Honda Accord Quality Control Issues

anselmo1

To date, the Honda Accord is the number #1 sedan sold in the United States for 2001. The majority of the Accords are produced in Ohio with a few being exported from Japan. Has the quality control of the Accord gone down hill in the last 3 years since the inception of the 6th generation model? There seems to be various issues debated regarding the quality of workmanship of the I-4 and V-6 Accords produced in the United States. Some of the issues I have been reading at Edmunds.com are transmission problems with the V-6 Accord, balancer shaft seal problems with all Accords, front brake and rotor problems, fuel sending unit problems as well as paint and finish flaws. Is it me or are there more quality problems developing in the US built Accords? There seems to be a host of problems listed on the Maintenance and Repair section of Edmunds. Comments please!

firstname

Well, recently I sold my 99 Accord EX Coupe because it had such an annoying clutch problem. The dealer Service Manager test-drove it and could not disagree, but he could only offer a fix if it finally BROKE DOWN on me (under warranty). It had one of those "intermittent" roughness problems that was especially annoying. I had suspected a clutch plate improperly mounted. It drove like the mounting bolt heads were grinding against the clutch plate material.

Anyway, my biggest complaint about Honda's is that they never mastered the transmission -- automatic or manual.

dc_sports_rule

Honda has slipped a lot quality wise. All you have to do is look at this board that lists all the problems with Honda products. I can no longer name any car manufacturer that has an outstanding automobile.

isellhondas

Forget the fact (if you can) that I sell Hondas.

The "problems" mentioned here have been greatly overblown.

Any car can and will have an ocassional problem. Since Hondas are so reliable, when something DOES happen it gets front page news.

They are better than ever!

anselmo1

I would say that Honda's reliability has fallen off dramatically since the inception of the V-6 Accord in 1998 in its 6th Generation model. NHSTA has a listing of all the transmission problems in the V-6 Accord. A bad supplier was blamed for the initial problem but why are the problems continuing?Since you sell Hondas, your bias is quite evident. Don't get me wrong, I own a 5th Generation Accord which I like a lot.Let's just say, that Hondas of today are not like Hondas back 5 to 6 years ago.

carguy62

In the recent JD Powers survey the Acura TL was near the top on the list with 76 defects. The Accord had 109 and the Acura CL 152. Why would there be such a difference? All three are made at the same factory with many shared mechanicals. Do they put away the quality checks when the Accord (though 109 is still pretty good) and the CL are being built? Someone once mentioned stricter quality for Acura, so how does that explain the CL having twice the defects of the TL?

FWIW my own experience with an '89 Accord has been quite satisfying. It was built in Japan. For the short time I had an Ohio made '01 Accord there weren't any major initial issues. I have to agree with Isell, I think Honda has such a good reputation that anything bad is magnified.

lancerfixer

Not to be too nitpicky, but a V-6 Accord has been available since '95.

anselmo1

I was talking about the 6th Generation Accords (!998-2001) in particular regarding the problems. I am aware that the first V-6 Accord was produced in 1995. Strange that it did not have the same type of transmission problems as the 6th generation Accord V-6's? What could be so different?

lancerfixer

I dunno. I drive manual trannies exclusively. :-)

isellhondas

First I ever heard of this was right here, in Town Hall. I'll repeat, this was very much overblown.

A supplier, unbeknownst to Honda decided to change specs on some part in the V-6 transmissions. This would cause a loud "clunk" while backing up. It did not cause total failure.

Honda was blindslided by this.

And, few cars were affected. To this day, I have NEVER heard this clunk and I've backed up literally hundreds of them.

The problem cars were fixed under warranty, case closed.

