Highlander ( 4cyl) is NOT a LOT more expensive then MPV. For getting STANDARD a roof rack WITH crossbars, privacy glass ,Traction ctrl and Stability ctr - the extra bucks are worth it. Not to mention the top notch q-ty...The only drawback....styling. My initial post comparison betw. MZ5 and Highlander was regarding engine performance and gas mileage. A much bigger and heavier HL's engine gets better performance then MZ5 is delivering (so far) listed.... Ball is in Mazda's backyard:)) Dan
When I observe where Mazda is apparently going with the M5, it reminds me of another model in the relatively recent history -- the Pontiac Fiero. I don't mean the cars are similar, but rather, the way the cars are marketed. IMO, the M5, like the Fiero did, has a marketable concept that is relatively devoid of competitors, and has a chance to define that segment. But, also like the Fiero, instead by swinging for the fences from the get go, it is tip toeing in by seemingly aiming the car at the "budget" crowd. The model is introduced with very pedestrian equipment and specs. I remember when they introduced the Fiero, a sporty, mid-engine design, Pontiac marketing thrust was that the car was an affordable commuter! And by the time the car was updated with serious go-fast hardware befitting its style and potential, it was too late. It could not recover from the hole that Pontiac dug for it. Unfortunately I see many similarities with the M5. This model may be stillborn.
Based on the track record of the posters on edmunds Im not so sure I would cry uncle yet.......According to the posters on here, everything mazda has sent to the US in the past 4 years was going to be a flop, waste of time, mazda will be out of business, etc...of course, once the cars got here the tune seemed to change.
go back and read the posts of the 3,6,8 before they arrived...If we listened to many of the folks on here we should have boarded up the windows and dropped mazda from our line-up...good thing we didn't listen. Our mazda franchises havent been this profitable since the miata was introduced.
If they planned on selling this thing in huge volumes, I would agree the road might be a bit tough....but the low volume numbers make it an easy sell. our salesguys have a canny way of knowing what is going to sell and what isnt...they are all looking forward to this vehicle...I can't say they feel the same way about the some of the current and future line of some other brands we sell.
I hope it works....we will see soon enough. July/Aug arrival is the current schedule.
I was driving a 2003 highlander for apx 2000 miles this winter..The quality was there and I'm sure it will be great for the long haul but it was one of the most uninspiring and bland vehicle I have ever driven...some folks like that but I like a car that I want to drive everyday. This was one step above riding the bus.
In my opinion if the highlander was just a Camry wagon it would sure be much better. I think the Camry with the manul is not too far off of the Accord for driving experience. They are basically in the same class. Fairly nimble family sedans. Below the BMW's and above the Buicks as far as handling goes. I have never driven an automatic version of either thought and that does numb the experience some.
Camry wagon would be quicker, lighter, smoother and more efficient than the highlander. It would probably be a little longer (Camry is 5 inches longer than the Highlander) and would have less ground clearance.
Off topic, but I find it absurd that Toyata has 7 or 8 suv's and only 1 minivan, and no wagons (wagons are the same length as sedans, so the Matrix does not count being quite a bit shorter than the Corolla)
Despite all I don't like about the 5, I do applaud Mazda for bringing it here. Maybe they can address the shortcomings for future model years. I think the chasis is very sound. My only issues are the engine/gearing and the packaging.
Off topic, but I find it absurd that Toyata has 7 or 8 suv's and only 1 minivan, and no wagons (wagons are the same length as sedans, so the Matrix does not count being quite a bit shorter than the Corolla)
What have we as a market spent our dollars on? SUV's - that's why Toyota has 4 of them.
"Despite all I don't like about the 5, I do applaud Mazda for bringing it here. Maybe they can address the shortcomings for future model years. I think the chasis is very sound. My only issues are the engine/gearing and the packaging."
