Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

isellhondas

uplanderguy said:

andre, I actually had two high school friends who got new '75 Monza 2+2 V8's. 'Envious' isn't the word! One was an orange one with saddle cloth, and the other was red with sandalwood (light) vinyl. Both were AT's and PS and PB. I anxiously awaited one appearing at our dealer's, and none showed up until Feb. '75 which made me think there were production issues. I've subsequently seen very-early ones and they had chrome-edging on the B-pillar vents, but by the time my friends got theirs, it was just silver paint there. The red one was actually a regional rep's car and had 2,600 miles when my friend got it, still in '75.

Those cars started at $300 more than a Camaro, base price!

At the time, I thought they were magnificent-looking. Not quite as much so today .

A Vega-sized car with a V8 was cool to me...and they sounded neat.

That said, both wore out the Firestone radials quickly up front, and I could hear the brakes coming down our street half-a-block away. That's no joke.

The '76 supposedly addressed these areas, but I didn't like the new instrument panel nearly as well, nor the extra, square 'corners' they put on the rear bumpers.

Both of my friends' cars stickered at $4,800-odd....about the same as a new Impala (not 'S') 4-door with whitewalls, wheelcovers, AT, PS, PB, radio.

The red one is still owned by my friend, although he's really not my friend anymore.

The orange one was owned by a family who viewed cars as disposable and by '80 or so, it looked like crap.

Both cars tended to lose their nice-looking wheelcovers easily. The red one is now mounted on factory Monza aluminum wheels.

Replacing the spark plugs on those glorified Vegas was a nightmare! You had to remove the motor mounts and jack the engine up. Even after doing that it was miserable!

stickguy

Craig, I looked at a V8 monza in around 1979. The mechanic that inspected it said it was in good shape, but to not bring it there for plugs! passed on it due to $ though. Darned fun with a stick however. Silver over red. Looked like stainless steel to new at the time. And futuristic for the times (a hatchback)

sda

stickguy said:

Craig, I looked at a V8 monza in around 1979. The mechanic that inspected it said it was in good shape, but to not bring it there for plugs! passed on it due to $ though. Darned fun with a stick however. Silver over red. Looked like stainless steel to new at the time. And futuristic for the times (a hatchback)

Thankfully the Buick V6 wasn't too bad. If memory serves it was a bit tight around the ac evaporator, but only patience required.

stickguy

I liked my '67 Camaro 6 cyl. You could literally stand in the engine compartment next to the engine. On either side. If you couldn't work on that engine, you should not be near a car with tools.

uplanderguy

I remember, the loosening of a motor mount to get to one plug on the Monza V8, didn't make itself known until after my friends both had their cars. I'm sure the owners of the orange one never had a tune-up done, and the owner of the red one was the son of a Chevy-Buick Service Manager. I remember the son (my friend) saying, "Ah, only every 22,500 miles, not a big deal." As of a decade ago, the car only had 40K miles. I bet a whole lot of those cars went without that one spark plug ever being changed.

The Mustang II V8's battery had to come out to change plugs, but that's preferable to the Monza for sure!

steine13

Subtract a zero maybe?

http://palmsprings.craigslist.org/cto/4856840295.html

"[..] It has all the bells and whistles and everything works, including the factory A/C. Although, it will need to be recharged."

Like, wow. Classy.

isellhondas

So...the a/c "works" only it blows hot air. OK, I understand.

uplanderguy

I wish I had a dime for every car advertised with "A/C needs recharged"...that, and "ran when parked".

isellhondas

Yeah, the A/C needs a charge because all of the Freon leaked out from several different areas.