If anselmo wants to think Hondas aren't as good as before, I'll respect his opinion even though I totally disagree.

anselmo1

It just wasn't a few units on the V-6 transmission. I know for a fact that one man has had his replaced on his 1998 Accord V-6 as well as his 2001 Accord V-6. The problem with V-6 transmissions is continuous. The Honda-Acura. Net board has numerous postings regarding this problem. http://www.Honda-Acura.net Thank you for respecting my opinion but it is an ongoing problem along with the fuel sending unit and balancer shaft seal defects just to name a few examples.

pblevine

I sort of have to agree with isellhondas on this one. I've seen the complaints on Honda-Acura.Net and they are real. But they are rare. I've got a '98 Accord Coupe (EX V6) and have not had that problem. The only problem I've had concerned the Fuel Sending Unit. It worked but just was not accurate. But Honda replaced on a recall and it has been fine since then. Anyway, most of these problems have been rare, but it does seem that as time goes on, more and more such problems are being reported. Could it be that quality has been going downhill since '98?

isellhondas

All cars will have problems. Hondas have so few that when something does go wrong people, like yourself, tend to make a BIG deal over it.

I'm not trying to make light of this, but, let's think about it.

Fuel sending problems...well, big deal! Fixed under warranty. Another problems I've only heard about in these forums.

Balancer shaft seal? Yep, honda discovered that this seal *can* fail (it rarely does) on I think 1994-1997 Accords so on their own, they offer an update seal kit at NO CHARGE to the owners of these cars.

Problems....? Yeah, you bet!

Find something with fewer problems!

isellhondas

It's true. Misery DOES love company. I've watched these posts talking about things like gas guage problems and I see the responses...

" Gee...now that you mention it, I think my gas guage may be off too" or " I better go back up 50 times to see if I have that terrible clunk"

Just human nature I guess...

anselmo1

Your right, it seems there is a lot of misery with 6th Generation V-6 Accords. As far as the balancer shaft seal blowing, it is a major design flaw that took numerous complaints to NHSTA to resolve by Honda. Your V-6 automatic transmission will be next. The fuel sending unit has puzzled Honda engineers for 6 years now as well as their supplier. Don't get me wrong, I own an Accord but I think the 6th Generation Accords have far many more problems than any previous generation.

isellhondas

Yep. all of these "problems" that some folks seem to delight in telling and retelling...

The gas guage one is the one that puzzles me the most. I have NEVER heard of this except for right here, in these forums.

A "lot of misery" ? Amazing!

dc_sports_rule

I have had my fuel sending unit replaced twice on my Accord. Maybe you should confer with your service manager at your dealership isellhondas. He can probably fill you in on a lot of problems that as salesman you are unaware of.

phelpsg

I bought my 1st Accord about a month ago because of the reputation for quality. I've always owned GM so I thought this would be a step up. It's still too early to say it's not, but my Accord has a wind noise that's been driving me crazy at highway speeds. I found out that there is a TSB about the problem which apparently is due to a faulty windshield seal so it's going back to the dealer for repair. This seems like a basic quality control issue if you ask me.

isellhondas

Oh, I'm sure the fuel guage problems exist. It's just that I'll usually hear it when problems pop up and this is one that's news to me.

Somehow, I don't think it's that widespread. Of course when it hits home, it's a REAL problem!

anselmo1

Everyone knows about Accord's fuel sending unit problems isellhondas. As a salesman, I guess I wouldn't tell my customers that Honda Accord's have fuel sending unit problems while trying to close on a sale. The Balancer Shaft Seal is a major problem as well as dangerous.You watch the little oil light on your dash keep blinking and blinking and whamo, in the matter of no time you have a seized engine. This problem is well documented at the NHSTA's website. Maybe sometime you should pay a visit there and note all the Accord problems.

fritz1224

I too have the funny gas gauge. After 30 miles 3/4 tank. 140 miles 1/2 tank. Then normal. Got the extended Honda warranty for 925, bumper to bumper, not worried, for now. Still, IMHO, Honda ain't all that.

lugwrench

Blew my balancer shaft seal on my 1996 Accord while on vacation in Myrtle Beach, SC back in March. My Accord had only 32K on the odometer. Financially speaking it was a nightmare. Had to have the car towed to the dealership where it sat over the entire weekend and two extra days. Tried to charge me over $700.00 since my car was out of warranty. Remembered reading about the problem at Edmunds and informed the dealership. After a few phone calls, Honda covered the cost of the repair but it ruined my vacation. Had to rent a car etc. Found out later that this repair happens often. Never thought this would ever happen with a Honda.

