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I can't seem to shake people quite that easily. I did have to hear about it - "you told me Jettas have electrical issues and I haven't had a single one, Ms. car expert." OK, dude, I get it. You have a sample size of one, and I examined a sample size of thousands. I ingested hemlock and didn't die... wanna come over for a drink? I'll let you pet my rattlesnake.
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2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
I wonder if the 300 uses one of those "truck rear axles" that Edmund's review of the TC alluded to? :P
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
How are the interiors on the PT Cruiser?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Trying to find out, but I have to go - beautiful Niagara on the Lake today to see An Ideal Husband, I told my wife it is an autobiography about me. Some good information though on the advantages and disadvantages of a solid rear axle if you go to:
Advantage/disadvantage solid (beam) axle
They are stronger for carrying weight etc., but not so good for handling and absorbing bumps, and of course, much cheaper to produce.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
The PT was a sales success, but most of the buyers were 45+ year old boomers, which pretty much guaranteed that no one under the age of 30 would even consider it.
Ah...a typewriter drive car.
Brings back memories of my Father's '58 Plymouth Sport Suburban wagon. I learned to drive with that car and type. Not to mention a couple other things you learn as a teenage boy.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Labor costs are actually higher in Canada than in the USA. Ford and the CAW had talks in November 09 to narrow the $5 to $10 an hour labor cost disadvantage in Canada.
I also think some people drive expensive European makes due to an impression they want to make. Maybe a need to appear like they are successful?
Richard--
That is the salient point--and seems to have been obfuscated by the protracted evaluations of the merits of the Town Car. You had an enjoyable experience with this particular type of car. The fact that the Lincoln has changed so little--while a detriment to the reviewers--creates reassurance for you that the driving characteristics that you enjoyed remain essentially unchanged.
Since the Jeep and Explorer have been significantly redesigned the same can't be said of either of them and they will require more seat time and careful consideration.
Nothing wrong with "floatiness", isn't it next to "Godliness"?
Gogiboy
I decided I'm going to try graphicguy's patented out the door offer method of negotiating. After my parents drove the Cayenne (with a different salesman from the same dealership - more on that after the purchase) on Tuesday night, the salesman offered to sell them the car at a $2000 discount off sticker. They said they'd get in touch tomorrow, but the salesman would be off.
So I worked up an out the door price using edmunds new car pricing. Edmunds is the only car pricing site that has the correct invoice pricing on the 2011 Cayenne. The price I came up with is $1500 over invoice plus tax & DMV fees.
I called the salesman today. I told him we'd like to order the car today if he can agree to my price of: $XX,XXX.14 out the door.
"What do you mean by out the door?"
"Selling price plus 8.375% sales tax & DMV fees."
"I don't deal with sales tax, that's the finance manager's job. Back out that number for me to the sale price you came up with and I'll present it to my manager."
I give him the number & he tells me he'll call back.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD, 2025 Integra
"I'll have to get back to you."
Now this price is $1500 more than I said.
(The original offer I gave was $2000 over invoice, not $1500)
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD, 2025 Integra
Why the GLK? I thought that you had come to agree with me that the Audi Q5 is the best of the small German crossovers.
That's probably true in some cases, but many of us (I drive a BMW) drive German cars because we appreciate superior ride & handling.
Here's another way of looking at it. When I was a kid - a long time ago - many people drove Cadillacs because they wanted to make just the kind of impression that you're talking about. As a result, Cadillac made tons of money for GM.
Don't you think that Cadillac (& Gov't Motors) would love to get back that business? I certainly do.
Maybe OTD is one of those terms they only use for low end brands. Or, he's a greenpea... or he's full of it and too lazy to "back out that number" himself.
"I don't deal with sales tax, that's the finance manager's job
hmm, seems it would be the sales managers job. But, it's been a couple months since I bought a Porsche, so things may have changed. :surprise:
I think most of the time they say "let's split the difference" you can get it for a lot less.
Richard
LOL! Only you would have thought of that!
Richard
"Your price is still on the high side."
"If I come down another $500, will that get you down here tonight? So now we're only $1000 apart. I'm already giving you over 5% off list on a car that's being ordered and hasn't even been released yet."
"I'll get back to you. Either tonight or tomorrow."
"I'm here until 9"
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD, 2025 Integra
It has been my experience that the vast majority of BMW and Benz drivers can't wait to drop the make of their car (Where most people would say "We went up to Wisconsin over the weekend" they would say "We took the BMW up to Wisconsin for the weekend") and that they rarely drive in such a way as to push the envelope of the handling of a ugo let along a BWM.
Also just for the record having the feel of the road is a superior ride in some situations and an inferior ride in others.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
There are no guarantees either way, sometimes your flight is delayed or canceled or you hit bad weather when driving.
