By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
Go to the Ford website and put in your information to get a RCL estimate for comparison.
If they charged you list price minus only the $3K rebate, you paid too much for the vehicle up front. They can be had for close to invoice, minus the $3K rebate. Plus there are unconfirmed rumours of an additional $2K in dealer incentives.
Scroll back in the posts here for some examples in the last few days for comparison. jndcav paid almost the same price (if you subtract the $1K loyalty rebate and $500 down payment) and got the same payment but with 15K miles per year.
Well to placate myself in the meantime, I took my gf over for a test-drive this past weekend. The salesman pulled around an LSE and her-and-I did a little zoom-zoom. She'd never been in one before, and actually quite liked it. The car seemed to have a little more power than I remembered from the '00 I test-drove a few years back. I stomped it a little more than I normally would have, since I'm not used to getting the oompf in my SHO unless it's WOT. But so smooth, so quiet - makes my SHO sound like a POS...
Well with 20-30 more HP/torque and the lower-RPM torque, I am going to have so much fun in that car! And as a bonus, now my gf's eyes don't immediately glaze over when I start going on about it.
The traffic and such make an auto my choice now for a daily driver, eventually I will probably pick up something manual for a "toy" for the weekends or days when I want to stir the gears, but to me the LS w/SST is a darned good compromise.
Replacing the SHO was one of the hardest car shopping experiences I've had. The SHO was a great car, the engine howled wonderfully, and it was a great car for stealth speeding, cops thought it looked like a Taurus rental. ;-) The LS doesn't seem to attract too much attention either, thankfully. Definitely a better stealth speeding car than a BMW or Vette/Stang.
As much as I loved the SHO, I don't miss the FWD though. (Even though the SHO handled quite well for a FWD car)
JS
LLSOC Charter Member
reneleblanc & lsv8 thanks for your response on my knocking noise. I have not noticed the advance track signal on the dash so I will just have to wait and see if the dealer finds anything in 2 weeks. I will keep you posted.
Second SHO was a 1993 Green/Saddle loaded. Yamaha V6 and 5 speeed
Third SHO was a 1997 Green/Saddle loaded Yamaha V8 Automatic.
The 1990 was the fastest of the three (options added weight). The 1989 SHO plus was the fastest sho of them all, even had an aluminum hood.
The LS was for me a spiritual successor to the SHO. I would probably still be driving one if they had done another...
HOWEVER, not that I have an LS I could never go back. The comment about RENTAL car is very true. I travel a lot and rent Tauri all the time. The SHO's were fun and LOUD and had a lot of torque steer from the FWD. The LS is in a totally different league...
My gear stirring comes from my 99 Wrangler which I have totally customized and is my play toy!
BUT if I want to get somewhere fast the LS it is. I love the contrast the LS provides versus the very rudimentary technology of the Jeep.
I have the best of both worlds... Now I just need a nice used 911....
I would much rather have all of these seperate vehicles than a single very expensive one...
(Guess I will never be able to afford an M5 Sigh)
I think there's something wrong with your car.
I was hell bent on getting a 2001 V8 sport
for between $25K-$28K. I just read all the
changes to the 2003 from www.llsoc.com.
WOW. Anyone have any idea what its going to
do to the sticker price of the car???
I would assume new list price on a fully
loaded car has to be around 43-45K.
Anyway, part of me says buy a 2003 and drive it
into the ground (since trading it in for a new
one 3 yrs later would mean getting killed with
resale) and the other says just stick with plan
A and get the 2001.
Any opinions? Also - LSV8 owners, what kind of
mileage do you get and how's the car in the
snow???
Thanks,
Ace
The current V8 will get you 16-18 city and 24-27 highway. 2003 is supposed to be the same or slightly better even though it has more power and lower gearing.
No problems with snow but Advance Trac is recommended along with snow tires if you get a lot of the white stuff.
I think the bottom line is that you can get away with all season tires on most FWD cars, but with a RWD car like the LS you need good new all season tires or you need to invest in real snow tires.
Its really just a matter of money. If you can wait until the new year and can afford the money, I don't think you'll be disappointed if you wait for the 2003. You could also get a new 2002 now for a great deal right now. It has a little more power than the 2000/2001.
My 2001 V8 gets 18mpg city/hwy. If you drive only city, expect 16-17. If you take a long trip, expect 22-24.
