Honda Odyssey 2005+

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Comments

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,553
    aas of Friday evening, my local dealer (southern NJ) had 3 tourings (at least) available. 1 on the floor, and 2 outside available to drive. Not sure if they had any others in stock.

    I think 1 was base touring, and 1 for sure was navi/res. I think the 3rd was base also.

    So, at least tourings seem to be available, and IMHO, at these prices, they will be a much slower seller than Honda expects. The EX will probably be a much bigger hit, with the EX-L for the luxo folks that need their leather or moonroof.

    Still havent' seen an LX in person. Wonder if they actually make them? Of the 5 that I saw personally in 2 visits to my dealer, 4 were tourings, and one was an EX-L

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • torquetorque Member Posts: 14
    Touring...Torque steer...pulling to right...Danger? Should I cancel my order and go with Sienna AWD? Or is there a CURE ?

    Reality check...there is no Ody AWD !

    Let us focus on dealing with what we've got.

    Thanks.

    Ty
  • torquetorque Member Posts: 14
    Can two car seats go into the third row using the LATCH system with top tethers ?

    The brochure says LATCH only in middle position of the third row. The touring that I saw only seemed to have Latch and a top tether in the middle position. Furthermore the tether seems to be in odd postion. It transverses the cargo area behind the third row and attaches near the hatch door, effectively dividing the cargo area in two. Most modern day top tethers that I have seen attach to the back of the seat.

    So it seems that Honda, unlike Toyota, does not support two carseats in the third row using Latch. It is possible to retrofit for LATCH and reposition the tether so that it doesn't transect the cargo area ?
  • ac00lraac00lra Member Posts: 69
    You don't give up, do you? How many people actually bought Sienna with AWD. How many percent is that? And I supposed the rest of those who bought the non-AWD Sienna are in danger also?? Why don't you go post in the Sienna and tell everyone they should buy AWD Sienna only and the non-AWD Sienna is very unsafe and suffer lots of torque steer because it's FWD only.

    And again, there's a separate thread for the AWD vs FWD discussion now. You should post there only. This one is getting old.
  • ezuckerezucker Member Posts: 34
    I've been driving a 2000 Odyssey for nearly 5 years, and not once have I noticed any torque steer. Why would the 2005 Odyssey be any more likely to demonstrate torque steer?

    -- EVAN
  • revitrevit Member Posts: 476
    So how many minivans does Toyota produce actually have AWD?

    The people that would buy this are the same ones that think they need a full size SUV solely to drive to Walmart once a week.

    AWD may seem impressive to some, but a minivan is a minivan! Seems like some people can't admit to just a few of the more important deciding factors:

    - Odyssey is the only minivan to come equipped with dedicated side impact sensors for all three rows

    - Odyssey is the only minivan to offer a rollover sensor that deploys the side curtain bags in the event of a rollover.

    - Odyssey also earns the highest overall EPA rating for any vehicle in its class.

    - Odyssey is the first minivan to utilize Michelin PAX System run-flat tire technology for enhanced safety and security with continuous mobility of up to 150 miles at 50mph following a tire puncture.

    - A comprehensive list of advanced safety features delivered as standard equipment on all models including anti-lock brakes (ABS), advanced front and front side airbags, three-row side curtain airbags with rollover sensor (a minivan first), and Vehicle Stability Assist (VSA(R)) with Traction Control.

    - Odyssey has the best in class third leg room.

    - Industry-leading Honda Satellite-Linked Navigation SystemTM with expanded Voice Recognition capabilities has new features including rearview camera and Zagat survey information for restaurants.

    Granted the Sienna is a good minivan, but the new Odyssey just raised the bar in the minivan class yet again and is now the benchmark by which all other minivans are judged.