Did the straight through driving round trip to Florida back in 1988. Not is a hurry to do it again. That is more of a 21-22 hour trip.
The phone companies have a little wireless card you can plug into your pc.
I am hoping my Fusion will look pretty much good as new when I pick it up from the body shop tomorrow. The front and rear bumpers are being replaced.
I hope others are driving their cars (regardles of type of car and their own personal ideas of what puts a smile on their face) for similar reasons?
Lord knows I am not driving my car cuz I am concerned what others might think!
:shades:
How am I supposed to respond to this? I'm not the vast majority & I don't see see why I should have to speak for them. Is this a Midwestern thing?
Still, that's always been true to some extent of all luxury brands, & that's the point I was trying to make to "luvmybuicks": a luxury brand, whether it's BMW, Mercedes, Cadillac, Rolex or the Hyundai Genesis, can't be considered a true sales success unless it attracts some badge-chasers. After all, the definition of a luxury is something that's not essential - something that at least some of us buy because we want to show off.
One of the reasons that GM fell into the soup is that Cadillac lost the prestige-seeking customer.
Also just for the record having the feel of the road is a superior ride in some situations and an inferior ride in others.
Now you've lost me. Would you translate this sentence into something closer to English? In any case, I referred to "superior ride & handling" in my previous post - not to "feel of the road", which is your phrase & not mine.
There is a nice little museum just past the entrance for the ferry to Ocracoke from Hatteras. Just stay to the left and go straight ahead instead of turning right to line up for the ferry. They have a damaged, but recovered Enigma Machine there. It's focused more towards adults than kids, but i see plenty of kids in there.
The labor costs might be higher per hour, but the Canadian dollar used to be worth about 65 cents compared to USD. Today it is closer to 95.
When we bought our 1995 Volvo I didn't consider a Cadillac, because I equated them with a guy with a big cigar who has finally made it. I am sure many people buy European cars because they feel more sophisticated or something, but we (my wife and I) just like the styling and the road handling ability, and the fit and finish, but I liked my D3 cars when I had them. So, what you are saying is true, in many cases, but I don't really drive a European car because I want to be a snob, I drive it because I like it. Honestly, I think if I wanted to impress people I would get a big honkin Caddie with a vinyl roof, spoke wheels, bulls horns on the front....that would do it
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I do agree 100% that the Q5 is superior. It is almost a hopeless battle to get Richard to even try the GLK that I didn't want to throw another car into the mix. He said he would consider the GLK so if he liked it I would imagine the next step would be to compare it to the Q5. Also, the MB dealer is an hour a way from him, and I am taking a chance that the Audi dealer (seems to be fewer of them) will be even further.
I think he has narrowed it down to 4 cars, the 4th is probably a Pilot. I don't think the GLK had a chance, let alone trying to get him to test a Q5.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I had wondered about that, but hadn't mentioned it. If I was driving through a construction zone or on a dirt road or on an old paved road, it would seem to me that cars like the BMW wouldn't be very comfortable. In fact, I would think that it would make for a pretty rough ride. Also, if you hit one of the many pot holes on today's streets, it would appear to be a killer feeling. Perhaps I don't understand Driver's meaning of the "feel of the road". I have ridden in those small BMW convertibles but didn't think that they felt that good.
Richard
LOL! Only you would have thought of that!
or "sterility", one of the two!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Actually, it would be 4 hours if we left from Toronto International airport, but we took the smaller plane because the flights had better times, and it was a lot cheaper.
I don't know if we have looked into those cards yet. I just do the buying these days, I don't want to get involved in real work stuff any more.
I have a lot of respect for the Fusion. The fellow that takes us to the airport has over 100000 miles on his and it is a 4 cylinder...and he has never had a problem. Lots of room and very comfortable, well worth the price.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Couldn't have said it better myself. When you get to a certain age you know people aren't going to think more about you because of the car you drive.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Just try the GLK or Q5 and you won't go through life not knowing what it is like to have precise steering......you can corner and the car stays flat, doesn't feel like it is going to tip over.
MBs, BMWs, and Audis are built so solid you will hit a bump, know you have hit a bump but it will be a good solid feeling with no shake and rattle. I like to experience the real thing, if the road has bumps I want to know because it helps me to steer the car better...I don't want that non-communicative numb dumb feeling as if you have a steering wheel in your hands and it isn't attached to anything......you don't even know you are in a car.
