's most popular truck had peeling paint because Ford skipped the primer layer. According to Nissan documents provided to CAS by a whistleblower in 1990, Nissan had at one time up to 48 secret warranties covering various cars and trucks.
There is no doubt that auto manufacturers presently have many other secret warranties. However, assessing how widespread secret warranty programs are is difficult because these programs, by definition, are not intended for public disclosure. Since CAS began exposing secret warranties more widely in the 1980's, the auto makers having gotten better at keeping them secret. Even CAS can no longer get lists of secret warranties to disclose. one Honda insider told CAS that Honda has only one secret warranty book for each of its regions. The book is chained to a desk.
I can certainly look into your concern with your sunroof. Can you please email me your information at socialmedia@gm.com ATTN: Erica? I will need you to provide me with your name, VIN, mileage, address, phone number, and the name of the Certified GM Dealership you are working with in regards to this concern. Look forward to hearing from you soon.
Erica Tiffany
GM Customer Service
We are happy with our Dodge Crew now. Liked the Outlook more, but that chapter is closed. GOOD LUCK everyone.. keep pushing. Remember - YOU are right!
Now fast forward 4 months and it has been back to the shop twice, the first time after my wife went to the car wash and got wet. She was told at that time by the service manager that she should know better than to take a vehicle with a sunroof through the car wash as some leaking is normal. My past vehicles with sunroofs have mysteriously never had a leak after performing the same task of making sure I have a clean vehicle. As the weather continued to get warmer and into the rain season, guess what more leaks and the growing musty smell of mold - which of course is great for my toddler and infant children to breathe in as we travel In our "family" vehicle.
We of course brought it in again and were told the Drains had magically plugged again and that they took care of it. I received a call later that week where they told me that they read replacing the front seal "might" take care of the problem.
As I don't like paying for uncertainty, I decided to investigate myself. Pulled the headliner down and doused the vehicle with the hose. All drains are perfectly clear but the stationary moonroof is leaking. Next stop will be to a glass installer to have it reseated, which of course will be a bill paid out of my pocket to fix the manufacturer defect.
I will update the status of the fix after we get rained on. Sorry for the rant but one day somebody is going to have a serious accident or lasting health issues from this problem.
I am sorry that you are experiencing an issue with your vehicle. Have you contacted GM Customer Care? If not, we cannot guarantee anything but we would be happy to look into your concern. You can reach via email at socialmedia@gm.com or you may contact Saturn Customer Assistance Center at 800-553-6000
Jennifer T. (Assisting Amber)
GM Customer Care
The GM dealership told me is was not because the sunroof was defective, but because it was full of pine needs, leaves, etc... I beg to differ. It leaks because the sunroof was designed poorly and is defective.
I'm tired of having a lake on the passenger side floor all winter long, changing out towels and having moldy smelling carpet.
Thus far, thankfully I have not had any issues with the fuse box or electrical system.
GM needs to figure out how to fix this problem and issue a Recall so all Outlook owners can have this fixed permanently for Free.
I have also submitted my complaint as suggested on-line to NHTSA. Thank you for posting how to file a complaint.
I am sorry to hear of the ongoing issue of your vehicles leaking sunroof that you had to deal with. I am glad you were able to work with a dealership who helped resolve and fix this concern for you and that there have been no leaks since. Thanks for sharing your experience with everyone. If you ever have additional concerns or questions, please reach out to us by email at socialmedia(at)gm.com.
Sincerely,
Laura M.
GM Customer Care
I am sorry you are experiencing a sunroof issue. I would like the opportunity to further discuss your situation with you. Please contact us by email at socialmedia(at)gm.com and include your contact information, VIN and current mileage. We look forward to hearing from you.
Sincerely,
Laura M.
GM Customer Care
However, the damage between the inside and outside of my car remains to be seen. Of course they don't think any water damage could occur. It is amazing how water can come from the outside of your car to the inside of your car for YEARS and no water damage be done between the out/insides (sarcasm meant).
Have a great day!
I also own an 08 Outlook and have had the same problems and woes as you. I am extremely happy that you found a resolution to your leakage. Would you mind sharing with me a couple of more details about these mystery holes? I am taking my car to a non-GM repair facility I trust and would like to describe this to them.
Where exactly are the holes? Under the roof racks or near the 2nd moon roof?
Is this something that is easily accessible?
Are you still leak free?
I would greatly appreciate any info you give me. Thank you so much for reading and taking time away from your life to help me out.
Such a shame that the company won't just make good on the problem they created!
