Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

nyccarguy

I like @driver100 & all, but he is not what I'd consider a Chronic Car Buyer;)-

abacomike

nyccarguy said:

I like @driver100 & all, but he is not what I'd consider a Chronic Car Buyer;)-

I don't know, nyccarguy - he bought a 2013 Audi A4, a 2013 VW Passat for his Florida place, and a 2015 Mercedes E400.  Let's say he is "semi" Chronic!

Mr_Shiftright

Spotted a 2007 Porsche Cayman coupe for sale. Average miles but pricey at $18995 asking. I wonder what it's really worth these days? The Cayman is one of those rare cars where higher mileage is better than lower miles (how can that be?) because of the Cayman/Boxster engine defect which usually shows up early in the car's life. If you can get past 75K you're probably safe.

Wish it was an S though.

I should go drive it this week. Never drove a Cayman before.

nyccarguy

abacomike said:

nyccarguy said:

I like @driver100 & all, but he is not what I'd consider a Chronic Car Buyer;)-

I don't know, nyccarguy - he bought a 2013 Audi A4, a 2013 VW Passat for his Florida place, and a 2015 Mercedes E400.  Let's say he is "semi" Chronic!

You are right @abacomike. He qualifies!

abacomike

nyccarguy said:

nyccarguy said:

I like @driver100 & all, but he is not what I'd consider a Chronic Car Buyer;)-

I don't know, nyccarguy - he bought a 2013 Audi A4, a 2013 VW Passat for his Florida place, and a 2015 Mercedes E400.  Let's say he is "semi" Chronic!

You are right @abacomike. He qualifies!

And he is already considering a new C Class!

stickguy

just got back from our annual Holiday excursion through various parts of NYS, visiting family. Decided this year (largely because the weather forecast upstate was abnormally warm, and no chance of snow) to take the new car. Plus, I wanted to, and my daughter wanted to do a chunk of the driving and would rather she drove that. She did the NYC burbs to outside Albany run (about 2.5 hours), and did fine.

anyway, as to the Sonata. Turns out to have a huge trunk. Not only wasn't it a problem fitting everything, I had extra space (saying a lot since my wife packs real heavy). We did use 1/2 the back seat though (only 3 people helped here). So it carries a ton of stuff. It is also a great highway car. Rides well, comfy seats, good visibility, nice and quiet. eats miles, and feels the same at 65 and 85. Gotta watch the old speed creep! 75 is only about 2250 RPMs.

MPG even seems to be improving. Got about 30 on the trip up, though that included a day in the rain with some traffic and a bit of around town, plus the daughter (she does not have my obsession is hypermiling!). But, the 2nd tank, which included her driving up and me driving back (mostly highway) avearaged up to about 32. And the leg back, with me driving (and not babying it, mostly between 65 and 75) was just over 34. So I feel better that it really can pull good MPG, since after I got gas through home, which is part back roads, was about 33.

I'm guessing on a run down south, without all the NY hills, on a run without major traffic tie ups, averaging close to 35 is actually doable.

Oh, I have pretty much proved that the trip computer is just about 1 MPG optimistic over the calculator. I'll keep checking to see if that holds up. Also either the gas gauge is pessimistic, or the filler always clicks off early, because based on the gauge, MTE, etc. I expect to get more gas into it. If I ever pump it myself (doesn't happen in Jersey!) I will check to see.

anyway, it does seem to be an honest 500 mile highway car. Though I would have to let it run down lower (to no MTE or the light on) to figure out true capacity. Because if the MTE is close to accurate, the tank doesn't fill all the way up!

nyccarguy

I was hoping to not drag you guys into this, but I've gone from "let's see what we can do" to "it's not right" in a 24 hour period.

GM is running a 20% off vehicles in stock the longest promotion right now. There are also some additional $1500 in rebates available that I qualify for. On a $50,000 + AWD Buick Enclave it adds up to somewhere around $11 - $12K off sticker. Couple the healthy discount off sticker with a low interest rate (1.6%) and a high residual value (59%) & I calculate a lease payment that's about $325/month which is roughly half of what I pay for the Pilot right now. If I trade the Pilot in, I'd shoot for a price about $10K above my current payoff amount (to pocket & use towards my kitchen renno).