I haven't had too much experience in the snow with my car yet but so far it performs predictably and confidently. If you're concerned, get AdvanceTrak. If you're in NJ as your username implies (as am I), you shouldn't have any problems unless it snows a couple of feet. My personal opinion is that good snow driving is more in the driver than in the car anyway.
Joe
BTW: I'm the NJ co-director of LLSOC. Hope to see you there.
Thanks
I'm guessing your drone could be either a tire or a bearing. There have been some bearing issues.
Well, you have to go to the dealer now anyhow.
I have a buddy who is a ford mechanic and was trained to work on the SHO v6 back in the late 80's. He described it as the closest thing you could get to an Indy car engine, in a passenger car! When testing initial prototype engines, apparently Ford could run the SHO v6 at 8000+ RPM's all day long.
I reluctantly gave up my SHO after 5 clutch/pressure plate/ throwout bearing R&R's in two years. Great engine, POS transmission.
Does Lincoln market this particular car to an age segment - seems that I always see people driving these cars that are older than I am, at age 37!! No offense, but that is my observation!
The average age of a Town Car customer is around 70.
The average age of a LS customer is around 50, which is probably brought up by lots of traditional Lincoln customers getting LS's too.
There are lots of younger LS drivers, as was shown on a LS driver age poll on llsoc.com. In fact I've gotten lots of complements about mu LS from people as young as 16. The only problem is there are very few 16 year olds who can afford an LS. From the participants on llsoc.com it seems that since used LS's are showing up in the market there are a lot more 20 something year olds now driving LS's, simply most of them can't or won't spend the $$ for a new LS.
I really wouldn't worry about the age of LS owners as I see lots of 50 something people driving BMW 5 series and GS series cars. If you like the LS, get one. You will be pleased at some of the benefits of owning a brand that older people drive, such as low insurance rates.
Anyway the dealer replaced BOTH rear window regulators (I made my wife a copy of the TSB) The drone/humming noise that I heard turned out to be a wheel bearing like someone suggested. Dealer replaced.
Still think the car is the best daily driver I've ever owned. I don't expect something as complicated as a car to be totally problem free as long as they fix the few problems right.
But, this is not the reason you should buy the car. Buy it because you like the way it drives and handles and because you think it is a good value. 2003 models have quite a few changes including variable valve timing and more power. If you drive and like a 2002, you will like a 2003 even more.
I still enjoy Magic Mountain. I love roller coasters. Reminds me of taking 25 mph off-ramps at 65 in my MTX LS.
Not ready for the rolling coffins yet.
If you want a real American V8 Car with European Looks, Handling, and Sophistication (Getting there--2003 Definitely) the LS is for you!
Also, The Cars you mentioned the Lexus GS300, and the BMW 530 are marketed towards same segments as the LS pretty much. IMO Lincoln sees the BMW 5 Series as the Target Competition. Correct me someone if I am off base here.
Regards,
Airwolf1000
LLSOC Texas Chapter Director
P.S. The LLSOC WebMaster is even younger than I am! And we have many in their 20's.
In my opinion, the magazines also feed into the BMW, M/B bias of much of this age group. Like it or not, image meens a lot to those in that age group, and a small tarnish by a magazine can affect a purchase decision.
And, as we've discussed before, Lincoln advertising could be a lot better.
Airwolf: How did you avoid, or deal with, the 'stigma' of buying a Lincoln?
As far as 2002 vs 2003, there will be significant improvements in the 2003. Becuase of this, pricing is very good right now on the 2002s. The 2003s will hit dealer lots sometime in December. So, if you like the car in general but there are a few things that you would like to be different, let us know because that may be changed in the 2003.
LLSOC is an absolutely wonderful group. Mania 4 next summer sounds fantastic!!!! We hope you can join us.....
Chris
LLSOC Charter Member
Arizona Chapter Director
With a cat-back system, K&N, and a 2002 air box, the V-6 Manual will give the V-8 a run for its money until both cars reach about 65 mph. Then the torque and gearing advantage of the V-8 seems to make a difference.
If you are into the cut and thrust of short in-traffic offensive driving, the quick movements of the V-6 MTX are hard to duplicate with the automatic. The MTX is also quicker off the line.
At Mania III at California Speedway, a 2001 MTX had the best slolom time. Chaulk that up to slightly better balance and quick reflexes (Or maybe photographers have better cone vision).
If there are any 2002 MTXes left, they are an incredible buy for the best edition of the LS MTX.
