Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

lemko

Feds Seize Armor-Plated Car Bought in Iraq

Updated 8:16 AM ET May 20, 2006

Federal agents seized a Mercedes-Benz from an Army reservist who said the armor-plated, bulletproof luxury car probably belonged to Saddam Hussein.

First Sgt. William von Zehle said he bought the car while serving in Iraq. U.S. Immigration and Customs enforcement agents said the car, which was also equipped with loudspeakers and hidden microphones, was being treated as a "possible war trophy."

"It belonged to the former Iraqi regime," ICE spokesman Dean Boyd said. He said investigators were unsure whether the former Iraqi dictator actually owned it.

Von Zehle was quoted in news stories last summer as saying he bought the car for about $5,000 in 2003 while serving in Baghdad with the 411th Civil Affairs Battalion. "I can't prove it, but yeah, this was Saddam Hussein's car," he said.

The car was seized Thursday. A call to von Zehle's home in Ridgefield on Friday was not immediately returned.

Federal agents are holding the car while investigating possible violations of federal smuggling laws and an executive order barring the importation of property from the former Iraqi regime.

Von Zehle was not charged with a crime.

The white Mercedes was also equipped with a series of pipes that shoot flames out the side of the car, von Zehle has said.

andre1969

look closely at the price in that BMW ad. It actually says "-$1750". The guy must be REALLY desperate to get rid of it! :P

Mr_Shiftright

Old German cars come in three flavors....vanilla, which is a clean, good driving, well kept car; chocolate, which is a slightly ratty running car with some fixable, non-critical repairs; and parts car worth virtually nothing. The minute these cars stop running, they are just about worthless except to someone who parts them out. The "Blue Book" for German cars should not read Excellent Good and Fair, it should read Excellent / Runs Every Day At Least / and Hopeless

fintail

"The white Mercedes was also equipped with a series of pipes that shoot flames out the side of the car, "

That's a popular anti-carjacker tool in South Africa, too. I think I want that feature.

But anyway, the guy actually shipped the car home? That takes guts. I know quite a few cars came over after WWII though, and TONS went to Russia (just like today).

Mr_Shiftright

Without documentary evidence, the guy has nothing here but yet another armored old Benz...dime 'o dozen....

ghulet

...here's the 'nice' one (well, it at least looks nice, I love the plethora of details in the ad, though), at LESS than twice the price of the BMW convertible I posted before (exactly 60% more, actually):

http://chicago.craigslist.org/car/162886965.html

Just remembering how cool we thought these were when they came out, mostly because we had never seen a BMW convertible in the states up to that point. Looking at it now, it rather resembles a bathtub with wheels and a windshield, doesn't it?

fintail

Reminds me of all the "Hitler cars", stories you'll hear about any midrange or above MB from about 1930 on. I don't buy any of that.

Mr_Shiftright

You could make a gazillion dollars if you ever found a photo of Hitler DRIVING a car. Apparently he didn't know how....good thing, too...imagine the level of road rage....

fintail

Looks like a nice old survivor for the money

andre1969

For some reason, whenever I think of generic appliance-cars, that style of Rambler is always the first thing to pop into my mind! :P I like the older styles, that had the horizontal quad headlamps, and the later Rebels and Ambassadors with their curvier bodies, but that style just made me think of an appliance. And the Norge-white paintjob isn't helping any! :surprise:

But it does seem to be a well-maintained appliance. And I do like the interior.

andre1969

this is not an idea that I should be entertaining, but in theory, if the opportunity came up, how much '78 Mark V Diamond Jubilee should I be able to get for $3-4K?

A buddy of mine, who has two, is thining about getting rid of his "beater" Mark. It's a good 50-footer, but really does need a new paintjob to be really primo. Interior's in pretty good shape though, and there's no rust or water leaks. I think it has about 120,000 miles on it, and its 460 was rebuilt and beefed up a bit.

