Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

andres3 · July 2017

So we looked at ES 350's, ES 300H's, Avalon's (ridiculous 4 trim lines), TLX's, and A4's.

Mother liked the Lexus and Audi a bit more, but is biased towards Lexus, as is my Father.

The hybrid can't be had for $40K out the door though; unless CPO. The ES 350 might be doable for $40K out the door if they go very light on the options (as in none). My friendly local Audi dealer offered an Ultra A4 2018 model due to arrive at the end of July for less than $40K out the door, and it stickered for over $40K (fully loaded). The problem with '17 models at Acura and Audi is that there are barely any left. Acura said something like $8,500 off on '17, $200 off on '18

My parents like lighter colored exteriors excluding white (makes it a rare find these days), with lighter interior (basically, not black, also rare these days).

Good thing about ES350 if that is what they have to have, is that they can go anywhere from 1 to 10 years old and get the same exact drive-train in the V6.

ab348 · July 2017

stickguy said:
I thought that Prius was a hearse, not a limo. Though I guess a Hearse is just a limo for 1!

I thought it was a hearse too. Either way it makes me think the end of the world as we know it may be nigh.

isellhondas · July 2017

fintail said:
Most windows are rectangles, trapezoides, triangles, and parallelograms Dashboard styling elements don't need to be, however.

1960 Meteor is an oddball, like a 60 Ford with a Mercury grille and random side trim. I don't think I've ever seen one in person.

driver100 said:

Those windows look like trapezoids and parallelograms.

My Dad had a 1960 Meteor, which was the Canadian version of that Ford model.

I've never seen a Canadian car that I've liked and I've always wondered exactly why they felt the need to somehow make the "different"? I know a guy who has a 1954 Ford Convertible, a Canadian model. It looks like they tried to make a Ford ugly by making some strange changes. It has a flathead V8 and a 1954 Merc dashboard! Why?

I've seen Canadian 1965 Pontiacs built on Chevy frames with 283 engines. They look so strange with the wheels
tucked under the car! Why not just leave the cars as is and change the speedometers to KM's?

houdini1 · July 2017

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe
Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).
You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.

suydam · July 2017

andres3 said:
So we looked at ES 350's, ES 300H's, Avalon's (ridiculous 4 trim lines), TLX's, and A4's.

Mother liked the Lexus and Audi a bit more, but is biased towards Lexus, as is my Father.

The hybrid can't be had for $40K out the door though; unless CPO. The ES 350 might be doable for $40K out the door if they go very light on the options (as in none). My friendly local Audi dealer offered an Ultra A4 2018 model due to arrive at the end of July for less than $40K out the door, and it stickered for over $40K (fully loaded). The problem with '17 models at Acura and Audi is that there are barely any left. Acura said something like $8,500 off on '17, $200 off on '18

My parents like lighter colored exteriors excluding white (makes it a rare find these days), with lighter interior (basically, not black, also rare these days).

Good thing about ES350 if that is what they have to have, is that they can go anywhere from 1 to 10 years old and get the same exact drive-train in the V6.

Do those Lexus models have all the safety features? That's what kept me away from the CT200h. -- it didn't even have blind spot Warning.

andres3 · July 2017

suydam said:

andres3 said:
So we looked at ES 350's, ES 300H's, Avalon's (ridiculous 4 trim lines), TLX's, and A4's.

Mother liked the Lexus and Audi a bit more, but is biased towards Lexus, as is my Father.

The hybrid can't be had for $40K out the door though; unless CPO. The ES 350 might be doable for $40K out the door if they go very light on the options (as in none). My friendly local Audi dealer offered an Ultra A4 2018 model due to arrive at the end of July for less than $40K out the door, and it stickered for over $40K (fully loaded). The problem with '17 models at Acura and Audi is that there are barely any left. Acura said something like $8,500 off on '17, $200 off on '18

My parents like lighter colored exteriors excluding white (makes it a rare find these days), with lighter interior (basically, not black, also rare these days).

Good thing about ES350 if that is what they have to have, is that they can go anywhere from 1 to 10 years old and get the same exact drive-train in the V6.
Do those Lexus models have all the safety features? That's what kept me away from the CT200h. -- it didn't even have blind spot Warning.

Looks like '14+ have safety features (optionally at a minimum at least)... older ES 350's do not seem to have it at all. that is a big catch. The '17 redesign seems to have made the safety nannies standard.

ab348 · July 2017

isellhondas said:

I've never seen a Canadian car that I've liked and I've always wondered exactly why they felt the need to somehow make the "different"? I know a guy who has a 1954 Ford Convertible, a Canadian model. It looks like they tried to make a Ford ugly by making some strange changes. It has a flathead V8 and a 1954 Merc dashboard! Why?