Or we could just keep the Pilot which has only 58K miles and keep paying it off until May 2016 which isn't all that far off.

Now I know the easy answer - punch the card, cut my payment in half, pocket $10K

Here's the problem. Every 20% off Enclave I look at on dealer websites has the standard 7 passenger seating (not the optional 8 passenger). 2 up front, 2 captain's chairs in the 2nd row, & 3 in the 3rd row. Our Pilot has seating for 8 (we've got a 2nd row bench). Now we've never had 8, we have fit 7 comfortably on quite a few occasions. When we go on vacation, we put all 3 kids in the 2nd row & use all the cargo space we can (for the 5 of us).

I had "the talk" with my wife who originally shot down the idea, then kept an open ear and told me to go look. The sticking point is not having that bench seat in the 2nd row. It's a super price, but if it doesn't work for us, there's no value in it.

Thoughts?

breld

I wouldn't worry too much about the 7 passenger vs 8 passenger, since it sounds like you never have had the need for 8. On a road trip, you could still have one side of the rear row down for luggage.

Tough call on whether you should do it or not. Having less than 18 months of payments left on the Pilot is tempting to just ride that out, but if you're just gonna want/need to swap it out at the end of the payoff anyway, maybe taking care of that now would be a good idea.

$325/month for a loaded up Enclave certainly sounds like a great deal.

Here's how I'd look at it - you're "paying" for depreciation one way or the other. Let's say you're paying $12k in depreciation on the Enclave (based on that $325 payment). How much will your Pilot depreciate over the next 3 years? Probably a bit less than that, but not much. So that differential is your "extra" cost for leasing the Enclave - and you get to "cash out" on the Pilot early. If it meets some short-term needs, may make sense.

And by the way, why wouldn't you "drag us into this"? If not us, who?

nyccarguy

@breld‌

On the 8 passenger vehicle, we can fit 7 comfortably. 8 would be a tight squeeze, especially with the car seat & booster seats. The 7 passenger vehicle would give us seating for 6 comfortably, and we'd loose cargo space.

stickguy

I'm willing to bet that the Enclave has more cargo room though, so that helps. Plus, if need be, can always toss a bag or box up top.

Or, bring less stuff!

anyway, I can't honestly believe you still get away with doing 3 abreast like that. maybe they are still too little, but how much longer will that last? Not that they will physically be unable to do it, but just for the "he's bothering me" factor. Might be easier to have the oldest get a private room (in a way!), with the other 2 spread out a little.

also, while you lose part of the 3rd row, you can a nice space in the middle. perfect for a cooler maybe? or just general storage. our dog used to like the lay there when we had the Odyssey.

I am looking at it this way. When the Pilot is paid off, you won't keep it long anyway, so you are just jumping a little ahead.

but one thing, make sure all those discounts and rebates count on a lease. Sometimes they cancel out, right?

roadburner

@nyccarguy

That 20% off deal is even tempting me- a Chevrolet dealer nearby has a loaded Camaro SS manual with nearly every option for $33k- $9000 off MSRP...

stickguy

I don't think I could drive a Camaro. I am only 6', but "sit tall" (long torso to leg ratio!), and from test sitting, it was very uncomfortable, and felt dangerous as to how poor visibility was. Plus, it just felt bad all around. I guess if you don't care about seeing out of the beast it is fine!

nyccarguy

stickguy said:

I'm willing to bet that the Enclave has more cargo room though, so that helps. Plus, if need be, can always toss a bag or box up top.

Or, bring less stuff!

anyway, I can't honestly believe you still get away with doing 3 abreast like that. maybe they are still too little, but how much longer will that last? Not that they will physically be unable to do it, but just for the "he's bothering me" factor. Might be easier to have the oldest get a private room (in a way!), with the other 2 spread out a little.

also, while you lose part of the 3rd row, you can a nice space in the middle. perfect for a cooler maybe? or just general storage. our dog used to like the lay there when we had the Odyssey.

