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thanks for the info on how to purchase a Tribute through the S plan. It was very helpful in conducting my research into which vehicle to get and how much to pay. Here's what I've found so far: After exhausting research, I'm going to choose the Mazda over the Ford. It would seem that they are not equals after-all and I've heard that, similarly equiped, the Mazda will out perform the Ford. I have yet to confirm this by personal experience.
As far as price is concerned: Apparently, those of us in the Gulf States region (South central and South eastern US) are having a hard time getting dealers to go below MSRP because they say their 1st and 2nd Quarter 2001 allotments are virtually sold and why would they willingly loose money. Even though several Ford Dealerships (some next door) offered me below invoice on XLT Ford Escapes, this didn't carry much weight with Mazda lots. And yes, I did speak to the right people at the Mazda dealerships. Soooooo.......
Anyone north or east of Oklahoma know of a good Mazda internet or fleet sales person who is willing to deal? I'm currently seeking a Desert Metallic or Chestnut Mica LX 4WD, Towing pkg, Premium Audio pkg, 16" alloy wheels, all-weather floor mats but NO moon roof and NO ABS. hot4ridn@yahoo.com PS How about those Sooners!!!
reliability; excellent customer satisfaction; all-wheel drive from most experienced manufacturer, along with a viscous limited slip rear differential; highest HP & torque 4-cylinder engine; best-of-class crash rating; best-rated handling and ride; larger cargo space; and 60 month/60,000 mile major components warranty. Key features that were also important to us but pretty much comparable to its competition were the 4-wheel ABS & disc brakes, side impact door beams, side airbags (except the RAV-4), moonroof (except for the CR-V, which doesn't offer one and can't have one installed -- Honda says they have to remove a roof beam, which would negatively affect the structure of the car body) and leather interior, gas mileage, price, heated seats, ability to use regular gas, a full-size spare, heated power mirrors, loaner cars for overnight service while under warranty and door-to-door shuttle service thereafter . Although I have to admit even the little things -- like the de-icing front wiper, integrated window antenna, multiple storage compartments, a rubber cargo area tray, subfloor storage, a dimming rear view mirro with electronic compass, and the easiest-to-open rear door (especially when compared to the CR-V) -- were advantages over the competition as well. I never would have bought the Ford Escape or Mazda Tribute -- neither companies have good reliability records overall, and these products are in their first year of production. The President of Mazda happens to be an old friend of mine, so I knew if I wanted the Tribute I could get a great deal. It
wouldn't have been worth it.
I'll also tell you we considered a few wagons -- with the Subaru Outback and Volkswagen Passat coming out on top. Here, my wife and I simply preferred the SUV-style over the Outback wagon. And while the Passat wagon is a highly-rated vehicle, to get what we got with the Forester would have meant spending an additional $4,000 to get all-wheel drive, forcing us into the 6-cylinder model with much poorer gas mileage and a requirement to use much more expensive premium gas. All in all, I can't get over the outstanding combination the Subaru Forester offers in terms of reliability, safety, features and value.
With all this, I still had just a bit of hesitation before making the final buying decision because neither my wife or I had ever owned a Subaru. This is where Al Rowe, our salesman, came in. His professionalism, knowledge and straightforwardness in dealing with both of us made the difference. In sales myself -- 20 years with IBM as a salesman, sales manager and now sales executive -- I've learned a thing or two about salesmanship and the right way to earn a customer's business. Al Rowe represented Subaru very well. We expect this to be just the start of a long-term, positive relationship with Subaru of Morristown, New Jersey as we need to service our Forester along the way -- and look for our next car!
I was so ready to purchase a ES Tribute, but I got so frustrated with the whole recall situation. I couldn't seem to get a straight answer from anyone associated with MAZDA. Really disappointing. I'm a 10 year Miata owner who would have loved to have been a Tribute owner, but MAZDA/FORD really needs to get their act together. Especially their customer relations. I don't want to bash MAZDA or the Tribute, as I was all ready to go. I wish all of you Tribute owners out there the best of luck. So many of you have not only been patient, but also very generous with your thoughts. Thank you!
PS. Bought a Lexus RX300. More $$, but one great car. I don't suggest that you test drive one, unless you are prepared to fall in love!!!