teo

Was your '96 Accord a V6 model?

lugwrench

My 1996 Accord is a 4 cylinder.

isellhondas

Sorry, but not "everyone" knows about Honda's fuel sending unit problem. I don't give a rip whether you believe this or not, BUT, prior to reading some comments in these forums, I had NEVER heard of this. Guess the problem can't be all that bad. This is why cars come with a warranty.

The balancer shaft seal failures are also very isolated. The vast majority of owners never had a problem with this.

Still, Honda is doing a product update for the affected models at no charge.

No car is perfect, anselmo and I would challenge you to come up with the name of a more reliable car than Honda.

I just have to wonder why you continue to rehash all of these "problems"?

lugwrench

The problems presented regarding the fuel sending units and the balancer shaft seals are not isolated and are an ongoing problem at Honda America. These problems have been rehashed in Edmunds to alert Accord owners of potential problems. Heck if I didn't read it here about the blown balancer shaft seal problem, I would have been out over $700.00. As far as the V-6 transmission problem in the new Accords, I have read in other forums that this is happening a lot more than you seem to realize. I guess you would have to go to the JD Powers survey to find the most reliable car. I am pretty sure that Lexus or Acura is at the top of the list and Honda is somewhere in the middle of the top ten. Everyone should be able to voice their problems regarding Honda Accords at this forum. I guess that this is the reason they are on Part 2 now!

anselmo1

The balancer shaft seal problem, V-6 Accord transmission problem and the fuel sending unit problems are well document isellhondas. I guess selling Hondas makes you blind to the many problems found lately in Honda Accords. I would suggest you go take a visit to the NHSTA website and view the long list of complaints yourself. Frequent would be a much better word than isolated describing the above three problems. By the way, the Honda Accord is not the most reliable car in any report that I have seen. Consumer Reports as well as the JD Powers survey does not list the Accord as the most reliable car sold in America. Honda's quality control is just slipping as compared to the late 80's and early 90's.There is no denying any of those facts.

dc_sports_rule

The problems seem to be more frequent in the 5th and 6th generation Accord than in the previous generations. I can understand why isellhondas wants to make these recurrent problems look isolated. He sells Hondas and doesn't want to believe there are problems. Unfortunately, these problems and defects are hurting the once stellar standing that the Honda Accord once had! As far as finding the perfect car, maybe the old Model T Ford was that vehicle?

isellhondas

To argue here. Since I do happen to sell Hondas, I realize that few people here will believe me.

I still contend, however, that given the hundreds of thousands of Accords produced that these problems are few and far between.

Naturally, in these forums any problem is magnified as it is discussed over and over again as others chime in with stories of their own.

As problems arise, Honda always does a great job of taking care of their customers under warranty.

So, has quality slipped? In my opinion, not at all but I'm sure others would disagree.

Discussing these issues is what a Town Hall forum is all about, isn't it?

teo

A car salesman admitting problems with the products he sells. "Defects" and "Problems" are not two words found on a sales person's vocabulary.

Isellhondas::: I respect much your views and insights in the business of selling cars, but to be so 'stubborn'and not to accept the fact that even Hondas (specially models of late) are not as perfect as you would like others to believe, is quite frankly, a little bit overboard and erodes your credibility.

Having owned several Honda/Acura products since 1989 all I can say is that the quality level of the current Honda/Acura breathen has deteriorated considerably and this applies to the great majority of models assambled in North America. My sister has a '99 Honda Accord LX Auto (Her third Accord car)and she has been having chronic problems with the front brakes in terms of premature pad wear and rotor warping. However, the service received from her dealer has been very good so far.

