... "Just did the upgrade potion of SOS/DD trek, starting with app little more than 1/2 tank @ 38 mpg,, 36 mpg with 2 folks, packed trunk, in MB 250 BT (computer screen only) . Most of the way was clear sailing, pea soup fog @ the start. 80 to 85 mph (slow lanes) for most of the way up . Almost a magical space cushion for almost all the way."...
SOS/DD trek up grade FILLED (14.2/15.6 tank) for (MB 250 B/T) 36 mpg, before the downgrade. On the down grade (computer screen only) did a 50 mpg for 90 miles (lots more obstacles in the mountains) and then dropped to 42 mpg (210 miles) over all (up/down grade legs) for app 39 mpg over all. WEIRD traffic patterns for the (MLK) holiday, so I didn't do much over 90 mph on the return leg. Happy MLK day to one and all ! There were intermittent pea soup conditions in some of the Sacramento, CA corridor, aka ADJUSTED accordingly.
... "Just did the upgrade potion of SOS/DD trek, starting with app little more than 1/2 tank @ 38 mpg,, 36 mpg with 2 folks, packed trunk, in MB 250 BT (computer screen only) . Most of the way was clear sailing, pea soup fog @ the start. 80 to 85 mph (slow lanes) for most of the way up . Almost a magical space cushion for almost all the way."...
SOS/DD trek up grade FILLED (14.2/15.6 tank) for (MB 250 B/T) 36 mpg. On the down grade (computer screen only) did a 50 mpg for 90 miles (lot more obstacles in the mountains) and then dropped to 42 mpg (210 miles) over all (up/down grade legs) for app 39 mpg over all. WEIRD traffic patterns for the (MLK) holiday, so I didn't do much over 90 mph on the return leg. Happy MLK day to one and all ! There were intermittent pea soup conditions in some of the Sacramento, CA corridor, aka ADJUSTED accordingly.
Do you go to Tahoe every weekend? That can be a brutal drive.
No, the normal intervals are a bit more spread out than that. But then, I have gone up/ back, back up again with only a to a few days between. Yes, I have had a few BAD legs !
But I think dialing into the "local vibe mentality" helps to keep the BAD legs down ! ( as opposed to Alpine/X country skier/s, boater/s, hiker, biker, hunter, gold panner, camper, horse folk, off roader, gambler, event festivals, etc, cycles)
Left Coast (corner store where I filled for SOS/DD)
(Newer diesel cars emit more NO2, per an airqualitynews.com link.)
Probably cost too much to convert those double deck buses to CNG. And all the lorries are likely diesel. They could ban the buses and get rid of all those pesky tourists. Only allow horse drawn delivery and rickshaws for transport. Or just abandon the stinking city. They cause nothing but trouble and crime.
Have you been to London? It is an interesting city. Was there in 2013. Plan to go back in 2016. Enjoyed the "Tube" and buses.
avalon02: Have you been to London? It is an interesting city. Was there in 2013. Plan to go back in 2016. Enjoyed the "Tube" and buses.
No never anywhere in Europe. Kind of wanted to do the European delivery on a new Mercedes ML Bluetec. They are made here and not available for EU delivery. I realize big cities like London have unique experiences you will not find in more rural locations. I just don't like being around big crowds of people. Too many places in the World I would rather see. Until we are rid of the [non-permissible content removed] tactics associated with flying we will be driving the Touareg diesel on our vacations. Avoiding large cities as best we can.
You mis-characterize the % DIESEL PVF % (cars) during Reagan's tenure. At that time, it was even a SMALLER minority (25% of the 5% diesels were cars) than it is NOW (less than 50 % or less than 2.5% of the diesel fleet ! So while you might not like the word HATE, ULSD is STILL and FURTHER being economically penalized (from a price per gal point of view).
STILL/unchanged, price per mile driven ppmd FUEL is still better for diesel (like model). So the distinction/hair splitting does not change nor alter the original points. The key point is LSD (500 ppm) can be EXPORTED, RUG/PUG can NOT !
So, if you wish to use more (30 to 65% more) RUG/PUG when you can use LESS ULSD, to beat a dead horse, I am perfectly fine with that. In that sense, that was the longer term design which exists to this day. To be clear, I want to use LESS to even less AND cost less to EVEN less.
As for NEW processing plant's near to production and on US soil, I say yippee yahoo !! However, it is a Yogi Berra type issue: "it ain't processing product, till its up and processing product". So to me, a TOTAL non starter on effect/s on diesel or natural gas prices.
So yes, I hope that one correctly placed environmental lawsuit does NOT tie these intended plants up for an unknown term of YEARS or does not allow it even to run.
I did not mis-characterize the % DIESEL PVF %. All I did was provide an explanation of why we have the higher diesel tax via an article. Diesel needs to be taxed more. Those 80,000 pound semis do a lot more damage to roads than an average passenger vehicle.
For those of you that missed the big news. “The number of well completions decreased from 145(final) in October to 39(preliminary) in November.” https://www.dmr.nd.gov/oilgas/ With ND sweet going for about $35 per barrel companies are waiting on completing wells. Next month we will see how much that impacts production.
On another note, the other day a local businessman told me he would buy a gasoline truck (3500) instead of a diesel. Cost of diesel here is $2.89 while RUG is $1.99. He said it just does not pay to spend the $8,000 diesel engine premium. You know its bad for diesel when the business people start looking at gasoline engines for their rigs. As McCoy would say: “He's dead Jim!”
Cost per BTU RUG vs ULSD is different depending on the region you are in. Currently in parts of Oregon that I travel RUG and ULSD are comparably priced. BTU is also not directly related to MPG. It looks to me that for any given sized engine gas vs diesel, the diesel is always gets more MPG than the comparison of BTUs would indicate. So right now if you live in Roseburg Oregon you can buy ULSD for 2 cents more than RUG.
Diesel needs to be taxed more. Those 80,000 pound semis do a lot more damage to roads than an average passenger vehicle.