How about "It probably needs a fuse or it has a loose wire"

Or.." It just needs to be driven"

" It's probably bad gas"

" That ought to rub out"

" I'm sure it's something minor"

" The bands probably just need to be adjusted"

texases

The description on the DuPont Registry ad is HILARIOUS. In part:

"Dr. Aldo Gucci explained that "this car was designed to give a fortunate few owners a rare possession of distinction, beauty and ultimate luxury". Only 200 of these limited production Cadillacs were made. In 1979 these retailed for $23,000! Who could have afforded these extravagant, ultra luxurious Sevilles by Gucci? Sammy Davis Jr. owned one. So did Luciano Pavarotti. David Ruffin owned two of them! Today, less than 7 of them remain roadworthy in the world. Of the 3 colors that were available, Cotillion White was the rarest with only 11 produced in 1979. These Sevilles were built by International Automotive Designs and sold exclusively at Braman Cadillac in, where else but, Miami Florida This priceless, rear-wheel drive beauty has less than 20,000 original miles(that's right, ORIGINAL)!"

The only thing "priceless" about the car is this ad...

andre1969

sda said:

stickguy said:

Craig, I looked at a V8 monza in around 1979. The mechanic that inspected it said it was in good shape, but to not bring it there for plugs! passed on it due to $ though. Darned fun with a stick however. Silver over red. Looked like stainless steel to new at the time. And futuristic for the times (a hatchback)

Thankfully the Buick V6 wasn't too bad. If memory serves it was a bit tight around the ac evaporator, but only patience required.

On the Buick engines, the spark plugs pointed up slightly (Pontiac and Olds too), but on the Chevy they pointed downward. I wonder if that's why the Chevy V-8 models had to be jacked up a bit?

isellhondas

That small block V8 was, literally shoehorned into that engine bay!

My buddy put a built 327 into his Vega years ago. I took a ride in it ONCE! It was terrifying especially since
he left the Vega brake system on it!

The first time he got on it, the body flexed and the windshield broke! He had to gusset things up as I recall.

fintail

David Ruffin had two? Only sold in that bastion of taste and class known as Miami? Whatever the price, it isn't enough...

A MB 6.9 was twice as expensive in 1979, is at least a mild legend now, and a mint one isn't worth as much as the dreamer wants for the Guccimobile. Wacky.

texases said:

The description on the DuPont Registry ad is HILARIOUS. In part:

"Dr. Aldo Gucci explained that "this car was designed to give a fortunate few owners a rare possession of distinction, beauty and ultimate luxury". Only 200 of these limited production Cadillacs were made. In 1979 these retailed for $23,000! Who could have afforded these extravagant, ultra luxurious Sevilles by Gucci? Sammy Davis Jr. owned one. So did Luciano Pavarotti. David Ruffin owned two of them! Today, less than 7 of them remain roadworthy in the world. Of the 3 colors that were available, Cotillion White was the rarest with only 11 produced in 1979. These Sevilles were built by International Automotive Designs and sold exclusively at Braman Cadillac in, where else but, Miami Florida This priceless, rear-wheel drive beauty has less than 20,000 original miles(that's right, ORIGINAL)!"

The only thing "priceless" about the car is this ad...

Mr_Shiftright

I bought a pair of Gucci shoes at a thrift store once. What kind of man could afford such a shoe? These were the very rare "double gold G" model. Only 5 pair are known to exist in the world, and only two pair are actually on someone's feet. Tony Danza's BiL owned a pair.

I'll let them go for $400.

stickguy

was watching the evening news, and they broadcast from Cuba, and did a piece on the cars. Talked to one guy with IIRC a 1953 Pontiac. With a Benz straight 6 in it.

David Muir asked how much of the car was actually Pontiac, and the answer was the body and the trans. Everything else was from some other type of car.

can find some nice rust free bodies though.

lemko

fintail said:

David Ruffin had two? Only sold in that bastion of taste and class known as Miami? Whatever the price, it isn't enough...

A MB 6.9 was twice as expensive in 1979, is at least a mild legend now, and a mint one isn't worth as much as the dreamer wants for the Guccimobile. Wacky.

texases said:

The description on the DuPont Registry ad is HILARIOUS. In part:

"Dr. Aldo Gucci explained that "this car was designed to give a fortunate few owners a rare possession of distinction, beauty and ultimate luxury". Only 200 of these limited production Cadillacs were made. In 1979 these retailed for $23,000! Who could have afforded these extravagant, ultra luxurious Sevilles by Gucci? Sammy Davis Jr. owned one. So did Luciano Pavarotti. David Ruffin owned two of them! Today, less than 7 of them remain roadworthy in the world. Of the 3 colors that were available, Cotillion White was the rarest with only 11 produced in 1979. These Sevilles were built by International Automotive Designs and sold exclusively at Braman Cadillac in, where else but, Miami Florida This priceless, rear-wheel drive beauty has less than 20,000 original miles(that's right, ORIGINAL)!"

