I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

explorerx4 · May 2019

My friend is back from NC with the Porsche he bought.
7 year old C2S with 25k on it.
I've only seen pictures, but it is bright yellow.
His other one is red, so I told him he needs to get a black one to complete the German flag theme.

explorerx4 · May 2019

Pretty amazing story.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/enthusiasts/the-north-korean-designer-responsible-for-the-1967-shelby-gt500/ar-AAAYVN5?li=BBnb4R5

kyfdx · May 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:

kyfdx said:
Speedster!

$1 million bucks, if real.

Looks real. Some guy with a t-shirt from the local Porsche dealer was around it, and a few stickers for the 356 registry on it. I was guessing half a million, off the top of my head.

Mr_Shiftright · May 2019

It's a Carrera, so a special Speedster. EASY one million, if real. There were only 75 of them ever made. And that's for a mediocre one. If it were super sharp (and real) it should hit $1.5 million.

kyfdx · May 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:
It's a Carrera, so a special Speedster. EASY one million, if real. There were only 75 of them ever made. And that's for a mediocre one. If it were super sharp (and real) it should hit $1.5 million.

My feeling is mediocre, just based on the general condition. I have no doubt it's real. There was plenty of high dollar iron there. I just picked a few that I thought were interesting.

If you click on the picture of the rear end, you can see that he has a 356 registry license plate surround. I'd think those guys would roast him, if it was a fake.

kyfdx · May 2019

I think the owner of the Porsche owns this place:

https://www.metalkraftcoachwerkes.com/

From browsing around the internet, it appears that plenty of 356 era Porsche owners modify their cars to look like more expensive models, though.

uplanderguy · May 2019

I haven't been in the latest Cruze yet, but the interior room was one of the things I liked about the first-gen Cruze. It felt bigger, and roomier and more comfortable inside, than most compacts at the time.

I own a '15 (first-gen) Cruze which my younger daughter drives, too. It feels heavier, doors thicker, etc., than my '17, but I prefer everything else about the '17. The '15 to me is tight in the back seat; the '17 is surprisingly large. The interior finish (chrome trim and cloth on the instrument panel) wins hands-down too IMHO. The '17 has stop-start and the '15 does not, but I don't mind the stop-start feature.

My buddy asked me why my '17 had both digital MPH readouts and a large, round analog speedometer. I replied that you can turn off the digital, but I like it, and without the analog, you'd have a big blank space there, which I detest in cars--ones that have all gauges in the center, or top of the instrument panel, and have nothing, or almost nothing, in front of the driver...yuck! Reminds me of a Willys Jeep, LOL.

Michaell · May 2019

uplanderguy said:
I haven't been in the latest Cruze yet, but the interior room was one of the things I liked about the first-gen Cruze. It felt bigger, and roomier and more comfortable inside, than most compacts at the time.

I own a '15 (first-gen) Cruze which my younger daughter drives, too. It feels heavier, doors thicker, etc., than my '17, but I prefer everything else about the '17. The '15 to me is tight in the back seat; the '17 is surprisingly large. The interior finish (chrome trim and cloth on the instrument panel) wins hands-down too IMHO. The '17 has stop-start and the '15 does not, but I don't mind the stop-start feature.

My buddy asked me why my '17 had both digital MPH readouts and a large, round analog speedometer. I replied that you can turn off the digital, but I like it, and without the analog, you'd have a big blank space there, which I detest in cars--ones that have all gauges in the center, or top of the instrument panel, and have nothing, or almost nothing, in front of the driver...yuck! Reminds me of a Willys Jeep, LOL.

Is there a way to switch the digital speedo to show something else? Both my Jetta and the wife's Outback can toggle through different info - instant MPG, trip MPG, etc

uplanderguy · May 2019

Yeah, there are so many things, including bar graphs for certain stuff, LOL. Really, too much stuff.

Duh, I see now, after I commented about the 'dustbuster' vans, that the original conversation was about the Venture and its ilk.

Those, I can speak of with some authority, as I had two new Ventures and an Uplander.