    So if you have to buy a Toyota, stop complaining about their product and write to Toyota and complain to them to get on the ball.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    I've had two friends buy Siennas. One bought an XLE with pkg. 9 when they came out, without AWD because there really wasn't a need for one and one couldn't be found. The other friend bought an LE AWD (I forget the package) because AWD was available and the dealer would deal on the AWD model. I drive a 2002 Odyssey, FWD, and during one heavy snow and iced winter in Ohio, it did great.
  • revitrevit Member Posts: 476
    Exactly...for the majority of consumers looking at a minivan, AWD is of little interest. Also, the new Odyssey has traction control which again is more than sufficient.
  • lumbarlumbar Member Posts: 421
    Regarding your reproduction of Honda advertising copy, considering how much it costs in real world terms, is there some reason why the Odyssey -shouldn't- have "raised the bar"? Believe it or not, some people still shop with a measure of value in mind and make decisions as to which "advances" they need and which they do not. I could care less about PAX or 1 extra MPG, but I certainly give Honda credit for some of the safety features like the roll-over sensor.

    And while I agree that the existence of AWD shouldn't be the paramount consideration for most people buying a mini-van, there's certainly nothing wrong with opting for it if an already highly competitive vehicle (Sienna) offers it.
  • oldieoldie Member Posts: 6
    I just brought an EX-L last week. The 8th seat can fit on a touring but there will be no seat belt. The 3-point seat belt of the 8th seat is inside the roof.
  • revitrevit Member Posts: 476
    Actually, you are incorrect! The information presented was not a "reproduction of Honda advertising copy", but simply the facts.

    As for value, you are exactly correct. Seems to be this big emphasis on here simply for AWD which again most people just don't need and one wonders why pay the added expense. As for Honda not offering it, it is probably due to the lack of demand for it and figure if you are looking for AWD, then the Honda Pilot is really what you should be looking at.
  • ace1000ace1000 Member Posts: 151
    In its test of the 2005 Acura RL, MotorWeek discusses why it is "nearly impossible" for AWD to handle as well as 2WD. I continue this discussion in the AWD vs. FWD forum where we are suppose to discuss it.
  • awdmanawdman Member Posts: 7
    If you want to go that forum, you and the rest of the "politically correct" can go there.

    New Odyssey especially touring model is having "torque steering problems" as repeatedly
    Sited on this web site.

    Here’s a quote from the MotorWeek review-On wet and sloppy roads, the SH-AWD works much like other all-wheel drive systems with traction control. The nominal 70/30 front to rear torque split can be reversed, with any one of the rear tires capable of getting all of the available power. But it is dry road handling that makes the all-wheel drive RL so unique and enjoyable. Without being reckless, we just couldn't force the RL out of its smoother cornering lines. The words safe, secure, and solid played over and over again around every bend.

    I don’t know, but the words, safe, secure, and solid played over and over again around every bend, sure makes me wish the Odyssey had that.

    For those of you who suggest AWD is on Pilot, one very important fact you are omitting.
    There is no Side Curtain Air Bags for 2nd and 3rd rows.
    Let me repeat that for you: There is no Side Curtain Air Bags for 2nd and 3rd rows.

    Of course those of you who wouldn’t want AWD, probably could care less about that little omission. But for a lot of us here safety is a major concern for our families.

    And vehicles without AWD or side air curtain protection is a glaring omission of features that should be options for those that want it.

    Of course Honda’s claims to be a safety company, leave a lot to be desired.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    "Of course Honda’s claims to be a safety company, leave a lot to be desired"

    Come on. Honda is making standard side curtain airbags standard accross its model line, along with traction control and VSC. All models are included, including the Civic DX. Name one other car company doing that right now. (except for luxury car companies)
  • dannodanno Member Posts: 114
    So go ahead and buy the RL or Sienna XLE AWD for $40,000 - $48,000 and be happy in your safe AWD world. The other 99% of us poor unsafe plebs will be more than happy with the FWD 2005 Ody.

    BTW - I currently own a FWD van and AWD Escape. I feel safe in both in all types of weather - especially since I have dedicated snows for both vehicles.
  • revitrevit Member Posts: 476
    Please remove postings here by awdman as they are off topic and belong in the AWD vs. FWD forum.

    Thanks!
  • graystricklandgraystrickland Member Posts: 51
    Kukks_99,

    Since the EX-L has an XM capable tuner in it already, why would you want to use your "XM Roady" in the Odyssey? I sincerly hope that that the answer is *not* that your XM subscription is tied to your Roady, making the in-dash XM tuner useless to you.

