True, and the only thing I will probably use the back seat for will involve moving the front seats up allllllllll the way and folded forward on a late night.
I don't really care how big the backseat is for other people in my car, afterall I made the compromises based on what I want for myself. Having a family is not going to occur to me for probably 10 years. Having some friends complain about the size of the backseat will absolutely not influence my car purchase. I bought the car to go fast, handle, have luxury amenities, and look sexy going fast.
Well said... compact sedan means just that *compact*. If you want a sedan you can stretch out in the back seat, buy a family sedan. I don't see that many people comfortably sitting in the back seats of 3-series. The cars in this segment are meant for drivers not passengers, right
Sure, a roomy back seat is not the end all and be all, but it is definitely a plus. To many people, having a usable back seat matters, even in this class.
Sure, a roomy back seat is not the end all and be all, but it is definitely a plus. To many people, having a usable back seat matters, even in this class.
One of the reasons (among many others) the 1st gen IS did not sell well was because its back seat was virtually unusable for the average American.
And just how much room does this "average American" need in the back seat? They're not playing basketball, they are sitting in a car.
I have an Audi A4 and can say it comfortably seats 4 adults. I've driven in the current IS and haven't found the back seats to be small. Again we're talking about 4 average size adults on occation, not 5 250lb. football players.
I have an Audi A4 and can say it comfortably seats 4 adults.
No it doesn't. It's insanely uncomfortable. I was literally in pain riding in the back of an A4. No toe room, the seat is low and you have to splay your knees. BTW, I'm only 5-7 and 145 lbs.
I've driven in the current IS and haven't found the back seats to be small. Again we're talking about 4 average size adults on occation, not 5 250lb. football players.
Again, I'd say otherwise. I'm small and really uncomfortable back there. A normal american male - 5-9, 5-10 and what 170 lbs must be in hell in the back of any of these cars.
I doubt anyone will be able to sit behind my seat without my seatback being bolt upright. I don't drive like that so that makes this a 3 person car in my case.
How many adults can a 325/330ci accommodate comfortably ? I'd say 2. How many adults can an Audi A4 accommodate, I'd say 4. I've sat back there and it can seat 2 adults of fair height and size. I tried to sit in the back seat of the new GS, and it is tight back there, so I won't be expecting any more back seat room for the even smaller IS.
The demographics for the IS are young, urban, mostly single 20-somethings. They won't be needing to carry 4 adults *most* of the time.... The current demographics for the IS is 29, and represent the youngest lux car owners, bar none, in the NA market. I'd expect the age bar to fall even more with an IS350, which should be a blast to drive.
You are correct. Both the current IS and the A4 have excessively small and remarkably uncomfortable back seats. While it may be true that most of the time this issue is irrelevant and the front seats are "where it's at," everyone on occasion will carry an additional 1 or 2 passengers and then the functionality of the back seat will be an issue.
If the back seat in the new IS is too small, it will definitely hurt sales. Mine, for one.
It's true that the demographics for the current IS is 29. They expect the demographics of the new IS to rise to 37 (or something like that).
I guess you gotta pay a premium to get a usable backseat in a RWD Lexus. When you think about it, a loaded IS350 will have the exact same features as a loaded GS300, but the GS300 will probably be $6000 more, equipped the same. What do you get for that $6000 other than more room?
How many adults can a 325/330ci accommodate comfortably ? I'd say 2. How many adults can an Audi A4 accommodate, I'd say 4.
2 for all the cars but the TL and G35.
The demographics for the IS are young, urban, mostly single 20-somethings. They won't be needing to carry 4 adults *most* of the time.... The current demographics for the IS is 29, and represent the youngest lux car owners, bar none, in the NA market. I'd expect the age bar to fall even more with an IS350, which should be a blast to drive.