My best Honda products were the 1989, 1990 and 1994 Honda Accords. The 1995 Acura Integra LS sedan was another excellent car. The 1997 Acura 2.5TL (Assambled in Japan) had many little nagging problems beginning at 4K miles.

Places such as Edmunds do serve a great purpose to keep consumers informed and up to date with the issues, please let's not bully them.

isellhondas

I don't think I've ever said Hondas were perfect. No car is. I've only stated my personal experience gain from six years of selling them.

I spend quite a bit of time in the shop and hear a lot from the technicians. The sky is NOT falling! I'll repeat these problems are NOT frequent but are pretty isolated. Naturally if YOUR car is affected then it becomes a major issue. I understand that.

You call me stubborn in my attempts to explain things....perhaps. Remember, I have nothing to gain here. I'm not here to sell cars and the "regulars" know that.

The best example is the fuel guage problem. Never heard of it except here where it seems to be a MAJOR issue.

I'm only trying to share my perspective as I see things. Sorry you see that as "bullying" people.

And...sorry to say this, but I strongly suspect your sister (or another driver?) is extremely hard on her brakes. Again, this is very uncommon.

Just traded our 98 Accord LX (same brakes) with 52,000 miles. Original pads measured 4 mm. they come with 9-10mm new. Lots of traffic and hills in Seattle too.

lugwrench

To bad you were not a salesman at our local Honda dealer. The mechanics would be talking your ear off when they found time. They are constantly working on blown balancer shaft seals, installing new fuel sending units, replacing SRS modules, trying to correct rattles in moon roofs as well as dash boards, and trying to get air conditioning units cooling to specifications. This is in addition to replacing V-6 automatic transmissions in 6th Generation Accords.It's tough to even get an appointment for an oil change and car inspection. Let's just say the Honda techs are constantly busy.

lugwrench

Also resurfacing warped rotors. When I do go in for service, at least I get a free car wash. Poor guy is always backed up washing repaired vehicles.

suvdreamer2

It seems that everyone in this forum is moaning about a few RARE problems. Remember, they are cars and how some things preform are a direct result of their drivers-- especially pads, rotors etc
I have both a 88 Accord LX and 2001 Accord EX, can they have problems ... sure .. but much less than other cars I even considered VW, GM-Pontiac-Saturn, toyota... to name a few
1. Take it to a good dealer or mechanic
2. Drive it correctly
3. Be happy its an excellent quality automobile!!!

isellhondas

And if you go to a hospital you'll see a lot of sick people.

I can think of a lot of other brands where you'll see a heck of a lot more cars being fixed!

Try a domestic or VW dealer sometime!

Funny...I never managed to warp my rotors. The original pads will probably go another 30,000 miles provided a non abusive driver buys it.

dc_sports_rule

Simply put, it has slipped. Sure the Accord is better than a Chevy Malibu or a Dodge Stratus. The big question is, is it better than the Toyota Camry or Nissan Maxima quality wise? I would definitely have to say no to the current Accord. The Accord at one time was the benchmark in the industry but it is no more. Quality wise, the best car Honda builds is the S-2000 roadster. The Honda Accord just doesn't have the same quality standards it once had.

teo

"Try a domestic or a VW"

Don't try to portrait current Honda products as the ultimate and glorified quality benchmark...

fast foward to 2001...domestics are no longer the junk of the Disco era and VW has also move forward in this regard.

Of course you will never admit that in the open.

After reading some of the entries made in the Honda Oddyssey, Honda Accord and Honda Civic boards, further substantiate that Honda's have lost the edge for quality they once enjoyed. Honda is still a small company by comparison with a very small product line also by comparison...they can't afford to cut corners if they want to remain soverign and independent from future take overs.

Some domestics are very, very close to the quality indexes of current bread and butter Honda offerings...Honda lives off of a reputation gained and lost long ago.....

isellhondas

You've been around these forums for a long time now. You have always taken a very adverse position against Hondas and do your best to share anything negative.

I'm not sure of the reason for this, but I think the newer people here need to know this.