    Although I've had a $9.95/month Real Rhapsody on-demand music subscription for over a year (and continue think it is the best bargain in the world of entertainment), I have shied away from buying an XM (or Sirius) tuner and subscription so far. However, having an XM tuner in the Odyssey may push me into buying a subscription for it.
  • planomateoplanomateo Member Posts: 12
    Can whoever keeps CRYING about the AWD discussion drop it? The Odyssey doesn't have AWD and therefore we don't need to keep beating a dead horse on this subject.

    Seriously....
  • player4player4 Member Posts: 362
    Thank You!!!! You guys think that Honda is gonna add AWD to the ODy just because you guys say so? If Honda didnt add AWD is because they know what they are doing and im sure they have better reasons that all of us do. Now stop crying maybe we'll get it for the facelift later on!!!
  • redirectorredirector Member Posts: 27
    AWDman sounds like a tort lawyer politician..., if you don't agree with him then you are against safety for families, and all car lines without AWD are death traps. Give it a rest.

    By your logic, Honda should not make motorcycles or the S2000. But, since neither have 2nd rows, the lack of side curtain airbags mean they're aren't plagued by the "glaring omission" that dogs the horribly unsafe Pilot.

    If you are really so concerned about safety then buy a Peterbilt, or an RV. Or does the lack of 2nd row side curtain airbags make those unsafe too? I am so sick of this that I am now violating my own lurking rule and adding to the anti-AWD frenzy.

    I own a Pilot and an Odyssey. How about this: If Honda EVER adds AWD as an option to the Odyssey I will NEVER buy another Honda again. Adding that feature would would drive up the line's total manufacturing cost, and lower the availability of regular unsafe Odysseys.

    Since I vote for Honda with my wallet, I think my view will cancel out your "vote".
  • jmatthewsjmatthews Member Posts: 10
    Just took delivery of my new Touring. Does anybody have any thoughts about rubber floormats? I like the snap together carpet mats that come in the Odyssey, but I know they will get soiled. I'm a new Honda person. What is the conventional wisdom on good source of rubber floor mats? Do the Honda mats look good and work well with the snap in carpet mats?
  • jmatthewsjmatthews Member Posts: 10
    Just took delivery of my new Touring. Does anybody have any thoughts about rubber floormats? I like the snap together carpet mats that come in the Odyssey, but I know they will get soiled. I'm a new Honda person. What is the conventional wisdom on good source of rubber floor mats? Do the Honda mats look good and work well with the snap in carpet mats?
  • revitrevit Member Posts: 476
    Exactly...Honda knows what they are doing...and again, look at how many units Toyota actually sold last year in relation to the total number.
  • anonymouspostsanonymousposts Member Posts: 3,802
    Calm down before this whole topic gets shut down.

    I'm sure AWD is GREAT if you NEED/WANT it. However, if you are a competent driver and don't need/want AWD the Odyssey is a terrific van. The Odyssey is far from unsafe or undrivable without it. Just as base Sienna's aren't death traps even though they don't include side curtain airbags and VSC.
  • revitrevit Member Posts: 476
    Interesting that Toyota claims "One thing that hasn't changed is Sienna's tradition of safety". Such an accurate statement as safety seems unimportant by making important safety feature optional instead of standard...very disappointing.

    Stability and traction control:

    Toyota Sienna - Optional
    Honda Odyssey - Standard

    Three-row side curtain airbags:

    Toyota Sienna - Optional
    Honda Odyssey - Standard (includes roll over sensor)
  • vpatelvpatel Member Posts: 17
    Try mats.com or use yahoo and type 2005 odyssey accessories.It will list a few dealers that will sell online at a lower price than your local dealer.
    GOOD LUCK!!!!!
  • lumbarlumbar Member Posts: 421
    The voice of reason--thank you.

    I'm trying to figure where I fit in between the AWD-at-any-cost crowd, and the "ban the posts" crowd.
  • lumbarlumbar Member Posts: 421
    Does the word "copyright" ring a bell?
  • minyiminyi Member Posts: 27
    I do not wish to offend anyone for their preferrence on FWD or AWD. I am just wondering what exactly do you want to do with this "mini van" with AWD? This is a minivan not a rally race car. I bet most us would not even feel nor need AWD for 99% of the time. I am sure someone would say that 1% counts, but come on. No matter how you put it, it is a still minivan. I bet even with AWD, it will not be that much different with the existing chassi, weifght distribution, driving characteristics...etc There are so many other factors contributing to the safty of a car. Just putting a AWD system on a same car would not dramatically change the character of a car. In my opinion, putting a "performance" tires would make it safer than AWD by itself.

