Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

stickguy · December 2015

Q, not sure where they get inventory. Some is trades, and they buy cars outright from private sellers. Also do leading, so I suspect some are lease returns. Probably auctions too.

Next time I stop to browse, I'll have to ask.

Michaell · December 2015

Mr_Shiftright said:
Deos the Mini have run flat tires on it? If so, you can ditch those and get a more flexible sidewall tire. It transforms the Mini's ride from "punishing" to " annoying".

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:
I'd be afraid to go and test drive it. Is it possible to walk into a dealership with a 175 horsepower 4 cyl car, test drive one with 151 MORE horsepower, and walk out without punching Ye Old CCBA card?
I hear you. I think I'm going to restrict my test drives next year to stuff that's woefully underpowered, since that's all I really need.

Drove my daughter's MINI last night (all 4 tires needed air) - maybe I'm getting older, but that thing rides rough, and it's pretty noisy. Fast, though.

Yes, the OEM Contis are run-flats. She's got 22K on them at the moment, and they probably will need replacing fairly soon.

I'll talk to her about non run-flats, but she likes the ability to drive on them should she get a flat. And, she probably doesn't know any better about ride quality.

xwesx · December 2015

jpp5862 said:

It can't hurt to go drive it.

Hah! Tell that one to your wallet!

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

Well the problem with run flats is that when you drive on them flat, you often ruin them. So instead of a year membership to AAA, you get to buy a very expensive run flat every time it "saves" you. Or two tires in some cases, if you can't match 'em.

I know, I know, Fear Sells.

Michaell said:

Mr_Shiftright said:
Deos the Mini have run flat tires on it? If so, you can ditch those and get a more flexible sidewall tire. It transforms the Mini's ride from "punishing" to " annoying".

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:
I'd be afraid to go and test drive it. Is it possible to walk into a dealership with a 175 horsepower 4 cyl car, test drive one with 151 MORE horsepower, and walk out without punching Ye Old CCBA card?
I hear you. I think I'm going to restrict my test drives next year to stuff that's woefully underpowered, since that's all I really need.

Drove my daughter's MINI last night (all 4 tires needed air) - maybe I'm getting older, but that thing rides rough, and it's pretty noisy. Fast, though.

Yes, the OEM Contis are run-flats. She's got 22K on them at the moment, and they probably will need replacing fairly soon.

I'll talk to her about non run-flats, but she likes the ability to drive on them should she get a flat. And, she probably doesn't know any better about ride quality.

jpp75 · December 2015

xwesx said:

jpp5862 said:

It can't hurt to go drive it.
Hah! Tell that one to your wallet!

My wallet would be fine, nyccarguy's wallet may suffer though. Although at that price he shouldn't be too far off on the value for his Legacy.....just saying.

ab348 · December 2015

Does the stiffer sidewall of run-flats improve handling as a trade off for the harsher ride?

Michaell · December 2015

Mr_Shiftright said:
Well the problem with run flats is that when you drive on them flat, you often ruin them. So instead of a year membership to AAA, you get to buy a very expensive run flat every time it "saves" you. Or two tires in some cases, if you can't match 'em.

I know, I know, Fear Sells.

Michaell said:

Mr_Shiftright said:
Deos the Mini have run flat tires on it? If so, you can ditch those and get a more flexible sidewall tire. It transforms the Mini's ride from "punishing" to " annoying".

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:
I'd be afraid to go and test drive it. Is it possible to walk into a dealership with a 175 horsepower 4 cyl car, test drive one with 151 MORE horsepower, and walk out without punching Ye Old CCBA card?
I hear you. I think I'm going to restrict my test drives next year to stuff that's woefully underpowered, since that's all I really need.

Drove my daughter's MINI last night (all 4 tires needed air) - maybe I'm getting older, but that thing rides rough, and it's pretty noisy. Fast, though.

Yes, the OEM Contis are run-flats. She's got 22K on them at the moment, and they probably will need replacing fairly soon.

I'll talk to her about non run-flats, but she likes the ability to drive on them should she get a flat. And, she probably doesn't know any better about ride quality.