The only thing "priceless" about the car is this ad...

I don't know if you've ever seen the TV movie about the Temptations, but one scene shows the group after they first hit it big. Every other member got brand-new 1965 Cadillacs. David Ruffin later shows up in a new Rolls-Royce Phantom with a pair of glasses painted on the rear quarter panels.

stever

lemko said:

David Ruffin later shows up in a new Rolls-Royce Phantom with a pair of glasses painted on the rear quarter panels.

Whynot?

sda

texases said:

The description on the DuPont Registry ad is HILARIOUS. In part:

"Dr. Aldo Gucci explained that "this car was designed to give a fortunate few owners a rare possession of distinction, beauty and ultimate luxury". Only 200 of these limited production Cadillacs were made. In 1979 these retailed for $23,000! Who could have afforded these extravagant, ultra luxurious Sevilles by Gucci? Sammy Davis Jr. owned one. So did Luciano Pavarotti. David Ruffin owned two of them! Today, less than 7 of them remain roadworthy in the world. Of the 3 colors that were available, Cotillion White was the rarest with only 11 produced in 1979. These Sevilles were built by International Automotive Designs and sold exclusively at Braman Cadillac in, where else but, Miami Florida This priceless, rear-wheel drive beauty has less than 20,000 original miles(that's right, ORIGINAL)!"

The only thing "priceless" about the car is this ad...

I have a glossy brochure of the Gucci Seville. Dad and I were out looking for cars. Dad really liked the new 79 Eldorado and they had a Seville in the showroom and dad indicated some interest. Salesman handed him the brochure. This was at Rodgers Cadillac in Knoxville, TN of all places. I wonder if the brochure has any value. Two years later dad bought a used 79 Eldorado Diesel which he both loved and hated.

andre1969

Mr_Shiftright said:

I bought a pair of Gucci shoes at a thrift store once. What kind of man could afford such a shoe? These were the very rare "double gold G" model. Only 5 pair are known to exist in the world, and only two pair are actually on someone's feet. Tony Danza's BiL owned a pair.

I'll let them go for $400.

I heard about those...I believe the other pairs were owned by Herb Tarlek of Cincinnati, Ed Higgins of Raytown, and Cousin Eddie from Coolidge, Kansas. There was a rumored 6th pair, but little is known about them other than they were from the Baltimore area and known only as "Juror #8"

fintail

Had the fintail out today, 24 days since driven last. Started on the first turn and ran fine. Turn signals are fine now. Brakes made kind of a grinding noise when I first set off, but maybe they were just adjusting or something. I still get a faint noise immediately after increasing speed at idle - either there's a miniscule timing fault, or something is loose and being set off by a specific vibration frequency, I can't figure it out. Car ran perfectly, otherwise. Got tons of attention too, several compliments, a few questions.

stever

Time to flip it.

boomchek

So I picked up this W124 wagon back in September for a few hundred bucks that came in on trade at the dealership I worked at. It was a 91 300TE 7 passenger ex Japan import with 210km (about 130k miles). It was a bit rough, sweating oil, needing alignment, taking forever to crank over and start but it ran. I drove it daily for about 3 months with no issues before I had 3 breakdowns in a month. First, it started stalling, at one point dying on me as i was rushing home to plan my wife's surprise bday party. I changed the battery and it ran ok until a week after it popped a rad hose. I changed that and it lasted another 2 weeks before it started stalling on me after warm up. I got tired of messing with it so I put it up for sale as a non runner for how much I had into it (I put another few hundred into it for the minor repairs, couple tows, etc). As I was showing it to a guy we managed to get it running and the head gasket blew. The 3rd guy who came to see it ended up buying it from me.