"It is clearly a better overall product than either the Toyota RAV-4, Honda CR-V, Mazda Tribute or Ford Escape among small SUV's .... highest HP & torque 4-cylinder engine ... best-rated handling and ride; larger cargo space ... I never would have bought the Ford Escape or Mazda Tribute -- neither companies have good reliability records overall, and these products are in their first year of production."
First of all, I would like to say that I think Subaru makes excellent cars... however, I disagree with several of these comments. First, although the four-cylinder engine does have the highest torque and horsepower, it falls short of other cars' V6 engines, or even Subaru's own flat-six. I'm not sure about the handling and ride as I haven't driven one myself, but I do know that the 0-60 time is somewhere above ten seconds (I think CR listed it as 11.1, but I could be wrong), which doesn't even compare to the Tribute's 8.7. I don't know where you're getting the idea that Mazda has a poor reliability record -- all Japanese cars basically have good reliability, and if you look in a magazine like CR you will find that Mazda has an excellent reliability history. For example, the Miata is really the most reliable roadster in existence.
The Subaru Forester is a great SUV, but I wouldn't say it's "clearly a better product" than the Tribute.
with 8000 miles they resealed the intake manifold.
it worked, no more fumes through vents.
I had to leave it for a few days to let the sealer set.
the rubber gasket that is on it was not a tight enough seal so they put a sealer on both sides of the gasket and let it set for a couple of days and it worked.
this is what the corporate techs advised and it worked.
Later...
As to the other parts of the car: the transmission is seemingly identical to the Escape's; the Tribute's suspension is different and designed by Mazda for better halding; brakes are the same; the interior was done by Mazda; and the sheetmetal/styling is obviously different.
Is all that right?
I would think that the Tribute's handling would also be better, considering how they have more of a sporting heritage (RX-7, Miata, racing program) than Ford.
lets get right to the point, drive both. which one gets up and goes, which one slugs along with the four cylinder mini cars. how bout cargo space.....hmmmm, lets see... towing capacity... handling, better go read consumer reports, don't bother driving one. styling, yeah this one is in the eye of the cupholder. 190 watt 6 disc in-dash, front/side airbags, enough rear seat room for adults, power moonroof/driver seat, abs, leather.......all for 25 grand. oh yeah, here's one, the roof rack has a 50 pound greater capacity on the forester. so if you line them up side by side.....you got one nice roof rack.
Preach it brother
Now we've been waiting 3 1/2 months for our order to come in and Mazda reputation is somewhat tarnished from where this journey began back in september with all the recalls and defects.
Still hanging and waiting.
FWIW the Audi/VW product is so much more advanced and high quality that you do get what you pay for. Automobile magazine picked the Passat as their BEST family car of 2001 based on those attributes. Of course buying a car is a matter of opinion...as she said.
Waiting to zoooooooooooommmmmmmmmmmmmm
Yes, you get what you pay for... and you pay for quite a bit more.
<<Automobile magazine picked the Passat as their BEST family car of 2001 based on those attributes. Of course buying a car is a matter of opinion...as she said.>>
I don't think it's fair to compare the Tribute to an A4 or Passat. As smaller, "high-performance" German sedans (or wagons), they lack the spaciousness and cargo area of the Tribute. Interestingly, the Tribute is also just as fast in a straight line (0-60 in 8.7 seconds) as an A4 2.8 Quattro Auto, and actually *faster* than the Passat. Of course there is the risk of rolling over, but the skidpad grip and slalom numbers are also comparable. Something to consider...
Also, the Tribute can do some utilitarian things that the A4 and Passat wagons can't do. I realize that many people aren't buying cars based on their pure "usefulness" (I want a fun car too!) but... would you really take your shiny new Audi skiing? Volkswagen recommends not towing with the Passat... another advantage for the Tribute.
What's my point with all this? Yes, German cars are better. I don't think anyone will argue that. Germans always have been, and probably always will be, masters of the craft. But when you consider its price, efficiency, usefulness, performance, and "fun to drive factor" the Tribute is hard to beat.
<<Waiting to zoooooooooooommmmmmmmmmmmmm >>
Me too. The dealership warned against revving the engine past 4000 for the first thousand miles. Oh well.