Hmmm, and that does not get charged directly to the consumer that buys the goods being hauled in those big trucks? The Interstates were supposed to be built for VERY HEAVY vehicles. So that should not be a factor. Just another excuse to tax and spend. Sadly the money collected in fuel tax is squandered on other things besides roads and bridges. This county needs tax revolt on so many levels.
We are exporting over 10 million barrels per month of finished gasoline."
To beat a dead horse, I have been perfectly fine with folks (like you) paying more per mile driven ! So have 95% PLUS of the PVF !! I am also happy that YOU are happy doing that ! Really to me, one issue ( given a like model) preserve the choice of paying less!
Again IF American CRUDE can not be exported and finished fuel products BY LAW, BUT under loopholes CAN be exported, it goes to the (my) point all along that there has been no fuel shortage/ crisis and prices have been/are continue to be manipulated. It is then inexplicable why Congress will not CHANGE those laws, i.e., lift those bans, even as EIA.gov sources such as you cite, say EVERYTHING CAN be imported AND exported.
It is too bad they can not convert the cost per BTU advantage of RUG/PUG into PAR or BETTER mpg 50 mpg to 50 mpg TO ULSD !!! Then it will be a no brainer. Same goes for torque. Well we should not leave out PAR engine size 2.0 L RUG/PUG to same (same ) 2.0 L TDI
You refuse to acknowledge the Congressional oil export BANS !! That is PAR for the course in keeping with your past post refusals. So your delay in response/s is/are pretty GOLDEN (telling).
..."According to the EPCA, oil pumped out of the ground in the USA can only be processed at American refineries"... (sidebar) I CLEARLY said DOMESTIC oil !!!
"One liberal target is to prevent any easing in the 39-year-old ban on oil exports. The ban makes less sense each year as U.S. production increases, with the latest estimate at 9.3 million barrels per day in 2015, up from about nine million last year. But the ban makes for good populist politics,...".
..."To the extent more U.S. crude makes it to the global market, prices will be lower, other things being equal."...
..."Instead, U.S. producers are at the mercy of U.S. refiners, since the export ban means they have nowhere else to sell."....
..."Most liberals know all this, which betrays that their real reason for supporting the oil export ban isn’t energy security. It’s climate-change politics. They know the shale boom has undermined their drive for renewable fuels by providing cheap oil and natural gas. They also know that exporting U.S. oil will increase the U.S. incentive to drill, and they’d rather all that oil and gas stay in the ground."...
So there are HOARDS of US based oil companies that wish they could export, what you say is COMMON practice, but somehow is BANNED to them solely because it is DOMESTIC oil/ fuel !!! ???? Not that your post and the 39 year old BAN is wrong, wrong headed and disingenuous or anything? Not that I have a pen and cell phone in hand nor FEDERAL executive, legislative, enforcement authorities, or magic wand.
So yes, they should take away the obvious and artificial barriers that make diesel prices HIGHER.
But then, I see your implied points. Why would we want to make fuel cheaper, add jobs, benefit the US economy, consumers, producers, refiners and help to positively affect the US lopsided balance of payments etc. ??????
But he also feels that the perception of a "glut" in world oil production now is overstated, with supply outpacing demand by only 1 million barrels a day or so.
I hope for $2 fuel and budget for $10. I would not let it change my driving plans. Diesel made a move downward in the last hour. In San Diego we now have CC diesel under $2.50 per gallon. My go to station in Oregon has diesel at $2.19 and RUG is still at $2.25, Oh, how can that be?
But he also feels that the perception of a "glut" in world oil production now is overstated, with supply outpacing demand by only 1 million barrels a day or so.
I hope for $2 fuel and budget for $10. I would not let it change my driving plans. Diesel made a move downward in the last hour. In San Diego we now have CC diesel under $2.50 per gallon. My go to station in Oregon has diesel at $2.19 and RUG is still at $2.25, Oh, how can that be?
LOL! Does that have anything to do with price difference per BTU, ULSD vs RUG-PUG ?
Lets see, the gasser (MB 350 PUG @ $2.99) with the much cheaper per BTU, gets 23.3 mpg vs the far more expensive BTU diesel (MB 250 BT, ULSD @ 2.79) @ 39 mpg. So if the gasser costs 12.8 cents per mile driven and the diesel costs 7.2 cents per mile driven, no matter? I am getting a cheaper per BTU fuel in PUG? Even as PUG is 78% more expensive than USLD (PMD: fuel) ?
At the cast of usual suspect stations (NorCAL- 250 miles spread, Gas Buddy), here are ULSD/RUG prices:
$2.79/$2.79, (PUG @ $2.99)
$2.89/$2.14,
$2.59/$2.37
$2.57/$2.45
$2.44/$2.25
Yes I hope for $1.85 (delusional) and know it will be higher ! Neither swing will change travel plans either !
The diesels range would be hard to see and imply, without mentioning that with EITHER TDI, VW T TDI, MB 250 BT, I have more miles range (station options) than with say gasser s, 94/96 TLC's.
LOL! Does that have anything to do with price difference per BTU, ULSD vs RUG-PUG ?
The diesels range would be hard to see and imply, without mentioning that with EITHER TDI, VW T TDI, MB 250 BT, I have more miles range (station options) than with say gasser s, 94/96 TLC's.
I don't think it is possible to attach an accurate BTU rating to our fuel supply. That leaves our own mileage as the best source of value to each fuel source. With ethanol the BTU factor for RUG goes down along with the MPG. I have yet to see a decided difference in mileage between the various brands of diesel. Oregon is the only place I came across bio diesel in the Shell B20 mix. I was tempted to try it as it was the cheapest diesel in town. I don't want to give VW any ammunition in case of a malfunction. My understanding is Biodiesel has a higher cetane than the minimum 48 for common ULSD. Cetane should be marked on the pump. I have yet to see any such rating.
Bottom line, is I get at least 45% better economy with more usable power out of a gallon of diesel, than a gallon of RUG/PUG. I have never paid 45% more for diesel than gas. That equates to 28 MPG vs 15 MPG.