Our first Venture was our favorite--navy blue, camel cloth of a handsome pattern. Rode smoothly and was quiet. It was a lease so in '02 we bought a new Venture in kind-of a khaki color. Traded that on the new '05 Uplander. I thought the Uplander looked much-nicer than other vans, although the rear-end view was obviously-Venture. They stiffened up the body structure I'd read, due to the not-great crash tests of the Venture. It resulted in notably harder ride IMHO. All three of mine were reliable--total mileage about 191K between the three--36K on the first; 60K on the next, and about 95K on the last. I really can't remember anything out-of-pocket on any of them.

We made a mistake in not getting the center captain's chairs in the Uplander. There were two small almost jump seats there, with no armrests. Go around a corner and the only thing keeping you in your seat was the shoulder and lap belts.

Mr_Shiftright · May 2019

kyfdx said:

Mr_Shiftright said:
It's a Carrera, so a special Speedster. EASY one million, if real. There were only 75 of them ever made. And that's for a mediocre one. If it were super sharp (and real) it should hit $1.5 million.
My feeling is mediocre, just based on the general condition. I have no doubt it's real. There was plenty of high dollar iron there. I just picked a few that I thought were interesting.

If you click on the picture of the rear end, you can see that he has a 356 registry license plate surround. I'd think those guys would roast him, if it was a fake.

Not necessarily. It could be a real 356 (no doubt it is if it's actually in the registry) but without the Carrera engine, or a real Carrera that no longer has the original engine (that happens a lot, too, because these engines are delicate and outrageously expensive to rebuild).

fintail · May 2019

I remember when I was a bit younger, Speedsters were well under 100K - more like in the 60K range. At the same time, one could get a good 300SL roadster for under 200K any day of the week, decent 356s and higher trim early 911s could be found for 20K, etc. Of course. at that time you could also get a little postwar bungalow in my zipcode for 100K, and now it can be worth 15x that for land value alone. What a world.

jwm40517 · May 2019

I went to West Palm Beach to a Super Chevy event around 1986-88. We visited a friend of a friend that lived in a huge house on a canal. He had 5 or 6 nice Speedsters in the garage and several lesser ones in the driveway.
We went upstairs to a second floor balcony the length of the house and he handed out full auto rifles to the three of us to shoot at floating jugs in the canal. No police ever showed up. I asked what he did and he said real estate.

fintail · May 2019

Palm Beach, 1980s, Porsches, automatic weapons, "real estate", yeah we can put that picture together

thebean · May 2019

Appropriately, I saw a white Aztek today. With the white cladding, it really didn’t look bad. Compared to today’s two-box design on most every SUV/CUV, it was a bit of fresh air. I think I would drive one today.

kyfdx · May 2019

I think the Aztec was ahead of it's time. With the benefit of hindsight, it is also more attractive than it's corporate twin, the Rendezvous.

jwm40517 · May 2019

Fintail, your short summary certainly sounded like an old Miami Vice episode.

uplanderguy · May 2019

I remember the first Aztek I ever saw. I was working maybe 10 or 12 miles east and slightly south of the GM plant at Lordstown. I carpooled with another guy and we were driving home on a back road as there was an accident on I-76. Near Lordstown, I saw a schoolbus yellow Aztek, although at the time I don't think it was out yet. I assume someone at Lordstown had been driving it. I do think the styling is hideous, but over the years I've read that people who owned them tended to like them (everybody seems to have louder opinions on cars than the owners themselves, LOL).

With the passing of time, I would say the Cube looks far-worse, and the Juke, maybe not as bad but the proportions of the Juke leave me asking, "Huh?".

ab348 · May 2019

I remember when I got a white Aztec rental for a business trip. I picked it up after leaving work the previous afternoon and drove it home. This was when they had just come out and there weren’t many around. The neighbors I encountered that evening all asked me about it. The next day in traffic a car full of kids pulled up next to me and all the kiddos were gawking at it. But it drove really well and the interior wasn’t bad at all.

fintail · May 2019

Did he also have one of these? (I'll admit I think white is the best color for one):

jwm40517 said:
Fintail, your short summary certainly sounded like an old Miami Vice episode.

fintail · May 2019

Regarding the Aztek, compared to many awkward-to-ugly modern CUVs, it isn't all bad. Definitely ahead of its time, and it became better as the cladding became body color.