I already said backseat is not relevant to me. Flipside, I'm not gonna misrepresent the roominess of a car. A4's a tight car in FRONT. The backseat's a nightmare.
from what we've seen in the stats, the IS looks just as miserable as its comp. I can't see the 35-45k IS350 going to many under 30 year old drivers. The IS250 is pretty much aimed right at that 18-34 year old demographic. We'll see...
IMHO, the Altezza was big with kids because of it's boy racerish looks, easy tunability (over 1000 hp on that engine was possible), badge and low price (a loaded one with an msrp of 35k could be picked up easily for 30-31k). It was rich kids civic.
guess you gotta pay a premium to get a usable backseat in a RWD Lexus. When you think about it, a loaded IS350 will have the exact same features as a loaded GS300, but the GS300 will probably be $6000 more, equipped the same. What do you get for that $6000 other than more room?
I bet it is going to have the smallest back seat in the class. Appropriate for Japan and parts of Europe, but not North America. I can't believe that the 350 wil be sold to anyone less than 30, based on cost alone. 250 is more realistic, though amazing to me that young people can afford even this car.
Yup, all those packages leave out essentials like moon roof, Levinson... Add them to the basic luxury package (choose one) and....voila...MB prices. The packaging of options sucks.
give me leather, tunes, roof and HIDs, and I am on my way. All the rest is superfluous. Try to get these in a package without buying 2 or 3 packages. Oh, I almost forgot the turbo diesel the Euros get....
Hello all, I am new to forums so bear with me while I spin my wheels. I just read an article that said that a high-performance exhaust system will be offered as an accessory for the IS350 as well as the much dreaded Vehicle Dynamics Integrated Management (VDIM) system being optional on IS 350. Louder engine and no nanny!!! Now you're talking..if it holds up.
Has anyone heard or read this anywhere else or am I reading outdated material. I make it a point to do a daily web scan for all recent news of the upcoming Lexus IS350 and have pretty much come to the conclusion that I will not trade in my IS300 for an IS350 that does not have a manual gearbox, plus I would slap myself if I bought one this year only to find out that 2007 models add convertibles and coupe options to the lineup.
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MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
Breakwater Blue seems to be one of many silver/gray colors -- go to www.thenewis.com, select "tour" and then "style" -- change the color of the standard front quarter image of the car by clicking on the applicable colors.
why is it MY2006 instead of 2007? BMW released their 3 series in march as an 06 model. Why doesnt Lexus do the same and make it MY07 instead?? Wouldnt that help the residual value also?
There are rules.. If they designate it as an '07 model, it must be available for sale at some point during '07... and I don't think they can bring it out until at least January 2nd, 2006...
So, if they came out with an '07 model this Fall, they would have to delay an '08 model until after January 1st, 07.... instead of bringing out the '08 next Fall..
They would be screwed, either way.. Why would you want to make it even more confusing than it is already?
Lexus did the same thing with the '01 IS300... It came out in April of '00....
nice to know. thanks so based wut i've read from this forum, a fairly loaded IS350 would cost about $40k-41K??? is that rite? considering it starts around $35k plus few options will probably bring it up to about $38k + tax and fees= $42K???
$42K will buy you a fairly well loaded IS350. The price will start around $36K for a base IS350, but don't expect to see any for that price. The real models you'll find on dealer lots (assuming you can find any IS350 on a dealer lot), would be around the $40K mark, with a bunch of stuff some may not want. Most, if not all IS350 will have a *base* starting with the Premium package and go up from there.
BTW, the options list include two different staggered 18" wheels, high performance exhaust system, and body moulding/kit and spoiler... yummmm ! And check out the 52/48 balance and gearing on the new IS.... Promises to be a true entry-lux sport sedan....
High performance exhaust? body kit? wow I had not heard that before, can you post a link to where you read that? Any pics of how it looks with the body kit? or pics of the 2 different 18' wheels as well?