I've seen Canadian 1965 Pontiacs built on Chevy frames with 283 engines. They look so strange with the wheels
tucked under the car! Why not just leave the cars as is and change the speedometers to KM's?

Back then up to the mid to late 1960s there were significant import duties on components brought into Canada from the USA, so they made do with stuff that was made in Canada and adapted US models to it. Ford and GM had foundries in Canada where engines were made. In the case of Ford they could only make the flathead in Canada in '54 as the plant hadn't been retooled for the Y-block V-8s yet. The same was true for GM Canada which had an engine plant that made Chevy engines, so the Pontiac was a Chevy under the skin. The other aspect was the much smaller Canadian market making it uneconomical to tool up for what would have been small volumes of production, so for example Chrysler Canada used the Plymouth dash in fullsize Dodges in 1965.

The Auto Pact between Canada and the US in the middle 1960s put an end to most of those duties and we started to see mostly the same products as the US after that kicked in.

jmonroe · July 2017

houdini1 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe
Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).
You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.

You better watch what you say to some of the kids in here, they might get upset.

I think we have something in common. Towards the end of this month I'll be having one of those landmark birthdays and at the middle of the month I/we are going to have one of those landmark anniversaries.

Maybe I/we should celebrate this landmark year by getting a new car but I might need help on how to break it to her without her breaking my neck.

Any suggestions ?

jmonroe

driver100 · July 2017

isellhondas said:

fintail said:
Most windows are rectangles, trapezoides, triangles, and parallelograms Dashboard styling elements don't need to be, however.

1960 Meteor is an oddball, like a 60 Ford with a Mercury grille and random side trim. I don't think I've ever seen one in person.

driver100 said:

Those windows look like trapezoids and parallelograms.

My Dad had a 1960 Meteor, which was the Canadian version of that Ford model.

I've never seen a Canadian car that I've liked and I've always wondered exactly why they felt the need to somehow make the "different"? I know a guy who has a 1954 Ford Convertible, a Canadian model. It looks like they tried to make a Ford ugly by making some strange changes. It has a flathead V8 and a 1954 Merc dashboard! Why?

I've seen Canadian 1965 Pontiacs built on Chevy frames with 283 engines. They look so strange with the wheels
tucked under the car! Why not just leave the cars as is and change the speedometers to KM's?

Good questions....I'll try to explain from what I can remember. I think it happened at a time when there were marketing strategies that worked really well at the time. GM had Chev/Olds dealers, so someone moving up from a Chev would see the Olds and move up to that. Pontiac dealers had Buicks to move up to. In Canada (and the US) you could move up from a Ford to a Mercury. I think they wanted to make a slightly upscale line and a distinctive Canadian line, so they made Meteors that were fancy Fords, and Monarchs, that were fancy Mercurys. Just added some chrome and made the instrument panels and seats a bit different. It also allowed for more dealers, and the more dealers the more sales potentially.

Pontiac was a different story. I think it had to do with it wasn't worth making the wide track models for the Canadian market. So they put the Pontiac body on a Chev frame.....and the wheels looked ridiculous because the Chev had a narrower frame. The wheels didn't come out to the edges like they did on a real Pontiac. They sold well though because Pontiacs were nice looking cars, and most people wouldn't know the wheels weren't really wide track on the Canadian models.

These marketing ideas, and the economics of the Pontiac worked in their day....though they may seem silly today.

jmonroe · July 2017

houdini1 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe
Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).
You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.

You better watch what you say to some of the kids in here, they might get upset.

I think we have something in common. Towards the end of this month I'll be having one of those landmark birthdays and at the middle of the month I/we are going to have one of those landmark anniversaries.

Maybe I/we should celebrate this landmark year by getting a new car but I might need help on how to break it to her without her breaking my neck.

Any suggestions ? And I don't want to hear "man-up" because I have tried that over the years and I have permanent body markings to prove that doesn't work.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50 · July 2017

houdini1 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe
Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).
You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.

Well, you wisecrack like a young whipper snapper.

jmonroe · July 2017

Hey, what's going on here with you 2 Canadians?

We now have 2 somewhat different stories. Are one of you equivalent to a Democrat here in the US and the other a Republican?