    If AWD is what you really believe safer, get a SUV, ot even Sienna. There are many choices, and many are selling really cheap nowadays...
  • aab4aab4 Member Posts: 39
    This is not meant to offend, and you are not.

    Obviously honda bigots don't want to discuss issue, because Honda doesn't have that option with AWD. And of course they want to attack position, and when they can't win argument, they want it moved off "their board". Think they forgot, it's not their board.
    The board belongs to Edmunds and is open to the public!

    Several problems you have in your statement.

    Sienna is a Van, and the new odyssey is being positioned as "Performance(Handling), and Safety.

    Big plus in my book for Sienna. Again that's my preference, may not be yours.

    Another problem, Honda makes 2 SUV's with AWD, the Pilot and Acura MDX.

    The new touring addition with the run flat tires is also experiencing "torque steering problems".

    These are important issues to be openly discussed, and of course the Honda Bigots don't want that. Just like the transmission problems, which oh by the way, is the same transmission still being used 05 Odyssey.

    Pilot doesn't have side air curtains for all three rows. What's up with that.

    Putting performance tires improves traction for performance, not for all weather capability. AWD is the answer.

    So if you want a Van with Side Air Curtains and AWD, you are correct, Sienna would be top choice.
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,553
    The market place (aka consumers) determined that AWD in a minivan is a niche product. Toyota sells a very small percentage of Siennas with AWD. Chrysler offered it for a number of years, and sales were so slow the discontinued it.

    Winter tires make more of a difference in snow than which wheels are driving the car. Some of the car magazines have done tests to prove this. They have also proven that AWD does NOT help with braking, which is significantly more important than getting traction from a stop (for safety), but the winter tires help with traction.

    It's obvious by now that some people think AWD is a must have. Since Honda made a business decision not to produce an AWD version of the ody, they determined that they can live without your business, so buy something else (the Sienna if you want a minivan, or an SUV).

    This does not make Honda evil, or their products unsafe. It just means that they didn't feel they could sell enough vans to make up for the additional development costs, etc. If hundreds of thousands of buyers were voting with their pocket books and shunning the Ody, I imagine they would tool one up.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • dexdex Member Posts: 42
    I need someone's help and advise regarding the PAX tire system. I am a logical person and logic tells me it must be great if Honda has gone to all this trouble. Does the PAX system somewhere lessen your chance of getting a flat or is it just a Michelin tire which allows you to drive a few extra miles when you have a flat? My understanding is:
    PROS
    1. You can drive for about 25 miles after you get a flat. Will it warn you that you have a flat (I don't always realise that I have a flat until it's obvious).
    CONS
    1. On a family trip to Florida or elsewhere, if you get a flat and you are in the 'boondocks', you are royally screwed since the nearest local Honda dealer is probably many many miles away. Yes they may pay for a hotel stay but that does help when you are on a family trip and do not want to be delayed. You CANNOT change the tire yourself !!

    2. Very few tire places can work with the PAX system, will probably need to go to a Honda dealer.

    3. You will pay a premium every time you need to replace a tire.

    Somebody, please advise.
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,553
    your points are all valid re: PAX. They do have a tire pressure monitioring system to let you know if the pressure is low.

    basically, it is just a fancy wheel/tire version of run flat technology that you can already buy. The purpose is the same 9to allow you to drive a short distance after a flat to get to someplace that can take care of the tire).

    The best thing that can happen is for other manufacturers to follow Honda's lead and adopt the PAX system. once that happens, more tire shops will get the equipment needed, prices will come down, etc.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • mkjj123mkjj123 Member Posts: 18
    I drove an 05 Ody EX that didn't have the 6-to-3 engine, just the full-time 6 cylinder. I drove the Touring and thought the ride was hard over bumps, but the EX w/out the PAX tires was much smoother (maybe it was all in my head). However I tried the EX on the highway and noticed wind noise throughout. I also noticed a hum from the engine when holding a steady RPM. Stepping on the gas caused it to go away and acceleration was very quite, but the hum really bothered me. Now I was purposely listening for these noises; no radio, minimal conversations, etc., so it may not be as noticeable in 'real-life'.

