That is the very thing that turned me off about my trusted and faithful Chrysler dealership. When they were bought out by the mega dealer, new servcie people were hired. My convertible suddenly had these "urgent" things that needed to be fixed. Not being mechanically inclined, I was tempted to allow the repairs. Then I remembered that the former servcie guys had always found my car to be in excellent condition. Brake pads were NOT an "urgent" issue on a two year old car with 20K miles. Neither were the belts. My response? Just change the oil this time. I haven't returned. My Cadillac dealer takes care of the convertible now. They haven't mentioned any problems with my Chrysler up to this point.
interestingly, I am in the middle of deciding on a kitchen remodel. Had a lady out from a local kitchen and bath store. She did measurements, discussed what we liked, etc. Then went and did a design.
what we got (computer generated now of course) are a few basic 3D views of what it would look like. Not exactly to scale I don't think, and no dimensions of any sort. basically a "vision" of what it could be.
if we like it, and sign a contract, then the full layout plans are available. But if we don't go with this lady, she keeps all that.
so the most we can do (similar to car deal) is take he ideas and price and shop them around! But I cna't just take he plans down to the local cabinet wholesaler and tell him to load up the truck.
I actually do NEED a car, if not now, then certainly by the fall. Our 2010 TSX gets the job done for us now, but with 3 children in child safety seats (We've got 2 boys & a 3rd child on the way) a sedan is no longer practical.
I actually did a decent amount of research. We needed a 4WD or AWD vehicle that had 3 sets of LATCHes across the 2nd row of seats. We need a vehicle that has a 3rd row of seats. We wanted something rock solid reliable, dependable, & long lasting. We want factory integrated navigation (our TSX has it & we feel it is light years better than the portables).
Our choices were pretty slim. The Pilot has everything we want.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
It worked the other way too. I sold a lot of cars to people who had spent hours in other stores with other salespeople. They ground out a number, left and shopped that number all over town and ended up with me.
Thanks, a few of us have been saying this for years.
Statistics almost guarantees that it evens itself out. No dealership can be so unlucky that they lose all the time.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
"I would actually feel a bit of smug satifaction when they would call the next day..." Well, we want to come and take another look at that car"
" Sorry, someone bought it an hour after you left"
I had to be very careful not to portray an " I told you so" attitude or I wold never see them again."
That happened to me 12 years ago when I landed on a car I really wanted at a local dealership. It was fairly rare, with low mileage and in decent shape. I wanted to think about it and hash it out with my wife so naturally I was pretty upset when it wasn't there two or three days later. My wife suggested checking the internet and lo-and-behold I found another "nearly identical" car with even less miles, more options, a nicer body and tighter engine. Of course I had to drive 120 miles to get it (240 round trip) and I believe it was about $1K more than the one at the local dealer. I still have the car and will will turn 20 in about 8 months.
My point is that "snoozing and losing" may not be anywhere near as dire as many dealers and salespeople think. After all there are tons and tons of used cars out there and the internet has now made it even easier to locate something nearly alike--sometimes better-- within a reasonable distance than it was 12 years ago. I know the old adage that no two used cars are alike, but that is a plus for the consumer in my opinion.
Again, it gets back to what is oft mentioned here: want vs. need. My solution to all those who are worried about car shortages--and want something rather than need something new/used-- is to buy a bicycle (although maybe the Shimano parts for bikes are also in short supply). :P
As for me, I've sunk my money into a new puppy from the humane society--no shortage of those unfortunately. Like used cars, no two are exactly alike, but plenty of great models to choose from.
might not have worded that well, but you don't get all the detail if you aren't buying the cabinets through them. You can have anyone you want install them.
I am actually working with another designer (not connected to a store like that), but who will source the cabinets from a custom maker. She coordinates with a contractor of your choice.
as to the HD option, yes they will do it, but as always, you will get what you pay for. and after having a real designer in, she had way better ideas than we did (and by extension, what the HD guy would whip up based on my ideas). and ultimately, probably will not cost much more, but will be higher quality stuff and more user friendly.