I am back!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Richard
I like a car where I can drive from here to Nashville or Charleston and arrive without feeling like I've been vibrated to death. I still like a car that follows the road, somewhat.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
These cars were almost always Lincoln Town Cars that were usually driven by chain-smoking Russian immigrants. To this day, when I see a TC - particularly a black one - I look to see if it has livery license plates. At least half of the time, it does. So I've long viewed the TC as a more luxurious taxi cab - a step above a yellow Crown Vic - but not as a genuine luxury car that I might aspire to own. You could say that my experiences have colored my perception.
Still, I respect the brand because it's a hard worker, even if it doesn't make my blood race. Almost all of the cars in which I rode had at least 150K miles on the odometer, & several had twice that. To cover the car payments, gas, insurance & franchise fees, the drivers, who were in most cases also the owners, typically worked 12 or more hours per day. So it's clear that a properly maintained TC will run pretty much forever.
The later (2007+) X3s were better but still left something to be desired. The 2011 X3 will be all new, & I strongly suspect that BMW has revisited the suspension issue. It should hit showrooms in October, & I'm looking forward to driving it.
As you say, the Town Car would probably last forever---or close to it. It's a big car with lots of metal and is built on a basic platform. It would be tough to kill if used for regular driving.
Richard
Richard
Richard
Some cars are more prone to attract those who want to be seen in it than others.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Simple if you took the time to read it. The BMW drive (the true enthusiast) is always talking about BMW's superior ride as feeling the road. In certain circumstances you want that, in others its a hindrance.
As an example, I live just outside Chicago and I have a sister who lives just outside Denver. It's around 1000 miles between our two homes and when we drive it we usually do it in a day. Now the trip is all but a few miles of Interstate highway on basically flat land with nice easy curves that an aircraft carrier could take at 70. Now taking this trip you don't want the "feel of the road" ride that the BMW offers as it will wear you down much faster than a cushy soft ride of say a town car.
Now if you drive an hour past her house you will be on mountain roads and if you want to run it fast you don't want that soft ride of a town car, you want that feel of the road that a BMW will give.
So it depends on what would make a superior ride.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
And thats my point, you really don't want that feel of the road if you are just on an easy drive. the longer the drive the more a softer ride is preferable simply due to the fact that you don't get all those bumps rattling you.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
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Offering to "split the differernce" is the dumbest thing that can be said.
few customers will say.." That sounds fiar let's do the deal!"
Nope, they will figure that is the MOST they will have to pay and they will offer less.
"Feeling the road" is Driver's expression - not mine. You won't find it in any of my posts. I don't use it & I'm still not clear on what it means.
Now taking this trip you don't want the "feel of the road" ride that the BMW offers as it will wear you down much faster than a cushy soft ride of say a town car.
Here in the Northeast on the older highways, you don't want that "cushy soft ride" either. When cars with soft suspensions hit those expansion strips, they rock back & forth, & before you know it, you've got carsick passengers on your hands.
What you really want under those conditions is something like a larger (5-series or 7-series) BMW without the firmer sport suspension. This will give you a supple, planted ride without transmitting every road flaw to your butt. With that setup, you can spend 8 or 10 hours behind the wheel without tiring yourself out.
Our 2004 X3 doesn't have the Sport Package and it rides just fine. No squeaks or rattles and it just hit 100,000 miles.
On the other hand, my father in law always drove Park Avenues. He'd always ask if I wanted to drive his car and the answer was always no. Riding(floating) in them made me carsick.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I would rather have the comfortable ride of a Lincoln (but not my friends Lincoln KB).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Seriously, it is a nice vehicle.
Richard
Craig, surprisingly the gentelman is NOT a greenpea. The first guy my Mom dealt with on Saturday was a greenpea, he couldn't get the computer to work and hand wrote what was in the 3 MAJOR option packages. He never even asked for my Mom's phone number. I actually called him on Monday and left a message. He never bothered to return my phone call. My Mom also said she was blatantly "passed off" onto this greenpea she dealt with.
jipster - I think I'm doing the right thing. I made my offer and haven't countered. He's voluntairly come down 3 times. I'm not grinding.
I'll keep you posted
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD, 2025 Integra
Maybe, like your convertible!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Let's straighten out the terms once and for all. No one has ever had a filling come out because they were driving a bmw rather than a Lincoln.
Soft ride is like a chair that is soft and spongy. Many people, particularly Americans, like that soft feeling of sinking into a chair or mattress. Others prefer a firm chair or mattress, this gives more support in the lower back and sides. You don't sink down, you are held in place firmly with some support in the right areas, it is actually less tiring on long drives, because your posture is actually better and you aren't slouched down in the seat. Read some reviews about cornering. You will see that European cars hold you in place in the seat and give support in the back and thigh area, while some cars give no support and are uncomfortable.
To make it easy, some people like a soft mushy mattress, some like a firm mattress. One more time, one isn't better than the other, one isn't right or wrong, it is a personal choice.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250