She's only done it once, for about 4-5 miles.

Michaell · December 2015

ab348 said:
Does the stiffer sidewall of run-flats improve handling as a trade off for the harsher ride?

Not sure how much the tires contribute to it .. I know the suspension is 'tuned' for sporty handling, at the expense of tire life.

This is the Countryman, the bigger 4-door. But, it still handles pretty well on the rare occasions when I can hustle it. According to my wife, my daughter doesn't use much of the brakes when going around corners.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

That's good--you're not supposed to use brakes going around corners.

I suppose run flats won't flex as much, so you might have less "give" in the sidewall, but really handling is about suspension, tire compound, and even corner weighting. Everyone talks about Minis cornering "like they were on rails" but that changes dramatically on a bumpy surface. Then you don't know where the hell the car is going to go.

qbrozen · December 2015

Runflats are typically considered a compromise in the handling and grip dept because of the harder compound and lack of sidewall flex. Some sidewall flex aids turning.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

They can be noisy, too. If I were buying a used car, I would include in my calculations the cost of taking off the run flats. That's just me, some are happy with them. If it were a truck, I'd keep them on probably.

stickguy · December 2015

one guy I used to work with had a Mini, and ditched the RF tires. He got a donut and a bag for it, and stashed it behind the drivers seat. not like there was enough room for a person back there!

My BIL did this with his BMW 550. Turns out that even though he had runflats, there was a spare in the trunk too. Odd.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

I carry "Slime" + an air pump + AAA Premium service (200 mile tow). Never had to use it though. 5 years and no breakdowns. If I had been the original buyer, though, at $28,500 MSRP, I don't think I would be deliriously giddy at this point.

iluvmysephia1 · December 2015

Went in to Frontier Kia to continue the maintenance items I need to get done on the Soul. Already got the oil change last week in Garden City. Well, I thought I'd need a timing belt replaced. The service writer says "well, I don't know - let's check and see if you've got a timing chain on your Soul."

Turns out I do! Nothing needed there. They did change my plugs and cabin air filter and battery - all for a low, low price of $277! Also, got a quote on some Kumho tires. For size 195/65R15's 4 of them will be $475 + tax. They have a price match guarantee - even if you've already had them installed at Frontier Kia (whatever tire you end up choosing) they'll match what a competitor would've charged you. So, if Goodyear in Dodge installs the same tires for $450 Frontier Kia will refund you $25!

And, of course, I had to avail myself of dealer coffee and a 2016 Kia Soul brochure. Knew a salesman would hone in on me (duh!!) and he did. They have a 2014 Soul dark green 6-speed with 18,000 miles on it selling for $14,995. Took a seat in it and started it up and took a look at the interior, dash, stick and steering wheel. Revved her up a bit. Liked what I saw but continually heard Mrs.iluv's voice saying "We don't need a new car...I like our Soul! That would be stupid to do now, iluvmysephia1." Ahh...we've only got 58,558 miles on our Soul and it is running like a champ. Why spoil a good thing - all we need is some fresh rubber and we're ready to rock and ride for a long while.

Spent 10-15 minutes explaining to the salesman that I had to try and live in the same household as my wife and this is not for us right now. He wanted to do a "soft pull" on our credit. I refused ta fill out the form! But now if I go back there to get their good tire offer I will have this guy tagging along with me as I oogle the new Optima's.

They will get the new Kia GT sports sedan - this salesman at least has heard of the new sporty RWD Kia sedan in development right now. Usually the car buffs out-knowledge their salespeople, right?

stickguy · December 2015

is there much functional difference between a 2011 and 2014? Enough to really matter?

One of my rules is never get the same thing twice!

iluvmysephia1 · December 2015

No, that's just it - there isn't. I'm holding my cards.

corvette · December 2015

I thought most 2011 4-cylinder cars would have a timing chain instead of a belt.