, I never thought of my Father as being that much of a visionary but, who knows, he might have started something
I read that post and your father had some great selling skills. Pretty ingenious actually, and I have taken a few selling courses and have read a few books on the subject.
Especially good was the bit about giving them the plan, then giving them a better plan, and then they have to go with him because he is going to get even better ideas as you go along...he is building trust and dependence!
His are very good, and what I really like, is they are all ethical and fair....no scamming!
I noticed that once out in Anaheim CA. I went to Home Depot around 7:30 AM and there must have been 25 guys waiting around for work. I had never seen that in NJ.
Have you ever considered that the same people who use to grind you for every penny are the same folks who are hiring those "day laborers"? When the allmighty dollar is your king everything else (law, country, morality) goes right out the window.
On the shortage scare: I think in today's highly intergrated auto business the whole production of a car can be halted by a few missing parts. I think someone mentioned a particular airbag sensor being made by only one company in Japan, as an example. The sensor could be made in China but will the Japanese company allow China to do that and risk having the Chineese steal their technology? I think not.
There could be dozens of potential bottlenecks like that facing the auto industry. I can't see how they could not have a shortage of finished product.
Of course that doesn't mean that the salesman isn't hyping up a bad situation to make it seem worse.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
The intake system "cleaning" was most likely a waste of money but, guessing now....685.00
I would have said the same thing except for the fact that BMW developed the procedure. You also get a large bottle of (BMW branded) Techron fuel additive and are told to add it at the next fill-up(using Top Tier/Premium gasoline). The service advisers at my dealer don't push the procedure. In fact, my adviser told me that my 3 Series didn't need it as I run it on high quality fuel and also use a bottle of Techron every 6-8 thousand miles. In contrast, my wife uses Kroger brand gas because it is convenient and a bit cheaper- and when I asked about the procedure my adviser thought that it would be a good idea considering the age and mileage of the truck.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I am going to guess $370...maybe they did some for free as a valued customer.
Hey Roadburner......I saw this great review for the BMW 1 Series M. He said if he had to buy his own car, this would be the one.
I copied this sentence, it might explain the concept of what I mean when I say "the feel of the road". it does harness that famous BMW combination of well-controlled body roll and precise, communicative steering. The M-Sport package’s well-bolstered seats and thick sport steering wheel make it all feel more authentic.”
To read the full review go to: Review BMW 1 Series M Be sure to click at the bottom to read the full article.
The M Coupe has flared wheel arches, a different front spoiler, flared wheel arches, and M3 Competition Package wheels.
Certainly looks like it is meant for business! None of the extra chrome to fancy it up. Looks good too in it's own way......bu I'd opt for the Sport myself.
Do we have to wait until tomorrow to know the answer?
my adviser told me that my 3 Series didn't need it as I run it on high quality fuel and also use a bottle of Techron every 6-8 thousand miles. In contrast, my wife uses Kroger brand gas
I don't mean to be impolite, but that really is a myth. The basic gasoline distribution system in this country is by pipeline to terminals, where it is loaded into tanker trucks for delivery to individual gas stations.
The gas from the different refineries mixes as it travels along the pipelines, so when it arrives at the terminal it isn't Shell or Chevron or Kroger, it's a blend of everything that went in at the far end.
However, the Shell, Chevron, and the unmarked tanker that delivers to Kroger are all filled with the same product, the only difference being the additive package that's either added to the tanker or goes into the tank at the gas station. That's how Shell 'burns cleaner' and Chevron with Techron 'cleans your injectors', but for practical purposes they're the same.
The only difference at the pump is the octance rating, which you can choose, and the percentage of ethanol, which you can't.
The reason why it says 'up to' 10% ethenol may be in the gas? Because like the additives, it's added either to the tanker, or most often to the gas station tanks, and the amount is rarely calculated precisely, though it should err on the conservative side.