Speaking of early test drives, I remember when I was a student and the PT Cruiser hit the street and became a big fad for a short time. A friend of mine was interested in it, we saw the first one at the local dealer, and they let us take it for a test drive, alone. People pointed and looked at it, and I think someone even asked something about it. Funny how it became so ordinary so fast.

andre1969 · May 2019

I think, in a way, we owe most of today's automotive style to the Aztek. For the most part, cars had been getting cleaner, simpler, and more conservative in the 80's and 90's. Even if they were getting swoopier, the designs were still fairly simple...not much in the way of excess, and everything seemed to flow together, as if it was designed by one team.

But then, along comes the Aztek. Its grille has what I call the "1961 DeSoto effect", where the upper part of the grille theme has nothing whatsoever to do with the lower. The high beltline and cowl, owing to its minivan origins, just didn't give the overall style a very good flow. And, it looked like different parts of the rig were designed by different committees, who were not in communication with each other. And when they brought all those parts together, they just made them fit the best they could.

And, since then, it seems like many vehicle designs have gone for a similar theme...clumsy, awkward proportioning, style features that just don't flow well, exaggerated lines, creases, etc, and so on.

One thing I'll say for cars of the late 50's, such as a '58 Oldsmobile, for instance...it's more of what I'd call "kitchen sink" syndrome. As in, they throw everything at it, but the kitchen sink, and just go with what sticks. But, the basic body, proportioning, etc was at least nice. You could clean up a '58 Oldsmobile and make it look nicer by simply stripping off some of the excess. But, you can't do that with an Aztek. Or, most modern vehicles.

fintail · May 2019

The rear quarter window on the Aztek always irked me, looking like it was designed by someone who hadn't seen the rest of the car.

I blame Toyolex for modern design messes - it seems they ran with the overdone theme, and as designers/stylists seem to be copycats, everyone else got on board with the way to make appliance cars appear less boring.

ab348 · May 2019

fintail said:
The rear quarter window on the Aztek always irked me, looking like it was designed by someone who hadn't seen the rest of the car.

I blame Toyolex for modern design messes - it seems they ran with the overdone theme, and as designers/stylists seem to be copycats, everyone else got on board with the way to make appliance cars appear less boring.

There were two Toyota wagons that irked me. One was the Tercel wagon that had a "portrait"-style rear side window. The other was a Corolla wagon that took a landscape window to the extreme.

uplanderguy · May 2019

I never liked the Camry wagon with the upward-sloping bottom line of the quarter window--reminded me for some reason of late '50's/early '60's Rambler wagons--or the Accord wagon that looked like a roof was merely grafted onto the decklid of an Accord sedan.

uplanderguy · May 2019

We can debate the merits of the cars all day, but I always thought that the Celebrity, 6000, Century, and Ciera wagons were handsomely-proportioned, especially considering that they didn't come out until after the sedans were already out.

uplanderguy · May 2019

From the Truman library comes this pic, in honor of V-E Day. HST was a Mopar man and kept the date of Germany surrender on his personal license plate. This is his '72 Chrysler Newport Royal, the lowest-priced model Chrysler made that year, and in a color I know I saw a ton of back then. In the way that others want to visit every baseball stadium, I'd like to visit every presidential home. The Newport is still in the garage in Independence. I have not been there but would love to. Supposedly Bess used the car until her death in 1982.

uplanderguy · May 2019

ab348, from a styling perspective, those two are indeed egregious! LOL

imidazol97 · May 2019

ab348 said:

fintail said:
The rear quarter window on the Aztek always irked me, looking like it was designed by someone who hadn't seen the rest of the car.

I blame Toyolex for modern design messes - it seems they ran with the overdone theme, and as designers/stylists seem to be copycats, everyone else got on board with the way to make appliance cars appear less boring.
There were two Toyota wagons that irked me. One was the Tercel wagon that had a "portrait"-style rear side window. The other was a Corolla wagon that took a landscape window to the extreme.

This all shows what I've felt all along. There are more cars that are "different" than just the Aztek. But the Aztek has been ridiculed by distractors as the ultimate example of car bad design by GM.

However While many color combinations of Aztek don't look good to my eye, I like most of the Azteks with a blending color all over, e.g., the dark red. And there are other cars such as the Juke and Element, that grate on my eye.