It would seem that the BTU issue folk has a hard time coming to the quotes conclusion, let alone figuring in better costs in BTU conversions and how they get LESS MPG !!!! ???
More to your biodiesel issue, I would support regulations for up to B 100 biodiesel engine specifications. ZERO ppm sulfur is almost total removal of emissions forming potential. Whether the diesel oems would be interested in a B 100 specification might be a different story.
RUG/PUG by law can be up to 90 PPM sulfur (off line FEE mitigation). 30 ppm is the current standard.
ULSD is @ 15 ppm STANDARD, nominally delivered @ the pumps 5 to 10 ppm.
This back story does not jump out at folks, but B5 was a sort of specification VW was dragged kicking and screaming to. So for all to most miles, I have not even used B 5.
Whether the diesel oems would be interested in a B 100 specification might be a different story.
When Pacific Biodiesel had the big promotion with Willie Nelson and his brand new Mercedes E320 CDI, I contacted them and asked what Mercedes' position was on B100. They told me that MB gave them a green light as their B100 passed all the tests. I think the only problem is all the home brew bio folks. If they say ok and some joker tries to run straight fry oil in his high performance TDI, well, that would probably be disastrous.
However, OFF topic, the local tire guru's removed the oem tires, mounted, balanced, verified the TPMS, put on the new tires and aligned the 09 VW Jetta TDI @ app 88,000 miles. Road tests completed the installation.
@ 88,000 miles, the alignment was VERY close to factory specifications. (aka, didn't really NEED the alignment) The nexus here are the rolling parking lot commute, 3 drivers, 5 total drivers intermittently, ROUGH and challenging road surfaces.
I did app 100 miles today ( for a SLOW 55/60 mph and GENTLE break in, right after completed installation). I intend to go to the 5,000 miles rotation, 10,000 miles oem recommendation. We shall see if this new set (Continental PureContact, w ECO Plus Technology, Grand Touring A/S ) will TOP 88,000 miles (on the OEM tires 13,538 miles per 1/32nd in wear) & UP. I did skip 3 rotations. So maybe that is one reason why they wore out so fast.
From a tad before the Christmas season (Nov 2014), ULSD (RUG/PUG too) seemed to drop from $3.99 (what I notice I have actually PAID) to a LOW of $2.59 (Jan 2015), a 35.1% drop, I am thinking that after the next financial reporting cycle (Bloomberg, CNBC, CNN, etc., etc.,), the price/s might "coincidentally" begin its climb back up to $3.99 ???
So, not that we are planning more and/or LONGER trips (due to 35% ULSD price drop $2.59 per gal ULSD).
But TMI, getting a tad bit out of the neighborhood, my daughter texted $2.77 from Salt Lake City, UT. On her return @ dinner with her, she said she saw $2.49 in Austin, TX.
CNBC's talking head is right now citing the VERY high cost $$$$ per KWH in Germany that is CHOKING the German and EU economy. (lesson here?)
However, we did catch up with friends that are going on a FEB 2015 foursome to hit Washington, CN, Colorado, Utah, Idaho for a 2 month long "follow the snow" ski trip in a GASSER for this threads purposes, (TLC) !! Another friend will gypsy around with them for a month. I am not sure what gasser he will take.
So really, is this (the fuel discount) part of a plan//s to redeploy monies, to also make it look like things are better than they seem ???? !! Or does it look GOOD, while we punish Russia, Iran & middle east terror cronies, China, Venezuela, etc. , and kill the US frackers? (all of the above is probably closer to the truth?)
So given the US drivers YEARLY averages (24.1 mpg and 15,000 miles), that posts 622 gals (@ $3.99 ULSD) or $2,483 per yr.
So, say the 35% discount (optimistic, I am think 2 quarters @ most) lasts a year or =$869. That would be $72.43 per month SAVED !! ?? OK, call this GOOD news !! ??
So part of the State of the Union address covered the SPECTER of raising (MASSIVE) TAXES ?? It was called, "tax the rich", but really are TAXES ( that hurts) the rest of US, 99 % ???? Some would call this GOOD news, me? BAD !! ???
So because we use (366 gals),... LESS ( 41 mpg for commute car, 15,000 miles) per year, the so called yearly savings are ... LESS ($42.58 month) and practically will pay for only a portion of the new tires (I just bought) my family needs to go to WORK (IF it lasts a year) (READ pay HIGH taxes already) .
Like I said, no "good deed" goes unpunished. The State of the Union Address promises (GREATER TAX) punishment, at least ongoing TO PERPETUITY !! ??.
@ruking I wish other manufacturers would follow Mercedes lead and price diesels comparable to the gas counterpart. Even with the reduced cost per mile it would take me years to make up for the higher price on the diesel at the time of purchase.
@ruking I wish other manufacturers would follow Mercedes lead and price diesels comparable to the gas counterpart. Even with the reduced cost per mile it would take me years to make up for the higher price on the diesel at the time of purchase.
Indeed, I have been ALWAYS advocated running ones' numbers. What will be, will BE.
Diesels have been, are, and will remain a niche market, within a niche market and probably within another niche market. (No, I am not trying to be clever here) So the important questions what are the benefits to you ?
Right now, the diesel CAR PVF is 2.5% and LESS, more than half of the 5% diesels, PVF are "LIGHT" trucks, IF one buys 3/4 ton on UP light trucks.
I think a lot of folks have forgotten (not that anyone cares) that " once upon a time" (yes, I know most fairy tales start this way to TANS, this ain't no S---t, glad for water proof watches) I ran ALL GASSERS !
However, having since ($236 premium) crossed over to diesels (the dark side @ app 350,000 miles), gassers need WAY more than a lower BE point, that is easy to catch up with, to get me to switch BACK. One example, @ resale, at the WORST, you get that up front premium BACK.