Craig...i understand where you're coming from. And, I also agree with you about used cars. I noticed it when I sold my Mother's Grand Marquis a couple of years ago. I heard people say that they were looking at another one exactly like it for $xxx less. I would tell them they better hurry up and buy because it sounded like a "helluva deal". Only to have them come back wanting to negotiate more on my GM.
I never asked them what happened to the GM they had a better deal on.
It was amazing to me how many people called me after I had the GM sold and then told me they were willing to pay me $xx more for it than what I sold it for.
I never said it, but always thought...."then why didn't you?"
Oh, people can be such liars and it was almost comical sometimes.
People would tell me how they were looking at an "identical" used car somewhere else that had a lower price and less miles etc.
I would tell them.." Wow...that car is really underpriced...why don't you go grab it before someone else does?"
I once had a very nice Ford Pickup for sale. It was an older one but in top condition. This was before my "car business" days but I had priced it to sell and as always, I was pretty firm on my price.
The first day the ad hit, I got a flurry of calls. When someone tires to "lowball" me over the phone, without seeing the car, I lose interest quickly.
An older guy called me and told me he was helping a young friend buy a truck. He told me the friend had 1800.00 to spend.
I very nicely told him that they probably needed to look for a truck in that price range. Mine was 2500.00.
He insisted on coming to see it anyway. I invited him over with a reminder that it was a 2500.00 truck and that was what I intended to get for it.
An hour later, he arrived with his young friend. He walked slowlyu around my ten year old truck and touched every flyspeck and chip in the paint making sure I saw him.
I started the engine. It was a cold morning and one of the fan belts squealed for five seconds before becoming quiet.
" Oh...it's going to need an alternator or a water pump". I said nothing.
Suddenly, a car with a middle aged couple pulled up and they both jumped out. " Is it sold yet?" Nope, it's still available"
The other guy said.." Wait a minute, we were here first!" Me..." Yes you were, do you want it or not?"...him..." Well, what is your price?"
" It's 2500.00, just like the ad says and just what I told you on the phone!"
Other guy..." Does it run as good as it looks?" me..." Even better"
me..." Do you want it or not" 2nd guy to the 1st guy..." I'll take it if you don't want it but you were here first"...1st guy..." Arent' you going to even test drive it or take it to a mechanic?"...2nd guy..." Why bother? I can see the care it's had."
1st guy..." Are you really going to pay him the full 2500.00?"
2nd guy as he pulled out a thick roll of 100's..." Sure, it's well worth it...I've been looking for weeks for a truck this nice"
The 1st guys look was priceless as they slowly walked back to their car.
However, the Shell, Chevron, and the unmarked tanker that delivers to Kroger are all filled with the same product, the only difference being the additive package that's either added to the tanker or goes into the tank at the gas station. That's how Shell 'burns cleaner' and Chevron with Techron 'cleans your injectors', but for practical purposes they're the same.
I DO think that the additive package makes a difference; my 318ti had a wonky fuel sending unit, when I switched to BP, Marathon, or Shell fuel it cured the problem. Ditto for my wife's 3er. When my MS3 threw an "EGR flow insufficient" CEL I switched from Kroger to BP fuel and the light did not reappear for over 10,000 miles. Coincidence? Perhaps, but I remain convinced that certain additives -Techron in particular- whether in the fuel or added from a bottle does help keep the injectors, valves, and combustion chambers clean.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Suddenly, a car with a middle aged couple pulled up and they both jumped out. " Is it sold yet?" Nope, it's still available"
That gsave me a good idea. When the 2 guys show up you get a friend to come over and say...What a great truck, I am going to give you $2500 without even testing it. That should make the 2 guys decide to take out their first come first serve option pretty quickly.
The total cost was $645.44. The biggest single item was the R&R of the spark plugs- $200. Still not that bad when you consider you only replace them every 110,000 miles or so.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Mac, you seem to be knowledgeable about gasoline so let me ask you something. I drive a 2006 Lexus LS and my wife drives a 2007 Lexus LX. Both cars require premium gas but occasionally we will fill up with regular, as they seem to run fine on it.