A 220hp MTX almost equals a 252hp V-8 when you consider the loss through an automatic tranny.
But you must drive drive the MTX in a more aggresive manner to extract it's performance potential. With the V-8, it's a lot smoother experience.
It depends on the involvement level you want with the car. Driving is the only excitement and movement I get in my mostly sedentary life.
Besides, all the millionares I know own transmission shops. I figure that with the Manual, I'll never give them any of my money (I'll let them take my wife's money for her car).
Cone-visionator out :>)
I need to go check for flying pigs....... :-)
re the earlier post about noise at highway speed: I'm near the end of my second set of Firehawks. I had a slight, low howling sound from the rear end at all speeds from around 50. At the time the 'Stones had about 25k on them. Rotating the tires changed the sound slightly but that's all. Replacing them at 35k eliminated it. The current tires have about 25k on them and have started to howl. I know the newer models don't have the Firestones so, FWIW.
LLSOC membership is the best investment (a puny one) an LS owner can make, to enhance your knowledge and enjoyment of your car. Yes, this is a shameless plug, but a sincere one.
Scott
Charter member
But my 0-60 time is Awful.
Mileage is just around 19 mpg, with the low tank warning light coming on at 270-300 miles.
The one trip I did take to Central Calif from San Diego yielded a high of 24 mpg.
But the MTX is not exactly a low rpm cruiser. Due to it's gearing, the little Duratech spins at 3,000 rpm at 75 mph.
As a result, you don't have to shift down for almost any grade. But don't expect neck-snapping forces if you want to pass at 90 mph. This little baby is already wound out and looking for virtual overdrive.
So I think the V-8's high overdrive ratio in fifth could easily better the Manual's mileage.
Maybe Mikey can fill us in on the V-6 Auto's mileage potential.
My experience is you will get about one MPG better mileage while highway cruising with the V-6. And you can't go wrong with ANY LS!
The problem was that my LS so effortlessly cruised at 80 MPH and the acceleration was so good anywhere from 50 to 100, that after a couple of hours on the interstate I'd become bored.
All I could think about was -- How long until I can get off the highway and find some good, empty, twisty back roads and have some fun!
Thanks everyone! I now follow this forum faithfully, and enjoy it almost as much as driving my LS on the twisty bits!
I installed 245/45/17 Bridgestone Pole Position SO-3's and they look like a tight fit.
These Summer-only tires have magnificent grip but the ride is for dedicated corner zombies like myself.
I mean, how many tires have "AA" for a Traction rating?
So the all-season Michelins are probably the best ticket for the sane LS driver.
Say your prayers with the 255's. Better be 255/40/17 if you even attempt it. And a 40 series would keep the speedometer error to a minimum. Also, even a 245 is on the edge of acceptability given the limited width of the stock LS Sport wheels. A 255 would probably have accelerated wear on the outside edges of the tread. If it fits.
As for tires (or do you spell it tyres?), I went with Yokohama AVS dB in 245/45/17. They were good tires for about 10K miles. Now (after 20K) they are marginal. I wouldn't buy them again and am seriously looking at Falkens. I have NO clearance problems. I may try 255/45s next, depending on the outcome of an autocross in Phoenix tomorrow.
My '00 V8 Sport will be two years old next week and has 59k miles, so I'm in your ballpark. My commute is 450 miles/wk on rural two lane highways, a few stops and lots of passing (heh,heh) and I get 23.5-24 mpg, about 2 mpg less during winter months due to the gas we get in Colo. At a steady 80-85 on the interstate it will get 26+, I've seen 27 a couple times. In general there doesn't seem to be much difference between V8 & V6 mileage.
I've had one rear window regulator fail, and one burned out light bulb. As yet there are no rattles, squeaks, or air noises. This car has been a gem. slunar is right, and I'll go a little further. Get on a wide open stretch in ideal conditions and decide to have some fun, run it up to 120 or more for a little while. It's so smooth and solid it's almost a non-event, feels like a normal cruise. Then when you slow back down to 80 it feels like the bad old days of the "double nickel."
A year ago LLSOC had a get-together in Dearborn, and I drove home to Greeley, Colo. in one shot, 1250 miles. The car was still fun to drive the next day. Other cars have seats that may feel more comfortable when you first get in; these are the real deal. I'm no kid (47) and thought I had outgrown driving extremely long stretches till I bought the LS. This car is like a slow luxury business jet. If it had a bigger gas tank it would need a rest room.:)