I had runflats on my E90 and never had a problem with them, but the ride was very firm. I think a lot of tire noise issues are exacerbated by "sawtooth" edge wear which is normal to some extent, but can be evened out by doing cross rotations if your tires are non-directional. A lot of shops just swap front to rear on the same side and never cross rotate, even if the tires are non-directional. That doesn't even out the edge wear and the tires will continue to wear in that pattern and get noisier.

nyccarguy · December 2015

Since we are on the subject of lightly used entry level luxury iron, I filled up ($2.139/ gal RUG - Costco) next to a beautiful 2013 or 2014 C300 4Matic. Polar White with the AMG Sport Package, Pano Roof, & Xenon Lights. Here are a few examples currently available at local Mercedes-Benz dealers in my 'hood:

http://www.mypreownedmercedes.com/used/2013/mercedes/c300/2013-mercedes-c300-white-rallye-motors-for-sale-wddgf8ab1dr276903 - this one is a 2013 with 27K miles. No Xenons & No Pano Roof (I can live without both of these). $28K

http://www.mypreownedmercedes.com/used/2014/mercedes/c300/2014-mercedes-c300-silver-mercedes-of-white-plains-for-sale-wddgf8ab6er307645 - Here's a 2014 with 13K miles. Palladium Silver. Pano Roof, No Xenons. $32,895

kyfdx · December 2015

Runflats keep getting better.

My only experience is with all-seasons on an SUV. But, in that application, I don't think you can tell the difference. By all accounts, on a performance-oriented vehicle with low profile size, it really shows up.

Sandman6472 · December 2015

Hertz got a whole lot of new 2016 models the last couple of days. Optima's, 200's, Sante Fe's, Elantra's and Camry's to name a few. Got a new Optima the other day, had like 147 miles on it and a newish 200 and Sante Fe today. Glad that we're finally getting rid of the higher miled up vehicles and replacing them with new iron. Must admit that am very impressed with the Kia brand for 2016. The Sedona really is a joy to drive and drives smaller than it looks.
Have been kept very busy at work these last few weeks and hoping to get more hours while we are in season. Funny, driving all these brand new vehicles does not feel like work...getting up in the morning is no longer a big deal because I love this job!!!

The Sandman

imidazol97 · December 2015

iluvmysephia1 said:
Spent 10-15 minutes explaining to the salesman that I had to try and live in the same household as my wife and this is not for us right now.

LOL. The voice of reason. Who needs that?

graphicguy · December 2015

Went to Hertz, as usual, while working in FL. They couldn't find the keys to the car in my stall. After 15 minutes of the agent calling everyone she knew to find the keys, slightly irritated, I told her I'd walk next store to Avis, as they had a sign stating they had cars available.

Not sure who it was, but another Hertz person stepped in and offered me a Q50 for the same money as my "intermediate" to make up for the mixup.

I accepted.

Not sure the year, but it had about 20K miles. As always with Infinitis, the 3.5L is the best part of the car.. Brakes needed replacing. Trans was willing to kick down. But again, the steering really lets the car down. One second it's light as a feather, literally the next second it tightens up considerably. Weird feeling. Had the car for two days and 100+ moles...never could feel good about it.

For less money, I still think the G37 is the better car, albeit behind the automotive curve and thirsty. Arguably, better looking, too.

sda · December 2015

stickguy said:
is there much functional difference between a 2011 and 2014? Enough to really matter?

One of my rules is never get the same thing twice!

I'm with you there as I've made that mistake. I leased a 96 Mazda Millenia for 24 months. I really liked it and thought about buying it at lease end. The residual was set high so it didn't make sense to buy it. Instead I bought a heavily discounted 'new' 98 Millenia. It was essentially the same car as my 96. I quickly got tired of it since I 'had' it for two years already and traded it about a year later for a 98 Cadillac Catera. That was a mistake in itself.

berri · December 2015

I'm not thrilled with Hertz buying Thrifty and Dollar. Seems like that's putting more Chrysler and Korean models in their lineup than before.

xwesx · December 2015

nyccarguy said:
http://www.mypreownedmercedes.com/used/2013/mercedes/c300/2013-mercedes-c300-white-rallye-motors-for-sale-wddgf8ab1dr276903 - this one is a 2013 with 27K miles. No Xenons & No Pano Roof (I can live without both of these). $28K

No pano roof on this one? It sure has a big hole up there.....