I am looking at it this way. When the Pilot is paid off, you won't keep it long anyway, so you are just jumping a little ahead.

but one thing, make sure all those discounts and rebates count on a lease. Sometimes they cancel out, right?

I've got to make sure all the rebates "line up" plus see if I can get top dollar for my Pilot. That space in the middle can come in handy as a pass through. Right now they "flip over" the seats to get into the 3rd row or climb in through the tail gate.

Right now when we don't need all the space, usually the oldest & the princess (youngest) sit in the 2nd row while the middle guy sits in row 3. He's the only one that will fall asleep in the car if the stars align.

Bring less stuff? There's 5 of us!

qbrozen

Have you actually talked to a salesperson and found that offer about 20% off holds true? How do you determine which one on the website qualifies?

kyfdx

I'll note that if they are offering 20% off, then that's the market value of the vehicle... Sounds great, but what prices were they going for, after rebates, before this promotion?

nyccarguy

qbrozen said:

Have you actually talked to a salesperson and found that offer about 20% off holds true? How do you determine which one on the website qualifies?

Scratch that idea.  20% off cars cannot be leased.  

The 20% off cars are listed in inventory.  It shows the MSRP & the 20% discount.

Anyway, thanks for listening.  I'll be here all week.  Don't forget to tip your waitress;)

roadburner

The deal breaker on that Camaro is the Black on Black color scheme- I hate it. If it was burnt orange(Hugger?) I actually would give it a look.

Mr_Shiftright

My rule of thumb, for whatever it is worth: "Don't buy a vehicle for what it can do 5% of the time you use it".

nyccarguy said:

I was hoping to not drag you guys into this, but I've gone from "let's see what we can do" to "it's not right" in a 24 hour period.

GM is running a 20% off vehicles in stock the longest promotion right now. There are also some additional $1500 in rebates available that I qualify for. On a $50,000 + AWD Buick Enclave it adds up to somewhere around $11 - $12K off sticker. Couple the healthy discount off sticker with a low interest rate (1.6%) and a high residual value (59%) & I calculate a lease payment that's about $325/month which is roughly half of what I pay for the Pilot right now. If I trade the Pilot in, I'd shoot for a price about $10K above my current payoff amount (to pocket & use towards my kitchen renno).

Or we could just keep the Pilot which has only 58K miles and keep paying it off until May 2016 which isn't all that far off.

Now I know the easy answer - punch the card, cut my payment in half, pocket $10K

Here's the problem. Every 20% off Enclave I look at on dealer websites has the standard 7 passenger seating (not the optional 8 passenger). 2 up front, 2 captain's chairs in the 2nd row, & 3 in the 3rd row. Our Pilot has seating for 8 (we've got a 2nd row bench). Now we've never had 8, we have fit 7 comfortably on quite a few occasions. When we go on vacation, we put all 3 kids in the 2nd row & use all the cargo space we can (for the 5 of us).

I had "the talk" with my wife who originally shot down the idea, then kept an open ear and told me to go look. The sticking point is not having that bench seat in the 2nd row. It's a super price, but if it doesn't work for us, there's no value in it.

Thoughts?

thebean

nyccarguy said:

I like @driver100 & all, but he is not what I'd consider a Chronic Car Buyer;)-

This is exactly why I'm not reporting a punch for my 2015 Accord bought in December.  This is my first purchase since buying a 2002 Civic in April of 2002.  Now, if there is a group called "Hardly Ever Car Buyers" (but love to look & research), I could qualify for that one.  

nyccarguy

My Dad & I picked up his Tahoe on Saturday. Beautiful truck (as far as trucks go). The interior is gorgeous! I can't figure out for the life of me how something so big doesn't have the interior room of my wife's Pilot. I had to bring the Tahoe back to the dealer today because the NAV didn't work. Needs a new Antenna.

Speaking of, while I was at the Chevy dealer I spoke to the salesman about this 20% off deal. he told me they won't lease a 20% off car. I checked out a Traverse and it was OK, but nothing I was ready to jump on. Cockpit seemed OK, but the 2nd row captain's chairs and 3rd row bench just felt like park benches. Very thin and cheap. This was on a $48K LTZ Traverse mind you. Sticking with the Pilot.

