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Comments
I was speaking of current American production.
Yup, saw a couple this morning (southern california, SF Valley). I also see a lot of pickup and large SUVs - I'd say about 1/3 of the vehicles are in either the SUV or pickup class. The Chevy Surburban and Ford Expedition seem especially popular. In my home state of Texas, I'd bet it is close to 50%, expecially pickups. Of course, there is a lot of ranching down there, and they probably actually use their pickups for appropriate things, rather than shopping trips.
Also, I don't agree with the second part of your statement. Americans will do what they please, and many people would just as soon eat out a bit less than change their preferred vehicle. It is the poor people with large families that bear the real burden.
The Toyota Highlander in the article was over $36,000. Isn't that enough $$$$ for decent fit and finish?
I don't have a problem with the Prius fit and finish. Of course, it's also $10,000 less.
I don't think we should fall into the trap of a car that costs $36k should automatically come with X, Y, and Z. I hear stuff like this on BMW discussions, "I paid $XX for my car and it doesn't even come with blah blah feature that a $15k hyundai has." The only thing I can respond with is: does the $15k hyundai have all the features which make the BMW unique?"
I think you should find a car that costs $36k that has what you think has the appropriate level of amenities, say a BMW 325i. Now add a hybrid engine to that- how much should it cost?? Now to get that figure down to $36k, what would you change?
I think it's ok to say, "for $36k, i think the HH is too expensive for what it offers."
I happen to think the HH has a certain value. Obviously others disagree with my opinion, and they are entitled to that. I wasn't bashing the HH (this will be my next car so why would I bash it?), I just wanted to make it cleat that I disagreed with the WAY he presented his opinion (that the HH failed some litmus test). After rereading my last post, I wish I could edit it to say the author of the article should have changed his wording.
That's why there should be an incentive for people to buy Hybrid Highlander over regular ones. It seats 7 just fine.
In California (at least the LA area), you have to pay before you pump - if you don't use all the cash you leave with the station operator, you have to go back to get change. Very effective against drive offs.
jprice SoCal '05 Silver, #1, 6700 miles, [non-permissible content removed]. mileage 46.7MPG
http://tinyurl.com/92slm
I am SO glad I have my Prius! MFD currently reads 48.3
Gotta love this car!!!
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/la-me-hybrid12aug12,1,978702.story?ctrack=1&cset=- true
http://www.hamiltonmountainnews.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=brabant/Layout/Articl- e&c=Article&cid=1123797020672&call_pageid=1071061598490&col=1073476868360
"Getting in is a hard climb but inside the huge cab it's all leather and electronic comfort. It even has a rear-view video camera to prevent the accidental crushing of hybrid cars."
http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/columnists/bogert/articles/1673721.html
Yeah, hasn't the Honda FCN already been on the road in several cities for like a year now? Kudos to Toyota for getting in the came, but this is hardly a revolution.
Well, that's an interesting spin. Wagoner had a meeting with Toyota, but it was never clear exactly what was discussed, and I never read anything about a "rebuff".
http://www.taftmidwaydriller.com/articles/2005/08/12/news/features/feat02.txt
I think Ford is full of it. They ordered 20K units from Aisin. Aisin says they can increase production by 20 percent at present. Ford is whining because they'd like to double production. How many production lines for hybrid transaxles do you think Aisin actually has? I'm guessing one. More production would require setting up a second line, training a second team of workers to build them, etc. These things take time. If Ford had not been as risk-averse they could have ordered 40K up front and had them by now. Instead they will have to wait, no matter who they pay to build the parts.
"...The $286.5-billion transit bill signed into law Wednesday by President George W. Bush includes incentives to encourage sales of fuel-efficient, low-exhaust autos. Buyers of Toyota's Prius hybrid should get a $3,150 credit next year, the most for any vehicle, while its hybrid Highlander sport-utility vehicle and Ford's hybrid Escape SUV should receive $2,600, the American Council for an Energy-Efficient Economy said in a statement Friday.
Other models benefiting from the tax rules that take effect Jan. 1, 2006, include Honda Motor Co.'s Civic Hybrid, which will receive a $2,100 credit, its Insight hybrid that qualifies for up to $1,450, and the Accord Hybrid, which should receive $650, said James Kliesch, a spokesman for the Washington-based energy group. General Motors Corp.'s so-called mild hybrid Silverado and Sierra pickup trucks might qualify for a $250 credit..."
In addition to these tax incentive, some states permit hybrids with only the driver to use HOV lanes.
Do you believe these breaks are justified, and why or why not?
i don't think hybrids should get HOV privileges, since for one thing, it is not the best use of their technology. also, a hybrid does not cut down on the number of vehicles on the road.
Railroadjames (Times R a Changing) :sick:
http://tinyurl.com/8catn
There's also a feature about the 2007 Toyota Camry as well.
Notice that Inside Line article (posted August 11th) says "the Camry Hybrid will most likely combine electric motors with a gas V6", but the Toyota website (undated, but designated Summer 2005) says "the 4-cylinder engine will be assembled in Georgetown, Kentucky".
Do we see any kind of disconnect here?
Thats 500,000 Hybrid vehicles on the World's roads today.
A big achievement.
Ford must have sold 10,000 Escape Hybrids by now.
will not get the Return on Investment by showing Accord Hybrid.
Liars.
Now if Hybrid-Camry goes V4, Accord may probably follow, otherwise
Camry may outsell Accord by around 4 - 1 margin.
And 180,000 Hybrid vehicles sold in US will grab 1 % share of the 17,000,000 vehicles market.
A remarkable feat.
Railroadjames ( want world peace...use yer turn-signal)
One interesting and totally hypothetical analysis one can do is to compare the % mileage increase Honda got going from the Civic to the hybrid civic and then apply that to the Camry. Doing this yields 37 city/ 45 highway. Of course, that is just one possibility and might actually be what Honda would achieve with a 4 cyl accord and IMA.
http://tinyurl.com/8qlvk
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/21/magazine/21OIL.html?ei=5070&en=0423aa08c1b8c8de&ex=11248- 56000&pagewanted=print
"The largest oil terminal in the world, Ras Tanura, is located on the eastern coast of Saudi Arabia, along the Persian Gulf. From Ras Tanura's control tower, you can see the classic totems of oil's dominion -- supertankers coming and going, row upon row of storage tanks and miles and miles of pipes. Ras Tanura, which I visited in June, is the funnel through which nearly 10 percent of the world's daily supply of petroleum flows. Standing in the control tower, you are surrounded by more than 50 million barrels of oil, yet not a drop can be seen. "
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/08/toyota_camry_hy.php
It's been addressed in the "toyota camry hybrid versus honda accord hybrid" forum AT LENGTH last week or so.
Kudos indeed to Toyota for taking Hybrids (AGAIN) where they have never been !!!
Anyway I think the Toyota i4 hybrid approach is exciting and I will definitely consider one to inhabit the space in my garage(though I am still tempted to buy a gas guzzling sport sedan---just call me old fashioned)
You could probably sacrifice a little, move down to the Corolla, and get similar real world mileage to the Camry hybrid for about $10-16000 less. That would be an affordable solution.