Some folks don't like the Rendezvous while I liked it better than the Aztek then. We drove our son and belongs using the room in a friend's Rendezvous to OSU to move into the tower dorm when he was a freshmen. A reasonably large amount of room.

I'm relieved to see some examples of folks' opinions of poor design being posted and they are a mix of cars.

fintail · May 2019

I always liked the dual rear wiper reverse slant C-pillar Camry wagon for its weirdness. Not a beauty, but it was unique, and during that era, when Toyota tried to be daring, it was a lot cooler than now. I see the funky Corolla/Tercel wagons as JDM style oddity that didn't translate well (but sold plenty in this region).

The Ciera/Celebrity etc wagons weren't bad looking, along with period Cavalier and rebadge wagons. On a GM theme, I think these wagons are an underappreciated forgotten design that was pretty slick:

I think maybe 75% of full sized Chrysler sales in the fuselage era were green. My grandpa had a green on green with a green vinyl top Newport 4 door HT.

imidazol97 · May 2019

uplanderguy said:
We can debate the merits of the cars all day, but I always thought that the Celebrity, 6000, Century, and Ciera wagons were handsomely-proportioned, especially considering that they didn't come out until after the sedans were already out.

I saw two of those wagons at a car show in Knightstown IN last year in rough form: one Celebrity and one Chevy II smaller wagon. Rough But I was glad someone had started preserving them. I probably have pictures dumped onto my laptop.

I see Celebrity and equivalent wagons around here on the road. Some in worse shape than others, but some are amazingly good. I suspect they lived in someone's garage as a second vehicle so they have low mileage and were protected from the elements and salt.

uplanderguy · May 2019

Those Saturns are indeed long-forgotten. Subsequent Saturn styling was...unfortunate IMHO.

tjc78 · May 2019

I saw one of those Saturn wagons the other day in gold. Looked like it could be in the scrap yard soon.

xwesx · May 2019

I was going to reply to a comment above, then another, then another, and then I just gave up and decided a general response was best.

Agreed about the disjointed styling revolution. I feel more and more that way about today's vehicles, a time when elegant-looking designs such as Tesla, Ford (many, not all), and the "new" Continental stick out like a sore thumb within the sea of blistered, struck-with-the-ugly-stick offerings. When designs such as VW's offerings, which are just so pleasing on the eyes, are called "boring."

Hopefully there will always be a place for true masters of design, as I will always be within the market of those eager to appreciate them (and, at times, perhaps even buy).

imidazol97 · May 2019

While my preferences and likes of vehicles isn't that of everyone else, I always think of a professional car salesperson on the forums who said, "There's a butt for every seat." I think I have that quote correctly... No matter how unlikable a vehicle is to some of us, there's a person who will buy it.

explorerx4 · May 2019

A Land Rover Disco, yellow and decked out in Camel Trophy trim.

uplanderguy · May 2019

Coming home from Cracker Barrel an hour ago, I passed on I-76 a Cadillac Sixty Special I believe; black, beautiful original/authentic condition; I'm guessing somewhere from a '42 to a '47, on a trailer. I had forgotten my phone (camera) at home so no pic.

berri · May 2019

We can debate the merits of the cars all day, but I always thought that the Celebrity, 6000, Century, and Ciera wagons were handsomely-proportioned, especially considering that they didn't come out until after the sedans were already out.
I think Ford was called the wagon master back in those days for good reason. But I do agree that the GM A car wagons were very cleanly styled.

From the Truman library comes this pic, in honor of V-E Day. HST was a Mopar man and kept the date of Germany surrender on his personal license plate. This is his '72 Chrysler Newport Royal
We could use some Truman's today who put country over party.

andre1969 · May 2019

I think Ford really dominated in wagons, full-sized at least, in the mastodon years of the 70's. From what I recall, Ford did a good job with offering all the luxury trappings in the Country Squire, that lured a lot of buyers in. And, as I recall, Ford kept its names fairly consistent for awhile, whereas Chevy would jump around, sometimes calling the top wagon a Kingswood or whatever, and sometimes a Caprice. And, IIRC, even in top trim level, the Chevy wagon was only about as nice as an Impala-trimmed car.

