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What about VW TDI engine?
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Unfortunately, before we see diesels over here again, a couple of things will need to happen. 1. Car manufacturers can meet diesel demand in Europe. 2. We get the sulfer levels in our Diesel way down to the same level as European Diesel fuel, thus letting the emission control systems work properly. 3. Americans realize that what they really love is Torque not raw HP (which few people ever make full use of anyway) and that diesels produce far more torque at a given displacement than gas engines.
Oh a final note.. From what I understand, Ford has an excellent direct injection 2.0 liter diesel that they put in the Focus in Europe : (.
And I don't mean to be hostile, but what does it matter if '02 is the last for this particular engine? Manufacturers update engines all the time.
I have a hard time believing that US emissions standards are more strict than they are in Europe. If anything, I would anticipate them becoming more lax in the next four years.
Happy owner of a TDI Jetta and love it. It's an auto and I typically get about 38 MPG in the city and 45 on straight interstate driving.
Gotta question about where to buy Castrol 5W-40 Synthetic Motor Oil. I can't find it anywhere except for the dealer where they want $7.50 a quart.
I can find the Castrol 5W-30 Synthetic all over the place, but no 5W-40. Any ideas on where to get this oil weight? I've seen Valvoline 5W-40 Synthetic, but want to stick with Castrol.
To our Canadian posters, is Castrol 5W-40 more available in Canada since there are so many more TDI's there than in the states? I'd be happy to make a trip there to pick up a case.
Thanks!
What action(s) would be most effective?
All new cars registered in NY must pass an emissions test to get an inspection sticker. TDIs cannot. Therefore, you can only bring them into the state used. Then NY grants you an emissions waiver and you can get your sticker. NY will not penalize you for already owning a TDI.
This would all be moot if the TDI met NY emissions standards. It does not as a new car.
VW has allegedly threatened its NY neighboring states dealers about selling TDIs to buyers with NY only addresses. 3 dealers told me that VW would penalize them or pull their franchise if they failed to comply. That is why some dealers don't want to know from you if you say TDI and NY in the same breath.
Now...if gas hits 3 bucks a gallon....maybe VW will think it's worth it to get them certified. But since they sell all the diesels they can in Europe, maybe not. Anyone's guess.
Personally....I owned a diesel Rabbit. Great engine but the car vibrated away around it. The new ones are a lot better, but you need to own them a long time to make up the difference in price and maintenance from a car that gets 25mpg or even a gas VW. Personal call. They are great machines.
1. 20k fuel system servicing. $150-200 at the dealer including an expensive VW only filter.
2. Synthetic Oil only for oil changes.
3. Timing belt replacement at 40k for automatic and 55k for stick, although new guidance might now have the auto at the same interval. Dealer estimate $600 in Northern VA.
If you can do all this yourself, more power to anyone. Hate to take a VW diesel to just any old mechanic, or young one for that matter. Past experience with VW reminds me of VW only parts costing a bundle.
Sure, diesels don't need gas type tune-ups, but they don't run maintenance free either. And I didn't even mention the potential cost if you have out of warranty problems with the turbo or the direct injection system.
Suddenly the Pro sounds economical!
There is a huge market here for diesel. gas will only get more expensive and diesel is the wave of the future in the U.S. The passat with the TDI will sell big. there are a ton of middle aged men and women that have families and are looking at something economical. honda and toyota wont bring diesel here. Big opportunity. yep.
erik in chicago. passat 1.8t 1999
erik
Link to article about strong sales of TDI. TDI's should be somewhat easier to find this Fall when gasoline prices are not so high.
If you think the 1.9 TDI is cool, you'd be surprised to know it's antiquated in terms of diesel technology. the 1.9 PD 130 as it is called, basically the same engine as the TDI but with direct injection technology (Aka Pumpe-Duse, where the PD acronym comes from). It has 130hp vs. the TDI's 90hp, and has a higher torque rating as well. They employ this engine in everything from the VW Golf to the VW Sharan (a minivan) and even the Passat. The reason I hate the US car market is because of the lack of options...You can get the Audi A6 with a 2.0 130hp engine, a 2.5diesel V6, all the way up to a 4.3 V8. So there is a model for every household and money bracket...American autos are far behind in technology, and imported autos to America lag behind their equivalents at home. Volkswagen Auto Group tends to be my favorite company due to the fact that they are taking the place of BMW and Honda in terms of innovation. They have the highest-efficiency, highest-performance diesels, effortless and economical turbocharged petrol engines, and the new W8 and W12 engines (which are VR6 engines arranged cascadingly and connected at the center with a common crankshaft). Even the 3.0 V6 Audi engine manages to crank out about 28mpg on the freeway.