I'm considering an Acura TL, BMW, or this new Lexus IS. I'm reading a lot on this forum about horsepower and acceleration times, but no mention at all of fuel economy. As prices next year approach the $4 per gallon mark in the U.S., I would think fuel economy would at least be a consideration.
I would like a four door sporty car with good styling and power (under 7.5 sec 0-60) with AWD and at least 20 mpg city and 30 highway (minimum).
So which of the above mentioned cars fits the criteria best? I know the Acura TL has 270 HP and a 0-60 time of 6.3 or so AND gets about 20 city and 28 highway, but it doesn't come with AWD.
If Acura can make a car with 270 HP and a 0-60 time of 6.3 and still get close to 30 mpg on the highway, then I'm sure Lexus with their 205 HP engine can can get at least a 7.3 sec 0-60 and OVER 30 mpg. You'd think?
I have 05 TL and it gets amazing hiway mpg. City is HP consumer but at 70 mph 1900 rpm I get consistently 32 mpg. Yesterday on 100 mile trip steady 65 I got 37 with the ac on and tail wind. Same trip with head wind was the stated 32.
Anyhow, my 04 got 32 avg on a 1200 mile trip MD on I 70 from OK. Not bad at all considering those gas sucking SUVS.
I experiment with my 25 mile hiway commute in the AM and make sport of going 60 mph and have gotten 35 mpg over a week. But hard to drive that way but nice to know you can use the smooth HP when needed.
IF acura added VCM man who would need an accord hybrid that costs almost the same with no sunroof!!
No offense to TL owners but I would either get a BMW or the IS350 AWD. First of all the TL doesnt come with AWD like you wanted. I just think that it's kinda old now- been out couple of years already. I also know that it's noisier than the BM and LExus cars. As for reliability it's better than BM- dunno about Lexus. I just think that if you're gonna spend money on a NEW car, why not buy a new one with new style? Oh and the TL has more room and comes standard with pretty much everything you need. All three are good cars- and the mileage you get depends on the way you drive. Just some thoughts...
IF acura added VCM man who would need an accord hybrid that costs almost the same with no sunroof!! It won't be long - I think both the Accord and MDX are getting VCM for 06. Most Honda V6s will have VCM with a year or two.
While the standard IS250 will have cloth and no moonroof (making it the one of the least contented cars in its class in base trim) I have a feeling you won't find such a car on dealer lots. I wonder how many special orders for such a car will be out there..... :confuse:
i just re-read the IS350 full-test and noticed something strange about it. THey say that the VDIM hampers the IS's chance against the BMW3. Why would anyone complain about that though? Doesnt the 3 have DSC and DTC?? I thought that it's pretty much the same as VDIM?? IF this is true then why the **** did they say that about the IS?? Though im not a Lexus owner- i just hate biased opinions!
Nothing bias in that. In the 3 series e46 and e90 you can disable the nannies. Not so in Lexus' cars. They're permanently on. Many us choose to drive our cars with these nannies turned off. Can't be done in Lexus,
ricwhite: Where do you live that you fee you "need" AWD? A RWD BMW or Lexus with a set of dedicated winter tires and wheels and all of the electronic nannies are all you need to get you through the winter season. AWD just helps you get started. In winter emergency conditions such as braking and swerving manuvers, the AWD system's extra weight will hamper you car's performance in these aspects. The AWD's extra weight and power routing will get you worse fuel economy during the Spring, SUmmer, And Fall. AWD's extra weight will also make the car's Performance sub par compared to its RWD counterparts.
The TL is a nice car. Very comfortable on the highway. 270hp is way too much to be driving the front wheels. My best friend's wife has an '05 TL (he says the torque steer is unbeable) he's driving an '03 325iA with Sport Package (his sister's car that he's using up the lease miles on). He says the BMW is the most fun car he's ever driven and considered buying out the lease.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Where they need electronic nannies ans complain about torque steer. If you know the front wheels can only take so much power in the corners, get out of the pedal. It's that simple. It's the same with the stability control and traction control. How did people ever get by on the road with them.