I though it would be a decent car to keep and fix up but in the end I didn't have the space or the time to be messing with it. Plus 3 breakdowns in a month is enough for me. Fun car though and felt solid like a tank. Even my 5 year old son loved it. But in the end at least I got free 3 months of driving it and got all my money back that I put into it including purchase price.

fintail

Those M103s are known to eat a gasket if they are neglected. Too bad, but I guess the age and mileage are enough to make some things weak. Are those real Monoblocks? I see someone did the facelift conversion. I am jealous of the JDM imports you guys get, lots of weird MBs running around there now, I see oddly spec'd W220s advertised, W210s with JDM nav systems, lots of cars with late 90s era wheels, etc.

boomchek said:

<

I though it would be a decent car to keep and fix up but in the end I didn't have the space or the time to be messing with it. Plus 3 breakdowns in a month is enough for me. Fun car though and felt solid like a tank. Even my 5 year old son loved it. But in the end at least I got free 3 months of driving it and got all my money back that I put into it including purchase price.

boomchek

Yeah, real monoblocks, and yes, the upgraded hood gave it a more modern look. It had a funky 80s style momo wood/leather steering wheel too inside. There are still a lot of ex Japan cars being imported here but not as much as 5-10 years ago. We have the 15 year rule here so pretty much anything mechanically sound that's 15 years old or older can be brought it. I saw a few European A Classes here already too.

Mr_Shiftright

If it's German, has over 80,000 miles, and no warranty, it's guaranteed to nickel and dime you as long as you own it.

andre1969

Just out of curiosity, what age/mileage is usually the expiration date on an Audi A5? I have to confess I do have a bit of a fondness for them.

ab348

Mr_Shiftright said:

If it's German, has over 80,000 miles, and no warranty, it's guaranteed to nickel and dime you as long as you own it.

It sure is a handsome car though. Too bad the reliability was so dodgy.

Mr_Shiftright

Yeah nicer looking than a Volvo wagon-----"handsome" is a good word for it. I'm not sure what "maintenance" has to do with a head gasket, especially at 130K miles. Subaru had the same head gasket woes for the longest time---it's just defective parts or engineering.

fintail

Wouldn't neglecting coolant and oil changes help age that part?

A lot of these cars end up with neglectful people by the 3rd-4th owner.

Mr_Shiftright said:

Yeah nicer looking than a Volvo wagon-----"handsome" is a good word for it. I'm not sure what "maintenance" has to do with a head gasket, especially at 130K miles. Subaru had the same head gasket woes for the longest time---it's just defective parts or engineering.

fintail

If the wheels were good, they were worth a little too - people always want those.

I spent a week in BC back in October, mostly in the interior - saw a lot of JDM SUVs and little 4x4 vans, and of course the neglected Skyline or RX7 here and there. The MBs are harder to spot, as they'll be LHD. I've seen A-class and late 90s vans for sale there.

boomchek said:

Yeah, real monoblocks, and yes, the upgraded hood gave it a more modern look. It had a funky 80s style momo wood/leather steering wheel too inside. There are still a lot of ex Japan cars being imported here but not as much as 5-10 years ago. We have the 15 year rule here so pretty much anything mechanically sound that's 15 years old or older can be brought it. I saw a few European A Classes here already too.

fintail

I don't think they are too bad. No really complex systems like suspension etc. Audis since 2009 or so seem to be much-improved, but it won't be like a Lexus.

andre1969 said:

Just out of curiosity, what age/mileage is usually the expiration date on an Audi A5? I have to confess I do have a bit of a fondness for them.

lemmer

Long time, no post.

Somehow, I decided that a 2005 MB SL500 would be a good third car to share with the wife. I found one that checked all the right boxes, signed a demo agreement, and took it home to show the wife. She loved it. I explained about the ABC suspension and all the other things that can kill you on 10 year old $100K car. She was not phased by this.