So what gives?

jmonroe

fintail · July 2017

I have to believe there must have been some kind of duty/tariff thing about selling identical models. Nothing else seems to justify it - seems like a waste to make all of these little changes for a market 1/10th the size of the US.
Either that or it was trying to pander to customers by giving them a unique product, just like how many US companies with Canadian locations will stick a maple leaf in the logo. Back then, it wouldn't have even required different gauges, IIRC, kms weren't a thing until around the 1979 model year.

Here's one that fascinates me in a way, the 1960 Ford Frontenac, the Canadian version of a Falcon. Nice kind of baroque space age grille. Why?

isellhondas said:

I've never seen a Canadian car that I've liked and I've always wondered exactly why they felt the need to somehow make the "different"? I know a guy who has a 1954 Ford Convertible, a Canadian model. It looks like they tried to make a Ford ugly by making some strange changes. It has a flathead V8 and a 1954 Merc dashboard! Why?

I've seen Canadian 1965 Pontiacs built on Chevy frames with 283 engines. They look so strange with the wheels
tucked under the car! Why not just leave the cars as is and change the speedometers to KM's?

fintail · July 2017

Yeah, it's a nice car, not a sports sedan. Many cars that aren't exactly sporty have "sport" modes, which probably just change the shift points. Unless it is a tuned model or a purpose built sports model, it doesn't really get the "sports" name, IMO.

houdini1 said:

I don't consider the Genny to be a sports sedan. Just a very nice all around sedan. Seeing you driving the Genny is like seeing an attractive 40 year old lady in a nice knee length skirt. Age appropriate.

fintail · July 2017

I suspect people in Portlandia now have the same ire towards southern immigrants as people in Seattle, as that place is experiencing the same pains Seattle has been dealing with for ages. The newbies bring their traffic and housing market, and expect the locals to worship them. It doesn't work like that.

Mr_Shiftright said:

The perp has to be either an old guy or a young working class bro'. Well gee, 157 days of rain, Nude Bike Day, A Protest -a- Minute and Mt. Hood ready to blow up---I'll stay here, thanks.

cdnpinhead · July 2017

Anyone remember Fargo pickup trucks? Looked just like Dodge trucks in the States.

nyccarguy · July 2017

Anybody else have a rooster blocking the street on their way home tonight?

oldfarmer50 · July 2017

fintail said:
I have to believe there must have been some kind of duty/tariff thing about selling identical models. Nothing else seems to justify it - seems like a waste to make all of these little changes for a market 1/10th the size of the US.
Either that or it was trying to pander to customers by giving them a unique product, just like how many US companies with Canadian locations will stick a maple leaf in the logo. Back then, it wouldn't have even required different gauges, IIRC, kms weren't a thing until around the 1979 model year.

Here's one that fascinates me in a way, the 1960 Ford Frontenac, the Canadian version of a Falcon. Nice kind of baroque space age grille. Why?

isellhondas said:

I've never seen a Canadian car that I've liked and I've always wondered exactly why they felt the need to somehow make the "different"? I know a guy who has a 1954 Ford Convertible, a Canadian model. It looks like they tried to make a Ford ugly by making some strange changes. It has a flathead V8 and a 1954 Merc dashboard! Why?

I've seen Canadian 1965 Pontiacs built on Chevy frames with 283 engines. They look so strange with the wheels
tucked under the car! Why not just leave the cars as is and change the speedometers to KM's?

While tariffs and production factors have something to do with it there may also be the sense of national identity. Many Canadians I have met are very protective of their country not being overwhelmed by that aggressive country to the south. Completely understandable that styling tweaks sould be use to differentiate Canadian versions from American.

oldfarmer50 · July 2017

nyccarguy said:

Anybody else have a rooster blocking the street on their way home tonight?

So that's where he went.

Mr_Shiftright · July 2017

stickguy said:
I thought that Prius was a hearse, not a limo. Though I guess a Hearse is just a limo for 1!

Well someone here did say once they wouldn't be caught dead in a Prius---don't be too sure, eh?

Mr_Shiftright · July 2017

nyccarguy said:

Anybody else have a rooster blocking the street on their way home tonight?

But WHY is he crossing the road?

stickguy · July 2017

well, obviously that is his Camaro, and he is heading home after work.

Mr_Shiftright · July 2017

Must be a Google rooster. Obviously not working for chickenfeed.

suydam · July 2017

nyccarguy said:

Anybody else have a rooster blocking the street on their way home tonight?

In Ohio I would occasionally have to stop for a bull. That will give you a start. Or geese crossing the road. No roosters though.