And, I'll admit it, I'm a bit (or more than a bit) defensive about a product that I own, sell, and believe in.

We should probably leave it at that.

No one car will please everybody and people should buy what suits them.

Has quality slipped? Honestly, I don't believe so but I do know that it's the buyer's PERCEPTION that really matters.

Honda will have to continue to build a great, reliable product or they will suffer the results.

fritz1224

I don't know about previous generations of honda, because my first one was a 2k lx v6, but there were initial problems of hard starting(replaced ecm and fuel pressure regulator), scratched window(replaced), improper installation of window gasket(repaired), stripped bolts in the air cleaner box(replaced box) and I have the funny acting fuel gauge. Also had to have an alignment done at 15k(techs advised me of the need only after the 12k limit for free alignment had been exceeded).
It's a nice car, but the initial problems have been many and do reflect poorly about quality control, design , suppliers and assembly.
Because of the above, my confidence has been shaken and for peace of mind I have shelled out another large sum of money for the Hondacare extended warranty. Being a Honda no longer means bullet proof, at least in my opinion.

dmac8

I'm in the market for a car and am looking at the Accord. One of my present vehicles is a 1986 Acura Legend, which I've owned from new. It has 150,000 miles and has been remarkable in terms of reliability. My only wish is I'd owned it from the beginning in California and would not have any rust issues.If I could, I'd replace it with the exact same car.

My first choice to replace it would be with the current Acura RL, but that is $44,000. While looking at that car, I also looked at the TL and CL, which are built in the US. IMHO, they are lesser cars, in quality appearance, than the Japanese ones.

Similarly, when I look at the exterior and interior of an Accord, Camry or Impala, I'm not struck by one having any quality advantage over the other. In fact, there are many elements of my 86 Acura that are of much higher quality.

I conduct a fair amount of business in Japan, and one of the common features of their manufacturing is low speed, and often, low volume.

Almost all of the early generation of Japanese cars fit into this category, and their quality levels were very high.

In Southern California, I see lots of 1980 Accord Coupes, like one I had in Chicago, still running around. One of my friends has a 1984 Accord sedan with 220,000 miles on it and this prompted him to buy an 01 Accord. Nice car, but I'm not sure it's content is as good as the 84.

When the Japanese became mass producers in the US, they were shopping the same component manufacturers as everyone else. Obviously, engineering and design play a part in this, and the Japanese, as well as the domestics, have an edge.

My conclusion is that the quality of Japanese namebrands produced in the US has definately slipped from the quality that gained the beachead. At the same time, domestic quality has increased dramatically.

Since expectations are so high for Honda and Toyota, they are subject to criticism on things domestics might get a pass on. But the worst thing for them is to live solely off their reputation.

In the old days, we might buy a domestic car and be thankful if it went 100,000 miles. Now people expect, with reasonable maintenance, that their Accord will go 250,000 miles. Honda has proven this with earlier products.

The question is, can we expect the same from the present generation of vehicles?

lugwrench

I have to agree with dmac8, the mass produced 6th Generation Accords are not up to par with earlier JAPANESE built generations. Anytime you have US parts suppliers involved in mass producing certain parts, you are bound to have problems. The fuel sending unit comes first to my mind. To me, it is almost now to the point if you want to buy an Accord, you hope the Vin number starts with the letter J. J of course stands for Japanese built. When Honda was producing lesser number of autos, their quality control was top notch! Let's face the facts, if you sell Hondas like isellhondas, you will never admit to flaws in the 6th Generation Accord. Honda has cheapened up on a lot of features to make the car competitive on the open market in North American and abroad. In conclusion, Honda has slipped in reliability and in quality of their overall product.

tboner1965

V6 engine (I think that gets rid of balancer shaft seal issues, isn't that a 4cyl problem) and 5 speed. That gets rid of the auto transaxle issues.

HTH

TB

dc_sports_rule

Maybe cut down on production numbers per day and instituting more stringent quality control inspections before final assembly?

isellhondas

Please don't tell the readers here what I will and will not admit to.