My sentiment exactly. I have driven this type of vehicle in Europe over the years like Megane Scenic Turbo Diesels that get 50 honest mpg and I have been eagerly awaiting something close to that genre in NA. I had high hopes for the MZ5 and I hope it is a big success, because if it is, someone will soon execute it properly whether it be Mazda or someone else. I am certainly not going to buy it with a high winding engine and 22-27 mpg.
a plain jane highlander is about $22k in my neighborhood
I know, it's bland, it's boring, it's got an auto. I felt the same when driving my ody too, but it's perfect for a family vehicle
For those of you who said they want an engaging driving experience in a family hauler, let me ask you this: are you going to nail that corner with wife and kids (or friends) on board? How "engaging" your drive can be when hauling whining kids?
And the MZ5 came with a 160hp 4cyl slush box, how big is the difference in driving dynamics when compared to say, a highlander or a CRV? :confuse:
The MZ5 is an innovative people hauler that we should be seeing more on our shores.
One can have that 'engaging' driving experience when the kiddies are NOT on board. What is attractive is the fact that one can have an 'engaging' vehicle which ALSO does great as a family hauler. And any Mz5 I would be interested in would have a stick, not the slushbox. Can you get nice captain's chairs in the mid row of a Highlander? How's the 3rd row in a Highlander compare to the Mz5?
try to remember that very few car companies put "everything" in a brand new model...one reason is they won't have anything to add for the next year's model...and the other is cost. The longer they make a product the production costs come into line and they can add additional features without jumping the price by a huge amount. The MZ5 isnt a $40K car where adding everything is easy, nobody notices a $400-500 price increase on a pricey car. On a under $20K car adding something that adds $500 is very noticeable.
Agee in principal; however, regarding the new Mz5........I'm pretty impressed with the standard equipment levels AS IS (again, keeping in mind it is a sub-$20k car).
Ok, nav is an (expensive) option, and apparently traction/stability control aren't offered. (hmmm, future additions?) But good lord, for less than $20k you get standard ABS, side/curtain airbags, sunroof, and 6-disk CD changer? All in a package which will seat 6 in a pinch or 4 comfortably with loads of cargo space. And offer (comparitively) 'engaging' performance at the same time?
What the heck do people EXPECT for less than $20k?
I just received a Mazda5 brochure from my dealer. The base model will start at $20,000 CDN ($16500usd), features include ABS w/ EBFD (4 wh discs), clear-lens taillights w/ bright housings, rain-sensing wipers, "sporty" side sils, tilt/tele steering wheel, wheel mounted audio controls, CD w/ 4 spkrs, power win/locks/mirror. Avail. Automatic is 4 spd "Sport" mode
GT model features: 17" alloy wheels (vs 16" alloy), leather steering wheel, power moonroof, fog lights, spoiler, CD (not 6 disc changer) w/ 6 spkrs, center row fold-out table, heated mirrors, cruise. A/C w/ climate control is optional on base, no mention of it being incl in GT pkg. Side airbags only avail as an option on GT No mention of Stability control at all in brochure, nor 7th passenger seating. Dealer said maxxed-out pricing should be under $25,000CDN.
Brochure does not mention any specs, not even EPA mileage.
Just compared brochures, there are some diffs between the US and Cdn models
CDN base 16" alloy vs 17" alloy on US no mention of rain-sensing wipers on US side sils standard on CDN A/C standard on US Cruise standard on US side airbags standard on US So although the base price of the US model is about $1000USD more than the CDN model, it is more than made up by the extra features, but this depends on how much they will charge for the A/C and side airbags.
only diff on GT (CDN) model vs Touring (US) is the 6 disc CD changer
I think you hit the nail on the head with most of the Toyota line-up. They just aren't much fun to drive. Even the Corolla and Matrix in XRS guise are not that exciting to drive. At least not compared to a Mazda3 or Mazda6. I heard someone state once that in the Matrix you feel like you are driving ON the wheels where in the Mazda3 you fell like you are driving BETWEEN the wheels.
That being said, I am looking forward to seeing the Mazda5 when it is in showrooms. The seating configuration intrigues me. I just hope they do a better job with the Mazda5 than Suzuki did with the XL-7. I used to drive a Sidekick and really enjoyed it ... but it only had 4 seatbelts and with my 3rd child on the way I needed something to fit more passengers. The XL-7 seemed to be a nice option but when I tried to sit my family in the vehicle it was obvious that there was not enough room.