Whenever we have a tank of regular both our autos get about 2 mpg better mileage. We buy 90% of our gas at Costco and their "blend" uses up to 10% ethanol.
Since ethanol has a higher octane rating than gasoline, my theory is that Costco simply adds more ethanol to their "premium" gas to increase the octane rating to 91, but since more alcohol would reduce your mileage, that is why we get better mileage on regular...less alcohol.
All purely supposition on my part but I would appreciate your opinion and opinions of others as well.
Since ethanol has a higher octane rating than gasoline, my theory is that Costco simply adds more ethanol to their "premium" gas to increase the octane rating to 91, but since more alcohol would reduce your mileage, that is why we get better mileage on regular...less alcohol.
I can't argue with your reasoning, although I don't know if that's what Costco are doing.
Your Lexus manual specifies premium because the engine is relatively high compression, and a high octane fuel which ignites less easily is required to prevent pre-ignition 'knock'. It will run fine on low octane regular though, because it has a 'knock' sensor that allows the computer to retard the ignition timing to eliminate the pre-ignition issue. While this reduces the performance, if you're actually seeing an increase in economy it indicates that the regular gas is probably low or completely lacking in ethanol (maybe they're pouring it all into the premium tanks! )
If you hunt around a little you can find instructions on how to measure the ethanol content of your gas using a rainwater gauge, a sample of the gas, and a little water.
IMO ethanol is only of benefit to farmers and the ethanol industry. It doesn't benefit the motorist one bit. If you're lucky enough to have a gas station that sells ethanol free gas, use it whenever you can. They can often be found near boat ramps and marinas as there isn't currently a single outboard manufacturer that recommends any percentage of ethanol as being suitable for use in their engine, two stroke or four stroke.
Those additives that make the difference in one brand of gas or another are noticeable. I've had vehicles that were fussy about brand - not so much recently. The real culprit was the old Volvo.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
That gsave me a good idea. When the 2 guys show up you get a friend to come over and say...What a great truck, I am going to give you $2500 without even testing it. That should make the 2 guys decide to take out their first come first serve option pretty quickly.
Something like that happened to me in the mid 70’s when I was getting rid of a ’67 Impala 2 door with around 93K miles for $150. It was worn out body wise (a good bit of rust on the rocker panels and rear wheel wells) but it ran great. Just couldn’t kill that thing. As a guy was looking at it in the driveway Mrs. jmonroe comes to the door and motions to me. I excuse myself, go to the door and she tells me that there is a guy on the phone and he wants to talk to me about the car. I told her to get his number and I’d call him back even if the guy that was there buys it. I go back to the driveway and the guy said, “that was somebody else calling about the car, huh”? I said, “yes but you’re here so you get to say yea or nay”. He said, “I’ll take it. Although this thing isn’t all that pretty it sure does run well. That’s why I want it. You’re asking a fair price and because of that you’re phone is going to ring off the hook”.
He was right; I must have gotten 10 calls that Saturday afternoon and another 10 the next day. This was before the days of answering machines or I would have created a message to handle all of those calls.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Those additives that make the difference in one brand of gas or another are noticeable. I've had vehicles that were fussy about brand - not so much recently. The real culprit was the old Volvo.
About a year ago I get an almost frantic call from DIL #1. She’s driving Son #1’s ’01 Altima 3.5 V6 and she won’t make it home without having to get gas. She tried to call him but his cell phone if off so she called me. She asks, “is Chevron a brand name gas? He told me not to use a no-name gas in his car because it doesn’t like it. I’m in West VA; we don’t have those stations at home, so I have to know before I put it in”. I said, “yes, but is that car really that finicky”? She said, “you know how he is about these things with cars so I wanted to make sure”.