I know how to modulate the throttle to avoid wheelspin. You'd think the same could be done for torque steer. I mean how often do you need full throttle in a car with 270 hp?
It's like the people complaining about the power in the IS250. Look at the competition...The TSX has 200hp and FWD. Acura like it's market performance. The C-class has less than 210hp in it's little 2.5L V6. Have you seen those prices? Audi has a turbo 4 with 200hp...that still has to push an AWD system too. Looks like Lexus is doing just fine with the IS power and even if the prices stay the same as the outgoing model, it'll be cheaper than many.
I can see where someone would rather have the TL over the IS. Especially if they drive like a sane person. Since most of my driving is on the interstate, 270 hp is just fine through the front wheels. Especially in a $32K fully loaded entry-lux car that has been known to top 30mpg.
Not much chance of VDIM geting in my way when the interstate is pretty much straight in the Southeast where I live.
That being said...That new Civic SI looks nice. Considering you can't get much in the back seat of the IS anyway, might as well buy the lighter, faster, cheaper, more efficient car and get a 65" plasma screen with the savings. I mean if performance is such a priority.
to do the Lexus driving event on 9/18 at 9AM on Long Island. I'm definitely excited about getting to drive a new IS. I hope it sells better than the new GS. While I don't know the sales numbers, I see not too many new GS on the road where I live (NYC suburb). The few that I have seen have ALL been GS300 AWDs.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Performance, handling, power and luxury. Why is it all of you leave that last bit off? The whole package is the desire. A civic is not the whole package.
Sales of the GS are doing quite well - nipping at the heels of the two leaders: 5 series and E class.
The reason for all those AWD models is Lexus' campaign of pushing what it thinks customers want in certain regions. The number of special orders is miniscule so you have to buy what Lexus has on the lot. That will also be the case with the IS - it doesn't matter what you want - you have to take what's available.
It's like the people complaining about the power in the IS250. Look at the competition...The TSX has 200hp and FWD. Acura like it's market performance. The C-class has less than 210hp in it's little 2.5L V6. Have you seen those prices? Audi has a turbo 4 with 200hp...that still has to push an AWD system too. Looks like Lexus is doing just fine with the IS power and even if the prices stay the same as the outgoing model, it'll be cheaper than many.
This is truth personified. We need to frame this paragraph and throw it in the face of any IS detractors who claims the IS250 is underpowered. The I-4 int he TSX is so buzzy that you can't really feel the 200HP until you get to much higher rpm. The e46 325i had less than 200HP, do I hear any complaints about it being underpowered for its price ? For many, an IS250/6MT would be plenty of car, if priced right. The key, as I see it, is the pricing. If Lexus gets it right, the IS will be a resounding success. Everything we've read so far says it will be a success.
$12k is a lot to pay for a little more luxury and a couple extra doors. Unless you really really just want an IS. And if you really just want an IS, then quit complaining about the price, performance, or handling. Since if it was the tops at everything, it'd be priced like a....Beemer.
Please stop bringing up BMW every time I make a comment about the IS2350/350. There's a board for that.
A little more luxury? Have you been in an economy car and then immediately hopped into a sport sedan? The last gen civic (can't speak of the upcoming one), was a tin trap with flimsy doors, plastics, crap ergonomics, no engine power, zero insulation and in general didn't even feel as nice as the 88 civic si my best friend had in high school.
There's no comparing an economy car's feel to an entry level lux car. If you don't see the difference, then by all means go for it.
Comments
I don't really care how big the backseat is for other people in my car, afterall I made the compromises based on what I want for myself. Having a family is not going to occur to me for probably 10 years. Having some friends complain about the size of the backseat will absolutely not influence my car purchase. I bought the car to go fast, handle, have luxury amenities, and look sexy going fast.