As a long-term Toyota fan, I find myself (reluctantly) in agreement. I'll quibble a bit about the fun to drive comment based on my experience with my Celica GTS. However, in their infinite wisdom, Toyota has seen fit to kill off their most sporting machines (Celica and MR2). The new 'sporty' model that supposedly took the Celica's place was the Scion tC.
Uh, no. I've driven the tC and while yeah, it's kinda sporty, it is a poor substitute for my Celica GTS.
I think some of you are dismissing the 5 before giving it a chance yourselves. I'm talking about the engine here. With VVT and variable intake-control geometry, this little engine feels a lot peppier than its 160hp figure would suggest.
Case in point: I borrowed a loaded Mazda3 wagon (with the 2.3-liter four) from my dealership a few months ago and took it home for the weekend. The reason I borrowed it that weekend was to show it off at a Mazda owners' get-together we were having at our house, with people coming from several states (even one from Chicago, coming to our house in Richmond, Virginia!).
At one point, one of our group members was driving the car (a 5-speed) and another member was in the passenger seat, and all 260 pounds of yours truly was in the back seat. The three of us in the Mazda3 roughly equaled the weight of the Mazda5 and a normal (yuck yuck) sized driver. Still, the car was a rocket on wheels. (I know; we're still giving the driver a hard time for nearly making us lose our lunches on a particular hilly road near my house that day!)
I would really urge you guys to go out and drive a 3 with that engine. You'll see what I mean. This little baby has a lot to spare under its hood.
In fact, I couldn't wait, guys. Sorry, but a 2006 Mazda5 is a moot point for me now. If any of you keep up on the 3 discussions you'll know by now that I BOUGHT A VELOCITY RED MICA 2005 MAZDA3s WAGON (with a 5-speed, but of course) yesterday! Woo-hoo!!!
I thought that vehicle looked way too long and thin. Good catch with the soccer ball.
Anybody seen the new Honda airwave yet? Looks quite promising. There is info on it over on VTEC dot net (note no direct link and no promotion of the site)
...at least, the first one I've seen, anyway. Quite a good review, + some pictures. Sounds like our lack of a +1 seat is no great loss....however, our lack of the hard drive music system and especially, the top diesel engine is a MAJOR LOSS! (are you listening, Mazda?) The diesel engine is easily the best of the bunch, and is the only one that can comfortably deal with a full load of people/luggage, while at the same time returning excellent fuel economy. The Brits also prefer the standard version (styling-wise) to the tarted-up "Active" version (the one we get stuck with). At least they get a choice. http://channel4.com/4car/road-tests/M/mazda/505-/505-.html
I also live in the Suburbs of Richmond Virginia. Our son, who is in college out of state, turned me on to the Mazda5 when we went to the Richmond Auto show. They didn't have a 5 and the salesman said he thought it would be a year or two before the 5 came out. We knew he was wrong.
About a month ago I ran into a fellow in the parking lot of Bon Air Library with a brand new white Mazda3 wagon. He had bought it that week. I asked him how they liked it and mentioned that we were waiting for the Mazda5 to come out this summer. I probably should not have described the 5 because he seemed to have second thoughts about the 3 after my description of the 5. I think there were two booster seats in the back. I
f we like it, this will be our first Mazda. I'm driving an 03 manual Civic Hybrid and my wife drives a Camry wagon. I'm a pretty aggressive driver and the lack of horsepower in the five speed Civic doesn't keep me out of the fast lane. I've averaged 39.7 mpg for the first 28k. So, 160 hp sounds like a rocket to me. Zoom Zoom. I drove an 87 4runner for years while my wife has had several Toyotas. We always liked the older Oddesy and are glad to see a new mini minivan. We will probably get the sport with a moonroof. The big decision will be what color to get...
Do you think there will be any incentives/rebates for the 5 initially, or no? I don't imagine that this will sell like the Mazda3, so I'm wondering whether or not I can expect much in the way of discounting off invoice/S-plan pricing.