    Has anyone else noticed this hum?

    I'm going to try the EX-L (this is what we would purchase) to see if maybe it was just that particular vehicle or maybe the full-time 6 cylinder engine.

    Thanks
  • dexdex Member Posts: 42
    Thanks Stickguy for your response. Just wanted to let you all know that for a test I got the Honda/Acura roadside number and called them. I waited 21 minutes before they answered my call. I told them that I had a new Odyssey with PAX and that I was stranded in the boonies and needed help. They said it would be 1 hour before they could get someone to me and that I could ride with the towtruck to the nearest Honda. I then told her that there were 5 of us in the Odyssey. She suggested I get a taxi and said I could try and get reimbursed for the taxi but she was not sure. I then told her this was a test call and she was OK with that. Bottom line is that it was disappointing, I expected a much faster response from Honda. BTW, Honda did tell me that you could drive 125-150 miles at 55mph after you get a flat. That at least was encouraging.
  • grayghostgrayghost Member Posts: 23
    AWD definitely makes a difference. Respectfully, if it were only for 1% of the time (per you, which I don't agree with), that 1% may be the time when my family is in the vehicle and we are near a drop off. Ask yourself, is YOUR family worth it? Yes, it's a mini-van but it's not the vehicle it's the contents that matter. I've checked out the Sienna, the new Odyssey is just plain better!
  • ace1000ace1000 Member Posts: 151
    Here is some information about winter driving on the Touring models, and it has nothing to do with AWD! The Owner's Manual says on page 351 that there are no snow tires compatible with the PAX system. It then says:

    Do not replace the PAX system tires and wheels with conventional tires and wheels. Doing so would disable the PAX system and the tire pressure monitoring system (TPMS), and may VOID YOUR NEW VEHICLE WARRANTY. [The caps are mine]

    I read this to mean that Honda could void your warranty if you use a set of conventional wheels with snow tires during the winter.
  • chacha Member Posts: 16
    Odyssey with AWD would have been even been better.

    Especially the new Honda SH-AWD. That looks like a great system.

    Odyssey Touring with Run Flat is a little too harsh for a family vehicle, and speaking of family, I totally agree. AWD is just superior in wet conditions to FWD, so for me it’s a option I wish Odyssey did have. For me I want my family in an AWD vehicle.

    People might not think they need it, but once you drive with AWD, it's tough to go back to FWD.

    Odyssey handles better than Sienna, but they are the top two Vans in my book. Some prefer the drive of an Lexus to an Acura, a little more luxurious and not as sporty which is what the Sienna is to Odyssey. You won't go wrong with either one of these vans.
  • chacha Member Posts: 16
    Don't worry no AWD issuse.

    The run flat tires have been around, especially in Europe, but are not a big seller. The Sienna has a similar version, and they do ride harsher. In Sienna’s case it actually makes
    The Sienna feels a little more like the Odyssey.

    The biggest problem is people think they won't get flats, which is not the case. They still can get punctured, but The Pax system allows a tire to run flat for more than 120 miles at 50 mph. Changing a run flat tire is only done at in this case, Michelin or Honda.

    Bridgestone's competing run-flat tire system is standard on the BMW Z8 and Z4, and optional on the BMW 5 and 7 series. The system is also on Toyota's Sienna minivan and optional on the Lexus SC 430 and Infiniti Q45.
    Using a run-flat tire for the Odyssey makes sense, says Tsunemi Tachibana, an analyst at Nikko City Group in Tokyo. "It provides a sense of security, which is key for a family car."
    Funny isn’t that what AWD does?
  • ohmsterohmster Member Posts: 7
    Hi, I have a deposit down on a Desert Rock/Ivory that probably won't make it to my driveway until Christmas....I have the opportunity to get a Silver w/Black interior very shortly.

    I haven't seen the black interior. Any comments? I'm not too worried about the heat as we cover all the kiddie seats with towels...