Disclaimer: The IS is not a family sedan
One of the reasons (among many others) the 1st gen IS did not sell well was because its back seat was virtually unusable for the average American.
I have an Audi A4 and can say it comfortably seats 4 adults. I've driven in the current IS and haven't found the back seats to be small. Again we're talking about 4 average size adults on occation, not 5 250lb. football players.
No it doesn't. It's insanely uncomfortable. I was literally in pain riding in the back of an A4. No toe room, the seat is low and you have to splay your knees. BTW, I'm only 5-7 and 145 lbs.
I've driven in the current IS and haven't found the back seats to be small. Again we're talking about 4 average size adults on occation, not 5 250lb. football players.
Again, I'd say otherwise. I'm small and really uncomfortable back there. A normal american male - 5-9, 5-10 and what 170 lbs must be in hell in the back of any of these cars.
The demographics for the IS are young, urban, mostly single 20-somethings. They won't be needing to carry 4 adults *most* of the time.... The current demographics for the IS is 29, and represent the youngest lux car owners, bar none, in the NA market. I'd expect the age bar to fall even more with an IS350, which should be a blast to drive.
If the back seat in the new IS is too small, it will definitely hurt sales. Mine, for one.
I guess you gotta pay a premium to get a usable backseat in a RWD Lexus. When you think about it, a loaded IS350 will have the exact same features as a loaded GS300, but the GS300 will probably be $6000 more, equipped the same. What do you get for that $6000 other than more room?
2 for all the cars but the TL and G35.
The demographics for the IS are young, urban, mostly single 20-somethings. They won't be needing to carry 4 adults *most* of the time.... The current demographics for the IS is 29, and represent the youngest lux car owners, bar none, in the NA market. I'd expect the age bar to fall even more with an IS350, which should be a blast to drive.
I already said backseat is not relevant to me. Flipside, I'm not gonna misrepresent the roominess of a car. A4's a tight car in FRONT. The backseat's a nightmare.
from what we've seen in the stats, the IS looks just as miserable as its comp. I can't see the 35-45k IS350 going to many under 30 year old drivers. The IS250 is pretty much aimed right at that 18-34 year old demographic. We'll see...
IMHO, the Altezza was big with kids because of it's boy racerish looks, easy tunability (over 1000 hp on that engine was possible), badge and low price (a loaded one with an msrp of 35k could be picked up easily for 30-31k). It was rich kids civic.
You also get a smaller engine
Yup, all those packages leave out essentials like moon roof, Levinson... Add them to the basic luxury package (choose one) and....voila...MB prices. The packaging of options sucks.
give me leather, tunes, roof and HIDs, and I am on my way. All the rest is superfluous. Try to get these in a package without buying 2 or 3 packages. Oh, I almost forgot the turbo diesel the Euros get....
Has anyone heard or read this anywhere else or am I reading outdated material. I make it a point to do a daily web scan for all recent news of the upcoming Lexus IS350 and have pretty much come to the conclusion that I will not trade in my IS300 for an IS350 that does not have a manual gearbox, plus I would slap myself if I bought one this year only to find out that 2007 models add convertibles and coupe options to the lineup.
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kirstie_h
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Not much exciting in their color pallet.
So, if they came out with an '07 model this Fall, they would have to delay an '08 model until after January 1st, 07.... instead of bringing out the '08 next Fall..
They would be screwed, either way.. Why would you want to make it even more confusing than it is already?
Lexus did the same thing with the '01 IS300... It came out in April of '00....
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BTW, the options list include two different staggered 18" wheels, high performance exhaust system, and body moulding/kit and spoiler... yummmm ! And check out the 52/48 balance and gearing on the new IS.... Promises to be a true entry-lux sport sedan....
I would like a four door sporty car with good styling and power (under 7.5 sec 0-60) with AWD and at least 20 mpg city and 30 highway (minimum).