I recognize your dissatisfaction with this situation and apologize that you are experiencing a sunroof leak in your Saturn. If you would like for us to look further into this issue for you, and work towards a possible resolution we are available by email for assistance. We can be reached at socialmedia@gm.com [attn Amber]. Please include your screen name, VIN, exact mileage, contact information, as well as your current and selling dealership.
Amber N.
GM Customer Care
We have an 08 Outlook, currently in the shop, that the roof drains are clogged. Funny thing is the shop manager told my wife that it says in the owners manual to clean the drains. When I asked him, he said it's in there vaguely and of course couldn't say, but he ultimately said "you must maintain your vehicle." We love the Outlook, but unfortunately, the sunroof has issues. The America people did the so called "right thing" when GM was bailed out, GM should step up and fix this problem. If anyone hasn't filed a complaint on the NHTSA site, please do so now! The more complaints the better. Also, write letters to GM and voice your issues on every social media outlet. If you have news stations that will do investigative stories, see if they will bit on this. I wish everyone the best of luck with their Saturn.
I apologize that you have experienced this with your Outlook. I would be happy to look into your situation further. If this is something you would like my assistance with please email me, attn: Jonathan A. at socialmedia@gm.com. If you would also reference your username, and include your full contact information, VIN, current mileage, and involved dealership. I look forward to hearing back from you.
Sincerely,
Jonathan A.
GM Customer Care
I'm leaning towards a '12 Ford Explorer XLT.
I'm very sorry to hear that this experience has led you to consider trading off your vehicle. I apologize that the leaking sunroof hasn't been fixed on your Saturn and recognize your dissatisfaction with this situation. If there is anything we can do to help with this matter, please email us your name, VIN, mileage, contact information and the name of the dealership you've been working with. We can be reached at socialmedia@gm.com [attn Amber]. Thank you, and we look forward to hearing from you.
Amber N.
GM Customer Care
can anyone tell me if they got any good outcomes with GM repairing the sunroof leak hose? i have had the same problem since last year. the last time i took mine into the dealership they said they could not find a problem so nothing was done. we just had a bad storm this past weekend and my airbags on side panel were leaking and my front passenger carpet was soaked. ive been told by the dealership that the hoses for dranege could not handle that much water so it overfloaded into the car. and the hose is too short. this should be put on recall.. now they want to charge me $450 to replace hoses.
My mom has a 2007 Saturn outlook that has the clogging problem. she took it to the dealership (same one she purchased it from) and they want to charge her $4000 to fix it. The recall part was apparently fixed. I am so worried about her driving it because of the electrical system and the water. Plus the car restarted itself after she turned it off and took the key out. I am a loyal chevy customer- was getting ready to buy a new cruze later this year but now am disheartened.
Hi weebijou,
I just responded to your private message regarding your mom's vehicle. I look forward to hearing back from you and working towards a possible resolution.
Amber N.
GM Customer Care
Does anyone got an answer from GM about this leaking issue with Saturn Outlook and GMC Acadia? I sent an e-mail to socialmidia@gm.com but so far I haven't received a response. In my case, I have water leaking on the airbag sign of the airbag in the column at the sides of the windshield. As the water may affect the performance of the Airbag it may be ineffective on an accident and may jeopardize the lives of the front passengers thus I believe it is time for GM to take serious action and propose a recall before they have to pay another $35Million fine to the NHTSA....Amber, I'm at your disposal for discussing it. Just let me know where I can contact you.
Hello tiredofgm1,
We are sorry to hear that you are having concerns with your vehicle. I understand you mentioned you sent us an email, I want to ensure that you sent the email to socialmedia@gm.com. We look forward to hearing from you.
Thank you,
Andraya R.
GM Customer Care
I can't believe all the claims and GM has not made this a recall issue. I to have always both GM, I have loved my Saturn all these years and had intentions of keeping this vehicle forever, BUT I think the end is near. Hoping GM will stand by this major flaw.
Is there a lawyer in this Forum who wants a class action suit?
So I ended up giving the 2008 Outlook to my parents. First it was the transmission with the defective wave link?. The dealer tried to screw my elderly parents into a new transmission until I got involved. I did my research and found out about the defective wave link?.
Now the leak! If something happens whether it be electrical or mechanical from the roof leak, before I can get to them and intervene, all hell will break loose. Especially now that GM has such a [non-permissible content removed] record for admitting defects and doing something about it (ie the ignition switch debacle). Very disapointed from what I'm reading on this topic.
Found culprit. Its the front part of the racks on the inside there's a opening toward the front of the rack. You have to really look to see it. I put a water hose in the opening and there came the water inside the headliner. I had already sealed the front and back roof glass a day later it rained and there was water again so I move to the roof racks and found the problem. You need to calk the inner roof rack and the back or the whole inside of it thats what I did. Hope it works out for you