Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

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  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    I always liked the looks of the greenhouse on those early 77/78 downsized big Buicks and Pontiacs.
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,387
    Plain jane interior really works against that Buick. I never cared for the styling of the '77-'79 LeSabre but on a positive note I loved that Buick dashboard, which was a homage to early '50s Buicks.

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    gsemike said:

    Michaell said:

    qbrozen said:

    Only looking through my phone, but I'm liking this:
    http://www.blacktieclassics.com/details.asp?VID=281573

    I like that.
    It's nice, but 21 grand is pretty rare air for a Dart.
    Well, according to Hagerty, a concours Swinger 340 can break $30k, with "excellent" being $23,500 and "good" at just a hair under $17k.

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    When Hagerty shows a #1 value, they mean a car that probably hasn't been touched by ungloved hands. So their #2 cars are in themselves, knock-outs, and #3s are very clean "drivers" that you might see actually be used in "real life".

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    edited February 2017
    yeah, that's pretty much what I figured. So their starting price right in the middle of #2 and #3 isn't all that bad as long as it is as represented.

    My gut feeling is, if it is as good as it looks, $18k is about right.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    A #3 car is still supposed to be really nice---like what you'd find at most local, small-time car shows, where the cars were driven there. A #3 car might have a few chips, a light ding, and perhaps not as spiffy underneath as up top. It's a 3-footer. If you can stand back from the car and see any issues, it's not a #3.

    A #2 is what most people would call "restored" top to bottom.

    #1 cars pretty much don't have their tires touching the ground.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    good to know

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    Got me a whole list to show. I can't believe how many cars this one franchise seems to have. Could spend all day just surfing their site. Just think, this is only the Ford page.

    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/houston/1971/ford/mustang-S465.html
    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/louisville/1971/ford/mustang-S1394.html
    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/atlanta/1972/ford/mustang-S67.html
    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/louisville/1947/ford/coupe-S1280.html
    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/louisville/1966/ford/futura-S1461.html
    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/saint-louis/1967/ford/mustang-S7084.html
    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/chicago/1968/ford/mustang-S1179.html
    http://www.mjcclassiccars.com/1961-ford-thunderbird/#

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,636
    I like the futura. Conceptually. Needs a stick though. And hate the wheels and upholstery

    I guess should just look at mustangs instead!

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    I think, of all those, the red Mach 1, silver 67 stang, and the 47 coupe would be my top 3.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,741
    edited March 2017
    stickguy said:

    I like the futura. Conceptually. Needs a stick though. And hate the wheels and upholstery

    I guess should just look at mustangs instead!

    That's funny; I like the wheels and upholstery! The wheels are the same as what I have on my Econoline, and they're not beautiful, yet I find them non-offensive. It screams 90s cheap-o "restoration", but I don't know the market on these cars, so can't really judge the price. My gut says it's high.

    Overall, I kinda like it. It looks good enough, and isn't something that you'll see very often in the wild.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,387
    I'm not too crazy about any of them TBH. The Futura's interior is horrendous, just awful. Pass. I wanted to like the '68 Mustang but every picture I looked at made me dislike it more and more. Too many clones, tributes, and out-and-out bad decisions by previous owners on most of them.

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  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,143
    Odd color on that Futura's roof, to me. And uh-oh, no belt on the a/c compressor...
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,741
    Whew; tough crowd! :D
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    Price is pretty crazy, but this is cool.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,143
    edited March 2017
    Is $24k all that high for that '69 Buick GS 400? Seems pretty nice, with a high output engine.
    I'd rather have a similar Cutlass (grew up with one), but their Cutlass prices ARE high!
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,636
    I like the red Mach I. Though the blue clone is also sharp.

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  • sdasda Member Posts: 7,631
    I didn't look at it in detail but I like the '61 T-bird.

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    texases said:

    Is $24k all that high for that '69 Buick GS 400? Seems pretty nice, with a high output engine.
    I'd rather have a similar Cutlass (grew up with one), but their Cutlass prices ARE high!

    It's the GS400 "Stage 1" that's worth big money--it would bring 2X what this car is listed for. There's really not much difference in price between the GS350 and the GS400, maybe 10%.

    If it were a Stage 1 convertible, the price would be 3.5 X.

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    How do you know it is a stage 1? I read about such a thing but assumed this wasn't one of those.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    You mean how do you identify a Stage 1? Different heads, larger exhaust, re-jetted carb, hi-lift camshaft, larger valves, etc.

    Right, this one isn't a Stage 1...never said it was :p
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    Ah, ok. Misunderstood your post.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,741
    qbrozen said:

    Ah, ok. Misunderstood your post.