So as this board has heard me say, we have a 21 year old (94) TLC with over 250,000 miles. @ 15 (14 to 16 mpg) mpg, I'd be happy with 31 mpg (THEN gasser or diesel) that I am (NOW) getting with the 12 VW Touareg TDI. (my quick and dirty @ todays prices: I spent $23k more than I HAD to !! ??
On the 14 MB 250 BT (like model MB 350) with MINUS - 500 MSRP, again, IF one needs or wants that platform, 39 mpg ULSD vs 23.3 mpg PUG?
Run that cheap calculator for ONES' miles (mine 250,000 miles for a minimum of $ 11,189 fuel savings) !!! K say rack sah rack ! (it is currently @ 15,000 for 9 months) A longer term question (for me anyway) would be: would using a PUG GASSER over come $11,189 in fuel savings?
In the luxury sport-utilty vehicle segment as a whole, the take rate on diesel engines is 15 to 20 percent in the vehicle lines that offer them.
..."That's essentially what his company expects to see for the pair of diesel Range Rover models it will sell. ... In the total U.S. market for passenger vehicles, diesels have jumped from 2 percent in 2009 to 3 percent last year. But within luxury SUVs, the rate grew rom 3.1 percent to 4.6 percent.
Overall vehicle sales in 2014 (roughly 16.5 million) were up 75 percent over the grim recession year of 2009--but diesel-powered luxury SUVs have risen 130 percent over the same period. Finally, while luxury SUVs with diesels may carry a price premium, buyers typically recapture that premium when they sell. Their vehicles retain a higher percentage of their value when resold as used cars.
Data from industry analyst ALG shows that after four years, diesel models of luxury SUVs have retained 2 to 7 percent more of their value than their gasoline counterparts.
That can add as much as $3,000 to the value of the used vehicle for owners selling it or returning it at the end of a lease."...
Ruking: On the 14 MB 250 BT (like model MB 350) with MINUS - 500 MSRP, again, IF one needs or wants that platform, 39 mpg ULSD vs 23.3 mpg PUG?
My nephew just leased his second GLK350. I asked if he test drove the GLK 250 BT. He said the dealer did not have any in stock and convinced him they are a lot slower. Also the lease would be higher on the diesel. So MB is either overloaded with gassers or just cannot get enough diesels for the demand.
Toyota Edges Out VW And GM To Remain World’s Biggest Automaker In 2014
Anyone want to bet on who ends up on top this year. VW did mediocre in the USA last year. Yet they gained on Toyota by 160,000 vehicles WW. 90k vehicles is not a large margin.
A week ago, an inventory search @ the dealer where I got mine, showed ZERO 15 GLK 250 BT inventory. Today an inventory search (216) @ the dealer where I got mine, showed ZERO 15 GLK 250 BT inventory with 1 GLK 350, rear wheel drive.
San Diego county dealers have 4 GLK250 Bluetec, 11 GLK350 gas. I looked at the numbers on leasing a Mercedes ML350 BlueTec and it just did not work for me.
Looking at the Touareg TDI, the choices are even more limited. Only 3 available in SD county. And they are proud of them. Like model to mine for $18k more, I don't think so. Looking at the used Touaregs matching mine, there are 4 in the entire USA for sale. With 20k miles price is $45k. That means I have only lost a little over $3 grand in a year and a half and 20k miles. I can live with that loss. That is a TCO in Prius range and getting to drive a Luxury vehicle.
Talking about holding their value. A 2013 ML350 BlueTec with 288,805 miles is listed for $46k. That is a heap of driving on a two year old vehicle.
While the MB GLK is in a (small) niche market (listed 2014 sales @ 35,000 miles & most yearly sales), it seems to have sold better year over year since 2009.
So IF 15% to 20% is the diesel (GLK 250 BT) take rate (per article) , the units range MIGHT be between 5,250 to 7,000 units. Again all this is PURELY IF. In any case this is the niche within a niche. The other niche is so called luxury? car niche?!
So 2015 MY would make this GLK generation 7 years old.
Funny, surprised I didn't find that one earlier this morning when I was searching for "smirks and snarks" articles to post here.
My default search for news is "diesel -vin", to weed out the Vin Diesel hits.
I really don't think the spread is going to stay this big for many more months. Our lowest unleaded jumped thirteen cents yesterday to $1.69. @texases pointed out elsewhere though that oil isn't moving off $50 a barrel.
Bottom line is that now should be a good time to buy one (or a Prius). Whether the dealers and manufacturers have figured that out yet is the other question.
I am a little over 500 miles on this tank and headed up the coast to fill up. Price for ULSD today in San Diego $2.48. Same station RUG. $2.31. So I do not feel stupid in the least. I have a luxury SUV that gets nearly twice the miles on a gallon of fuel. If diesel is double the price of RUG, I may be less enthusiastic. Still not going to complain. And the station is a couple blocks from our favorite Greek restaurant. Life is good when you own a diesel.
Gas prices have not dropped here in a week or so - at $1.79 now with diesel about $1 more. For the first time in months the prices actually went up a little for unleaded in Sioux Falls. Now at $1.65 so unleaded may be stabilizing. Diesel may continue to drop - we will see.
Yes it is a perfect time to buy any vehicle that gets great mileage Hybrid, diesel or economy car. I can barely grasp how short sighted most consumers are in this country. Making a 5 year or more ownership based on prices of gas in a 2 month period. Fuel costs will rise again (especially if all the idiots go out and buy guzzlers now). It may be in a few months or a few years but they will be back where they were.
Gas prices have not dropped here in a week or so - at $1.79 now with diesel about $1 more. For the first time in months the prices actually went up a little for unleaded in Sioux Falls. Now at $1.65 so unleaded may be stabilizing. Diesel may continue to drop - we will see.
Yes it is a perfect time to buy any vehicle that gets great mileage Hybrid, diesel or economy car. I can barely grasp how short sighted most consumers are in this country. Making a 5 year or more ownership based on prices of gas in a 2 month period. Fuel costs will rise again (especially if all the idiots go out and buy guzzlers now). It may be in a few months or a few years but they will be back where they were.
