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2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Also, has anyone mentioned that non-sequential shifting isn't so hot on a DSG? (because you may be activated the same gearbox for both gears that you've selected rather than the second gearbox). Never tried to do this yet, but apparently you can really slow down the shift.
Not sure under what circumstances you'd choose to do this with a DSG though.
I do it all the time with my manual 6-speed.
CVTs are pretty lame to drive, but quite efficient.
With all the variations of DSGs available, it amuses me how hard they are trying to add expensive ways to mimic the simple action of a manual transmission.....when you could just actually GET a manual transmission!
But alas, they still can't get there - from the inability to skip gears as you shift up or down (as Shifty mentioned) to the lousy behavior many of them have in stop and go traffic, the purity of the manual is often imitated, never duplicated. ;-)
As for "getting it", "it" is just the visceral quality of controlling the engine and interacting with the machine to make it move down the road. There are less and less people that "get it" as each year goes by, but beware: when the day arrives in the not-too-distant future that cars are completely self-guided and we are all just passengers behind the wheel, it won't be the manual transmission that abetted the death of the driving experience, it will be the automatic - automotive self-guidance can't occur with a stick shift and three pedals.
I have been cruising the used car listings lately and I'm gratified to see that at least in some models, most of the cars out there are manual-trans. WRX is one of them, but GTI is another. Miatas too, although even there a distressing number of automatics appear....but I'm pinning my hopes on the future of sporty cars, which I'm beginning to think will still be offered with a manual for as long as I will continue to buy cars.....
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
What is this "wheel" thing you speak of? No need for such an anachronism in the electrically-driven self-guided personal transportation pods that are closer than many of us would like to think, but that many others will probably line up to
buylease.I ride a sportbike. It has far more of everything you mentioned in your post, and goes faster than everything on 4 wheels, for half the price of your average compact car. (Mine in particular was $11,200 in 2001. It's still kill-you-in-an-instant fast.)
Day in and day out, there just isn't enough need or opportunity to rejoice in the small perks of a manual transmission, and there are many, many opportunities to enjoy the convenience of a DSG.
so far, I have used it once. And that was not to actually shift. i was curious as to what gear I was in, so I pushed the lever over to check! then put it back in D.
I got the car to teach my daughter on (the stick was just not working out...). But, mostly I use it for around town errands/short hops, so like you say, no real situations where having a stick matters (from a performance standpoint).
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
The car frequently selects D5 for 35-40 mph tooling around town but I never hear the engine lugging. I've used manual mode once, just to verify it worked on the test drive. I've read that it upshifts at 6,000 rpm in manual mode; that's kind of self-defeating since sport mode shifts at ~6,500.
My favorite excuse for not buying a manual in a sporty car is "I have to drive in traffic all the time"
If somebody is in traffic all the time, then why have a sporty car. Buy a Prius for the commute and a miata for the weekends. That automatic 5 series (or whatever) does you no good in a traffic jam.
Few people want to admit they are commuters and buy a commuter car.
BTW - test drove the Scion FRS last weekend - wow. Nice shifting excellent handling (salesman was hanging on for dear life). Good car for a stick shift. Nice fun car - and cheap enough that you don't feel guilty when you hang out the tail.
Only complaint I have is the engine did not seem like it really wanted to rev. In fairness I did not go beyond about 5k since the engine was brand new and the car had about 30 miles on it. Maybe once broken in and at higher revs it will loosen up.
When a car has only 100 HP you *have* to use a manual transmission "O&I"---often, and intelligently.
Now, with numbers like 500 ft lbs of torque you don't even need half the gears---1st, 3rd and 5th would be just fine for a new Corvette or Mustang. You'd hardly miss the other 2. :P
Yes, yes I KNOW....NASCAR powerhouses use a manual transmission....but we aren't on the track and don't need 750HP.
There is nothing...NOTHING..that is more fun than driving a 100 HP small sports car on a twisty road.
Funny what can make a car feel fast. A small convertible that is low to the ground, noisy and needs to be flogged always feels much faster than a large boat that isolates you from the experience (given that their times are about the same).
