Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

qbrozen

but watch the black one's video. sounds great.

ab348

kyfdx said:

Last Monday, a week ago, took the wife's 2011 X3 to the dealer for regularly scheduled maintenance. Oil change and spark plugs, plus a few other things. 75K miles. Estimate was $550.

I knew that rear brakes were a possibility, but the call I got later that morning was a gut punch.. The new total estimate? $2750.

I won't go into the gory details, but one of the items was the belt tensioner pulley. I think it's spring-loaded or hydraulic or something like that. Anyway, it was losing it's "spring", and wasn't keeping the belts taut. "We really need to fix this, because the belts are starting to work their way off of the pulley, and if that happens, you'll be stuck on the side of the road".

The car had a recall that involved the body shop, so they had it all week. Picked it up on Friday. Final bill was $2685. (Rear brakes, leaking transfer case seal, aforementioned other items).

Fast forward three days later to Tuesday. My wife calls and the car is dead in the busiest intersection in town. And, the "wrench" symbol is flashing. She was very, very happy. Towed it to the dealer. Get a call the next day. Tech had installed the tensioner improperly, and the belts had come off the pulley. It's like the service advisor was psychic!

Dear god. As they say in the old car hobby, the last thing you worked on is likely the cause of your next problem.

28firefighter

kyfdx said:

Fast forward three days later to Tuesday. My wife calls and the car is dead in the busiest intersection in town. And, the "wrench" symbol is flashing. She was very, very happy. Towed it to the dealer. Get a call the next day. Tech had installed the tensioner improperly, and the belts had come off the pulley. It's like the service advisor was psychic!

I really hope they refunded the labor for that particular effort...

ab348

Volo has a mixed reputation. Used to be that alot of the cars they offered were pretty tatty. Seems like they have moved on from that and a lot of the ones I looked at seem pretty nice. Found some off color combos among the ones I looked at, like the '69 4-4-2 that is red with a gold interior. Weird. They also have a very good photographer. Everything seems overpriced though.

Mr_Shiftright

Some are priced way way high. I guess like many dealers they are trolling for uninformed buyers. Some prices seem ok though.

That Cadillac "Milan" is hilarious.

Michaell

So, I had lunch with a co-worker, then headed off to the VW dealership.

I came ...

I saw ...

I drove ...

I didn't lease, though an offer is on the table.

While I was hoping for a 'real' color this time around, the Platinum Grey of the Jetta isn't bad. Cloth interior, manual seats, PW, PM, cruise, and VW's 'car-net' which is sort of like Apple's Car Play. Rear view camera and push button start.

The test drive was the basic "4 right turns" - all city, which is fine, since that's what most of my driving is. While the 1.4T is rated at 150HP, it sure felt like a lot more, compared to the 148HP of my Elantra. Nice pickup, though there is a slight bit of turbo lag when you first put your foot into it. Also, pretty quiet ride - the noisiest thing I heard were the tires. Decent amount of room, both front and back. And, a pretty spacious trunk.

So, back at the dealership, we talk a little bit about numbers. Turns out the price posted on the web will also work for leases, just add the $625 acquisition fee. But, turns out VW has added an extra $500 rebate in the last day or two, which wipes out that cost. The $500 is in addition to the current $1000 bonus and $1750 lease cash. Looking at the prices, they are selling the car for about $50 under the Edmunds invoice number before incentives.

Before dealing with the Elantra, we're at $209/mo with tax included. We figured about $2000 in charges on the Elantra (2 payments, mileage cost and damaged bumper). We easily agreed to split the difference, which would add about $25-30/mo to the payment. First payment only out of pocket; everything else rolled into the lease.

Net, the payment on the Jetta would be about $10/mo more than what I'm paying now.

@stickguy - salesman told me that while RUG can be used, they recommend either mid-grade or PUG for best performance. Here in CO, RUG is 85, mid is 87 and PUG is 91. What do your kids use in their car?

Couldn't get hold of the wife, so no final decision was made. Though, I suspect the deal is valid for the next day or so.

Couple of thoughts -

1. Wondering if I can get the selling price down another $500 or so -- I'm sure the dealer is getting holdback from VW
2. Instead of a 50/50 split on the Elantra costs, I can push for them to cover more of it - 60/40 or 70/30

nyccarguy

stickguy said:

well, the WRX and GTI both come with an automatic, so entirely likely that the Si will.