Thanks for your help guys!

nyccarguy

roadburner said:

The deal breaker on that Camaro is the Black on Black color scheme- I hate it. If it was burnt orange(Hugger?) I actually would give it a look.

That would actually be a cool sort of stealth car for you. Black out the wheels and you've got yourself a decent car:)

qbrozen

Interesting.

Well, if anybody cares, Oasis Chevy in Old Bridge has several Camaros on their list, including 2 bright yellow SS models (automatics) and even a Z28. The Z is $61k down from $76k.

They also have a diesel Cruze automatic for $21.6k down from $27k.

roadburner

nyccarguy said:

roadburner said:

The deal breaker on that Camaro is the Black on Black color scheme- I hate it. If it was burnt orange(Hugger?) I actually would give it a look.

That would actually be a cool sort of stealth car for you. Black out the wheels and you've got yourself a decent car:)

It actually does look pretty cool; my aversion to black is primarily due to my 1,500 foot gravel driveway. Just like my black 1988 M6- I would never be able to keep the SS looking clean:

stickguy

simple answer. Pave the driveway.

roadburner

stickguy said:

simple answer. Pave the driveway.

Ever priced that? Around $60k for a 10' wide driveway...

slorenzen

roadburner said:

stickguy said:

simple answer. Pave the driveway.

Ever priced that? Around $60k for a 10' wide driveway...

Um, yeah, paving a 1500' driveway would put the hurt on buying any cars for a while.

Unless, of course, you won the lottery...

stickguy

what is more important, a little money or a clean car?

Priorities man, Priorities.

but it really costs that much for a basic asphalt layer on top of the stone? Though I guess that is slightly over 1/4 mile.

I would never buy a house with a gravel drive though. Of that I am sure.

suydam

I would definitely be a member of the Hardly Ever But Love to Look and Research club. I like to know what's out there for when I or a family member might buy. 

tommister2

@nyccarguy‌ are there any good lease deals on the Pilot right now? Maybe you could swing a similar deal on a Pilot lease and cash out of your old one for kitchen money. You know you want that power rear hatch

qbrozen

My house had a gravel driveway when we moved in. Wound up redoing it all in pavers. Big expensive project. Now, a few years later, seeing the state of it, I kinda wish we went with asphalt or even concrete. Oh well. At least I only paid about half price for it since it was the husband of a friend (at that time) of my wife.

roadburner

@rayainsw‌

I came across this puppy at the CJD dealer: 2015 Charger R/T




It's my wife's favorite so far. Nicely equipped, too- Super Track Pak[sic], upgraded audio, heated everything. Still, as nice as the ZF eight speed box is, I just don't think that I can deal with an automatic.

qbrozen

You really have to try it, RB. If they've programmed it right, you put that in manual mode and use the paddles, it will only shift when you tell it to. My 6-speed ZF in the bimmer was the best part about the car. It worked wonders at the track. It is part of the reason I want to go back to one now (PDK in the porsche). Manually shifting the Stang is .... quaint? in comparison. I tire of it.

tommister2

I came across this puppy at the CJD dealer: 2015 Charger R/T




It's my wife's favorite so far. Nicely equipped, too- Super Track Pak[sic], upgraded audio, heated everything. Still, as nice as the ZF eight speed box is, I just don't think that I can deal with an automatic.


Oh man those red seats are giving me flashbacks of the 80s. Had a few Fords with red/burgundy interiors like that.

nyccarguy

tommister2 said:

@nyccarguy‌ are there any good lease deals on the Pilot right now? Maybe you could swing a similar deal on a Pilot lease and cash out of your old one for kitchen money. You know you want that power rear hatch

Nah. If I'm going to stick with the Pilot, I'm going to stick with OUR Pilot. No sense in buying the exact same thing. I ran a quick calculation on Weymouth Honda's web page & it spit out about $426 per month for an EX-L w/ Nav 4WD. Yes cheaper than the $678 I pay right now, but if I did this I'd want to go "all in" and try to cash out and cut my payment in half (or get damn close to it). I know it isn't going to happen.