My ‘09 Genny V8 can run on regular or premium (per the manual) but the premium is supposed to give you 8 more HP (375, I think). So, to play the game, I must have alternated a dozen times when I bought that thing in March of ’09 but I couldn’t tell one iota of difference in how it ran or the MPG so I stop playing the game. Along comes the first cold morning in November and when I stomped on it getting on the PA turnpike I could tell a difference then. I found out that cold air intake trumps premium gas, by a good bit.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Hi, I am the internet coordinator for my dealership, I worked on the floor at for a while before this selling Honda's, and I do have a couple of goodies. I was looking back at the earlier posts, (2006) and saw a lot of hooplah regarding test drives. I once worked with a customer on a Fit Sport one night. We had two in stock, one silver, and one grey. They wanted the silver one, but it hadn't been PDI'd yet, so we test drove the grey one. They liked it, we agreed to a price and They gave me a deposit on the silver one. They left with the understanding that the silver one would be available the next day.
The next day, I had the car cleaned, filled, and ready, and I offered them to look at it, to make sure that this was in fact the one they wanted. They declined, saying that it looked great. Everything went great until two weeks later, when the CSI came in, they gave me a bad score because I "refused to let them drive the one they purchased!"
Come back next week for the man who couldn't drive an automatic!
they gave me a bad score because I "refused to let them drive the one they purchased!"
Just a guess, but could the survey question have been, "Did you test drive the car you purchased?" and they answered honestly without thinking the survey had a hidden agenda.
Before I knew better I did the same thing in the past. If the salesman had told me it wasn't a survey by the manufacturer to improve the customer experience, which is how it appears to the customer, but had told me that to get his full commission it needed to be all 'excellent', 'yes', and '10' I would have filled it out that way.
>In contrast, my wife uses Kroger brand gas because it is convenient and a bit cheaper-
Not to get off topic (grin)
but the Kroger gas here is rumored to be Shell gas. That's since their cooperation with the Shell stations to honor the 10 cents per gallon Kroger Card discount at the Shell pumps.
but the Kroger gas here is rumored to be Shell gas. That's since their cooperation with the Shell stations to honor the 10 cents per gallon Kroger Card discount at the Shell pumps.
I'm not taking any chances; I get Shell 93 and use the Kroger discount.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
they gave me a bad score because I "refused to let them drive the one they purchased!"
It really sounds like a misunderstanding.....people can't be that dumb. Miscommunication is so easy, especially when there is a language barrier for example, so the question might not have been worded right, or the customer might not have realized how bad that sounds for you.
I think mistakes must have happened, because my dealer tells me very clearly to let them know if there is anything I am not satisfied with, because they really want to get the best scores in the country...makes you feel guilty if you don't give them a good score.
They always washed the car when I took it in for service, but these days they actually clean the mats and clean any dust on the instrument panel.
Nice to have you aboard internetguru, and as was mentioned we don't have a real Honda salesman any more...in fact we don't have any real salesman around any more.
Comments
That is the very thing that turned me off about my trusted and faithful Chrysler dealership. When they were bought out by the mega dealer, new servcie people were hired. My convertible suddenly had these "urgent" things that needed to be fixed. Not being mechanically inclined, I was tempted to allow the repairs. Then I remembered that the former servcie guys had always found my car to be in excellent condition. Brake pads were NOT an "urgent" issue on a two year old car with 20K miles. Neither were the belts. My response? Just change the oil this time. I haven't returned. My Cadillac dealer takes care of the convertible now. They haven't mentioned any problems with my Chrysler up to this point.
Richard
what we got (computer generated now of course) are a few basic 3D views of what it would look like. Not exactly to scale I don't think, and no dimensions of any sort. basically a "vision" of what it could be.
if we like it, and sign a contract, then the full layout plans are available. But if we don't go with this lady, she keeps all that.
so the most we can do (similar to car deal) is take he ideas and price and shop them around! But I cna't just take he plans down to the local cabinet wholesaler and tell him to load up the truck.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
It'll be good to have, once your "kitchen designer" hits you with a big price...