Bradd, I thought you were keeping the Legacy for kid duty? How many years until the oldest hits 16? A miled up, beat up, putt putt legacy, sounds like the perfect 1st car for all of the youngins.

My oldest son turns 10 at the end of September, so 6 years. I like the Legacy, but I just don't LOVE it the way I should. If I could find something that's fun to drive with a reasonably cheap lease payment, I might keep the Legacy since I have been doing preventative maintenance for "the long run."

I'll have to go drive a GTI & a WRX to see.

corvette

28firefighter said:

kyfdx said:

Fast forward three days later to Tuesday. My wife calls and the car is dead in the busiest intersection in town. And, the "wrench" symbol is flashing. She was very, very happy. Towed it to the dealer. Get a call the next day. Tech had installed the tensioner improperly, and the belts had come off the pulley. It's like the service advisor was psychic!

I really hope they refunded the labor for that particular effort...

I wouldn't count on it. Benz dealer that accidentally banged up my coworker's Benz has had it for about three weeks now. Supposedly, nothing has been said about waiving the charge for the routine maintenance it was in for, on account of them wrecking the car and all... :@

28firefighter

@Michaell I'd be curious to know if you could step up to a Jetta 1.8T Sport model for similar money or not much more? That would get you some extra appearance goodies and the better engine.

Still a lot of car for the money.

Michaell

28firefighter said:

@Michaell I'd be curious to know if you could step up to a Jetta 1.8T Sport model for similar money or not much more? That would get you some extra appearance goodies and the better engine.

Still a lot of car for the money.

The dealer I visited today was out of the Sports - S, SE or SEL only.

And, not sure I'd want the bigger wheels and tires of the Sport.

If I can find one close by, I may have to take it for a spin. Slightly better residual to offset the higher price.

28firefighter

Michaell said:

If I can find one close by, I may have to take it for a spin. Slightly better residual to offset the higher price.

The only reason why I am suggesting a Sport or SE is something to get you CarPlay/Android Auto - it may seem silly, but having the extra functionality really offsets a lot of other missing features.

For instance, when I drive the A3, I have auto climate control, auto headlights, and auto wipers at my disposal, but just the regular old fashioned headunit tied to the Bose. I'd give up all 3 of those features (plus Bose) to have the CarPlay instead.

stickguy

It only calls for regular. I don't even think there is anything in the manual about PUG giving extra HP. So we put in RUG.

Jetta does have a large trunk.

Me, I spend another $25 month, and get more goodies.

stickguy

Actually, if it is more per month, and not wowing you, why rush? You certainly seem pretty "meh" about it!

stickguy

I really want CarPlay next time. Will be a must to buy new.

Michaell

stickguy said:

Actually, if it is more per month, and not wowing you, why rush? You certainly seem pretty "meh" about it!

I like it well enough. At my price point, nothing is really going to 'wow' me. This is one more "get along" lease; in 3 years, I'll get something I really like.

Did find some other colors of the 1.4T SE at another dealer. Two blues, a red and some copper.

The SE has CarPlay (or Car-Net, in VW speak).

My biggest deal is that the 2016 inventory is shrinking for all makes. If I wait until November, I'll most likely get a 2017, and the deals on those won't be as good as what I'm seeing now.

nyccarguy

stickguy said:

Actually, if it is more per month, and not wowing you, why rush? You certainly seem pretty "meh" about it!

And there is the slippery slope of leasing. Only another $25 per month for more goodies. Only another $25 more per month than that for a car level up. Oh, for another $100 per month I can get X brand's luxury performance car's base model for...

28firefighter

Michaell said:

The SE has CarPlay (or Car-Net, in VW speak).

I may be wrong, but I thought Car-Net was the VW version of on-star? At least that's what the VW dealer told me when I took delivery of the GTI.

Michaell

28firefighter said:

Michaell said:

The SE has CarPlay (or Car-Net, in VW speak).

I may be wrong, but I thought Car-Net was the VW version of on-star? At least that's what the VW dealer told me when I took delivery of the GTI.

Here's the link:

http://www.vwcarnetconnect.com/?cid=sem_4QvcwtgI_6194829114_c

28firefighter

Huh! I did not realize it was part of a larger package. Go figure. Thanks!

Michaell

28firefighter said:

Huh! I did not realize it was part of a larger package. Go figure. Thanks!