So, after she drove it and decided she wanted it, I was returning to the dealer (with my reliability/maintenance concerns still intact). I decided to goose it good from a stop sign about 4 miles away from the dealership. The sweet V8 revved up and pulled hard through first gear and then...nothing. The car went dead, every single dashboard light was on, and I was apparently just coasting in neutral at 30 mph or so. I pulled over and it restarted but was making a weird noise. I don't even know how to describe it other than it varied with engine speed and it didn't sound good. I took it back to the dealer and told them what happened. They seemed unsurprised. They just instantly tried to convince me that the Lexus SC430 they had on the lot would never do that.

Anyway, I think I will avoid SLs.

steine13

Sissy.

Mr_Shiftright

"It is easier to stay out then to get out"--Mark Twain

fintail

10 year old R230 - good luck with that. Another old MB that even as an enthusiast, I shy away from.

steine13

I just think it's great this decade old sled is posted in 'project cars' and nobody bats an eye..
Jumped timing and/or broken plastic (TM) guides.
Classic indeed.
-Mathias

isellhondas

Mr_Shiftright said:

If it's German, has over 80,000 miles, and no warranty, it's guaranteed to nickel and dime you as long as you own it.

If it were only "nickles and dimes" it wouldn't be so bad.

The trouble is after paying for countless "minor" repairs then the transmission go's effectively totaling the car.

explorerx4

Car collection for sale. Some great stuff. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LlC-9b4PMgA

lemmer

Opinions on an SMG equipped M3 at 100K miles?



This car belonged to an acquaintance who had it since new, loved it, and traded it in on a new M6.

qbrozen

hell, i'd be more worried about the convertible top.

stickguy

Nice looking car. Would not touch the gearbox. And valid point about the top.

boomchek

lemmer said:

Long time, no post.

Somehow, I decided that a 2005 MB SL500 would be a good third car to share with the wife. I found one that checked all the right boxes, signed a demo agreement, and took it home to show the wife. She loved it. I explained about the ABC suspension and all the other things that can kill you on 10 year old $100K car. She was not phased by this.

So, after she drove it and decided she wanted it, I was returning to the dealer (with my reliability/maintenance concerns still intact). I decided to goose it good from a stop sign about 4 miles away from the dealership. The sweet V8 revved up and pulled hard through first gear and then...nothing. The car went dead, every single dashboard light was on, and I was apparently just coasting in neutral at 30 mph or so. I pulled over and it restarted but was making a weird noise. I don't even know how to describe it other than it varied with engine speed and it didn't sound good. I took it back to the dealer and told them what happened. They seemed unsurprised. They just instantly tried to convince me that the Lexus SC430 they had on the lot would never do that.

Anyway, I think I will avoid SLs.

The SL's are ok if you buy them cheap enough, and set money aside for repairs. $120k cars when new, now can be bought for the price of a new compact car. As long as you purchase one with the mindset that you won't get Corolla like reliability or cost of maintenance, you'll be happy.

boomchek

lemmer said:

Opinions on an SMG equipped M3 at 100K miles?



This car belonged to an acquaintance who had it since new, loved it, and traded it in on a new M6.

I've driven quite a few SMG equipped M cars and I'm not a big fan. Jerky in auto mode at lower speeds (city driving) and can be problematic at times.

lemmer

Yeah, after driving the SMG, I don't think I can buy it. The auto mode was awful. My wife would hate it.

fintail

Mint 140s for big bucks?

qbrozen

Ridiculous asking price.

What are those growths on top of the rear fenders? I can only think some sort of manual security thing, but 2 of them?

Michaell

qbrozen said:

Ridiculous asking price. What are those growths on top of the rear fenders? I can only think some sort of manual security thing, but 2 of them?

I think those are guides for parking. They look like power antennas. 

fintail

Yep, those would be the ancestorof parktronic. I think that's the last model year and model of MB sold in the US to have a mechanical odometer, too. Hard to find one so nice, even with the dreamer price.

Mr_Shiftright

$7500 on a good day, hitting it out of the park.

boomchek

Yeah I've seen them sell for less locally with less mileage. You can get a decent next generation SClass for that kind of dough although personally I'd stick with the older W140 style due to less complexity and more elegant styling in my opinion.