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

Yes I think run flats have gotten better---but not cheaper.

suydam · December 2015

Thrifty and Dollar are much cheaper than Hertz. I hope that doesn't change. couldn't believe how much Hertz charged for Florida rentals.

cdnpinhead · December 2015

Mr_Shiftright said:
Yes I think run flats have gotten better---but not cheaper.

Okay, but what about the availability of a replacement in the middle of Nevada on the weekend (worse yet, at night)? What about the special equipment required to dismount/mount these solid sidewall gems without damaging the wheels?

They may cost a fortune and can't be repaired most of the time, but at least no one outside of a dealer in a major metropolitan area can deal with them, and even at that you may have to wait "a day or two."

What's not to like?

sda · December 2015

The Sandman

That would be great driving new cars on a frequent basis. I went to the Hertz used car site. Looks like most have high 40-50k on them. I didn't realize they were keeping them that long. I thought they got turned in around 30k.

Sandman6472 · December 2015

Depends on the vehicle it seems. Turnbacks usually go back with between 12k and 20k. Then there are the wholesales, not sure about their mileage. Then the ones that have up to 50k. Lately though, we've been getting in a mess load of new iron...the intake area at Ft. Lauderdale was so packed with iron, they were parked outside on the grass with more trucks waiting to unload. I know that we took some rentals from their back to our office. But they are definitely getting the message about replacing their fleet with newer vehicles.
They also buy all makes and models as I've driven most of them. But will agree that Dodge/Chrysler and the Korean twins are a large percentage of the fleet. But, they've both come a long way in improving quality and driveability of their models!

The Sandman

ab348 · December 2015

My ATS has run-flats from the factory. I don't find the ride harsh but I have nothing to compare it against. When the time comes for replacement I wonder what I will do. The car doesn't have a spare tire, jack or lug wrench, so it wouldn't be easy or cheap to add one. And it would make a tight trunk even tighter.

Sandman6472 · December 2015

The Golf came with Continentals ProContact TX and they are wearing very evenly though I do rotate and have the alignment checked on a regular basis. Not sure what I'll replace them with when the time comes but have heard good things about Goodyear Assurance brand. Hopefully I won't have to think about it for awhile though.

The Sandman

berri · December 2015

For Hertz prices, I prefer the better comfort and driving traits of Toyota, Honda, Ford, GM or Nissan. The Chrysler and Jeep products always seem noticeably less attractive as they get miles on them and I guess while the Korean cars are much improved, they still don't seem to drive a nicely for me at least. I recognize that Hyunkia are great bargains when buying them, but Hertz isn't supposed to be a bargain discount rental line. It's kind of like Dollar Thrifty bought Hertz instead of the other way around.

corvette · December 2015

sandman_6472 said:
The Golf came with Continentals ProContact TX and they are wearing very evenly though I do rotate and have the alignment checked on a regular basis.
The Sandman

I had similar Continentals on my old Altima. They went 45k (slightly misaligned with some uneven wear) and would have gone a little longer, but I had already ordered new tires and one of the Contis got a nail in it. I would guess you'll get at least 50k out of them. I've always had the best luck with Michelin replacements.

qbrozen · December 2015

cdnpinhead said:
What about the special equipment required to dismount/mount these solid sidewall gems without damaging the wheels?