Although I have an iPhone, I did not test the functionality on my test drive. In fact, I turned the stereo off entirely.

28firefighter

Michaell said:

28firefighter said:

Huh! I did not realize it was part of a larger package. Go figure. Thanks!

Although I have an iPhone, I did not test the functionality on my test drive. In fact, I turned the stereo off entirely.

The Apple CarPlay functionality works incredibly well - I just plug in my charger to the USB port and it automagically comes right up with the CarPlay interface.

stickguy

Car Net is like onstar (and you have to pay for it). After reading the link, carplay is part of some apps package, which, if I followed the logic, you need carnet to get.

so yes, Carplay is available. Is it free? Not sure.

And @nyccarguy, that is exactly how I ended up in a limited tech package. I wanted the moonroof, and it was only $30 more per month (or some such), so, why not?

stickguy

Michael, if you just want cheap, stop at Hyundai first. Just got an email from my dealer. 2017 Elantra SE, $149/mo (36/36000). Only 1st payment down, plus tax/tags. So I could drive out for about $1,200 OOP, then $149 mo. Required lease/owner loyalty, which you got. Based on MSRP listed, looked like standard car, so adjust accordingly for the basic equipment package. Still going to be well under $200.

if we were shopping this year, I know what my daughter would be driving. Heck, me too if I was getting one now.

stever

@michaell has to buy something different to keep in good graces with his contract with Edmunds.

Okay, that's a lie, but why repeat?

And why lease when you can buy and flip (more easily) in a year?

Some leasing company needs to either do six month leases for you guys or 18 month pull-forwards.

ab348

stickguy said:

Actually, if it is more per month, and not wowing you, why rush? You certainly seem pretty "meh" about it!

That's what I was wondering. Having a bit of difficulty with a higher monthly payment for a car that in my mind is not quite at the same level as the E-GT.

Michaell

stever said:

@michaell has to buy something different to keep in good graces with his contract with Edmunds.

Okay, that's a lie, but why repeat?

And why lease when you can buy and flip (more easily) in a year?

Some leasing company needs to either do six month leases for you guys or 18 month pull-forwards.

Shh, @stever - we can't let everyone know about the T's & C's of being a moderator.

Infiniti offered a 12 month lease term for a brief time a year or two ago.

Michaell

stickguy said:

Michael, if you just want cheap, stop at Hyundai first. Just got an email from my dealer. 2017 Elantra SE, $149/mo (36/36000). Only 1st payment down, plus tax/tags. So I could drive out for about $1,200 OOP, then $149 mo. Required lease/owner loyalty, which you got. Based on MSRP listed, looked like standard car, so adjust accordingly for the basic equipment package. Still going to be well under $200.

if we were shopping this year, I know what my daughter would be driving. Heck, me too if I was getting one now.

It's not just cheap - think of it as a "value" lease.

I liked the VW - it felt well screwed together compared to my Hyundai. And, as @stever pointed out, I would like something different.

kyfdx

I think the Jetta would be an upgrade from an Elantra.

breld

How many miles is that lease quote for @michaell?  

henryn

kyfdx said:

Last Monday, a week ago, took the wife's 2011 X3 to the dealer for regularly scheduled maintenance. Oil change and spark plugs, plus a few other things. 75K miles. Estimate was $550.

I knew that rear brakes were a possibility, but the call I got later that morning was a gut punch.. The new total estimate? $2750.

I won't go into the gory details, but one of the items was the belt tensioner pulley. I think it's spring-loaded or hydraulic or something like that. Anyway, it was losing it's "spring", and wasn't keeping the belts taut. "We really need to fix this, because the belts are starting to work their way off of the pulley, and if that happens, you'll be stuck on the side of the road".

The car had a recall that involved the body shop, so they had it all week. Picked it up on Friday. Final bill was $2685. (Rear brakes, leaking transfer case seal, aforementioned other items).

Wow! I'm not rich enough (or profligate enough) to ever buy a new BMW or Mercedes. And the above is a very good example of why I wouldn't own a used one that is out of warranty.

Michaell

breld said:

How many miles is that lease quote for @michaell?  

36 months, 12,000 miles per year.

I've put less than 600 miles on the Elantra since I've started my new job in mid-July. Granted, I've been trying to drive the Outback more than normal to keep the miles off the E-GT, but I figure I won't go over 1000 miles a month.