My 1900 lb Scirocco felt plenty peppy with a 10.0 time to 60. That was a fun car - miss manual steering.
Soon we may have no choice - often you only see a manual with the base engine. At least the "base" engine is improving in most cases. Still wish you could get more options with manuals, though.
Automakers are almost forcing people up with packaging.
Anyway. I agree with Shifty in that high powered modern cars often remove the need for manual transmissions. But all the sophisticated onboard electronics do other things, too. The Nissan GT-R is an easy, and probably over-referenced example. It's tremendously heavy, and in the 80s or 90s we would have looked at curb weight alone, ~3850 pounds, and felt sure that this was no sportscar.
But it is.
Anyway, I have no real nostalgia for manual transmissions or old, underpowered cars. I understand those that do. But we won't be seeing manual transmissions in new cars for much longer.
It probably was a dog with a 3 speed automatic.
My Audi is the first automatic new car I've bought (6spd dsg). My wife's Suzuki is a 5spd slushbox, and I've had a number of musclecars with automatics. My other cars have all been 5 speed manuals: '99 Impreza RS, '95 M3, '03 Evo.
The missing 3rd pedal is not missed.
Hear hear! Absolutely right on point. Of course, there isn't really anything you can still buy new that has power in that range, more's the pity. My Yaris with the "sport package" (tee hee, although it handles really well for an econobox) has 106 hp, and that is absolutely a hoot to drive down up and down canyons, which I'm lucky enough to get to do as part of my commute a couple of days a week. Yes, to whomever posed the question: I DO go out of my way to find twisty roads to have fun on, on a regular basis. :-)
If I could fit well in a Miata that would be my next purchase, but since I can't I'm very interested in the new FRS. Manual shift, of course. Interesting note: the VP of Scion made a statement to the effect that they expect half or more of the first-year sales of the FRS to be manual shift. :-)
Edit...my RX-7 was an '87, and that car was a joke with the automatic because of the way the rotary develops its power. But with a manual, there just weren't words for how great it was - like being strapped to the back of a jet engine. Too bad mine didn't make it.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Insider's tip: remove the dead pedal. And/or to the other pedal mods to gain an inch or so.
I actually modified mine very carefully, it sits about 1/2" farther back now. Every little bit helps. It did leave a small gap between the carpeted mats and the dead pedal, but no one sees it.
Headroom is fine on my PRHT, and I have a long torso. I think you need a couple of inches above a helmet, though, so if I tracked it I'd need to do that.
That and moving the dead pedal back worked.
Hard for Mazda to make it bigger without adding a lot of weight, I think. 3 of the 4 cylinders are behind the front axle center line.
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/06/26/2013-hyundai-elantra-gt-first-drive-review/
Luckily, the six-speed manual transmission is well-sorted and a friendly companion for lots of shifting action, with a good amount of feedback built into the clutch and a throttle that hasn't been tuned to deliver all of its power at initial tip-in. We've driven some truly terrible manual setups from Korea, Inc. before (Kia Forte, anyone?), so this more engaging setup is a welcome change of pace. If manuals are your thing, you'll be happy to know that you can still spec the stick in even the highest of Elantra GT trims.
That's nice because with a lot of Korean cars you only get the base model in a manual.
I really hope the 2013 Toyota Camry has a manual since they took it out of the 2012 models.
Mazda is a choice with the 6. And VW you can do the Passat or Jetta.
Subaru still has one in some models of the Legacy.
not sure about the new Altima.
but yeah, in the mid size class, much slimmer pickings.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2012 Hyundai Sonata GLS- 6MT standard- dropped for 2013
2012 Kia Optima LX- 6MT standard- dropped for 2013
2012 Ford Fusion S - 6MT standard- 2013 redesign- no MT offered
2012 Subaru Legacy- 2.5i & 2.5i Prem 6MT avail- 2013- only 2.5i (Base) 6MT
2012 Toyota Camry & Nissan Altima Sedan- no MT options
2012 Honda Accord- LX & EX (cloth) - 5MT standard- 2013 redesign- ???
It looks like your best bets are-
2012 Mazda6 i Sport - 6MT standard - same for 2013
2012 Suzuki Kizashi - S & GTS Sport FWD - 6MT standard
The Mazda or Passat would be my choices.