Diesel is in renaissance overseas, and some myths should be dispelled. The reason the TDI won't make the emissions standard in CA and NY is because we use very unrefined high-sulfur diesel. The TDI is an old design so it doesn't need low-sulfur diesel, but most others do. the PD engines and direct-injection engines require low-sulfur diesel, and in fact most modern turbodiesels require it. So it doesn't behoove any company to import an engine that won't run on any fuel readily available, right? Apparently low-sulfur diesel will be available in about 5 years in the US...which could mark a renaissance here.
Low-sulfur diesel is actually as environmentally friendly or friendlier than petrol, and most European emissions standards are more stringent than the US, so you can rest assured that diesel in and of itself is clean.
The newest diesel breakthroughs I have noticed are:
the Pumpe-Deuse technology on VW engines
BMW now sports a 330d, a 3-series with a 3.0 diesel inline six which has almost 300lb-ft of torque and hits 0-60 in about 8 seconds. BMW has made a commitment to being able to prove that diesel can be the fuel of a sports car. BMW has an equivalent diesel for almost every petrol engine they produce now.
BMW also has a 2.5 inline-six diesel which is used in the 3, 5 and even 7 series overseas. It gets about 30-35mpg and puts out about 180hp and 250lb-ft, and apparently hits 0-60 in the 525d model in about 9 seconds. This is a marvelous combination of economy and performance.
Diesel is now engine of choice for about 45% of the UK market, and ironically Honda's sales are doing poorly because Honda does not have diesel technology of their own. They have no engines to speak of that are diesel, and are having to outsource in order to catch up with the market.
Toyota produces diesels, but apparently isn't very good at it. The next generation Echo (which is called the Yaris or Vitz overseas), is going to be built together with Peugeot, and Peugeot will supply the diesel engines while Toyota will supply it's VVT-i engines for gasoline.
Ironically, european marques are selling well and making a profit. Apparently Renault and Peugeot have lots of change in their coffers...the Laguna midsized hatchback has a wonderful diesel and sells very well. Peugeot is very well respected in Europe and rom what i've seen, I am VERY disappointed they're not here in the US anymore. The new 307 apparently has the build quality of an Audi, the handling of a Focus, at the price of a Focus.
But, before I go off on a tangent, just realize that the technology to support diesel is rapidly approaching that of petrol and that us Americans are in fact missing out on the most American thing of all, the freedom to choose in a consumer market.
It was against the Chrysler Voyager with a 2.5 Turbodiesel, the Renault Espace with a 2.4 TD, compared to the Volkswagen Sharan with the 1.9 PD engine. The service interval for the Sharan was the longest, somewear near 20,000 miles, while the Voyager was a pathetic 7,000 and the Espace a more reasonable 15,000. So that appears to be one cost-saving measure. The direct-injection technology probably doesn't require shorter intervals for anything, since the basic difference between the 1.9 PD engine and the 1.9 TDI is 2 extra valves/cylinder, and the injector. So anything related to the injector probably requires special TLC.
About the earlier timing belt issues, I have two options available to have timing belt changed that will cost less than $300 including parts, and one of those is a dealer service department.
Would be nice if there was a timing chain, the timing belt is an negative aspect of the TDI that I choose to accept.
You are 100% correct that for ownership cost the VW is not lowest cost TDI or gasoline. It is however the most excellent ownership experience for the $ that I have come across.
I spend far too much time in my car to have one that is not going to provide enjoyment when I drive it.
Oh, and by the way, the TDI uses 4.4qts of oil, 10 oil changes over 100K miles would be $220 or $0.0022 per mile. This is using your $5.00 per quart figure.
An automatic would sap it as much or worse than you can experience on a 2.0.
70 to 80 MPH is quiet and comfortable with the engine turning less than 3K RPM.
The comment about TDI's not having auto in Europe needs to be taken in context. Almost no small cars and very few large cars in Europe that I ever saw had automatic. Europeans prefer manual. Does not indicate that an auto is not good.
I drive a TDI auto because I drive in major stop and go traffic and the auto just makes more sense. When I drive my truck with a manual I have to row the gears like a madman.
A/C or no A/C, auto or stick, the TDI has plenty of performance, and if it is not powerful enough, $300 to have the car "chipped" will provide more performance.
As far as the MPG difference, yes the sticker is accurate as to the MPG differnce.
My mileage averages 42. 37-39 MPG for the TDI with auto is common for other owners. Over 50MPG is common for manual drivers. Expect a 15% penalty on the mileage for an auto compared to manual for the TDI.
