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Maybe some day someone can show a single bad thing that ever happened to a "premium recommended" engine due to putting 87-octane in it! It could happen some day. Maybe if I put another million miles on my car(s) something bad will happen to the engine and we can blame it on 87 octane. I will let yall know!
Maybe the cheaper econoboxes will breed some new MT drivers.
"Auto companies believe young drivers such as Pscheidl, 19, are a good target for manual transmissions, which are cheaper to manufacture, purchase, drive and insure. And they're being marketed to the millennial 20-somethings as a hipper, more interactive way to drive.
It could help explain why the stick shift seems to be making a minor comeback this year, accounting for 7% of new cars sold during the first five months, compared with 4% in the same period last year, according to Edmunds.com, which tracks car sales."
Automakers stick more teens with manual transmissions (USA Today)
I guess my point is that many drivers aren't even aware of what "pinging" is, and might ignore it---to their peril.
Oddly enough, this question of octane relates somewhat to manual transmissions, since it is possible to "lug" an engine with a manual trans, and this is where the detonation damage really occurs--when the engine is bogging down from being in too high a gear.
So, someone like yourself who might never "lug" an engine with a manual trans, can get away with just about any fuel at the pump---but a careless manual transmission driver using a lower octane than recommended, could, I think, damage their engine.
I would think that anyone with a manual transmission car would kinda prefer the peppier performance from premium fuel (presuming one's engine was designed for premium fuel I mean).
regarding pinging, i understand you are mistaken that it is something to worry about. some pinging indicates optimal operation and is a design goal for all the modern car/truck gas engines, as far as i understand the goals. "engine knock" is NOT pinging.
Q: WHY run 87 octane in an engine for which PREMIUM is recommended?
A1: When the engine has 400 ft-lbs, and the roads allow barely 100 ft-lbs of traction due to the season. (cold dry roads are slippery too.)
A2: When you are on a longer-than-one-tank cruise-control 75 mph drive in such a car. this is the type of drive on which V8s evidently can provide better mpg with 87 than with premium.
A pilot study released in November 2006 by several researchers at the University of Virginia Health System watched 10 male teen drivers on a driving simulator.
"Subjectively, participants report being more attentive while driving in manual transmission mode," the study concluded. "Objectively, participants drive safer in the manual transmission mode."
I realize the wording of the title was intended to be a play on words, but it's too bad it makes it sound like it's a penalty to have a manual transmission. :-(
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
In the US, manual transmissions became associated with econoboxes with that stigma. May as well get crank windows and skip the radio and AC if you want a manual. :sick:
The manual transmission probably has the high low segment stratifications. You can provide the lower end examples. Porsche 911 Carrerra and Corvette Z06 and ZR-1 come to mind.
I thought so too, but did a little cursory research and didn't see it.
link title
Hey you just described my 1994 Miata (except for the radio).... There is something special about driving around in a "stripper" car, you feel much more involved in the driving process. My dad has a 2010 Lexus ES and that is about as involved in driving as watching TV in your living room...
I could live without A/C and power windows (in the SF Bay Area) as long as I had the "wing" windows I had in my 1968 Olds...
Long ago, manuals gave significantly better performance and MPG, along with a lower cost. Modern automatics, especially the dual clutch types, are as good or better than manuals on both counts. However, in a fun, sporty car a stick is just plain more involving. Any difference in power isn't noticable to me, but the added fun is. When a business partner showed up with an automatic (!!!) Audi R8 I nearly wretched! Very cool, but what was he thinking?
My four kids all drive manuals. A wonderful benefit is that in college their friends can't borrow them because they don't know how to drve them.
Soon, I suspect we'll be paying a premium to get a car with three pedals. If so, I'll pay it.
The manual is fun to drive, provides lots of control, and the kids are learning and having fun. Hurrah for VW and keeping the manual alive and available not only on the stripped model! Long live the third pedal.
Bel Air Car Guy
"Down shifting to slow car's speed, takes more gas?"
Assume it's an ECU controlled, fuel injected manual transmission car and you aren't rev matching.