I know I shouldn't be toying with this idea, but I am a bit tempted...

fintail

Does it have to be a diamond jubilee?

andre1969

Well, in this case, the one my buddy is thinking of is a Diamond Jubilee. It's the icy metallic blue color, which seems to be "THE" color for a car like this. They also made them in kind of a gold/champagne color, but that one doesn't do it for me. Although I actually saw one of those in somebody's yard, out towards the road, like it was for sale or sold and waiting to be picked up.

My buddy is thinking about taking it up to Carlisle for the Ford Nationals and trying to sell it, but when he said he thought he'd only get $3-4K for it, my ears perked up. He used to be a bit delusional about these cars and their worth, but has since come down to earth.

Here's a pic of my buddy's matching set. The "beater" is in the front and the "good one" is behind it.

Wonder if it's soon going to be time for me to go down to Park and Planning and apply for another garage building permit. :surprise:

Also, it just hit me...this would be the first F-word I've ever owned. I hope that's not a sign of the coming apocalypse or something! :P

Mr_Shiftright

Price sounds about right for a fully functioning #4 car. You can buy the best one the world has ever seen with extra low miles (under 50K) for about $12,000, and around $8,500 should find you a really clean daily driver with higher miles that doesn't need paint. So if you start subtracting downward from the primo car at $12K, basically a beater Mark V Diamond isn't worth much at all.

fintail

Oh, I was wondering if you were shopping for one. I've noticed a few really nice ones locally on CL, for slightly more than your price range. One was even that light blue, I believe I posted it here. Not a Diamond Jubilee though.

This is in my backyard...high maintenance color though

I agree with your opinion about the color...it's the only one I would want, and it does suit the car. Just a bit lighter than the blue on that Fleetwood I posted, which is also pleasant on the car.

andre1969

really turn me on when they're the right shade of blue or green. Only problem with green though is that sometimes some of the greens they use on the inside are pretty clashy. I could also deal with a midnight blue or black one, and maybe a white one, with the right interior color. But some of those browns, golds, champagnes, etc, do nothing for me.

If I were getting one of these monsters, I'd also want a 460, which my buddy's car has. A lot of them only had 400's, which had 179 hp in '77, 166 hp in '78, and 159 hp in '79. OUCH!!

It's kinda funny how some cars I'd be happy with no matter how awful the color, like a '76 LeMans or Electra, or a '79-81 Mopar R-body. And on some of those cars I'd even be happy with a less-than-optimal engine (as long as it's not a 231/250/260 in the LeMans or a slant six in an R-body!) But with the Mark V, it seems much more dependent on the color and engine with me.

Common sense is really telling me though that I should take that $3-4K that I'd be spending on this car, plus insurance, and put that money towards fixing up my other cars.

fintail

That's what I would do...put it in the other cars. 3-4K can do a lot of fix up work.

volvomax

Personally, I would go for an earlier Mark IV.
The had the good 460's and a better looking body.

jaserb

I've finally gotten the Alfa back on the road. This wasn't a concours restoration by any means, but it's a pretty nice driver now. I went back and forth for a while deciding whether or not to leave it the original color but I'm glad I did.

Before:


After:






-Jason

lilengineerboy

WOW, congratulations, that is very inspiring.

fintail

Lookin sharp, very nice. Congrats

qbrozen

i can't believe you even considered not keeping it yellow. Ok, maybe a little darker yellow would be nice, but still, i think yellow spiders are the best looking. I thought about changing my original color, too, and yellow would have been the easy choice. But, in the end, I also decided to stay original and stuck with the black.

lemmer

That car looks great! It makes me want one. But, why do you hate Spica. It is just a matter of getting it set up correctly, right?

andre1969

I was wondering that too...one of my roommates gets miffed at the SPCA from time to time, but that's because he works for them! :P

au1994

Awesome job. Great choice keeping it yellow! Got it done just in time for convertible season, I see!

jaserb

I had to replace the injection pump due to excess wear leaking gas into the sump. Then I had to replace the head gasket, and all the metal fuel lines made it about twice as hard as it needed to be.
Then the injection pump siezed with about 300 miles on the rebuild, leaving me stranded on the side of the road. The guy re-rebuilt it for free, but I had to do another R&R which is NOT fun. Long story short, I know WAY more about SPICA fuel injection than I ever wanted to. It runs pretty good now, but I'm still a bit shell shocked.