Michaell

nyccarguy said:

tommister2 said:

@nyccarguy‌ are there any good lease deals on the Pilot right now? Maybe you could swing a similar deal on a Pilot lease and cash out of your old one for kitchen money. You know you want that power rear hatch

Nah. If I'm going to stick with the Pilot, I'm going to stick with OUR Pilot. No sense in buying the exact same thing. I ran a quick calculation on Weymouth Honda's web page & it spit out about $426 per month for an EX-L w/ Nav 4WD. Yes cheaper than the $678 I pay right now, but if I did this I'd want to go "all in" and try to cash out and cut my payment in half (or get damn close to it). I know it isn't going to happen.

nyc - sorry to hear the Enclave lease idea didn't pan out. Seemed too good to be true - guess it was.

rb - I'm with Q on the idea of the paddles. I've been driving the wife's CX-7 the past few days (due to the snow we've had) and find that I can downshift almost to a complete stop on snowy / icy roads.

I need to look it up, but it seems that when the AWD kicks in on the Mazda, the bias is to the rear wheels. I've been doing slow drifts (10-20 MPH) around most corners and can hold it with just the right amount of throttle on these slippery roads. Channeling my inner Seb Loeb.

rayainsw

Bordello red seats???
Aside from that - and the black exterior - I like it...
- Ray
Still awaiting..............

ab348

I wish, if automakers are going to offer a red interior, that they offer a red interior, not a black interior with a few red bits. I want red seats, red door panels, red carpet, red dash and steering wheel -- I want red!!!

abacomike

ab348 said:

I wish, if automakers are going to offer a red interior, that they offer a red interior, not a black interior with a few red bits. I want red seats, red door panels, red carpet, red dash and steering wheel -- I want red!!!

My dad bought a brand new white 1956 Buick Roadmaster Convertible off the showroom floor.  It had red leather seats, red leather snap-on tonneau cover to cover the convertible top when it was down, red leather dash, red leather door panels and rear side panels and a bright white steerin wheel.  It had the Dynaflow transmission and that big 8 cylinder engine - I think it was a fire-ball 8.  The most gorgeous car I have ever seen.

Power windows, power seats, power everything.

venture

abacomike said:

ab348 said:

I wish, if automakers are going to offer a red interior, that they offer a red interior, not a black interior with a few red bits. I want red seats, red door panels, red carpet, red dash and steering wheel -- I want red!!!

My dad bought a brand new white 1956 Buick Roadmaster Convertible off the showroom floor.  It had red leather seats, red leather snap-on tonneau cover to cover the convertible top when it was down, red leather dash, red leather door panels and rear side panels and a bright white steerin wheel.  It had the Dynaflow transmission and that big 8 cylinder engine - I think it was a fire-ball 8.  The most gorgeous car I have ever seen.

Power windows, power seats, power everything.

Like this one?

abacomike

venture said:

ab348 said:

I wish, if automakers are going to offer a red interior, that they offer a red interior, not a black interior with a few red bits. I want red seats, red door panels, red carpet, red dash and steering wheel -- I want red!!!

My dad bought a brand new white 1956 Buick Roadmaster Convertible off the showroom floor.  It had red leather seats, red leather snap-on tonneau cover to cover the convertible top when it was down, red leather dash, red leather door panels and rear side panels and a bright white steerin wheel.  It had the Dynaflow transmission and that big 8 cylinder engine - I think it was a fire-ball 8.  The most gorgeous car I have ever seen.

Power windows, power seats, power everything.

Like this one?

Yep, but all white.  He had the real wire wheels and of course white-walls.

jayrider

abacomike said:

venture said:

ab348 said:

I wish, if automakers are going to offer a red interior, that they offer a red interior, not a black interior with a few red bits. I want red seats, red door panels, red carpet, red dash and steering wheel -- I want red!!!

My dad bought a brand new white 1956 Buick Roadmaster Convertible off the showroom floor.  It had red leather seats, red leather snap-on tonneau cover to cover the convertible top when it was down, red leather dash, red leather door panels and rear side panels and a bright white steerin wheel.  It had the Dynaflow transmission and that big 8 cylinder engine - I think it was a fire-ball 8.  The most gorgeous car I have ever seen.