Mr_Shiftright · July 2017

That's be dinner in my neighborhood.

suydam · July 2017

You run into a bull -- you're the dinner!

driver100 · July 2017

fintail said:
I suspect people in Portlandia now have the same ire towards southern immigrants as people in Seattle, as that place is experiencing the same pains Seattle has been dealing with for ages. The newbies bring their traffic and housing market, and expect the locals to worship them. It doesn't work like that.

Mr_Shiftright said:

The perp has to be either an old guy or a young working class bro'. Well gee, 157 days of rain, Nude Bike Day, A Protest -a- Minute and Mt. Hood ready to blow up---I'll stay here, thanks.

The Canadian market was smaller, one tenth of US, and cars cost about 20% more, so smaller less expensive cars sold better.

There used to be Ford dealers, and the prestige line was Mercury/Lincoln dealers. But, Mercury/Lincoln dealers didn't have any lower priced cars they could sell, so Ford wisely made a slightly different Ford and called it a Meteor, and that gave Mercury dealers a more popular priced car to sell. Same with the Frontenac in your picture, that gave the Mercury dealers their own version of the Falcon.

Ford dealers needed a more expensive car to move up to, so the Mercury was gussied up with chrome and a different grill and was called a Monarch.

Oldfarmer hit on a selling point too, this gave Canadians a car that seemed to be uniquely Canadian.

Pontiacs could be made for a lower cost by mounting the body onto a Chev frame. That made Pontiacs cheaper which was a big factor.....but, they weren't wide track up here.

nyccarguy · July 2017

driver100 · July 2017

nyccarguy said:

Anybody else have a rooster blocking the street on their way home tonight?

That could be dinner..........roadkill rooster

ab348 · July 2017

jmonroe said:
Hey, what's going on here with you 2 Canadians?

We now have 2 somewhat different stories. Are one of you equivalent to a Democrat here in the US and the other a Republican?

So what gives?

jmonroe

@driver100 's version was FAKE NEWS.

Actually we are both right. I touched on the manufacturing issues while he touched on the dealer structure/business reasons for it.

fintail · July 2017

I think the uniquely Canadian idea has a big part of it, kind of the "pandering" I was thinking about. Like anyone, Canada wants an identity too, and having unique cars can contribute to that. It's no doubt a lot cheaper to slap a new grille and some trim on an existing car, just enough to make it look different.

The cheaper small car might be part of it too. As long as I can recall, small cheap cars have sold in Canada, more than in the US. From the Pony to the Micra, these have succeeded. I've always thought because the winters are so harsh, cars are ruined by the conditions, and because of this, might as well get a car that will be mechanically fine until the structure starts to go.

driver100 said:

The Canadian market was smaller, one tenth of US, and cars cost about 20% more, so smaller less expensive cars sold better.

There used to be Ford dealers, and the prestige line was Mercury/Lincoln dealers. But, Mercury/Lincoln dealers didn't have any lower priced cars they could sell, so Ford wisely made a slightly different Ford and called it a Meteor, and that gave Mercury dealers a more popular priced car to sell. Same with the Frontenac in your picture, that gave the Mercury dealers their own version of the Falcon.

Ford dealers needed a more expensive car to move up to, so the Mercury was gussied up with chrome and a different grill and was called a Monarch.

Oldfarmer hit on a selling point too, this gave Canadians a car that seemed to be uniquely Canadian.

Pontiacs could be made for a lower cost by mounting the body onto a Chev frame. That made Pontiacs cheaper which was a big factor.....but, they weren't wide track up here.

explorerx4 · July 2017

I've had to stop a few times for a line of turkey's crossing the road.

driver100 · July 2017

Imid...you have a good knowledge of Canada.....more than a lot of Canadians. Canadians do buy smaller less expensive cars in much larger numbers. Our pay checks (Cdn would be cheques which I like better as you know what you mean when you spell it out and it is different than "check") may be a bit more, but our taxes are much higher and our general costs of living are much higher....leaving less money to buy things like cars.

Average home in Canada is just over $500k, in the US just over $400k. Cars are about 20% more. Most groceries are more....gas is about double. Sometimes, they import certain models that they don't send to the U.S., just because they are low priced and will capture a segment of the market.

qbrozen · July 2017

oldfarmer50 said:

Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe

Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).

You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

At that price, just get a 2005+ that will run circles around it. Wait...don't you HAVE ONE?

driver100 · July 2017

ab348 said:

jmonroe said:
Hey, what's going on here with you 2 Canadians?