No special equipment needed. I did it in my garage with my bimmer's low profile RFTs.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

I suppose runflats would be a bonus in certain situations for certain drivers, but it seems to me for the general population they seem rather pointless

carnaught · December 2015

Mr_Shiftright said:
I suppose runflats would be a bonus in certain situations for certain drivers, but it seems to me for the general population they seem rather pointless

Well, on my former 3-Series BMW, they saved my arce on a couple occasions. I had a couple of episodes when I experienced slow leak punctures. Instead of having to pull over and change a tire on the side of the road, late at night, I was able to drive slowly and get home safely. They were the Bridgestones, and although not my favorite brand, they served me well. The tires had punctures that were readily fixable, and I got over 36000 miles on the set, still looking like they had a bit more life when I traded the car.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

I feel that runflats were forced on us so that manufacturers could do away with the spare tire. It served them more than it served most of us.

stickguy · December 2015

Agreed. They did it to save a few pounds and a few bucks.

stickguy · December 2015

Even worse is when the put on normal tires and delete the spare. A 12v pump and can of fix a flat ain't gonna cut it. One of my rules is, no spare, no buy.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2015

Mankind has been changing flat tires for at least 110 years prior to run flats. We seemed to have survived okay.

roadburner · December 2015

I think that the STI is the only car I'm considering that actually has a spare. The Mustang GT with the Performance Package doesn't have one.

jayrider · December 2015

Mr_Shiftright said:
Mankind has been changing flat tires for at least 110 years prior to run flats. We seemed to have survived okay.

True, Shifty, but changing a tire requires doing some dirty work and nobody wants to do that anymore. Even me, and I've changed many a flat tire so I know how it's done. Will be looking at the Bridgestone Driveguard tires for my Buick when the OEM's are worn. All ratings are very positive.

stevedebi · December 2015

stickguy said:
Even worse is when the put on normal tires and delete the spare. A 12v pump and can of fix a flat ain't gonna cut it. One of my rules is, no spare, no buy.

I carry a tire repair kit (plugs) in my C-Max Energi. They supplied an air compressor in the car (under the front passenger seat in a special compartment). They also provided fix-a-flat, but that messes up the TPMS systems so I won't use it.

Of course, with my car they had an excuse for deleting the spare - there is a hulking big traction battery back in the cargo area...

stickguy · December 2015

Last flat I had was a sidewall shredded. That would take out a RF too, meaning sitting waiting for a tow and no way to continue on. At least with a donut you aren't stuck.

xwesx · December 2015

@Michaell Shed some light, O sage of the 3.6R!

http://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/comment/5157224/#Comment_5157224

xwesx · December 2015

stickguy said:
Last flat I had was a sidewall shredded. That would take out a RF too, meaning sitting waiting for a tow and no way to continue on. At least with a donut you aren't stuck.

Agreed. It is best to be prepared for what you can! I carry plugs (tire repair kits) in my cars, as well as having some type of spare in all of them. If I find a leak soon enough, I can sometimes clear the penetration and plug it without releasing too much air from the tire. If so, then I can just keep driving on the tire (especially useful when I find and repair without taking the tire off). Otherwise, I still have to use the spare until I can inflate the repaired tire.

In general, though, one plug and you've paid for the repair kit, so they're definitely a handy investment. Add a 12v compressor to that, and you're in great shape! I'll admit that I don't always have a compressor on me, but that's because if I keep one in my car in the winter time and actually have to use it, it will most likely shred those plastic gears inside and/or break the flimsy power cord in cold temps, so why bother?

I always take a compressor on my annual fishing trips, though, because those typically involve sand driving, so I want to deflate and inflate the car (and trailer) tires depending on need. On that trip, I also take a full-size spare in addition to the donut, as I have room for a full-size (due to trailer) and would NOT want to be stuck using a donut while pulling/carrying that load!

If you have a blowout, though, your only option is replacement, and nothing short of a spare is going to get you clear. AAA is great if you're in civilized areas, but I sure wouldn't want to rely on it traveling in most areas of Alaska or through Canada to America.

ab348 · December 2015

stickguy said:
Even worse is when the put on normal tires and delete the spare. A 12v pump and can of fix a flat ain't gonna cut it. One of my rules is, no spare, no buy.

Trying to remember when the last time was that I had to pull out the spare and jack to change a tire. I believe it was in 1982 with my '77 LeMans.

stickguy · December 2015

Just means you are due.

Michaell · December 2015

xwesx said:
@Michaell Shed some light, O sage of the 3.6R!

http://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/comment/5157224/#Comment_5157224

Thanks - I've posted a response to the query.

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