Power windows, power seats, power everything.

Like this one?



Yep, but all white.  He had the real wire wheels and of course white-walls.

Pops was a player back in the day.

sda

abacomike said:

venture said:

ab348 said:

I wish, if automakers are going to offer a red interior, that they offer a red interior, not a black interior with a few red bits. I want red seats, red door panels, red carpet, red dash and steering wheel -- I want red!!!

My dad bought a brand new white 1956 Buick Roadmaster Convertible off the showroom floor.  It had red leather seats, red leather snap-on tonneau cover to cover the convertible top when it was down, red leather dash, red leather door panels and rear side panels and a bright white steerin wheel.  It had the Dynaflow transmission and that big 8 cylinder engine - I think it was a fire-ball 8.  The most gorgeous car I have ever seen.

Power windows, power seats, power everything.

Like this one?



Yep, but all white.  He had the real wire wheels and of course white-walls.

And with the 4 portholes, it was the top of the line, sweet.

abacomike

@sda‌
@venture

I remember my Dad, Mom, my twin brother and I traveled from New York City to Miami Beach Florida in that Buick Roadmaster convertible back in 1956 for a vacation and to visit my grandmother who lived on South Beach (Miami Beach).  The trunk on that Roadmaster was huge and carried every last piece of luggage.  The thing I remember most about that trip was the fact that we drove through every town, village and city along US 1 and US 301 from north to south.  There were no interstates at the time, but I believe the Garden State Parkway was in existence in New Jersey.

I remember stopping in Lumberton, N.C., at a motel on the way south (the Redwood  Lodge)and at South of the Border motel on the S.C. Border on the way back.  Don't ask me how I remember back when I was 12 years old, but I do.

What at a car that was!

nyccarguy

@Michaell‌

Hey, I guess it just wasn't meant to be;)

@tommister2‌

I've also taken steps to assure our Pilot's long term service - synthetic oil changes, brake fluid flush, transmission fluid change, new tires, a VTM-4 fluid change, brakes...

corvette

@nyccarguy:
It's not in the spirit of this group to say this, but keeping your Pilot is kind of like buying a used car where you know the previous owner and have all the service records.

abacomike

corvette said:

@nyccarguy: It's not in the spirit of this group to say this, but keeping your Pilot is kind of like buying a used car where you know the previous owner and have all the service records.

Heresy - pure and simple!

Michaell

nyccarguy said:

@Michaell‌

Hey, I guess it just wasn't meant to be;)

Oh well.

The CX-7 went past 60k on the odo today. Need to make a few phone calls to see who will do the service cheaper - the dealer or my local Midas, where I've had the past few oil changes done.

First step is to review the manual to see what it says needs to be done.

Mr_Shiftright

tiny wire wheels on a big car look like coaster wheels on a shopping cart. Really messes up that car's lines. Looks like mobile home aluminum windows on an old Victorian, to my eye.

qbrozen

My Porsche salesman asked me a question about my Mustang yesterday morn, then disappeared. hmmm...

In my readings, I discovered I need to up my build a bit. While I figured I didn't need 20" wheels, I did not realize that they come with far wider tires. That's important to me. I have a couple of choices in the build sheet, but the cheapest ones, at $1200, aren't terribly attractive. The $1600 ones are far better (Spyder RS wheels). Sigh. Now I am starting to understand "how they get ya." I tried to see if I could sacrifice elsewhere to get back below that $60k barrier, but it doesn't look good. We'll have to see how it all pans out. Maybe they'll give me a discount (gasp!) or maybe better trade than I anticipate. Ya never know. And, if it comes down to a few hundred bucks, I could give up the heated steering wheel.

Is this whole thing simply a fantasy? Maybe. I keep trying to find something less expensive that makes better sense and I'd be happy with, but no luck thus far.

Mr_Shiftright

It takes a Mighty Man to defeat the dreaded monster--"The Porsche Options List". Many have tried, few succeed in this quest. Good luck. Many brilliant German minds have stayed up long hours to devise this labyrinth.