We now have 2 somewhat different stories. Are one of you equivalent to a Democrat here in the US and the other a Republican?

So what gives?

jmonroe
@driver100 's version was FAKE NEWS.

Actually we are both right. I touched on the manufacturing issues while he touched on the dealer structure/business reasons for it.

I agree, abs answer from the manufacturing perspective is right on. And, like ab said my answer was from a marketing perspective. We nailed it!

oldfarmer50 · July 2017

qbrozen said:

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe

Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).

You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

At that price, just get a 2005+ that will run circles around it. Wait...don't you HAVE ONE?

Well, the point was that since GG got a much better Cobra with lower milage for about $5k less he must be a wizzard at grinding for price. I'd sure like to have him in my corner on ANY car purchase.

And oh yeah, my 15' would blow the doors off that one.

houdini1 · July 2017

jmonroe said:

houdini1 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe
Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).
You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.
You better watch what you say to some of the kids in here, they might get upset.

I think we have something in common. Towards the end of this month I'll be having one of those landmark birthdays and at the middle of the month I/we are going to have one of those landmark anniversaries.

Maybe I/we should celebrate this landmark year by getting a new car but I might need help on how to break it to her without her breaking my neck.

Any suggestions ? And I don't want to hear "man-up" because I have tried that over the years and I have permanent body markings to prove that doesn't work.

jmonroe

Sounds like we both may have a 50th anniversary coming up. Congrats to you and Mrs. Jmonroe. After putting up with you for 50 years, Mrs. Jmonroe will probably see you buying a new car as a very minor inconvenience, though she will probably put up a token resistance just to stay sharp.

As to which car to buy, everyone is different, so that is a toss up. When I was younger, I loved Hondas. A little older and I went for BMW and Mercedes.

Today, I can certainly see the appeal of Audi and BMW etc., especially to the younger crowd. They are great drivers cars and lots of fun to drive. If I was a lot younger I would have my butt warming the seat of an A4....but now, at my age, I have different priorities.

At my age I tend more toward luxury cars that are comfortable, reliable, and good interstate cruisers, etc. Maybe not a lot of "fun" to drive, but one that is more satisfying (for me) to drive.

Mike's 7 series fits the bill, but a little rich for my blood. Lexus LS and your Genesis, or maybe Mercedes E class seems about right for me. I also have no problem with buying one a year or two old if it has low miles and the deal is right. While no one seems to like the '17 Kia Cadenza, I haven't driven one, but it looks pretty good on paper. Good luck.

abacomike · July 2017

houdini1 said:

Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe

Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).

You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.

You better watch what you say to some of the kids in here, they might get upset.

I think we have something in common. Towards the end of this month I'll be having one of those landmark birthdays and at the middle of the month I/we are going to have one of those landmark anniversaries.

Maybe I/we should celebrate this landmark year by getting a new car but I might need help on how to break it to her without her breaking my neck.

Any suggestions ? And I don't want to hear "man-up" because I have tried that over the years and I have permanent body markings to prove that doesn't work.

jmonroe

Sounds like we both may have a 50th anniversary coming up. Congrats to you and Mrs. Jmonroe. After putting up with you for 50 years, Mrs. Jmonroe will probably see you buying a new car as a very minor inconvenience, though she will probably put up a token resistance just to stay sharp.

As to which car to buy, everyone is different, so that is a toss up. When I was younger, I loved Hondas. A little older and I went for BMW and Mercedes.

Today, I can certainly see the appeal of Audi and BMW etc., especially to the younger crowd. They are great drivers cars and lots of fun to drive. If I was a lot younger I would have my butt warming the seat of an A4....but now, at my age, I have different priorities.

At my age I tend more toward luxury cars that are comfortable, reliable, and good interstate cruisers, etc. Maybe not a lot of "fun" to drive, but one that is more satisfying (for me) to drive.

Mike's 7 series fits the bill, but a little rich for my blood. Lexus LS and your Genesis, or maybe Mercedes E class seems about right for me. I also have no problem with buying one a year or two old if it has low miles and the deal is right. While no one seems to like the '17 Kia Cadenza, I haven't driven one, but it looks pretty good on paper. Good luck.

You can pick up a 2017 left-over 7 series (2018's are already out) for about the same price as an LS460. Lots of factory money available on the 2017's.

As for the Lexus LS, don't forget they are coming out with a complete makeover for 2018, so a 2017 can be had at some great pricing.