The Tribute has 200 Hp and 200 LbFt , Escape is 201 Hp and 196 LbFt torque. The engines are tuned slightly differently (different engine management chip) for slightly quicker power on the Tribute. The transmissions are programed slightly differently for sportier response for the Tribute. The suspension pieces are nearly identical but the Tribute has sportier handling with firmer ride, more controlled lean and quicker but less assisted steering.
Small changes can up to a very different feel. If you drive both you will find that the Escape is more of a cruiser and the Tribute is more of a sports car feel. Neither is a true sports car but both handle and accelerate very well compared to any SUV this side of the BMW X5.
While both vehicles roll off the same assembly line, Mazda seems more concerned with vehicle quality. The final quality control checks and adjustments are not the same on both. Also Mazda insisted on the same type of robots as those used on the Japanese built Millennium to reduce quality control problems.
Ford / Mazda have been quick to fix problems on these vehicles which has lead to a perception of a major problem. Most of these recalls have been for relatively few vehicles or minor flaws. Any new vehicle will have a learning curve, no matter who designs or builds it. Many Japanese cars have relatively fewer problems here because they are found and fixed in the Japanese market before being introduced here.
I don't have a significant reason to have a four-wheel-drive (live in SE, relative smooth terrain, no beach nearby) and have no significant attachment to the options I would forego if I choose the 4WD.
Would I be foolish for passing up the better deal on the 4WD? Are there any other differences between the FWD and 4WD that I should consider? Gas mileage? Added maintenance to 4WD? Any more known problems with the 4WD that the FWD hasn't had? etc.
Any input over the next couple of days would be appreciated.
Even compared to the X5 itself.
The Tribute is faster in both 0-60 and quarter mile than the X5 3.0/auto. It also had a higher slalom speed.
The more I know about my Tribute, the more I like it...
Also people are saying things like it's more of a Mazda because it was designed in Japan. Yea whatever...FORD ENGINE, FORD TRANS, BUILT ON FORD LINE BY FORD EMPLOYEES. IT'S A FORD WITH A MAZDA STICKER ON IT. Now Mazda is a great company but I see them turning into another Mercury.
"While both vehicles roll off the same assembly line, Mazda seems more concerned with vehicle quality. The final quality control checks and adjustments are not the same on both". -HOW CAN THIS BE TRUE? The Tribute and Escape had the same recalls for the same things. The quality checks are the same no matter what. When they build the Tributes they use different quality inspector then when they build the Escape? NO Ddeemo that's not true.
The Escape/Tribute is a piece of junk. Anything that has 5+ (5 for Tribute, 6 for Escape) recalls from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration is simply not worth it. Also the 5 recalls the NHTSA put out are the same for both!
FUEL:THROTTLE LINKAGES AND CONTROL
STEERING:WHEEL AND COLUMN
WHEELS:HUB
FUEL:FUEL LINES FITTINGS AND PUMP
VISUAL SYSTEMS:WINDSHIELD WIPER LINKAGE:PIVOT:DRIVE ASSEMBLY
This only proves that they are the same. Mazda is a wonderful company with quality cars only if Ford would keep out of them.
>> Mechanically they are identical... part for part. When you hear "suspension if different" that is NOT REALLY true.<<
I'm getting a little tired of this whining by people who sit hunched over a computer screen, have never driven the car, and have never been in an assembly plant, let alone an automotive design office.
The recall issues have been handled in this forum, logically, on many occasions. Speculation and guesses regarding the similarities/differences between Escape & Tribute are irrelevant; drive them, and decide for yourself. Discuss with us your impressions based on fact, not some dreamed up nonsense.
I'm a mechanical engineer, worked in the auto industry for 15 years, and am VERY impressed with the Tribute I bought.
It is spacious, fun, quiet, and drives with similar personality to that of my Miata.
I suggest the whiners who spout these useless proclamations without any supporting data or evidence (even empirical) return to whatever segment of internet geekdom they came from, and the rest of us spend time productively discussing technical issues related to a very well engineered and enjoyable vehicle.
Thanks!
I am enormously frustrated, but after reading this bulletin board, I can see I'm not alone. (small concession).
However, after shopping and reshopping, I am convinced that what I want is absolutely the Mazda Tribute. I ordered the LX model with ABS, moonroof... pretty much loaded... and have been told the consequence is a very long wait!