The deeper truth is/are the issue/s is/are/continues to be STRAWMAN ! Cutting out or continuing to dial out diesels leaves out app a minimum of 30% better mpg !! What does that imply??? In the 23.3 mpg vs 39 mpg diesel gives 67.4% BETTER. Begs the question, who the H--L CARES !! ???? The majority vilifies BETTER mpg !! ????
Indeed fuel prices & costs will ALWAYS fluctuate !! ???
Earlier in the BO administration, the THEN S o E Dr. Steven Chu was quoted/attributed as wanting to get ASAP and with almost any efforts to the goal of $10.00 per gal fuel ! The goal has NOT changed. So,...
Talking head on CNBC: $8.00 gal /ULSD !!!!!! ( today-Europe) I just Gas Buddied ULSD corner store @ $2.95. While we are not hearing about rioting in the streets on this issue, it makes me wonder how the issue fits into the economic stagnation in most parts of the EU.
Not a bad idea, declare a tax holiday on fuel. More people will move around and spend more and freight will get cheaper. And the US tourists already heading that way because of more favorable exchange rates would consider renting a car instead of taking the bus or train around.
Keep in mind the price of oil is the SAME world wide (exceptions of course). SO......
The most telling might be the AVERAGE miles per year differences between the US/EU PVF.
(PLUS + 6,000 miles= US or 67% more. ( 12,000 to 15,000 miles vs 9,000 miles) The PVF passenger vehicle fleets are roughly the same size 265.6 M. US vs 272 M EU (or so I have read and I think you have posted in the past).
So my SOTP's guess without knowing the pertinent issues, policies and numbers etc., etc., would indicate governments get roughly the same revenues from PVF's.
So for example, here is a quick and dirty. I do not know the AVERAGE mpg for the EU PVF, but have read in the US it is app 24.1 mpg. So using $3.00 (pre crash, or use whatever numbers one wants) = 12.4 cents per mile driven vs say 55 mpg @ $8.00 = 14.5 cents per mile driven.
Yes, the EU visitors that come here and get around and even seasoned world travelers (that I know) usually have commented about the differences in US SCALE !!!!!
Indeed, when I lived back east so did I.
It reminds me of the time I asked directions to DFW Airport. This ole boy said: ya can't miss it !! Just go down this road a piece and the exit is on the right. OK !!! Thank you Sir. ... One hour and half later @ 80 mph I was thinking I was missing something. Sure enough, a while later.... couldn't miss it.
Comments
SOS/DD trek up grade FILLED (14.2/15.6 tank) for (MB 250 B/T) 36 mpg, before the downgrade. On the down grade (computer screen only) did a 50 mpg for 90 miles (lots more obstacles in the mountains) and then dropped to 42 mpg (210 miles) over all (up/down grade legs) for app 39 mpg over all. WEIRD traffic patterns for the (MLK) holiday, so I didn't do much over 90 mph on the return leg. Happy MLK day to one and all ! There were intermittent pea soup conditions in some of the Sacramento, CA corridor, aka ADJUSTED accordingly.
ULSD: $3.359
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
But I think dialing into the "local vibe mentality" helps to keep the BAD legs down ! ( as opposed to Alpine/X country skier/s, boater/s, hiker, biker, hunter, gold panner, camper, horse folk, off roader, gambler, event festivals, etc, cycles)
Left Coast (corner store where I filled for SOS/DD)
ULSD $ 2.99
RUG $ 2.29
MG $ 2.39
PUG $ 2.49
No never anywhere in Europe. Kind of wanted to do the European delivery on a new Mercedes ML Bluetec. They are made here and not available for EU delivery. I realize big cities like London have unique experiences you will not find in more rural locations. I just don't like being around big crowds of people. Too many places in the World I would rather see. Until we are rid of the [non-permissible content removed] tactics associated with flying we will be driving the Touareg diesel on our vacations. Avoiding large cities as best we can.
Diesel is currently more expensive per BTU
Rug $2.14 on 1/12/15
ULSD $3.05
Gasoline 114,000 BTUs/gallon
Diesel 129,500 BTUs/gallon
Gasoline $1.88 per 100,000 BTUs
ULSD $2.36 per 100,000 BTUs
RUG wins, the crowd goes wild....
“The key point is LSD (500 ppm) can be EXPORTED, RUG/PUG can NOT ! “
Not true! http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=PET&s=MGFEXUS1&f=M
We are exporting over 10 million barrels per month of finished gasoline.
completions decreased from 145(final) in October to 39(preliminary) in November.”
https://www.dmr.nd.gov/oilgas/ With ND sweet going for about $35 per barrel companies are waiting on completing wells. Next month we will see how much that impacts production.
On another note, the other day a local businessman told me he would buy a gasoline truck (3500) instead of a diesel. Cost of diesel here is $2.89 while RUG is $1.99. He said it just does not pay to spend the $8,000 diesel engine premium. You know its bad for diesel when the business people start looking at gasoline engines for their rigs. As McCoy would say: “He's dead Jim!”
http://www.oregongasprices.com/Shell_Gas_Stations/Roseburg/68153/index.aspx
If you happen to be lucky enough to live in Bandon Oregon and own a diesel. RUG and ULSD are both $2.22 per gallon.
http://www.oregongasprices.com/76_Gas_Stations/Bandon/36579/index.aspx
In San Diego you will pay 18 cents more per gallon for ULSD.
http://www.oregongasprices.com/ARCO_Gas_Stations/Chula_Vista/83318/index.aspx
Hmmm, and that does not get charged directly to the consumer that buys the goods being hauled in those big trucks? The Interstates were supposed to be built for VERY HEAVY vehicles. So that should not be a factor. Just another excuse to tax and spend. Sadly the money collected in fuel tax is squandered on other things besides roads and bridges. This county needs tax revolt on so many levels.
"RUG wins, the crowd goes wild....