As for JM, he's been so happy with his Genesis, why look elsewhere. The 2018 should be a much improved vehicle.

oldfarmer50 · July 2017

A little something for you 4th of July bbq fanatics:

driver100 · July 2017

Very Best wishes for the Best July 4th ever:

graphicguy · July 2017

explorerx4 said:
That Cobra looks a little funny. It looks like there is a piece missing from the lower rear bumper and it has some kind of aftermarket shift topper.

Good eye....right on both counts.

The '99 Cobras came with a bit of a stigma. That's the year Ford overstated the HP. They then had the dealers tweak the ECU, intake and exhaust manifold to fix it. Some say that didn't do the trick, though.

Then, it was the first year for an IRS in a Mustang. But, it added close to 100 pounds to the weight, which affected performance, too (compared to the solid rear axle in my '98).

I can see some who would buy it because it says "SVT Cobra" on the badging. Those who know the history would back away from it.

stickguy · July 2017

I could live with a 2005+ GT of some sort. Just need to find some aftermarket or later model seats that don't kill my back.

jmonroe · July 2017

driver100 said:

ab348 said:

jmonroe said:
Hey, what's going on here with you 2 Canadians?

We now have 2 somewhat different stories. Are one of you equivalent to a Democrat here in the US and the other a Republican?

So what gives?

jmonroe
@driver100 's version was FAKE NEWS.

Actually we are both right. I touched on the manufacturing issues while he touched on the dealer structure/business reasons for it.
I agree, abs answer from the manufacturing perspective is right on. And, like ab said my answer was from a marketing perspective. We nailed it!

I still say one of you guys is a Democrat.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50 · July 2017

stickguy said:
I could live with a 2005+ GT of some sort. Just need to find some aftermarket or later model seats that don't kill my back.

Go for a 2011+ and get the extra 100hp. Find one with the 3:73 gears and the speed will make your eyes bleed.

Having said that I'd like to get a nice cheap 2005ish 6 cyl. Convertible version for sedate cruising that won't scare my wife.

jmonroe · July 2017

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

houdini1 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe
Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).
You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.
You better watch what you say to some of the kids in here, they might get upset.

I think we have something in common. Towards the end of this month I'll be having one of those landmark birthdays and at the middle of the month I/we are going to have one of those landmark anniversaries.

Maybe I/we should celebrate this landmark year by getting a new car but I might need help on how to break it to her without her breaking my neck.

Any suggestions ? And I don't want to hear "man-up" because I have tried that over the years and I have permanent body markings to prove that doesn't work.

jmonroe
Sounds like we both may have a 50th anniversary coming up. Congrats to you and Mrs. Jmonroe. After putting up with you for 50 years, Mrs. Jmonroe will probably see you buying a new car as a very minor inconvenience, though she will probably put up a token resistance just to stay sharp.

As to which car to buy, everyone is different, so that is a toss up. When I was younger, I loved Hondas. A little older and I went for BMW and Mercedes.

Today, I can certainly see the appeal of Audi and BMW etc., especially to the younger crowd. They are great drivers cars and lots of fun to drive. If I was a lot younger I would have my butt warming the seat of an A4....but now, at my age, I have different priorities.

At my age I tend more toward luxury cars that are comfortable, reliable, and good interstate cruisers, etc. Maybe not a lot of "fun" to drive, but one that is more satisfying (for me) to drive.

Mike's 7 series fits the bill, but a little rich for my blood. Lexus LS and your Genesis, or maybe Mercedes E class seems about right for me. I also have no problem with buying one a year or two old if it has low miles and the deal is right. While no one seems to like the '17 Kia Cadenza, I haven't driven one, but it looks pretty good on paper. Good luck.

Before I get into this, I want to wish you and Mrs. Houdini a happy upcoming anniversary and just for your info, I'm very easy to live with but this anniversary car buying thing ain't going so well for me.

You won't believe this but Mrs. j saw my post where I was asking for help with a convincing argument about why we should celebrate our anniversary by getting a new car. She never looks at what is on the monitor when she is about to open a new session but last night she did. So, now I have some 'splaining to do.

It went like this:

Mrs. j: So you want a new car as OUR anniversary gift and you want help with how to snow me.

Trying not to know what she is talking about.

Me: HUH?

Mrs. j: Don't give me that HUH stuff you know exactly what I am talking about.

Me: So what is wrong with a new car?

Mrs. j: We've talked about this before. We don't need a new car. I like the one I have and you hardly ever drive yours. I think you've waxed it more times that you've driven it.