I can understand not letting you have those plans... but, a contract? Without a price/materials spec sheet?
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I actually do NEED a car, if not now, then certainly by the fall. Our 2010 TSX gets the job done for us now, but with 3 children in child safety seats (We've got 2 boys & a 3rd child on the way) a sedan is no longer practical.
I actually did a decent amount of research. We needed a 4WD or AWD vehicle that had 3 sets of LATCHes across the 2nd row of seats. We need a vehicle that has a 3rd row of seats. We wanted something rock solid reliable, dependable, & long lasting. We want factory integrated navigation (our TSX has it & we feel it is light years better than the portables).
Our choices were pretty slim. The Pilot has everything we want.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Thanks, a few of us have been saying this for years.
Statistics almost guarantees that it evens itself out. No dealership can be so unlucky that they lose all the time.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
" Sorry, someone bought it an hour after you left"
I had to be very careful not to portray an " I told you so" attitude or I wold never see them again."
That happened to me 12 years ago when I landed on a car I really wanted at a local dealership. It was fairly rare, with low mileage and in decent shape. I wanted to think about it and hash it out with my wife so naturally I was pretty upset when it wasn't there two or three days later. My wife suggested checking the internet and lo-and-behold I found another "nearly identical" car with even less miles, more options, a nicer body and tighter engine. Of course I had to drive 120 miles to get it (240 round trip) and I believe it was about $1K more than the one at the local dealer. I still have the car and will will turn 20 in about 8 months.
My point is that "snoozing and losing" may not be anywhere near as dire as many dealers and salespeople think. After all there are tons and tons of used cars out there and the internet has now made it even easier to locate something nearly alike--sometimes better-- within a reasonable distance than it was 12 years ago. I know the old adage that no two used cars are alike, but that is a plus for the consumer in my opinion.
Again, it gets back to what is oft mentioned here: want vs. need. My solution to all those who are worried about car shortages--and want something rather than need something new/used-- is to buy a bicycle (although maybe the Shimano parts for bikes are also in short supply). :P
As for me, I've sunk my money into a new puppy from the humane society--no shortage of those unfortunately. Like used cars, no two are exactly alike, but plenty of great models to choose from.
Gogiboy
Damn, I never thought of my Father as being that much of a visionary but, who knows, he might have started something. :shades:
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I am actually working with another designer (not connected to a store like that), but who will source the cabinets from a custom maker. She coordinates with a contractor of your choice.
as to the HD option, yes they will do it, but as always, you will get what you pay for. and after having a real designer in, she had way better ideas than we did (and by extension, what the HD guy would whip up based on my ideas). and ultimately, probably will not cost much more, but will be higher quality stuff and more user friendly.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
, I never thought of my Father as being that much of a visionary but, who knows, he might have started something
I read that post and your father had some great selling skills. Pretty ingenious actually, and I have taken a few selling courses and have read a few books on the subject.
Especially good was the bit about giving them the plan, then giving them a better plan, and then they have to go with him because he is going to get even better ideas as you go along...he is building trust and dependence!
His are very good, and what I really like, is they are all ethical and fair....no scamming!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
You can always buy the cabinets and have a couple of these guys install them!
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
I never EVER thought we would have that here in WA where we live but every morning you can find a dozen guys standing waiting for jobs.
Coming to your area....soon!
Have you ever considered that the same people who use to grind you for every penny are the same folks who are hiring those "day laborers"? When the allmighty dollar is your king everything else (law, country, morality) goes right out the window.
On the shortage scare:
I think in today's highly intergrated auto business the whole production of a car can be halted by a few missing parts. I think someone mentioned a particular airbag sensor being made by only one company in Japan, as an example. The sensor could be made in China but will the Japanese company allow China to do that and risk having the Chineese steal their technology? I think not.
There could be dozens of potential bottlenecks like that facing the auto industry. I can't see how they could not have a shortage of finished product.