    Ohmster
  • grayghostgrayghost Member Posts: 23
    One of my main sources for this information is http://www.paxsystem.com
    The PAX tire is a specially designed tire that consists of a larger wheel/rim, and a tire designed to grip the wheel/rim in the event of sudden deflation. The vehicle can be driven up to 125 miles at a speed up to 55 MPH in normal conditions (even, flat surface, etc..). An indicator on the dash tells you how many miles you have left before you NEED to stop driving.
    The Odyssey's that have the PAX system still have a convention jack, and the space place a regular tire.
    The price of the PAX 'tire' is just a little over a regular tire. The cost of replacing an entire assembly is said to be between $400-$500. But it should not be necessary to replace an entire assembly unless you impact the wheel/rim assembly somehow.
  • hifisoftwarehifisoftware Member Posts: 69
    I've seen Touring with black interior. It looks good to me. I actually liked it better then gray or ivory. My wife said that dark interior make inside look smaller... To me it felt more refined, not smaller.

    I am also thinking about silver/black. I currently have 03 Accord like this and in Southern California it does not seems to get extremely hot. We do usually leave windows open just in bit and always remote open windows before getting into the car.
  • mr_molinattomr_molinatto Member Posts: 1
    Here is what I do know. You can travel up to 125 miles at 50 mph or less on a PAX run-flat tire system. Michelin will send a replacement to the nearest dealer. If you cannot make it to a michelin dealer, they will bring the replacement to you. The tire pressure monitoring system does warn you that a tire is below air pressure specifications as well as when the run-flat system has been activated and how long you have to operate on the flat tire. This system has also been used on some high end Bentley models, so it has been tested in the field. Once in run flat mode the wheel rides on a composite ring that is around the center of the wheel instead of riding on the side-wall. That way when flat your tire tread is still flat on the ground. My guess is that the only reason there is a 125 mile limit for travel is due to heat. (Air in a tire dissipates heat.)
  • rvc888rvc888 Member Posts: 3
    The black interior is very nice. Looks more refined. The dash is also very nice with a black and metallic combo. I have the black/black touring nav/res. Love it. The little extras on the touring are definitely worth it.
  • rvc888rvc888 Member Posts: 3
    The highway noise of our touring '05 is minimal compared to our '02 Odyssey. I haven't noticed the hum.
  • hocahoca Member Posts: 2
    we have the 05 Odyssey EX-L. brought it on the highway and immediately notice wind noise coming from the front. We haven't notice the humming sound.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    If you need AWD, Toyota will sell you a car. But I think that the automakers have determined that the AWD Minivan market is very limited, since Chrysler discontinued its AWD Grand Caravan and Town & Country. The GMC Safari, Chevrolet Astro, Chevrolet Venture, Chevrolet Uplander, Saturn Relay, Buick Terrazza, Pontiac Montana, Pontiac Montana SV6 and Toyota Sienna all offer AWD, if you need it. Honda didn't make AWD available for a reason, because it probably determined that this is a niche market, not very popular, and not worth the extra production expenses to justify building an AWD Odyssey.
  • scottphillipscottphillip Member Posts: 249
    Power passenger seat...

    The Toyota has it, and I cannot understand why they don't offer it on the Honda. I do enjoy driving the Honda better.
  • rorrrorr Member Posts: 3,630
    One other little tidbit (rumor) regarding the PAX system:

    Since the vehicles suspension must be designed specifically for the PAX system, the owner can NOT replace the rims with conventional rims using conventional tires. According to other posts here in Edmunds, the owners manual states that installation of conventional rims will VOID your new vehicle warantee.

    If, for whatever reason, the owner is dissatisfied with their PAX tires (excessive wear, noise, ride, cost, etc.), tough. No one else makes tires, of any kind, to fit the PAX rims. Changing rims so you CAN have a choice will void your warantee. And as of this date, Michelin does not manufacture snow tires for the PAX rims.

    If someone here has a touring model, I would be interested if they can verify whether or not the warantee is voided if conventional rims are installed.
  • ac00lraac00lra Member Posts: 69
    According to Michlein press release, they have licensed the technology to Pirelli, Dunlop, Toyo, and a few others. It won't be long before those guys jump on the bandwagon once the sales and use of the Ody Touring became widespread. You might have a problem if you look for it at Costco only. But I don't think you'll have problem finding places to fix or repair, at least not in California (outside of Death Valley). Heh.
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