So which of the above mentioned cars fits the criteria best? I know the Acura TL has 270 HP and a 0-60 time of 6.3 or so AND gets about 20 city and 28 highway, but it doesn't come with AWD.
If Acura can make a car with 270 HP and a 0-60 time of 6.3 and still get close to 30 mpg on the highway, then I'm sure Lexus with their 205 HP engine can can get at least a 7.3 sec 0-60 and OVER 30 mpg. You'd think?
The performance specs are:
Not quite the numbers you are looking for.
Anyhow, my 04 got 32 avg on a 1200 mile trip MD on I 70 from OK. Not bad at all considering those gas sucking SUVS.
I experiment with my 25 mile hiway commute in the AM and make sport of going 60 mph and have gotten 35 mpg over a week. But hard to drive that way but nice to know you can use the smooth HP when needed.
IF acura added VCM man who would need an accord hybrid that costs almost the same with no sunroof!!
It won't be long - I think both the Accord and MDX are getting VCM for 06. Most Honda V6s will have VCM with a year or two.
While the standard IS250 will have cloth and no moonroof (making it the one of the least contented cars in its class in base trim) I have a feeling you won't find such a car on dealer lots. I wonder how many special orders for such a car will be out there..... :confuse:
Source: CL
Hope this helps
The TL is a nice car. Very comfortable on the highway. 270hp is way too much to be driving the front wheels. My best friend's wife has an '05 TL (he says the torque steer is unbeable) he's driving an '03 325iA with Sport Package (his sister's car that he's using up the lease miles on). He says the BMW is the most fun car he's ever driven and considered buying out the lease.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
I know how to modulate the throttle to avoid wheelspin. You'd think the same could be done for torque steer. I mean how often do you need full throttle in a car with 270 hp?
It's like the people complaining about the power in the IS250. Look at the competition...The TSX has 200hp and FWD. Acura like it's market performance. The C-class has less than 210hp in it's little 2.5L V6. Have you seen those prices? Audi has a turbo 4 with 200hp...that still has to push an AWD system too. Looks like Lexus is doing just fine with the IS power and even if the prices stay the same as the outgoing model, it'll be cheaper than many.
I can see where someone would rather have the TL over the IS. Especially if they drive like a sane person. Since most of my driving is on the interstate, 270 hp is just fine through the front wheels. Especially in a $32K fully loaded entry-lux car that has been known to top 30mpg.
Not much chance of VDIM geting in my way when the interstate is pretty much straight in the Southeast where I live.
That being said...That new Civic SI looks nice. Considering you can't get much in the back seat of the IS anyway, might as well buy the lighter, faster, cheaper, more efficient car and get a 65" plasma screen with the savings. I mean if performance is such a priority.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
It's not edmunds' fault that lexus is too shortsighted to allow drivers to turn off worthless nanny devices.
The reason for all those AWD models is Lexus' campaign of pushing what it thinks customers want in certain regions. The number of special orders is miniscule so you have to buy what Lexus has on the lot. That will also be the case with the IS - it doesn't matter what you want - you have to take what's available.
This is truth personified. We need to frame this paragraph and throw it in the face of any IS detractors who claims the IS250 is underpowered. The I-4 int he TSX is so buzzy that you can't really feel the 200HP until you get to much higher rpm. The e46 325i had less than 200HP, do I hear any complaints about it being underpowered for its price ? For many, an IS250/6MT would be plenty of car, if priced right. The key, as I see it, is the pricing. If Lexus gets it right, the IS will be a resounding success. Everything we've read so far says it will be a success.
A little more luxury? Have you been in an economy car and then immediately hopped into a sport sedan? The last gen civic (can't speak of the upcoming one), was a tin trap with flimsy doors, plastics, crap ergonomics, no engine power, zero insulation and in general didn't even feel as nice as the 88 civic si my best friend had in high school.
There's no comparing an economy car's feel to an entry level lux car. If you don't see the difference, then by all means go for it.