I don't think the Mazda 5 is going to sell as well as the Mazda 3. If Mazda only expect to sell 20,000 of the 5 annually, they obviously don't think so, either. It seems to me that in America, the 5's chief Mazda competitor is the MPV, which they aren't cancelling. Why would you pay more for a 5 than an MPV, for example?
I've driven a 3 with the same engine as the 5, and yeah it flies. I still have reservations about the powerplant. The 5 is 500 pounds heavier than the 3, and that's with NO people in it.
Load up that 3 with 700 pounds in the back, and 4 passengers, and see what it does!
Gotta tell ya ... I'm having a LOT of fun with the 3 wagon!
I haven't loaded it up with 700 lbs and four passengers (yet), but I did load it to the ceiling with all the trimmings for our businesses' skybox at the ballpark two weeks ago. I'm posting this so that some of you who may be on the fence about the 5 vs. the 3 might get some idea of the 3's capabilities. Here's what I got in the Mazda3 wagon, along with my 270-pound self:
- Twelve 12-packs of sodas - Eight 12-packs of beer - Twelve 10-pound bags of ice - One large cooler - Three plastic tubs for the sodas (nested together) - Boxes containing styrofoam plates & bowls, napkins, plastic utensils, etc. - Five large deli trays (sandwiches, buffalo wings, veggie tray, etc.) - Two large boxes of individual packs of chips and cookies from Costco - Two pillow-size bags of peanuts in the shell - Two cases of Cracker Jack and cookies - One folding cart to carry all this stuff on
I took the parcel shelf out and left it at home, and folded down the seats too. I also had to use the front seat floor for a few 12-packs of beer. This was about all the Mazda3 could hold. Keep in mind some of this stuff was very irregularly shaped!
I think it's been a while since you priced an MPV.
I just searched my dealership's inventory of about 20 MPVs. A "stripped" MPV LX was $25,440; a top-of-the-line ES with leather was $31,200. I don't think even a loaded Mazda5 will touch a base MPV.
You're going the wrong way on the price of an MPV mdaffron.A stripped MPV LX would go for about $17,900. You can get a standard MPV LX for around $19,000(comes fairly well loaded).That price includes a big rebate ($2,500 I believe). You can get a LX fully loaded for around $22,000. And the top of the line ES for around $25,000. My 2004 MPV LX bought in July of 2004 had MSRP of $26,000. With rebates taken off close to invoice price of car...my price was $20,500. MPV's are not selling very well and can easily be had for close to invoice(minus the rebates) They are a great value for the money though. They are built in Japan and the quality of workmanship is excellent.
Well, I just checked your own Roger Beasley Mazda in Austin, Texas, who currently has 34 MPVs in inventory ranging from $23,485 to $32,570. Check yourself.
The MSRP on a 2005 MPV is $23,500.
Please, you guys -- I'm talking MSRP here. Any dealer can offer a discount, and I'm not counting rebates since they change or go away. Besides, we don't know if there will be any incentives on the Mazda5's when they come out. So let's compare apples to apples and compare MSRPs, OK?
Meade
P.S. You show me that $17,900 MPV (almost $6,000 off MSRP) and I'll buy it. Just make sure it's a 2005 model, OK? Mazda is offering up to $3,250 in "Customer Cash" right now, but that would only bring a base MPV down to $20,250.
If you want to compare apples to apples...then you compare what the vehicles are selling for...not MSRP. The market determines the price of a vehicle...not MSRP. You are also forgetting that MPV's are selling close to invoice. So, the invoice on that 2005 MPV LX(comes fairly well loaded) with a MSRP of $23,500 is about $22,000. Subtract the $3,250 in "Customer Cash" and you buy the 2005 MPV LX for $18,750. You still want that "stripped" 2005?
But I still don't think you're comparing apples to apples. If you're going to do that, then why aren't you guys comparing the INVOICE of the Mazda5 to the INVOICE of the MPV? So far you haven't.
The comment that made me start posting this morning (which wasn't a comment of yours) was a quote stating that "the 5 lists for $18-20, plus options."