How is the revvable nature of the engine sapped? This engine develops peak torque at 1900 RPM and operates best at 2 to 3K RPM. The mileage on manual is 42 city 49 hwy and on auto is 34 city and 44 hwy. 34/44 is damn good and only the Honda Civic HX CVT at 35/40 is comparable.
As I posted earlier I average 42 MPG with my Golf TDI auto and this is with 50/50 city and hwy driving.
The automatic is well suited to the torquey nature of the TDI. The manual is a better choice for higher mileage seekers and also saves cost due to 60K interval for timing belt as opposed to 40K interval for auto.
Some people prefer auto, some prefer manual, with the TDI either option is a good one.
? for focusmatt2 How much time have you spent with auto TDI? I can honestly say that I was doubtful about the auto before I experienced it, experience of the auto sold the auto.
My question is: Do you know of anywhere where you can buy Castrol 10-40W? No auto parts stores seem to carry it. Is it okay to switch to 10W-30 Mobil 1? Will I get better gas mileage with the lighter oil switch? What oil do you use? Where do you buy it?
Thanks.
Mobil Delvac 1 5W-40
Chevron Delo 400 5W-40
Amsoil Series 3000 5W-30
There are others that are OK. Forget about the dealer Castrol. It is OK but not as good as the above. Below is a link to info on where the oils can be purchased.
http://forums.tdiclub.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=5&t=001427&p=
I use Mobil Delvac 1 and get it at Farm and Fleet Stores for about $19/gallon.
Thanks.
But it comes to the overall appeal of the engine. There's a reason many german carmakers outsource their automatic transmissions to GM and other American companies. I simply am recommending the manual over the automatic, because that engine/transmission combination is tried and true, and it yields better gas mileage. If you get the automatic, you are demoted to Civic HX mileage. And the Civic HX with its CVT is faster and runs on more readily available fuel and is cheaper to buy and likely cheaper to insure. Now, if VW would allow a CVT (known in Audis as Multitronic) to exist with the 1.9 TDI, I would recommend it. Sort of the best of both worlds.
It's just that small 4-cylinder engines, especially diesel, tend to make driving a little less fun, a little less economical, and a little less peppy when mated to an auto tranny.
But anyway, I was impressed. I'll say it again... Pumpe-Duse VW engines NEED to come over here! I was reading an Audi AD in a magazine that explains PD technology and it sounds so exciting, like one of those Union Carbide commercials about "the exciting world of atoms".
In fact, this car's strength is its highway cruising and passing power, IMO.
The make a 2.5 TDI V6 Audi A6 wagon, which is the same platform as the Passat (in the UK). They are reportedly going to offer this engine in the Passat, too.
The TDI's strength isn't 0->60. It's not a drag racer. Its strength is 40->90. I'm guessing the other drive laid off, not petered out.
2.0 I-4 goes 0-60 in 9.0 seconds
1.9 turbodiesel I-4 goes 0-6 in 11.2 seconds
10.1 0 to 60 mph for 2.0 5 spd
11.9 0 to 60 mph for 1.9 TDI
Above numbers are for Golf and New Beetle
10.5 0 to 60 mph for 2.0 5 spd
12.4 0 to 60 mph for TDI 5 spd for the Jetta
What difference does 1.8 seconds make, 18 MPG.
I do not know how important 0 to 60 MPH are to most people, I did not have a specific time in mind when I bought the Golf TDI. What was important to me was if it could accelerate quickly to pass on the highway or to merge on an onramp, this it does with power to spare.
It stops quickly with 4 wheel disc brakes and ABS too.
I have the automatic that is slightly slower than manual and I am amazed at how well it performs in the crazy traffic that I drive in.
My opinion is that the TDI has plenty of power.
Then I took out my stopwatch and timed 3.7 seconds. After I stopped laughing I had a better understanding of why I am satisfied with the performance of the TDI.
Next, we tried the TDI 5-speed. Felt quite different than the auto TDI. For one thing, we didn't notice any lag when stabbing the accelerator. For another, the engine felt smoother, especially at a stop with the clutch in -- no vibrating like the auto. Certainly not as fast as the 1.8T, but quick enough. Cheaper to feed and insure, too (and fewer stops for fuel).
We paid $19,500 for a Black 2002: the only options were Cold Weather, Monsoon, and a CD changer. No Luxury package, so we have steel wheels and no moonroof. All 2002 VW cars benefit from a new 4 year/50k bumper-to-bumper warranty, so we didn't even look at a 2001.
I wish we had liked the auto TDI better, since they had so many more color choices (Red, Marlin Blue, Silver, White). Still, the 5-speed seemed to us the best combination.