I think I've mentioned this before but since it is relevant to this discussion, I'll repeat a little bit about my car ('15 Genny that I bought in June of 2015). Right now it has 5869 miles on it as it sits in the garage. When I took it in for the PA state inspection a few month ago I told the guy I knew it wouldn't need an emissions inspection because I knew I didn't put more than 5K miles on it since the last inspection. As he is giving me back my insurance info and owner's card he said, "you were right about not needing and emissions inspection. Do you know how many miles you put on your car since last year"? I said, "not too many, I know that". He said, "876 miles". You may want to know how that happened, so I'm gonna tell you. A lot of this is Mrs. j's fault. First off, I don't take it out in the winter when there is snow and salt on the roads. Her Subie is made for that so why not put it through its paces? Then, along comes the nice weather and she reminds me when we are about to go someplace that the parking spots aren't that big and my car might get scratched. So, that's why a lot of this is her fault (damn, I hope she doesn't see this post).

Now back to the discussion:

Me: But your car is getting old so why not?

Mrs. j: It's only a 2012 and even you have said it's in great shape and has low mileage.

She got me there. It has less than 28K miles on it.

Me: Well, I just thought you deserved a new car and this would be a perfect time to get one.

Mrs. j: Don't give me that whiny story. You're not that thoughtful.

Me: Oh, you don't know me as well as you think you do.

Mrs. j: Yes I do. If you want to give me something I can use for my anniversary, STOP TALKING ABOUT GETTING A NEW CAR. Why don't you start with that?

Like I said, this ain't going so well and it looks like we will have to celebrate the more traditional boring way.

jmonroe

abacomike · July 2017

Got a call from my gastroenterologist yesterday explaining to me that he wanted to extend taking the Epclusa I am on for Hep C for another 12 weeks. He said that since I had failed three other courses of drugs aimed at eliminating the virus, he wanted to be sure I took the drug for a long enough time to finally kill this bug.

So, I said OK. I am getting another 3 months worth of this drug, which must first be approved by my health insurance company and hopefully, I can get approval for copays to be paid by another foundation. God must be with me because not only did the health insurance provider approve another $75,000+ for the three months, but a new foundation approved picking up my copay for $7,200 for the three months.

I guess I'll just have to learn to live with this insomnia, weakness and tiredness another 12 weeks, which would end in October. I will continue to take blood tests every 4 weeks and, with God's grace, I can hopefully be rid of this horrible virus which caused my cancer and has played havoc with my immune system.

tjc78 · July 2017

@abacomike
Hang in there!! Hoping that this last round does the trick and the side effects are marginal!!

houdini1 · July 2017

Good luck Mike. Your travails make our small talk about cars seem trivial.

roadburner · July 2017

tjc78 said:
@abacomike
Hang in there!! Hoping that this last round does the trick and the side effects are marginal!!

Ditto!

oldfarmer50 · July 2017

jmonroe said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

houdini1 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

houdini1 said:

jmonroe said:

tjc78 said:
Man it's getting rough in here lately.

@jmonroe
Just out of curiosity how's does the new Genny compare to the old in terms of ride and handling?

I remember that you were not pleased with the ride of your '09 Genny but I didn't have a problem with it. So I don't know how much faith you'll have in my opinion with my '15.

I'd say the '15 is better. Firmer but somehow it seems to have a smoother ride than my '09. Takes curves better too. Now, don't think that means it will perform like the German makes because it won't. It has only 3 driving modes compared to more with the German cars. As you know the '09 had only one mode (Normal). The three modes for the '15 are Normal, Eco, and Sport. Son # 1 says, he'd never drive it in any mode other than Sport. He drove it back from Fairfax VA (over 300 miles) when I got it and he played with the modes many times. Therefore, he has a valid opinion for himself but he judges a car much differently than I do. Normal mode doesn't bother me but when I want to play I go to Sport, just because it's there. I almost have to force myself to go into play mode.

It doesn't excite me to take a 40 MPH posted curve at 65 MPH. 52 MPH is good enough for me. I know, not too much in the way of expectations, but like I have said before, I've never been one to get giddy about pedal mashing.

I don't know if this helps but if you are looking for a Buickish type of ride you probably won't like the new design either.

jmonroe
Seeing an old guy driving a "sports sedan" is like seeing a 70 year old woman in a mini skirt. (Ducking and running for cover).
You're catching up to us more and more every day 'grandpa'.