Of course that doesn't mean that the salesman isn't hyping up a bad situation to make it seem worse.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
1. Oil Service(an oil/filter change and brake inspection- including 7 quarts of synthetic oil)
2. Automatic transmission fluid change
3. Transfer case oil change
4. BMW's proprietary intake system/combustion chamber cleaning
5. Spark plug change- the originals lasted 113,250 miles(!)
So... How much did I pay for all of the above?
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
Nope.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I would have said the same thing except for the fact that BMW developed the procedure. You also get a large bottle of (BMW branded) Techron fuel additive and are told to add it at the next fill-up(using Top Tier/Premium gasoline). The service advisers at my dealer don't push the procedure. In fact, my adviser told me that my 3 Series didn't need it as I run it on high quality fuel and also use a bottle of Techron every 6-8 thousand miles. In contrast, my wife uses Kroger brand gas because it is convenient and a bit cheaper- and when I asked about the procedure my adviser thought that it would be a good idea considering the age and mileage of the truck.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Richard
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I am going to guess $370...maybe they did some for free as a valued customer.
Hey Roadburner......I saw this great review for the BMW 1 Series M. He said if he had to buy his own car, this would be the one.
I copied this sentence, it might explain the concept of what I mean when I say "the feel of the road".
it does harness that famous BMW combination of well-controlled body roll and precise, communicative steering. The M-Sport package’s well-bolstered seats and thick sport steering wheel make it all feel more authentic.”
To read the full review go to:
Review BMW 1 Series M
Be sure to click at the bottom to read the full article.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
The M Coupe has flared wheel arches, a different front spoiler, flared wheel arches, and M3 Competition Package wheels.
And yes, I want one. Bad.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Certainly looks like it is meant for business! None of the extra chrome to fancy it up. Looks good too in it's own way......bu I'd opt for the Sport myself.
Do we have to wait until tomorrow to know the answer?
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I don't mean to be impolite, but that really is a myth.
The basic gasoline distribution system in this country is by pipeline to terminals, where it is loaded into tanker trucks for delivery to individual gas stations.
The gas from the different refineries mixes as it travels along the pipelines, so when it arrives at the terminal it isn't Shell or Chevron or Kroger, it's a blend of everything that went in at the far end.
However, the Shell, Chevron, and the unmarked tanker that delivers to Kroger are all filled with the same product, the only difference being the additive package that's either added to the tanker or goes into the tank at the gas station. That's how Shell 'burns cleaner' and Chevron with Techron 'cleans your injectors', but for practical purposes they're the same.
The only difference at the pump is the octance rating, which you can choose, and the percentage of ethanol, which you can't.
The reason why it says 'up to' 10% ethenol may be in the gas?
Because like the additives, it's added either to the tanker, or most often to the gas station tanks, and the amount is rarely calculated precisely, though it should err on the conservative side.
Maybe they can justify charging more that way?
I never asked them what happened to the GM they had a better deal on.
It was amazing to me how many people called me after I had the GM sold and then told me they were willing to pay me $xx more for it than what I sold it for.
I never said it, but always thought...."then why didn't you?"
People would tell me how they were looking at an "identical" used car somewhere else that had a lower price and less miles etc.
I would tell them.." Wow...that car is really underpriced...why don't you go grab it before someone else does?"
I once had a very nice Ford Pickup for sale. It was an older one but in top condition. This was before my "car business" days but I had priced it to sell and as always, I was pretty firm on my price.
The first day the ad hit, I got a flurry of calls. When someone tires to "lowball" me over the phone, without seeing the car, I lose interest quickly.
An older guy called me and told me he was helping a young friend buy a truck. He told me the friend had 1800.00 to spend.
I very nicely told him that they probably needed to look for a truck in that price range. Mine was 2500.00.
He insisted on coming to see it anyway. I invited him over with a reminder that it was a 2500.00 truck and that was what I intended to get for it.
An hour later, he arrived with his young friend. He walked slowlyu around my ten year old truck and touched every flyspeck and chip in the paint making sure I saw him.