Unless I start delivering again.

tjc78

henryn said:

kyfdx said:

Last Monday, a week ago, took the wife's 2011 X3 to the dealer for regularly scheduled maintenance. Oil change and spark plugs, plus a few other things. 75K miles. Estimate was $550.

I knew that rear brakes were a possibility, but the call I got later that morning was a gut punch.. The new total estimate? $2750.

I won't go into the gory details, but one of the items was the belt tensioner pulley. I think it's spring-loaded or hydraulic or something like that. Anyway, it was losing it's "spring", and wasn't keeping the belts taut. "We really need to fix this, because the belts are starting to work their way off of the pulley, and if that happens, you'll be stuck on the side of the road".

The car had a recall that involved the body shop, so they had it all week. Picked it up on Friday. Final bill was $2685. (Rear brakes, leaking transfer case seal, aforementioned other items).

Wow! I'm not rich enough (or profligate enough) to ever buy a new BMW or Mercedes. And the above is a very good example of why I wouldn't own a used one that is out of warranty.

Wow, big bill. I may have lost whatever is left of my mind if it stranded me for the exact problem I just fixed!

stickguy

I'm kind of curious what one of my local BMW specific indy places would have charged for the exact same work.

Sandman6472

Use 87 in the Golf and works just fine. Sure, feel that slight turbo lag more than I'd like, but have gotten used to it. Never got over to see the X1 yesterday as I really wasn't feeling too well and had to work today as we are short bodies. I did receive an emIl from the Caddy dealer but thinking the timing is off.
Liked the Tiguan I drove for a couple of hours the other day more than I thought and leaning towards a CPO'd unit as my next ride. Definitely need more seat time in one to make sure but I do think that's the one. Kind of ironic that my twin brother is on his second one, but think he leases.

The Sandman

stever

This member could use some help on a new lease to replace his Highlander. Thanks!

corvette

tjc78 said:

henryn said:

kyfdx said:

Last Monday, a week ago, took the wife's 2011 X3 to the dealer for regularly scheduled maintenance. Oil change and spark plugs, plus a few other things. 75K miles. Estimate was $550.

I knew that rear brakes were a possibility, but the call I got later that morning was a gut punch.. The new total estimate? $2750.

I won't go into the gory details, but one of the items was the belt tensioner pulley. I think it's spring-loaded or hydraulic or something like that. Anyway, it was losing it's "spring", and wasn't keeping the belts taut. "We really need to fix this, because the belts are starting to work their way off of the pulley, and if that happens, you'll be stuck on the side of the road".

The car had a recall that involved the body shop, so they had it all week. Picked it up on Friday. Final bill was $2685. (Rear brakes, leaking transfer case seal, aforementioned other items).

Wow! I'm not rich enough (or profligate enough) to ever buy a new BMW or Mercedes. And the above is a very good example of why I wouldn't own a used one that is out of warranty.

Wow, big bill. I may have lost whatever is left of my mind if it stranded me for the exact problem I just fixed!

Ditto. I'd be auditioning replacements, at that point.

Of course, the crummy Volvo dealer here in Louisville managed to cause a fuel leak on my parents' Volvo while performing a recall intended to prevent a fuel leak. My head almost exploded on that one, too.

roadburner

They are hopeless; the two times I dealt with their inept service department were enough for me.

breld

Michaell said:

breld said:

How many miles is that lease quote for @michaell?  

36 months, 12,000 miles per year.

I've put less than 600 miles on the Elantra since I've started my new job in mid-July. Granted, I've been trying to drive the Outback more than normal to keep the miles off the E-GT, but I figure I won't go over 1000 miles a month.

Unless I start delivering again.

I only ask 'cause the payment on the stepdaughter's Jetta Sport is $166/month (before tax), but that's for 10k miles/year.

breld

Took the wife's MINI in this morning for service and got a Countryman S as a loaner. I'm pretty impressed with it. Coming out of the wife's very basic model, the Countryman feels quite roomy, is an upgrade in smoothness and noise level, and is certainly much quicker. I like the seating position - I've always viewed them as a hatchback like a Golf, but it does feel as though you sit a bit higher and more upright (like the mini-SUV it's marketed as).

On one hand, I'm excited for the upgrades my wife will experience if/when she gets into a newer MINI. On the other hand, I can't help but think of all the funds I'd save over something like that over the SQ5. Obviously it doesn't compare, but that's certainly reflected in the price too.