“The key point is LSD (500 ppm) can be EXPORTED, RUG/PUG can NOT ! “
Not true! http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=PET&s=MGFEXUS1&f=M
We are exporting over 10 million barrels per month of finished gasoline."
To beat a dead horse, I have been perfectly fine with folks (like you) paying more per mile driven ! So have 95% PLUS of the PVF !! I am also happy that YOU are happy doing that ! Really to me, one issue ( given a like model) preserve the choice of paying less!
Again IF American CRUDE can not be exported and finished fuel products BY LAW, BUT under loopholes CAN be exported, it goes to the (my) point all along that there has been no fuel shortage/ crisis and prices have been/are continue to be manipulated. It is then inexplicable why Congress will not CHANGE those laws, i.e., lift those bans, even as EIA.gov sources such as you cite, say EVERYTHING CAN be imported AND exported.
You refuse to acknowledge the Congressional oil export BANS !! That is PAR for the course in keeping with your past post refusals. So your delay in response/s is/are pretty GOLDEN (telling).
..."According to the EPCA, oil pumped out of the ground in the USA can only be processed at American refineries"... (sidebar) I CLEARLY said DOMESTIC oil !!!
http://www.oil-price.net/en/articles/oil-export-ban-hurts-us-oil-industry.php
"One liberal target is to prevent any easing in the 39-year-old ban on oil exports. The ban makes less sense each year as U.S. production increases, with the latest estimate at 9.3 million barrels per day in 2015, up from about nine million last year. But the ban makes for good populist politics,...".
..."To the extent more U.S. crude makes it to the global market, prices will be lower, other things being equal."...
..."Instead, U.S. producers are at the mercy of U.S. refiners, since the export ban means they have nowhere else to sell."....
http://www.wsj.com/articles/oil-export-myths-1421451968?mod=hp_opinion&autologin=y
..."Most liberals know all this, which betrays that their real reason for supporting the oil export ban isn’t energy security. It’s climate-change politics. They know the shale boom has undermined their drive for renewable fuels by providing cheap oil and natural gas. They also know that exporting U.S. oil will increase the U.S. incentive to drill, and they’d rather all that oil and gas stay in the ground."...
So there are HOARDS of US based oil companies that wish they could export, what you say is COMMON practice, but somehow is BANNED to them solely because it is DOMESTIC oil/ fuel !!! ???? Not that your post and the 39 year old BAN is wrong, wrong headed and disingenuous or anything? Not that I have a pen and cell phone in hand nor FEDERAL executive, legislative, enforcement authorities, or magic wand.
So yes, they should take away the obvious and artificial barriers that make diesel prices HIGHER.
But then, I see your implied points. Why would we want to make fuel cheaper, add jobs, benefit the US economy, consumers, producers, refiners and help to positively affect the US lopsided balance of payments etc. ??????
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2015/01/19/gas-oil-five-dollar-gallon/21865975/
But he also feels that the perception of a "glut" in world oil production now is overstated, with supply outpacing demand by only 1 million barrels a day or so.
I hope for $2 fuel and budget for $10. I would not let it change my driving plans. Diesel made a move downward in the last hour. In San Diego we now have CC diesel under $2.50 per gallon. My go to station in Oregon has diesel at $2.19 and RUG is still at $2.25, Oh, how can that be?
Lets see, the gasser (MB 350 PUG @ $2.99) with the much cheaper per BTU, gets 23.3 mpg vs the far more expensive BTU diesel (MB 250 BT, ULSD @ 2.79) @ 39 mpg. So if the gasser costs 12.8 cents per mile driven and the diesel costs 7.2 cents per mile driven, no matter? I am getting a cheaper per BTU fuel in PUG? Even as PUG is 78% more expensive than USLD (PMD: fuel) ?
At the cast of usual suspect stations (NorCAL- 250 miles spread, Gas Buddy), here are ULSD/RUG prices:
$2.79/$2.79, (PUG @ $2.99)
$2.89/$2.14,
$2.59/$2.37
$2.57/$2.45
$2.44/$2.25
Yes I hope for $1.85 (delusional) and know it will be higher ! Neither swing will change travel plans either !
The diesels range would be hard to see and imply, without mentioning that with EITHER TDI, VW T TDI, MB 250 BT, I have more miles range (station options) than with say gasser s, 94/96 TLC's.
The diesels range would be hard to see and imply, without mentioning that with EITHER TDI, VW T TDI, MB 250 BT, I have more miles range (station options) than with say gasser s, 94/96 TLC's.
I don't think it is possible to attach an accurate BTU rating to our fuel supply. That leaves our own mileage as the best source of value to each fuel source. With ethanol the BTU factor for RUG goes down along with the MPG. I have yet to see a decided difference in mileage between the various brands of diesel. Oregon is the only place I came across bio diesel in the Shell B20 mix. I was tempted to try it as it was the cheapest diesel in town. I don't want to give VW any ammunition in case of a malfunction. My understanding is Biodiesel has a higher cetane than the minimum 48 for common ULSD. Cetane should be marked on the pump. I have yet to see any such rating.
Bottom line, is I get at least 45% better economy with more usable power out of a gallon of diesel, than a gallon of RUG/PUG. I have never paid 45% more for diesel than gas. That equates to 28 MPG vs 15 MPG.
It would seem that the BTU issue folk has a hard time coming to the quotes conclusion, let alone figuring in better costs in BTU conversions and how they get LESS MPG !!!! ???
More to your biodiesel issue, I would support regulations for up to B 100 biodiesel engine specifications. ZERO ppm sulfur is almost total removal of emissions forming potential. Whether the diesel oems would be interested in a B 100 specification might be a different story.
RUG/PUG by law can be up to 90 PPM sulfur (off line FEE mitigation). 30 ppm is the current standard.
ULSD is @ 15 ppm STANDARD, nominally delivered @ the pumps 5 to 10 ppm.
This back story does not jump out at folks, but B5 was a sort of specification VW was dragged kicking and screaming to. So for all to most miles, I have not even used B 5.