    I could hear the air escaping from here..... B)
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • omarmanomarman Member Posts: 2,702
    I only looked at the '71/'72 Mustangs and if the red one has disc brakes then that's the one I like too.

    The seller of that '69 Buick GS 400 refers to "owner verified" numbers matching. Seller also pointed out restored/retro-fit A/C which is pictured with a nasty wad of black tape on the fittings. The red rattle can detail on the engine wasn't worth the effort. How many shades of black did the owner want to see under the hood? That ram air cleaner set up looks kind of beat up. At least get new carb seals.
    A time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    xwesx said:
    Ah, ok. Misunderstood your post.
    I could hear the air escaping from here..... B)
    Would that be the wind in my sails? Yes, he had me excited for a minute there. ;)

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • gsemikegsemike Member Posts: 2,425
    BMW X3

    Can I ask for opinions on this?

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/6020736563.html

    I am looking to get out of my minivan, and like driving a sedan,but am worried I will miss the versatility. I kind of liking this as something that I can buy for cash and drive my 6,000 miles a year. I work in NYC and take the train daily.
    He is right a book for a goiod condition car, so I expect that there is some wiggle room. Assuming decent maintenance records and carfax, what do you think?
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,143
    That first-gen X3 didn't get much respect. I'm not a fan of the styling, and there were issues with the ride/handling, IIRC. I've been thinking about getting a newer one.
  • gsemikegsemike Member Posts: 2,425
    texases said:

    That first-gen X3 didn't get much respect. I'm not a fan of the styling, and there were issues with the ride/handling, IIRC. I've been thinking about getting a newer one.

    I do see the proportions looking a little funny at some angles. I think that the sport package is a must have. It gets you the color matched bumpers and rockers
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,143
    Mr_Shiftright said:

    texases said:

    Is $24k all that high for that '69 Buick GS 400? Seems pretty nice, with a high output engine.
    I'd rather have a similar Cutlass (grew up with one), but their Cutlass prices ARE high!

    It's the GS400 "Stage 1" that's worth big money--it would bring 2X what this car is listed for. There's really not much difference in price between the GS350 and the GS400, maybe 10%.

    If it were a Stage 1 convertible, the price would be 3.5 X.

    What do you think of the $24k asking price for this one?
  • gsemikegsemike Member Posts: 2,425
    texases said:

    Mr_Shiftright said:

    texases said:

    Is $24k all that high for that '69 Buick GS 400? Seems pretty nice, with a high output engine.
    I'd rather have a similar Cutlass (grew up with one), but their Cutlass prices ARE high!

    It's the GS400 "Stage 1" that's worth big money--it would bring 2X what this car is listed for. There's really not much difference in price between the GS350 and the GS400, maybe 10%.

    If it were a Stage 1 convertible, the price would be 3.5 X.

    What do you think of the $24k asking price for this one?
    I know that the 68/9s are unloved, but that prices doesn't seem particularly bad for a real deal GS
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,387
    edited March 2017
    gsemike said:

    texases said:

    Mr_Shiftright said:

    texases said:

    Is $24k all that high for that '69 Buick GS 400? Seems pretty nice, with a high output engine.
    I'd rather have a similar Cutlass (grew up with one), but their Cutlass prices ARE high!

    It's the GS400 "Stage 1" that's worth big money--it would bring 2X what this car is listed for. There's really not much difference in price between the GS350 and the GS400, maybe 10%.

    If it were a Stage 1 convertible, the price would be 3.5 X.

    What do you think of the $24k asking price for this one?
    I know that the 68/9s are unloved, but that prices doesn't seem particularly bad for a real deal GS
    I just looked at the listing and that one doesn't seem bad if you can live with the green paint. It is decently clean underneath and aside from a shaky-looking radio fitment the interior does not seem very worn. The underhood issues previously noted can be easily addressed. The '68/'69 models suffer from some unfortunate design choices both inside and out and that holds them back somewhat, but if it drives well that would be a fun car at a fair price, I think.

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  • gsemikegsemike Member Posts: 2,425
    69 GS

    I rather like the green. There is an unfortunately high number of triple green cars from that era that I can't handle,but the black top and parchment interior, not bad. The radio is a headscratcher. It stands out like a sore thumb
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,143
    gsemike said:

    69 GS

    I rather like the green. There is an unfortunately high number of triple green cars from that era that I can't handle,but the black top and parchment interior, not bad. The radio is a headscratcher. It stands out like a sore thumb

    There was a triple green car (not sure the model) on a recent TV auction, looked terrible. This GS has a good combination, like you said.
  • gsemikegsemike Member Posts: 2,425
    texases said:

    gsemike said:

    69 GS

    I rather like the green. There is an unfortunately high number of triple green cars from that era that I can't handle,but the black top and parchment interior, not bad. The radio is a headscratcher. It stands out like a sore thumb

    There was a triple green car (not sure the model) on a recent TV auction, looked terrible. This GS has a good combination, like you said.
    I can like the Earth tones, but triple green just kills it and you see if on all the brands. Different time I guess.