Or, go slightly smaller. The Jetta and the Dodge Dart both offer a manual (the Dart I think in all trim lines). Not quite as big, but these are still large for compacts, so only marginally smaller inside than a Sonata.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I would choose the Mazda, most likely, especially given the incentives available. But I'd also give the Kizashi a long, hard look...
Lots of Japanese models too. I have been looking with some interest at the new Mazda CX-5, but have now discovered that just like so many Mazdas these days (Mazda5, Mazda3 SkyActiv, etc), the only way to get the stick is in the entry-level stripper trim, so if I want a factory moonroof I'm out of luck.
Mazda has unfortunately begun to take the attitude that so many automakers take now: that the only people who buy stick shifts are the cheapskates who want the cheapest model possible. :-(
Still, it's nice to see from the discussion above that VW is hanging in there with sticks in so many models and trim levels. Just wish they were all 6-speeds. ;-)
And at least Mazda offers sticks in the dedicated sport models like Miata and Speed3.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
The Fusion will also have a manual transmission for 2013.
there hasn't been a MT accord v6 in a really, really long time.
a number of the other options are the same way. Sticks only on the 4 cyl.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
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According to the Ford website, the 2013 Fusion S, SE and Titanium all have a 6-speed automatic standard. The description of each engine, 2.5L, 1.6L Ecoboost and 2.0L Ecoboost also state that they come with a 6-speed SelectShift Automatic standard.
FYI, as far as I know, all trims of the Dodge Dart will have a manual option.
Yes, absolutely, which is why one (me! :-P) wants the manual more than usual in this model. And the highway mileage goes from 32 to 35 mpg in this one when you go from the automatic to the manual.
I'm used to not having the stick available with the AWD (although that sucks too), but there's absolutely no good reason to discontinue the stick above the base trim in the FWD unless your only goal in offering the manual was the rather disingenuous one of being able to offer a super-duper-low "starting price".
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
interesting is the MPG ratings (and I really wonder what the real world difference will be) but the stick is about 21-27, and the CVT is 24-30. Pretty big spread (all for the 4 cyl of course)
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Me, I just got done reading a quick blurb about the 2013 Altima, in which the manual has finally been put to rest for good, second among the major Japanese midsizers after Toyota killed the manual in the Camry. And this article (was in Automobile mag, I think?) points out just as they all do how unpleasant the CVT is in use, and in this case is one of the few negative things to say about the car.
Which is pretty much how I feel about the CVTs in the Impreza and Outback after driving them both. Yuck. I don't know how anybody, even an ardent FAN of automatics, puts up with CVTs.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
that's such an easy question to answer!
the cvt has a much wider range than a 5 or even 6 speed manual. it turns fewer rpm cruising on the highway, especially over 65, and it will select a low rpm for cruising in town too.
I will have my wife drive it a bit more before we decide, but I doubt she will ever really notice.
Oh, and someone asked, but the manual trans is a 6 speed.
and if they CVT operation really bothers you, it comes with paddle shifters to manually control 6 pre-defined ratios (if you would rather have it act like a less-efficient slushbox AT)
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Face it, CVTs are the new slushboxes. Unless someone comes up with a "manual" mode for a CVT that will let you control ratio with a lot more granularity than 6 fake "gears."
Then automated manuals will cover the upper half, as CVTs are not perceived to be sophisticated enough for the near-lux and luxury set. Did you see all the bad press Infiniti got from every single review I read (had to be at least a half dozen) about the CVT they dropped in that new JX model?
I can't believe Honda is gong to a CVT for the Accord - ugh. At least it's gratifying to hear that they will still offer a stick shift with several 4-cyl trims. (and not the V6 coupe? Has anyone actually checked that?)
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
http://sohc.vtec.net/news_files/1062301/13accord_orderinfo.gif
The MB ML 350 BlueTec CDI 3.0 L 455# ft is mated to a 7 speed "hybrid" CVT.