If it weren't for the fact that I still need to pass emissions every year I would have yanked the injection for Webers in a heartbeat.

I have no problems with the SPCA. I like doggies and kitties.

Qbrozen, one of the reasons I kept the original yellow is because it is so light - I'm not a fan of the orangey yellows.

-Jason

Mr_Shiftright

Webers can be a nuisance as well. They are fussy, and really work best at WOT. You'll drop in gas mileage, too.

SPICA should be fine now that's it's all set up right. It works well if you stay on top of it....and of course never ever run out of gas.

lemmer

Webers rule. On my MGB, by the seat of my pants I gained about 3hp and still got 14 mpg.

martian

Yeah-whatever is said about AMC-they marched to their own drummer! Of course, the weird styling reflected poverty-AMC never had the money to introduce new models-so they were stuck with the same bodies for years. But you are right-the Matador was so eccentric-I wonder if there is some sort of minor collectable market for these cars by now? :confuse: :confuse:

volvomax

AMC styling lives!
Every time I see a Nissan Murano or Infiniti FX I think of the Gremlin.

Mr_Shiftright

I've seen the dyno sheets on Webers on an MGB (thank you Moss Motors) and those 3 hp are at very high rpm....and really now, 14 mpg on a MGB is pretty bad. For what you spend, I don't see the benefit of a Weber on a street car unless of course you have an obsolete carburetor on there that needs replacing or really bad/archaic fuel injection.

But Webers are sweet in pairs for vintage racing...

british_rover

At least double the price it should be

No idea what is market correct on this car but one of my customers has one and loves it.

A 911 from the same guy

And now some rovers.

The lightweights were always cool but the cracked frame has me worried.

Will be interesting to see what this sells for since it is fairly close to the one we have for sale but not in nearly as good a shape.

Never really like this special edition

For 500 bucks good thing it is not closer

Gas saver and Range Rover do not belong in the same paragraph.

Now some local ones.

Screaming deal or screaming for mercy?

Looks like my rally car is here

Must have missed this one earlier

I kind of like it

british_rover

I missed a defender and a good one. And it is right next door grrr.

Grrr Defender

ghulet

Hate that damned chrome fender trim, and this is a bit old, probably more than a bit worn, a bit miley and more than a bit fuelish (12mpg @$3.25 a gallon in Chicago is no fun), but still...I've always wanted one, not that I could afford to keep it on the road:

http://chicago.craigslist.org/car/164073580.html

ghulet

Never even heard of this, don't know what I'd do with it (I have little interest in most pre-war cars, but almost none before ~1935); something tells me getting rid of a dusty, strange, eighty year-old car for almost $4k won't be too easy, at least not on craigslist:

http://chicago.craigslist.org/car/164056986.html

Might make a good 'conversation piece', anyway.

british_rover

Strange that the Dictator name became much less popular after the war. :P

lemmer

plain jane 1970 Nova. No idea what it is worth, but it seems interesting.

stevedebi

The photos are a year old, wonder how it looks now...

andre1969

as that Nova, I kinda like this 1976 Ventura.

Kind of a stripper, with no a/c, and God only knows what the seats look like underneath. And with the Olds 260, which put out maybe 100-110 hp, it would be a dog, but at least it should be a durable dog.

lilengineerboy

My grandmother had that car in orange, it looked like a taxi. My folks had a same body style Nova, but it had the 250 straight 6. Those were great, every time something broke (which wasn't very often, and often self inflicted) it was $50 for the part. Any part. The door on my grandma's car was $50, the starter was $50, the radiator was re-cored for $50. When I started driving that car, I would just keep $50 in the glove box.
If my family still had that car, it would get the 350 it should've had all along, or a drivetrain from a Camaro or something.

Mr_Shiftright

That '69 LR 88 is scary business. That vehicle will break in half at the first impact. Parts.

Ditto '50 Chevy -- you can buy these in much better shape for not too much more $$.

Porsche 911 Cabriolet -- looks nice, but strictly retail pricing.