It doesn't. Since at least one of you wants to be to-the-letter, according to MazdaUSA's website, the 5 lists for $17,435 to $18,950, plus options -- taking it even farther away from even your heavily discounted MPV.
Comments
For getting STANDARD a roof rack WITH crossbars, privacy glass ,Traction ctrl and Stability ctr - the extra bucks are worth it.
Not to mention the top notch q-ty...The only drawback....styling.
My initial post comparison betw. MZ5 and Highlander was regarding engine performance and gas mileage. A much bigger and heavier HL's engine gets better performance then MZ5 is delivering (so far) listed.... Ball is in Mazda's backyard:))
Dan
go back and read the posts of the 3,6,8 before they arrived...If we listened to many of the folks on here we should have boarded up the windows and dropped mazda from our line-up...good thing we didn't listen. Our mazda franchises havent been this profitable since the miata was introduced.
If they planned on selling this thing in huge volumes, I would agree the road might be a bit tough....but the low volume numbers make it an easy sell. our salesguys have a canny way of knowing what is going to sell and what isnt...they are all looking forward to this vehicle...I can't say they feel the same way about the some of the current and future line of some other brands we sell.
I hope it works....we will see soon enough. July/Aug arrival is the current schedule.
-juice
Meade
Head, meet nail. Nail, meet head.
-juice
http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/pdf/pricing_update/2006_MZ5_pricing_update.pdf
Camry wagon would be quicker, lighter, smoother and more efficient than the highlander. It would probably be a little longer (Camry is 5 inches longer than the Highlander) and would have less ground clearance.
Off topic, but I find it absurd that Toyata has 7 or 8 suv's and only 1 minivan, and no wagons (wagons are the same length as sedans, so the Matrix does not count being quite a bit shorter than the Corolla)
Despite all I don't like about the 5, I do applaud Mazda for bringing it here. Maybe they can address the shortcomings for future model years. I think the chasis is very sound. My only issues are the engine/gearing and the packaging.
What have we as a market spent our dollars on? SUV's - that's why Toyota has 4 of them.
I think he's also including Lexus models, too.
But yeah, AWD 2-boxes include Matrix, Highlander, RAV4, 4Runner, Sequoia, Land Cruiser, Lexus LX, RX330, GX, and that's not counting the AWD Sienna.
Mazda will add the Crossport soon, though.
-juice
My sentiment exactly. I have driven this type of vehicle in Europe over the years like Megane Scenic Turbo Diesels that get 50 honest mpg and I have been eagerly awaiting something close to that genre in NA. I had high hopes for the MZ5 and I hope it is a big success, because if it is, someone will soon execute it properly whether it be Mazda or someone else. I am certainly not going to buy it with a high winding engine and 22-27 mpg.
-Jaz
I know, it's bland, it's boring, it's got an auto. I felt the same when driving my ody too, but it's perfect for a family vehicle
For those of you who said they want an engaging driving experience in a family hauler, let me ask you this: are you going to nail that corner with wife and kids (or friends) on board? How "engaging" your drive can be when hauling whining kids?
And the MZ5 came with a 160hp 4cyl slush box, how big is the difference in driving dynamics when compared to say, a highlander or a CRV? :confuse:
The MZ5 is an innovative people hauler that we should be seeing more on our shores.
Does anyone know the S-plan pricing for it? The 5 is not listed on the S-plan booklet I have that lists all of Mazda's lineup.
I'm going to seriously consider this and the Chevy HHR.
Ok, nav is an (expensive) option, and apparently traction/stability control aren't offered. (hmmm, future additions?) But good lord, for less than $20k you get standard ABS, side/curtain airbags, sunroof, and 6-disk CD changer? All in a package which will seat 6 in a pinch or 4 comfortably with loads of cargo space. And offer (comparitively) 'engaging' performance at the same time?
What the heck do people EXPECT for less than $20k?
Avail. Automatic is 4 spd "Sport" mode
GT model features: 17" alloy wheels (vs 16" alloy), leather steering wheel, power moonroof, fog lights, spoiler, CD (not 6 disc changer) w/ 6 spkrs, center row fold-out table, heated mirrors, cruise.