    That green paint that Chevy used must have had some serious rust proofing given how many pristine green 4 door Malibus I see.... wish that they were silver or black Chevelles
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,387
    gsemike said:


    That green paint that Chevy used must have had some serious rust proofing given how many pristine green 4 door Malibus I see.... wish that they were silver or black Chevelles

    Funny you mention that. Back in the '80s, a friend of my brothers SWORE that metallic greens as sprayed by the factory had magical rust-prevention powers not found in other hues. We all mocked him, but he would only buy dark metallic green vehicles and (interestingly) never seemed to suffer from rust to the same extent as the rest of us. Maybe there's something to it?

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I'd hit it at about $19.5K as fair market, and grade it as a 3/3+ car. He's asking closer to "local show" quality pricing, and I think it's a stretch, given what I'm seeing in the photos.

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    edited March 2017
    Mr_Shiftright said:
    I'd hit it at about $19.5K as fair market, and grade it as a 3/3+ car. He's asking closer to "local show" quality pricing, and I think it's a stretch, given what I'm seeing in the photos.
    Where might you hit that red Mach 1?

    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/atlanta/1972/ford/mustang-S67.html

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,636
    that red mach 1, I do like. My future BIL had a '73 red fastback when I was in middle school (I think at the time, maybe just into HS). Went to the NY car show with him in it. That was a way cool car. Especially back in those days! 302, 3 speed stick.

    I could live with that one I think.

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    Anybody know how to distinguish the 2 valve vs 4 valve? Apparently it makes a massive difference in performance.

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  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,387
    edited March 2017
    The red Mach 1 looks nice on the outside and I don't even mind the aftermarket wheels on it. The interior lets it down a bit with the shabby dash, the aftermarket head unit with parcel shelf speakers, and that awful steering wheel. But all of those are fixable if you want to spend the dollars.

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    edited March 2017
    Hmmm...so I'm trying to decode the data plate they have pictured and something is off. The first code, body style, is 65A. There was no such code on the mustang according to 2 websites I found. Also, DSO value of 17 does not exist, neither does the axle code value of 5. Plus, the paint code indicates yellow and trans code indicates 3-speed manual. I can only imagine this has the wrong plate on it.

    however, the VIN number pictured tells me it is a 2v.

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    qbrozen said:


    Mr_Shiftright said:

    I'd hit it at about $19.5K as fair market, and grade it as a 3/3+ car. He's asking closer to "local show" quality pricing, and I think it's a stretch, given what I'm seeing in the photos.


    Where might you hit that red Mach 1?

    http://www.gatewayclassiccars.com/atlanta/1972/ford/mustang-S67.html


    About $18.5K if it were all straight but there are things about this car I don't like--such as how it "sits", and some slap-dash restoration work. The car could be a little tired. So I'd be inclined to say less on this particular one.
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,143
    qbrozen said:
    Anybody know how to distinguish the 2 valve vs 4 valve? Apparently it makes a massive difference in performance.
    2 valve vs 4 valve what?
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,636
    i was wondering the same thing. Ford wasn't making 4 valve heads in a mainsteam mustang back in those days!

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  • bhill2bhill2 Member Posts: 2,607
    stickguy said:

    i was wondering the same thing. Ford wasn't making 4 valve heads in a mainsteam mustang back in those days!

    I think he meant 2 barrel vs 4 barrel carb. He's right about the power, 248 vs 163 net hp (ok I had to look that up). And they also offered a 351 HO which was even higher.

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,777
    edited March 2017
    they are labeled 2v and 4v. I assumed that meant valves. Maybe not.

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  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,387
    Back in Ye Olden Days of Yore 2V or 4V meant "2 venturi" or "4 venturi" (venturi = barrel) carburetors.

    I assumed the data plate shown was a matter of someone putting in the wrong picture since it says "Mercury" on it and is shown on a car with white paint.

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  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,387
    edited March 2017
    Look at this over at BaT:

    1973 Dodge Monaco




    I have never seen one in such pristine condition. What a car.

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  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,636
    No, I can't afford wasting another hour of work surfing at BaT. Don't make me do it.

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  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 265,051
    stickguy said:

    No, I can't afford wasting another hour of work surfing at BaT. Don't make me do it.

    Willpower, my friend.

    It doesn't help that it's the end of my companies fiscal quarter this weekend (don't ask why that is) and I'm up to my eyeballs in work.

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