I have yelled at my Mazda salesperson (who happens to be an autobytel dealer)... and then made up with him several times. He's getting no information from his sales rep... and Mazda will not "allow" him to give me his sales rep's phone number so I can get some idea of a delivery date, nor will they give him any reasons why, when... and have pretty much told the dealer to just let the customers cancel their orders (as he tells me most have done). No wonder the car manufacturers are facing cut-backs. They don't want to sell any vehicles..!
How long should it take a car manufacturer to recognize a production problem and correct it to deliver pre-sold vehicles? Am I missing something here?
I would love to hear from anyone who might know what the heck is going on.
This is very sad customer service on Mazda's part. They should at least be communicating with their customers on the status of the their orders and making some sort of concession in return for their extreme patience.
So, I remain... anxious, but waiting to zoom, zoom, zooooommmmmmmmmmm!
#2 I actually had one on order from Mazda using the Mazda S plan. I thought at first it was more Mazda than Ford but while waiting for it (5 weeks went by with dealer telling me it's being built just to find out they were not honoring the plan) I canceled the order due to increasing recalls from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration and poor communication from the Dealer/Manufacturer. I'm glad I never bought a Tribute.
#3 I have been in an assembly plant in Detroit where I used to live. I knew a few people that worked on the assembaly for Ford and Gm. They really we not the brightest light on the christmas tree. They were there for the $$$ and that's all. Sure you get paid good money and it takes a year to work on a car line but are you doing a quality job? I no longer live in Detroit and drive 2 foreign cars. I now see how some people are blinded into the buy American syndrome. I also had a close friend that just went to the Grand Prix plant. He said when that break buzzer sounded if a worker was in the middle of tightening a bolt they would lay down their tool and walk off the line. There is quality for you.
#4 "supporting data" What do you want me to support? I'm sure I've proved myself more than just a "whiner".
<<FORD ENGINE, FORD TRANS, BUILT ON FORD LINE BY FORD EMPLOYEES. IT'S A FORD WITH A MAZDA STICKER ON IT.>>
FORD ENGINE TUNED BY MAZDA, MAZDA SUSPENSION, MAZDA STYLING, MAZDA INTERIOR. IT'S A MAZDA. AND STOP TYPING IN ALL CAPS. PLEASE.
By the way, I'm a recent college grad, and if there are any other gads out there, the Mazda grad program will let you defer the payment of your loan 6 months. (for a high interest rate) But, at the end of the 6 months, you can refinance the loan with any bank (for a good interest rate and no extra cost) and have a decent down payment. (save during the 6 months)
My 2 cents worth on the recall deal
If you think about it, the recalls that were made were for fairly minor things. I realize that a recall in general doesn't happen if there is not a for sure issue with the vehicle, but come on... making your decision based upon a wind shield wiper recall is a little harsh. To each his own, I guess, but make sure you drive the vehicle before casting judgment. I have been pleased with everything I have seen so far... I pick up my new tribute tomorrow.... 3 days after calling dealers. Bottom line..... LOOK AROUND.... they're out there!!!!!!!
All real Mazdas have a 5 year powertrain warranty, but the Tribute only gets a 3 year Powertrain warranty.
You figure it out.
"divison of ford" - I never said that anywhere in my posts. Please do not quote me for what I have not said. But it is true that Mazda is controlled at least 30% by Ford.
Typing in all caps...well I went overboard. I won't do it again but the caps for the recalls are copy and pasted from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration web site. It's not my text.
All Mazda? How can it be all Mazda if it's built on a Ford line by Ford employees? Just because it says Mazda on the outside emblem do you really think Mazda makes it? Do you think Mercury makes the Mercury Mountaineer? No it's the same mechanical parts as a Ford Explorer with a different cosmetic look. The Tribute is has the same mechanical parts as the Ford Escape with a different cosmetic look. It's still built by Ford with Ford parts.
I own a 91 Mazda Protégé and there is no Ford in it. I love that car. I love Mazda. When my Protégé dies I plan on buying another Protégé only if it has not been touched by Ford.