When Pacific Biodiesel had the big promotion with Willie Nelson and his brand new Mercedes E320 CDI, I contacted them and asked what Mercedes' position was on B100. They told me that MB gave them a green light as their B100 passed all the tests. I think the only problem is all the home brew bio folks. If they say ok and some joker tries to run straight fry oil in his high performance TDI, well, that would probably be disastrous.
However, OFF topic, the local tire guru's removed the oem tires, mounted, balanced, verified the TPMS, put on the new tires and aligned the 09 VW Jetta TDI @ app 88,000 miles. Road tests completed the installation.
@ 88,000 miles, the alignment was VERY close to factory specifications. (aka, didn't really NEED the alignment) The nexus here are the rolling parking lot commute, 3 drivers, 5 total drivers intermittently, ROUGH and challenging road surfaces.
I did app 100 miles today ( for a SLOW 55/60 mph and GENTLE break in, right after completed installation). I intend to go to the 5,000 miles rotation, 10,000 miles oem recommendation. We shall see if this new set (Continental PureContact, w ECO Plus Technology, Grand Touring A/S ) will TOP 88,000 miles (on the OEM tires 13,538 miles per 1/32nd in wear) & UP. I did skip 3 rotations. So maybe that is one reason why they wore out so fast.
From a tad before the Christmas season (Nov 2014), ULSD (RUG/PUG too) seemed to drop from $3.99 (what I notice I have actually PAID) to a LOW of $2.59 (Jan 2015), a 35.1% drop, I am thinking that after the next financial reporting cycle (Bloomberg, CNBC, CNN, etc., etc.,), the price/s might "coincidentally" begin its climb back up to $3.99 ???
So, not that we are planning more and/or LONGER trips (due to 35% ULSD price drop $2.59 per gal ULSD).
But TMI, getting a tad bit out of the neighborhood, my daughter texted $2.77 from Salt Lake City, UT. On her return @ dinner with her, she said she saw $2.49 in Austin, TX.
CNBC's talking head is right now citing the VERY high cost $$$$ per KWH in Germany that is CHOKING the German and EU economy. (lesson here?)
However, we did catch up with friends that are going on a FEB 2015 foursome to hit Washington, CN, Colorado, Utah, Idaho for a 2 month long "follow the snow" ski trip in a GASSER for this threads purposes, (TLC) !! Another friend will gypsy around with them for a month. I am not sure what gasser he will take.
So really, is this (the fuel discount) part of a plan//s to redeploy monies, to also make it look like things are better than they seem ???? !! Or does it look GOOD, while we punish Russia, Iran & middle east terror cronies, China, Venezuela, etc. , and kill the US frackers? (all of the above is probably closer to the truth?)
So given the US drivers YEARLY averages (24.1 mpg and 15,000 miles), that posts 622 gals (@ $3.99 ULSD) or $2,483 per yr.
So, say the 35% discount (optimistic, I am think 2 quarters @ most) lasts a year or =$869. That would be $72.43 per month SAVED !! ?? OK, call this GOOD news !! ??
So part of the State of the Union address covered the SPECTER of raising (MASSIVE) TAXES ?? It was called, "tax the rich", but really are TAXES ( that hurts) the rest of US, 99 % ???? Some would call this GOOD news, me? BAD !! ???
So because we use (366 gals),... LESS ( 41 mpg for commute car, 15,000 miles) per year, the so called yearly savings are ... LESS ($42.58 month) and practically will pay for only a portion of the new tires (I just bought) my family needs to go to WORK (IF it lasts a year) (READ pay HIGH taxes already) .
Like I said, no "good deed" goes unpunished. The State of the Union Address promises (GREATER TAX) punishment, at least ongoing TO PERPETUITY !! ??.
Diesels have been, are, and will remain a niche market, within a niche market and probably within another niche market.
Right now, the diesel CAR PVF is 2.5% and LESS, more than half of the 5% diesels, PVF are "LIGHT" trucks, IF one buys 3/4 ton on UP light trucks.
I think a lot of folks have forgotten (not that anyone cares) that " once upon a time" (yes, I know most fairy tales start this way to TANS, this ain't no S---t, glad for water proof watches) I ran ALL GASSERS !
However, having since ($236 premium) crossed over to diesels (the dark side @ app 350,000 miles), gassers need WAY more than a lower BE point, that is easy to catch up with, to get me to switch BACK. One example, @ resale, at the WORST, you get that up front premium BACK.
So as this board has heard me say, we have a 21 year old (94) TLC with over 250,000 miles. @ 15 (14 to 16 mpg) mpg, I'd be happy with 31 mpg (THEN gasser or diesel) that I am (NOW) getting with the 12 VW Touareg TDI. (my quick and dirty @ todays prices: I spent $23k more than I HAD to !! ??
On the 14 MB 250 BT (like model MB 350) with MINUS - 500 MSRP, again, IF one needs or wants that platform, 39 mpg ULSD vs 23.3 mpg PUG?
Run that cheap calculator for ONES' miles (mine 250,000 miles for a minimum of $ 11,189 fuel savings) !!! K say rack sah rack ! (it is currently @ 15,000 for 9 months) A longer term question (for me anyway) would be: would using a PUG GASSER over come $11,189 in fuel savings?
Truly a no brainer for me.
Toyota Edges Out VW And GM To Remain World’s Biggest Automaker In 2014
MotorAuthority By Viknesh Vijayenthiran
9 hours ago
https://autos.yahoo.com/news/toyota-edges-vw-gm-remain-world-biggest-automaker-093004496.html
But then, I ran across this, GREEN no less !?
Diesel Engines Selling Well In Large Luxury SUVs & Crossovers
Green Car Reports By John Voelcker
4 hours ago
https://autos.yahoo.com/news/diesel-engines-selling-well-large-luxury-suvs-crossovers-143004665.html
In the luxury sport-utilty vehicle segment as a whole, the take rate on diesel engines is 15 to 20 percent in the vehicle lines that offer them.