88 Rover -- looks like a great parts car for $500.

Mercedes C36 AMG -- you are exactly right---it's double retail.

qbrozen

hey, BR ... on that '88 Rover, are you thinking $500 is good as a parts car or as a driver?

How long do you think it could hold together as a driver?

The fact that so many items are nonworking is kind of scary. I wonder which seat adjustments don't work. I suppose I'll have to email him. That's less than an hour from me!

fintail

Wow, that's the nicest C36 I have seen in ages...excellent. Price is insane, even if it was in Canadian $ - but I would think in that condition an enthusiast would give maybe 15K sooner or later. It's getting really hard to find an unabused C36, and there are so few to begin with. I like it.

fintail

This is kinda cool, but I suspect is not DOT compliant Canada I know has less repressive old car import rules, I bet this came through Vancouver.

fintail

Yeah that'd be a throaway 560SEL...but for the money, it might be comfy while it lasts.

Funny thing, the 'dictator' name....Chevy also had the 'confederate' IIRC...probably sold well in some areas.

Mr_Shiftright

How about a Triumph Tyrant? Didn't think so....

GEESH--you wouldn't want to drive a ratty '88 Range Rover....repairs would kill 'ya. But for $500, you could drive it until it stops then probably get your $500 back from the wrecker.

qbrozen

well, that's what I'm thinking. I'd use it to haul junk around for a while, then send it packing when it demands any money from me.

I'm just wondering how far I could get on just the purchase price. If its one month, its not worth it. If its 3 months ... maybe.

I've got alot of trees I'd like to haul out of my yard this summer.

Heck, I could donate it to the fire department in the end and probably take a $1k deduction on my taxes. What do ya think?

stickguy

my BIL had one identical to that, even the same color, about 15 years ago. Might make a good platform for a hot rod/SS clone.

reminds me, I was watching a show yesterday (I think on TLC) where some guy builds up custom muscle machines, and then tries to flip them at one of the big auctions for a profit. I think his name is Bill White? Specialty muschle machines is his shop IIRC.

Anyway, yesterdays show was a 1970ish Torino. Absolutely mint car, with absurdly low miles. Kicker is, it was strippo model, 6 cyl AT. The did a nice paint job, and upgraded suspension/brakes/wheels, etc. But mostly, they stuffed a custom made big honker V8. Buitiful looking piece.

Oddly, they left the interior perfectly stock, which was probably a turn off.

At Russo and Steele auction, it was a no-sale at about 30K, which I htink was less than it cost to build. The interior might have had something to do with it, plus Torinos don't really seem to have much of a following.

Mr_Shiftright

You could perform the "Shiftright 15 Minute Used Car Test".

What you do, if you can get the car alone, is to drive the hell out of it for 30 minutes. Floor it, go up hills, rev it up (but not abuse it), drive fast and furious, stressing engine, brakes, etc. If it's not a steaming heap of rubble by the end of the 30 minutes, it's a keeper.

My motto is: "if it'll go 50 hard miles, it'll go 5,000 miles".

michaellno

The show on TLC is called "Wrecks to Riches".

I've seen a few episodes so far ... caught part of the one last night, but didn't see the ending.

Most of the time, they take cars that are in truly horrible shape and do a frame up restoration. Sounds like the one last night was an exception to that rule. They keep track of the $$$$ spent and the man-hours invested. They set a time limit of 4 weeks, and the car goes to auction and they see if they can recoup the rebuild costs.

The guy's name is Barry White, and his specialty is creating "Super Muscle Cars" - essentially, an old muscle car body style with new hardware underneath - suspension, wheels, steering, engine.

I guess you could say he creates clones -- a couple of weeks ago, he took a Tempest and turned it into a GTO wannabe by purchasing and adding a new front clip. There have been episodes where he's created Mustangs, Plymouth Satellites, the GTO, a Camaro, and one or two others that escape me.

The first episode was probably the funniest .. he 'stole' his daughters car to restore without her knowing about it. She was pretty peeved but at the end of the show he pulls up in an identical car for her to work on.