Switching topics:

Every time I see one of these listed it makes me want to take GG with me on my next car negotiation.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/6203211326.html

Catching up ? Unless you are at least 74, I am way ahead of you.
You better watch what you say to some of the kids in here, they might get upset.

I think we have something in common. Towards the end of this month I'll be having one of those landmark birthdays and at the middle of the month I/we are going to have one of those landmark anniversaries.

Maybe I/we should celebrate this landmark year by getting a new car but I might need help on how to break it to her without her breaking my neck.

Any suggestions ? And I don't want to hear "man-up" because I have tried that over the years and I have permanent body markings to prove that doesn't work.

jmonroe
Sounds like we both may have a 50th anniversary coming up. Congrats to you and Mrs. Jmonroe. After putting up with you for 50 years, Mrs. Jmonroe will probably see you buying a new car as a very minor inconvenience, though she will probably put up a token resistance just to stay sharp.

As to which car to buy, everyone is different, so that is a toss up. When I was younger, I loved Hondas. A little older and I went for BMW and Mercedes.

Today, I can certainly see the appeal of Audi and BMW etc., especially to the younger crowd. They are great drivers cars and lots of fun to drive. If I was a lot younger I would have my butt warming the seat of an A4....but now, at my age, I have different priorities.

At my age I tend more toward luxury cars that are comfortable, reliable, and good interstate cruisers, etc. Maybe not a lot of "fun" to drive, but one that is more satisfying (for me) to drive.

Mike's 7 series fits the bill, but a little rich for my blood. Lexus LS and your Genesis, or maybe Mercedes E class seems about right for me. I also have no problem with buying one a year or two old if it has low miles and the deal is right. While no one seems to like the '17 Kia Cadenza, I haven't driven one, but it looks pretty good on paper. Good luck.
Before I get into this, I want to wish you and Mrs. Houdini a happy upcoming anniversary and just for your info, I'm very easy to live with but this anniversary car buying thing ain't going so well for me.

You won't believe this but Mrs. j saw my post where I was asking for help with a convincing argument about why we should celebrate our anniversary by getting a new car. She never looks at what is on the monitor when she is about to open a new session but last night she did. So, now I have some 'splaining to do.

It went like this:

Mrs. j: So you want a new car as OUR anniversary gift and you want help with how to snow me.

Trying not to know what she is talking about.

Me: HUH?

Mrs. j: Don't give me that HUH stuff you know exactly what I am talking about.

Me: So what is wrong with a new car?

Mrs. j: We've talked about this before. We don't need a new car. I like the one I have and you hardly ever drive yours. I think you've waxed it more times that you've driven it.

I think I've mentioned this before but since it is relevant to this discussion, I'll repeat a little bit about my car ('15 Genny that I bought in June of 2015). Right now it has 5869 miles on it as it sits in the garage. When I took it in for the PA state inspection a few month ago I told the guy I knew it wouldn't need an emissions inspection because I knew I didn't put more than 5K miles on it since the last inspection. As he is giving me back my insurance info and owner's card he said, "you were right about not needing and emissions inspection. Do you know how many miles you put on your car since last year"? I said, "not too many, I know that". He said, "876 miles". You may want to know how that happened, so I'm gonna tell you. A lot of this is Mrs. j's fault. First off, I don't take it out in the winter when there is snow and salt on the roads. Her Subie is made for that so why not put it through its paces? Then, along comes the nice weather and she reminds me when we are about to go someplace that the parking spots aren't that big and my car might get scratched. So, that's why a lot of this is her fault (damn, I hope she doesn't see this post).

Now back to the discussion:

Me: But your car is getting old so why not?

Mrs. j: It's only a 2012 and even you have said it's in great shape and has low mileage.

She got me there. It has less than 28K miles on it.

Me: Well, I just thought you deserved a new car and this would be a perfect time to get one.

Mrs. j: Don't give me that whiny story. You're not that thoughtful.

Me: Oh, you don't know me as well as you think you do.

Mrs. j: Yes I do. If you want to give me something I can use for my anniversary, STOP TALKING ABOUT GETTING A NEW CAR. Why don't you start with that?

Like I said, this ain't going so well and it looks like we will have to celebrate the more traditional boring way.

jmonroe

A '15 with 5900 miles? Never seen snow? Hmmmmm, that's my kind of car. I could give you a few hundred for it and then you could go back to your wife with puppy dog eyes and tell her that NOW you need a new car to wax.

I'll get in trouble with my wife for bringing another car home that she says we don't need but hey, what's sleeping on the couch for a few days when a buddy is in need?

Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles

Your Privacy