..."That's essentially what his company expects to see for the pair of diesel Range Rover models it will sell. ...
In the total U.S. market for passenger vehicles, diesels have jumped from 2 percent in 2009 to 3 percent last year. But within luxury SUVs, the rate grew rom 3.1 percent to 4.6 percent.
Overall vehicle sales in 2014 (roughly 16.5 million) were up 75 percent over the grim recession year of 2009--but diesel-powered luxury SUVs have risen 130 percent over the same period.
Finally, while luxury SUVs with diesels may carry a price premium, buyers typically recapture that premium when they sell. Their vehicles retain a higher percentage of their value when resold as used cars.
Data from industry analyst ALG shows that after four years, diesel models of luxury SUVs have retained 2 to 7 percent more of their value than their gasoline counterparts.
That can add as much as $3,000 to the value of the used vehicle for owners selling it or returning it at the end of a lease."...
On the 14 MB 250 BT (like model MB 350) with MINUS - 500 MSRP, again, IF one needs or wants that platform, 39 mpg ULSD vs 23.3 mpg PUG?
My nephew just leased his second GLK350. I asked if he test drove the GLK 250 BT. He said the dealer did not have any in stock and convinced him they are a lot slower. Also the lease would be higher on the diesel. So MB is either overloaded with gassers or just cannot get enough diesels for the demand.
Toyota Edges Out VW And GM To Remain World’s Biggest Automaker In 2014
Anyone want to bet on who ends up on top this year. VW did mediocre in the USA last year. Yet they gained on Toyota by 160,000 vehicles WW. 90k vehicles is not a large margin.
Mercedes-Benz of Greenwich: 8 GLK 350 - 1 GLK 250
Mercedes-Benz of White Plains: 0 GLK 350 - 4 GLK 250
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
Looking at the Touareg TDI, the choices are even more limited. Only 3 available in SD county. And they are proud of them. Like model to mine for $18k more, I don't think so. Looking at the used Touaregs matching mine, there are 4 in the entire USA for sale. With 20k miles price is $45k. That means I have only lost a little over $3 grand in a year and a half and 20k miles. I can live with that loss. That is a TCO in Prius range and getting to drive a Luxury vehicle.
Talking about holding their value. A 2013 ML350 BlueTec with 288,805 miles is listed for $46k. That is a heap of driving on a two year old vehicle.
http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/detail/625936193/overview/
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01/mercedes-benz-glk-class-sales-figures.html
So IF 15% to 20% is the diesel (GLK 250 BT) take rate (per article) , the units range MIGHT be between 5,250 to 7,000 units. Again all this is PURELY IF. In any case this is the niche within a niche. The other niche is so called luxury? car niche?!
So 2015 MY would make this GLK generation 7 years old.
http://www.lexusofsouthatlanta.com/VehicleDetails/used-2013-Mercedes_Benz-M_Class-ML350_BlueTEC_SUV-Union_City-GA/2435228473
http://www.automobilemag.com/features/columns/1501-diesel-doldrums-fuels-cost-could-dampen-interest-for-years/
My default search for news is "diesel -vin", to weed out the Vin Diesel hits.
I really don't think the spread is going to stay this big for many more months. Our lowest unleaded jumped thirteen cents yesterday to $1.69. @texases pointed out elsewhere though that oil isn't moving off $50 a barrel.
Bottom line is that now should be a good time to buy one (or a Prius). Whether the dealers and manufacturers have figured that out yet is the other question.
(so probably do owners of 25 M cars in CA)
Delusional as that might be,
TODAY's local fuel prices
ULSD $2.89
RUG $2.47 (.42)
MC $ 2.57 (.32)
PUG $2.67 (.22)
So using the GLK 250 BT's 39 mpg vs GLK 350's 23.3 mpg = .0741 vs .11459 cents per mile driven. That makes PUG 54.65% MORE expensive.
For those who think the comparison should be with Premium, it's $1.99 at the same station for that stuff.
http://www.sandiegogasprices.com/ARCO_Gas_Stations/Carlsbad/23330/index.aspx
That's on top of the usual diesel purchase premium.
And have you priced diesel spark plugs lately?
Yes it is a perfect time to buy any vehicle that gets great mileage Hybrid, diesel or economy car. I can barely grasp how short sighted most consumers are in this country. Making a 5 year or more ownership based on prices of gas in a 2 month period. Fuel costs will rise again (especially if all the idiots go out and buy guzzlers now). It may be in a few months or a few years but they will be back where they were.
Indeed fuel prices & costs will ALWAYS fluctuate !! ???
Earlier in the BO administration, the THEN S o E Dr. Steven Chu was quoted/attributed as wanting to get ASAP and with almost any efforts to the goal of $10.00 per gal fuel ! The goal has NOT changed. So,...
Fill up on cheap gasoline while you can, America
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/sns-wp-blm-news-bc-oil-comment22-20141222-story.html
The most telling might be the AVERAGE miles per year differences between the US/EU PVF.
(PLUS + 6,000 miles= US or 67% more. ( 12,000 to 15,000 miles vs 9,000 miles) The PVF passenger vehicle fleets are roughly the same size 265.6 M. US vs 272 M EU (or so I have read and I think you have posted in the past).
So my SOTP's guess without knowing the pertinent issues, policies and numbers etc., etc., would indicate governments get roughly the same revenues from PVF's.
So for example, here is a quick and dirty. I do not know the AVERAGE mpg for the EU PVF, but have read in the US it is app 24.1 mpg. So using $3.00 (pre crash, or use whatever numbers one wants) = 12.4 cents per mile driven vs say 55 mpg @ $8.00 = 14.5 cents per mile driven.
Indeed, when I lived back east so did I.
It reminds me of the time I asked directions to DFW Airport. This ole boy said: ya can't miss it !! Just go down this road a piece and the exit is on the right. OK !!! Thank you Sir. ... One hour and half later @ 80 mph I was thinking I was missing something. Sure enough, a while later.... couldn't miss it.