Chevy might have suffered a bit here, because GM had Pontiac, Olds, and Buick wagons to fill the more luxury-oriented crowd, whereas Ford just had Mercury. I think once GM started downsizing though, the Chevy wagons got more nicely trimmed.

Edit: By 1976, the last year a mastodon-class Chevy went up against a mastodon-Ford, Chevy was taking the lead in wagons...about 72K full-sized Chevy wagons, compared to 63K Fords. By 1979, when the Fords were downsized and again on equal footing with the downsized Chevies, Chevy was swamping them...around 120K+ Impala/Caprice wagons, compared to around 58K LTD/Country Squires. But, the Panther in general didn't sell all that well, at first. That was an era where it seemed GM could do no wrong, and the public was caught up in the euphoria of how wonderful the downsized cars were. Of course, they didn't have time yet for the under-sized THM200 trannies to start failing in mass quantities yet, or the Buick 231s and Pontiac 301s self-destructing prematurely, and the tigher emissions controls of '79 to start acting up, quite yet...

fintail · May 2019

In podunk for a long weekend, so far have seen 2x 84-85 Tempo, International Scout, Nissan NX, Mazda MX3, big early 80s Pontiac wagon, 38 Ford coupe, Pinto (wagon I assume) cut down into a pickup.

stickguy · May 2019

a couple driving around today. early 70s (pre-bumper) big Chevy 2 door. looked clean, but way over-sized wheels. Not a great look. And coming out of a train station parking lot, a later model run Nissan 280z. Didn't get a good enough look to see which specific nomenclature on it, but it was the rounder style before it went all 80's angular.

berri · May 2019

Those Pinto wagons weren't all that uncommon for awhile. They even had a fake wood sided model (don't recall if they called it a Squire), and I think for a short while a set up like a panel van with a small circular window on the rear side? You'd also see more than a few Vega Kammback wagons back in those days (provided the early ones hadn't rusted away or lost their engine. I thought they both looked nice, but I like wagons.

stickguy · May 2019

I think the woody was a Squire. The panel van was the Pinto cruising wagon.

berri · May 2019

Great, I'm not totally losing my mind

ab348 · May 2019

I was behind a last generation early ‘00s Mercury Marauder today, either a dark, dark brown or black with some dust on it. Driven by an older (than me, at least) gray-haired fellow in a very sedate manner. Looked in top condition.

fintail · May 2019

More small town sightings: immaculate Suzuki Swift GT, clean 67 Fairlane sedan, cigar 'Bird with much patina, 69 (I think) Camaro, couple of 80s Monte Carlo SS, VW Phaeton at a transmission shop, 2 66 Impalas in different locations, mid 60s Fury or Polara 2 door HT.

tjc78 · May 2019

ab348 said:

I was behind a last generation early ‘00s Mercury Marauder today, either a dark, dark brown or black with some dust on it. Driven by an older (than me, at least) gray-haired fellow in a very sedate manner. Looked in top condition.

Unless it was repainted it was black. With all the pollen right now everything looks dirty!

fintail · May 2019

Odd sighting yesterday, seen from the right on this rear facing dashcam capture:

https://youtu.be/F3rSbjceLqE

Lovely day today too, only saw one oldie out, and it was also unusual. Green and white 57 Ford convertible, non-retractable (soft top). I seen to recall it having normal US market side trim, but it had an odd grille with a dip in the middle like a Canadian market Meteor.

stickguy · May 2019

on the local highway near me, got passed by a 73 (I think) 2 door Pontiac. I think a Grand Am. beak nose, and the slant to a point trunk lid . Period beige. Looked nice and clean, and from the sound, I think the engine was breathed on a bit. But looked stock.

bhill2 · May 2019

fintail said:
Odd sighting yesterday, seen from the right on this rear facing dashcam capture:

I waited a while for someone more knowledgeable of cars of that era, but I will now put in my guess of a '49 or '50 Plymouth Fastback.

fintail · May 2019

Same general era, but smaller car. Making the video full screen may help.

bhill2 said:

I waited a while for someone more knowledgeable of cars of that era, but I will now put in my guess of a '49 or '50 Plymouth Fastback.

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

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