A/C w/ climate control is optional on base, no mention of it being incl in GT pkg.
Side airbags only avail as an option on GT
No mention of Stability control at all in brochure, nor 7th passenger seating.
Dealer said maxxed-out pricing should be under $25,000CDN.
Brochure does not mention any specs, not even EPA mileage.
I wish mz5 came with a stick too. I am also hoping that toyota would bring the wish into this country as well.
CDN base 16" alloy vs 17" alloy on US
no mention of rain-sensing wipers on US
side sils standard on CDN
A/C standard on US
Cruise standard on US
side airbags standard on US
So although the base price of the US model is about $1000USD more than the CDN model, it is more than made up by the extra features, but this depends on how much they will charge for the A/C and side airbags.
only diff on GT (CDN) model vs Touring (US) is the 6 disc CD changer
:confuse:
The standard mz5 is equipped with a 5-speed manual. A 4-speed automatic is listed as a $900 option.
That being said, I am looking forward to seeing the Mazda5 when it is in showrooms. The seating configuration intrigues me. I just hope they do a better job with the Mazda5 than Suzuki did with the XL-7. I used to drive a Sidekick and really enjoyed it ... but it only had 4 seatbelts and with my 3rd child on the way I needed something to fit more passengers. The XL-7 seemed to be a nice option but when I tried to sit my family in the vehicle it was obvious that there was not enough room.
Uh, no. I've driven the tC and while yeah, it's kinda sporty, it is a poor substitute for my Celica GTS.
Goodbye, Toyota......hellooooooo Mazda.
Case in point: I borrowed a loaded Mazda3 wagon (with the 2.3-liter four) from my dealership a few months ago and took it home for the weekend. The reason I borrowed it that weekend was to show it off at a Mazda owners' get-together we were having at our house, with people coming from several states (even one from Chicago, coming to our house in Richmond, Virginia!).
At one point, one of our group members was driving the car (a 5-speed) and another member was in the passenger seat, and all 260 pounds of yours truly was in the back seat. The three of us in the Mazda3 roughly equaled the weight of the Mazda5 and a normal (yuck yuck) sized driver. Still, the car was a rocket on wheels. (I know; we're still giving the driver a hard time for nearly making us lose our lunches on a particular hilly road near my house that day!)
I would really urge you guys to go out and drive a 3 with that engine. You'll see what I mean. This little baby has a lot to spare under its hood.
In fact, I couldn't wait, guys. Sorry, but a 2006 Mazda5 is a moot point for me now. If any of you keep up on the 3 discussions you'll know by now that I BOUGHT A VELOCITY RED MICA 2005 MAZDA3s WAGON (with a 5-speed, but of course) yesterday! Woo-hoo!!!
Good luck with the 5; I can't wait to see it!
Meade
Congrats Meade.
-juice
That creates an illusion that there is more leg room.
-juice
Anybody seen the new Honda airwave yet? Looks quite promising. There is info on it over on VTEC dot net (note no direct link and no promotion of the site)
Sounds like our lack of a +1 seat is no great loss....however, our lack of the hard drive music system and especially, the top diesel engine is a MAJOR LOSS! (are you listening, Mazda?) The diesel engine is easily the best of the bunch, and is the only one that can comfortably deal with a full load of people/luggage, while at the same time returning excellent fuel economy. The Brits also prefer the standard version (styling-wise) to the tarted-up "Active" version (the one we get stuck with).
At least they get a choice.
http://channel4.com/4car/road-tests/M/mazda/505-/505-.html
About a month ago I ran into a fellow in the parking lot of Bon Air Library with a brand new white Mazda3 wagon. He had bought it that week. I asked him how they liked it and mentioned that we were waiting for the Mazda5 to come out this summer. I probably should not have described the 5 because he seemed to have second thoughts about the 3 after my description of the 5. I think there were two booster seats in the back. I
f we like it, this will be our first Mazda. I'm driving an 03 manual Civic Hybrid and my wife drives a Camry wagon. I'm a pretty aggressive driver and the lack of horsepower in the five speed Civic doesn't keep me out of the fast lane. I've averaged 39.7 mpg for the first 28k. So, 160 hp sounds like a rocket to me. Zoom Zoom. I drove an 87 4runner for years while my wife has had several Toyotas. We always liked the older Oddesy and are glad to see a new mini minivan. We will probably get the sport with a moonroof. The big decision will be what color to get...
mdaffron@the-rma.org
Meade
-juice
Load up that 3 with 700 pounds in the back, and 4 passengers, and see what it does!