That's probably just crazy thinking after taking my stepdaughter up to college yesterday for move-in day. Getting the first bill for tuition and room & board, and then paying a trip to the bookstore for all her textbooks makes me think I had it right with the Mazda3.

graphicguy

nyccarguy said:

Well...that's not good. Can you claim those "rashes" on the parking garage's insurance?

stickguy

breld said:

Took the wife's MINI in this morning for service and got a Countryman S as a loaner. I'm pretty impressed with it. Coming out of the wife's very basic model, the Countryman feels quite roomy, is an upgrade in smoothness and noise level, and is certainly much quicker. I like the seating position - I've always viewed them as a hatchback like a Golf, but it does feel as though you sit a bit higher and more upright (like the mini-SUV it's marketed as).

On one hand, I'm excited for the upgrades my wife will experience if/when she gets into a newer MINI. On the other hand, I can't help but think of all the funds I'd save over something like that over the SQ5. Obviously it doesn't compare, but that's certainly reflected in the price too.

That's probably just crazy thinking after taking my stepdaughter up to college yesterday for move-in day. Getting the first bill for tuition and room & board, and then paying a trip to the bookstore for all her textbooks makes me think I had it right with the Mazda3.

I just made payment 5 of 8 for the princess (2nd and last child). Now you know why I stayed out of the TDI fun. And drive a Sonota.

breld

Yup. Obviously I knew it was coming, but the reality is sobering.

With her, we started only a few years ago putting some money aside in a 529 plan - it's just about enough for this first bill, so that helps. We have two more (ages 11 and 13 now) to go, but we've been saving since they were little so should be in better shape.

nyccarguy

graphicguy said:

nyccarguy said:

Well...that's not good. Can you claim those "rashes" on the parking garage's insurance?

The one in the front of the car will be paid for by the parking lot owner. I got an estimate. He would like me to go to "his guy" for an estimate as well. It happened a while ago and I just haven't had time.

I have no idea when or where the scratch on the back happened. I'll obviously get it fixed at the same time as the front. It isn't deep which leads me to believe it mouthy come out with my orbital & some machine polish.

nyccarguy

@breld - I've heard from quite a few people I do business with that no matter how much you plan for college financially, it's almost never enough. Every time I start plotting to make a move, I hesitate. It's NOTHING compared to college tuition, but I've got 3 kids in day camp. If you want the cheapest rate, sign up deadline is today. There's $1,500 out the door. I had to shell out $1,700 for a partial hockey travel team payment, $500 for hockey camp for 2 kids next week.

qbrozen

It will be impossible by the time my kids start (oldest is 10), so I'm kind of not bothering. Pretty sure he isn't college material anyway. And, from what I can see, it just isn't worth it unless you are getting scholarships or unless you are going for something that REQUIRES college, such as a doctor or lawyer or some such thing. I cringe when I hear a niece or nephew is attending an expensive school to major in theatre or global studies or whatever other made-up thing.

@nycarguy I feel your pain. When my 2 were in Goddard at the same time, it was $2400/mo at the high point. Went down a little as the baby got older, but never below $1800/mo until the older one moved on to public school in 1st grade. Summer day camp is just as bad. August cost me $2200.

stickguy

One good thing about day dare, fancy summer camps, etc. you get used to the cash drain.

I have developed my own unique theories on how to pay for college. If you can be rich, it will also help!

breld

Well, I don't know - those day camps/sport camps definitely get you in the mindset of expenses for college. They're expensive!

Both my boys are just now starting a baseball program for the next several weeks - it's something like 6 hours every Sunday for 8 weeks or so. I think it's somewhere around $1,500 per kid. I suppose I should count myself lucky they haven't discovered hockey!

stickguy

At least baseball doesn't practice at 4 AM like hockey.

28firefighter

Wife and I already had to nail down daycare for Baby Boy 28FF because of the wait lists here in the Seattle area - some places told us that we should have been on waiting lists a year before we were expecting. Apparently a requirement for getting reasonable childcare in Seattle is being a psychic.

In any case, we got "lucky" and snagged a spot at a well regarded place not too far from our offices. Once he starts, it'll be just under $2100/month for infant care.

fintail

My sister is the director of a multi-branch daycare in the south sound. Indeed, there is money to be made, and room to grow in that business. Makes me appreciate more what my parents did back in the day (although sports camps were a lot cheaper vs wages 30 years ago, not to mention housing, etc).