There is of course a potential confounding variable, namely that autos get chosen by most commonly by American tourists. AND I'm not trying to be funny on that point. Europeans are used to very narrow streets, roundabouts and other quirks of driving in Europe. Plus licences are earned there, not a right the way we seem to think.
'lugging' would, I think put a lot of strain on the bottom end of the engine --crank and main bearings....
The "pinging" you hear is actually internal engine parts rattling around--and in extreme cases of pinging, it's actually the cylinder walls flexing ! :surprise:
Or maybe there's a notation in her files - this year was the first time she wound up in an automatic, and the price was good. :shades:
But, at least she know how to drive a manual and has for decades. She's just not too skilled at driving period. My mom flat out refuses to ride anywhere with her.
The numbers I've seen for Europe indicate that manuals have an 80 percent penetration rate, vs 20% for automatics. Wolfram Alpha indicates that the US traffic accident rate is ~3 times that of Europeans.
SafeCarGuide indicates that the fatality rate in the EU is worse than the US (back in '99). But the source link is dead, and that number includes motorcycles.
Now go to another country where manuals presumably predominate, like India. Their traffic accident rates are worse than ours. Lots of other factors going on, so you're going to have to make some assumptions about a lot of stuff in order to pin better driving on using a manual transmission, or even assume it's a major factor.
Wikipedia has a laundry list. (Are there lots of automatics in Belgium and the Czech Republic?).
With Audi/VW DSGs high-milage translates to shortly-after factory power-train warranty runs out.
On the other hand, a car equipped with manual transmission can typically do 200k miles without ever needing several thousand dollar worth of repairs.
The "self-selecting" crowd of enthusiast drivers who choose MTs are likely better drivers, but they also understand the theory behind hand position on the steering wheel, or shift points in curves and have other knowledge and skills that fall into the esoteric realm for the average driver. The Joe off the street just wants to get into gear and go.
Plenty of "skilled" drivers drive like idiots too, come to think of it.
Regarding manual drivers in developed areas - some are terrible (like your sister, who to be fair , sounds like she should be banned from the road), but I think most have greater situational and spatial awareness than automatic drivers. But there are always exceptions - just like with motorcycles, most riders are very "with it", but some seem to have a room temperature IQ.
Yes, and a bad one would be a deal-breaker for me anyway: I wouldn't move to an automatic version of the same model, I would buy a different car.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I really don't see how an automatic transmission would make me markedly happier in a traffic jam--certainly nothing I could measure, and certainly nothing like the thrill of the jam opening up and me being free of it.
I just dig my left heel in a bit, and rock my foot in first gear---this is not anything like running a marathon.
Strange thing, I don't mind it nearly so bad on a bike.
When I am in the fintail, which has MB's weird first in-house automatic, I choose shift points both up and down. Clutchless shifting isn't bad.
Changing gears: Is knowing how to drive stick in America still essential? (CNN)
And new on our site:
Five Myths About Stick Shifts
The thing about Manuals is if you understand a little how they work they are far more appealing from a engineering standpoint IMHO.
I looked into CVTs - as they are billed as this great step forward and it looks like they use torque converters. So really the CVT part just replaces the planetary gear set which wasn't exactly a huge problem before..
The immediate and total control you have over your car with a manual is alot of fun in a world thats moving very rapidly to self driving cars..
And of course, less chance of plowing into a laundromat window while exiting a parking space. :P
An incremental advantage, I confess, but I just find a manual transmission more "intimate".
Honestly, I hate seriously considering a new car, because I know I have to compromise on something. Maybe I'll just keep the Escort until one of us gets too old to drive any more.
I had a Tiptronic in my '98 Audi A4. It was the same way but the Steptronic setup in my BMWs provides pretty fast shifts. I often use it for engine braking on downhill or some times just to lock out the torque concnverter on twisty roads.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Nissan's "tiptronic" mode is even faster, but that's a CVT, not a slushbox. Makes an AWD Juke awfully fun though. :shades:
Is the electric starter better than a crank?
Completely different. Worst analogy ever.