I haven't loaded it up with 700 lbs and four passengers (yet), but I did load it to the ceiling with all the trimmings for our businesses' skybox at the ballpark two weeks ago. I'm posting this so that some of you who may be on the fence about the 5 vs. the 3 might get some idea of the 3's capabilities. Here's what I got in the Mazda3 wagon, along with my 270-pound self:
- Twelve 12-packs of sodas
- Eight 12-packs of beer
- Twelve 10-pound bags of ice
- One large cooler
- Three plastic tubs for the sodas (nested together)
- Boxes containing styrofoam plates & bowls, napkins, plastic utensils, etc.
- Five large deli trays (sandwiches, buffalo wings, veggie tray, etc.)
- Two large boxes of individual packs of chips and cookies from Costco
- Two pillow-size bags of peanuts in the shell
- Two cases of Cracker Jack and cookies
- One folding cart to carry all this stuff on
I took the parcel shelf out and left it at home, and folded down the seats too. I also had to use the front seat floor for a few 12-packs of beer. This was about all the Mazda3 could hold. Keep in mind some of this stuff was very irregularly shaped!
Meade
The 5 lists for $18-20, plus options.
Maybe a bare-bones stripped model will overlap slightly, but not much.
-juice
I just searched my dealership's inventory of about 20 MPVs. A "stripped" MPV LX was $25,440; a top-of-the-line ES with leather was $31,200. I don't think even a loaded Mazda5 will touch a base MPV.
Meade
ES w/ leather for $31,200? Who in their right mind would pay this? My wife and I purchased a new '05 Ody EX-L 3 months ago for $28,600+TTL.
My 2004 MPV LX bought in July of 2004 had MSRP of $26,000. With rebates taken off close to invoice price of car...my price was $20,500.
MPV's are not selling very well and can easily be had for close to invoice(minus the rebates) They are a great value for the money though. They are built in Japan and the quality of workmanship is excellent.
The MSRP on a 2005 MPV is $23,500.
Please, you guys -- I'm talking MSRP here. Any dealer can offer a discount, and I'm not counting rebates since they change or go away. Besides, we don't know if there will be any incentives on the Mazda5's when they come out. So let's compare apples to apples and compare MSRPs, OK?
Meade
P.S. You show me that $17,900 MPV (almost $6,000 off MSRP) and I'll buy it. Just make sure it's a 2005 model, OK? Mazda is offering up to $3,250 in "Customer Cash" right now, but that would only bring a base MPV down to $20,250.
http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/loadDealerSearch.action
Meade
The comment that made me start posting this morning (which wasn't a comment of yours) was a quote stating that "the 5 lists for $18-20, plus options."
It doesn't. Since at least one of you wants to be to-the-letter, according to MazdaUSA's website, the 5 lists for $17,435 to $18,950, plus options -- taking it even farther away from even your heavily discounted MPV.
Source: http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/pdf/pricing_update/2006_MZ5_pricing_update.pdf
(Of course, applying your incredible MPV pricing logic, you'll be able to find Mazda5's for as low as $12,000, won't you?)
Meade
MSRP is just fiction nowadays, but it's hard to find models without options, so jipster's prices sound low.
Any how, they have 6 MPVs under $21 grand, so it's reasonable to say those will likely overlap with loaded up Mazda5s.
Especially at first, because the 5 will command close to MSRP for a few months. So someone shopping right now will find some overlap.
I guess when the 5 arrives we can actually take another look and see, but I'll bet there will be overlap, just like there was with the 3 vs. the 6.
-juice