The main thing I'm trying to say is the quality of the Tribute/Escape is poor. 5 recalls in 6 months is not a good record. Sure there are a lot of cars out there that have recalls even the best of them. But 5 recalls and it is only 6 months old? Some say -well it only affects a small amount out there they fixed the problems so soon-. True it does only effect a small amount of the Tributes out there but the fact is if the quality and workmanship was taken seriously that wouldn’t have happened. This makes me judge not the car but who puts it together, designs it, writes the instructions for assembly, and quality check. Will there be more in the future? We will find out.
I found that if you check at the end of the month that most dealers will usually deal more. I would think that this time of year would be a good time to buy a car.
I did not get exactly what I wanted (I wanted ABS, Tow Package, and FWD), but I love my new SUV. I have forgotten that it is not my "ideal" because it is so much fun to drive. Quit waiting and find something close to what you want... nothing in life is ever exactly the way you want it anyway.
Also, adamjrae... if you are so down on the Tribute, quit torturing yourself at this site and go post somewhere else where you can be positive about something.
Everyone that rides in my Tribute loves it!! Zoom!
Somehow my brain stopped working last year and I bought a new Ford Zx2 with the 2L Zetec engine. What a piece of crap (these were my thoughts before my tranny went at 6000 miles).
I think the Tribute is fabulous, but the tranny is a known weakness. Having assembled on a Ford line is indeed another worry. I may still get one, but I definetley will factor the 7year warranty into the price.
As I said in a previous message, you have to wonder why Mazda (in Canada) has 5year power train warranty standard, except on the vehicle with the Ford drivetrain. This is not confidence inspiring.
Peter
Yes, Ford isn't exactly known for quality. After all, the company *is* American...
At any rate, the reliability can't be much worse than my '86 Jeep Cherokee.
Upstream, there are many different parts and suppliers. Downstream, Tributes are sold, serviced and supported by an entirely different network than the Escape, and the warranty is longer (in the U.S.)
In some regards, you might say all they have in common is that they happen to be built in the same place by the same workers, and that they share numerous Tier 1 and some Tier 2 supplier components.
Two questions:
Has anyone any experience using studded tires on TribScape? Any binding of the drive line?
Has anyone any experience towing 3000 lbs with TribScape? Uphill acceleration? Emergency braking?
but, thanks to sjohn3. I appreciate your suggestion. I will start my call-around.
At this time the production of Tributes with moonroofs has been been cut to only 20% as well as less than 1% with ABS.
In response to the 4x2 vs. 4x4 .. if you can get a good deal on a 4x4 you will get the extra cost back at resale time .. the gas millage is rated the same and there is no extra maintance cost.
The good news is ... the Mazda store in Brandon FL ( high volume tribute store) has 30+ Tributes in stock and ready for delivery !
4x2 , 4x4 , DX,LX,ES, moonroofs , ABS , best colors !!
Have a great time with your tribute, and check out the Yahoo Mazda Tribute Owners Club at http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/mazdatributeownersclub
If, however, you are in the ruts already formed and you want to get out of them, it is very difficult to climb out of them. Some of my friends who own larger trucks and SUV's (i.e. Yukon, Expedition) said that they have similar results with their vehicles.
I was very impressed with my Tribute's performance on sand. I did make sure to put the transmission in the lowest gear and engaged the 4WD before heading out.
I plan to take my Tribute out on the beach alot more when warmer weather arrives.
I am in search for a ES 4X4 tribute in white fully loaded. Willing to travel east coast or ship it from other locations.. Can anyone advise of any dealers who may have one..
Thanks
The first click of the remote unlocks the driver's door. The second subsequent click unlocks all pass doors and the rear hatch.
Profit was over 250 million USD.
With the success of the Tribute and the MPV, and the excellent quality of the 626, Miata and Millenia, here's to a banner 2001 for this fine company!
"Press this control to unlock the driver's door. The interior lamps will illuminate. The flashers will flash twice to confirm the vehicle is unlocked.
Press the control a second time within three seconds to unlock all the doors."
Notice that it says, "...unlock *all* the doors." That statement would include the rear hatch.
bclamb: Since you posted *twice* that the remote of your ES won't lock or unlock your rear hatch, it would seem that the remote system of your ES is in need of servicing. The remote of everyone else's US Tribute seems to work as the manual states it is supposed to.