Problems...sure! A few like ANY car. The question here relates to a slipping of quality.

I don't believe so, but it's the opinion of the public that really matters.

For the sake of Honda, I hope this isn't the case.

anselmo1

I think the Honda Accord is going the route of the Mercedes Benz. In the early to mid 1990's, Mercedes Benz was considered a very high quality vehicle that would give you minimum problems. The Accord during that same period was considered to be a benchmark in quality.Unfortunately, both manufacturers have slipped since 1998 and their cars have become more problematic.If you ask a salesman at either dealership, they will tell you they build the best cars in the world. I can see their reasoning as they are equating what the Honda or Mercedes reliability precepperception todays market. Let's face, both have slipped quality wise. Maybe it is that they are mass producing cars for the American market and cutting corners? I think this is the primary reason for a decreased level of quality on the production line.Like it or not, the Honda Accord of 2001 isn't of the same quality standards of the Honda Accord of 1992 or 1993 for that matter. It is time to realize that the Accord isn't what it use to be. (Just like the old gray mare).

anselmo1

perception---darn spell check!

lugwrench

Sorry if I offended you isellhondas. As a car salesman I thought you would have thicker skin. It is tough to get a car salesman to admit to anything wrong with the product they sell. This comes to mind with a Yugo salesman I came in contact with back in 1987 at a house party. I kept smiling and telling him "sure they are a great car" to humor him. Honda Accords are good cars today as compared to great cars back in the late 1980's and early 1990's. More problems also seem to be the norm and not the exception.

isellhondas

I totally disagree with you.

You should probably buy something different and better if you can find it.

drobertson1

I have a 2001 LX 5spd. It is a peppy, efficient and comfortable vehicle. I wonder if there isn't a kind of perfectionism going on. For the name and the price, I expect more from Honda than a domestic. I haven't had a major issue with my car. I am having the driver-side mirror replaced because it wasn't sealed properly. A wind-whistle at highway speed is being addressed. I have noticed that the front passenger door is only marginally mis-aligned near the bottom of the window and the fabric material in the trunk doesn't quite fit properly in one small place. These are things I can deal with. That being said, I wonder if the little things say something about Honda's reputation for attention to detail? Still, as a relatively new Honda owner, what a beautiful car to drive!

dwillia4

List a source that provides actual data that proves that Honda's quality is sub-par now. Or how about a long term test by one of the auto magazines or web sites? I've searched but haven't found anything that suggests that Honda's quality has slipped. The reason why I ask this is because I own two late model Hondas (2000 Odyssey, 2001 Accord). Both vehicles have been flawless so far. I have relatives and friends that own late model Hondas and they are not having the types of problems the one would associate with quality issues. Believe me, I'm not trying to defend Honda. I just want to see actual data as opposed to anecdotal forum postings. You all have to admit, there are a lot more Accords on the road now than there were 10 years ago. You also have to admit that the Accord is an exceptional value right now. Is there another $20,000 sedan that's produced and sold in the numbers that the Accord is that has better quality, customer satisfaction ratings, and resale value? Are your facts based upon your actual ownership experiences? Or is it based upon browsing the NHSTA site and Edmund's forums. Just curious...

pblevine

I love a good little fight. Both lugwrench and isellhondas both have some good points, and I've acutally learned something from them. About my car that is! But they're (and most of us) being subjective about things for which we don't have any representative (ie: objective) facts. How many FSU's (Fuel Sending Units) had to be replaced? How many Moon Roofs have noise problems? Hey, I'm the same way, can't help it. When my FSU gave me funny readings, I went nuts! My perception is that Honda makes an extremely good car (Honda Accord) but that Quality is lower than in the past. Can't prove it and would still recommend my Accord Coupe to others. Still a great car. BTW, CU (Consumers Union - ie: Consumer Reports) attempts to keep statistics even if they are a bit too generalized.

Anyway, lugwrench and isellhondas: please do keep up with your comments. You've done nothing wrong, and actually contributed a lot.