I started the engine. It was a cold morning and one of the fan belts squealed for five seconds before becoming quiet.
" Oh...it's going to need an alternator or a water pump". I said nothing.
Suddenly, a car with a middle aged couple pulled up and they both jumped out. " Is it sold yet?" Nope, it's still available"
The other guy said.." Wait a minute, we were here first!" Me..." Yes you were, do you want it or not?"...him..." Well, what is your price?"
" It's 2500.00, just like the ad says and just what I told you on the phone!"
Other guy..." Does it run as good as it looks?" me..." Even better"
me..." Do you want it or not" 2nd guy to the 1st guy..." I'll take it if you don't want it but you were here first"...1st guy..." Arent' you going to even test drive it or take it to a mechanic?"...2nd guy..." Why bother? I can see the care it's had."
1st guy..." Are you really going to pay him the full 2500.00?"
2nd guy as he pulled out a thick roll of 100's..." Sure, it's well worth it...I've been looking for weeks for a truck this nice"
The 1st guys look was priceless as they slowly walked back to their car.
I DO think that the additive package makes a difference; my 318ti had a wonky fuel sending unit, when I switched to BP, Marathon, or Shell fuel it cured the problem. Ditto for my wife's 3er. When my MS3 threw an "EGR flow insufficient" CEL I switched from Kroger to BP fuel and the light did not reappear for over 10,000 miles. Coincidence? Perhaps, but I remain convinced that certain additives -Techron in particular- whether in the fuel or added from a bottle does help keep the injectors, valves, and combustion chambers clean.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
That gsave me a good idea. When the 2 guys show up you get a friend to come over and say...What a great truck, I am going to give you $2500 without even testing it. That should make the 2 guys decide to take out their first come first serve option pretty quickly.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Maybe they can justify charging more that way?
It is because an Oil Service is more than a simple oil change. On an E83 X3 an Oil Service consists of the following:
1. Oil change
2. Microfilter (cabin filter) replacement
3. Removal of wheels, removal and inspection of brake pads, inspection of rotors, greasing of hub centering bores
4. Parking brake adjustment if needed
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Whenever we have a tank of regular both our autos get about 2 mpg better mileage. We buy 90% of our gas at Costco and their "blend" uses up to 10% ethanol.
Since ethanol has a higher octane rating than gasoline, my theory is that Costco simply adds more ethanol to their "premium" gas to increase the octane rating to 91, but since more alcohol would reduce your mileage, that is why we get better mileage on regular...less alcohol.
All purely supposition on my part but I would appreciate your opinion and opinions of others as well.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I can't argue with your reasoning, although I don't know if that's what Costco are doing.
Your Lexus manual specifies premium because the engine is relatively high compression, and a high octane fuel which ignites less easily is required to prevent pre-ignition 'knock'.
It will run fine on low octane regular though, because it has a 'knock' sensor that allows the computer to retard the ignition timing to eliminate the pre-ignition issue.
While this reduces the performance, if you're actually seeing an increase in economy it indicates that the regular gas is probably low or completely lacking in ethanol (maybe they're pouring it all into the premium tanks!
If you hunt around a little you can find instructions on how to measure the ethanol content of your gas using a rainwater gauge, a sample of the gas, and a little water.
IMO ethanol is only of benefit to farmers and the ethanol industry. It doesn't benefit the motorist one bit. If you're lucky enough to have a gas station that sells ethanol free gas, use it whenever you can.
They can often be found near boat ramps and marinas as there isn't currently a single outboard manufacturer that recommends any percentage of ethanol as being suitable for use in their engine, two stroke or four stroke.
Those additives that make the difference in one brand of gas or another are noticeable. I've had vehicles that were fussy about brand - not so much recently. The real culprit was the old Volvo.
Something like that happened to me in the mid 70’s when I was getting rid of a ’67 Impala 2 door with around 93K miles for $150. It was worn out body wise (a good bit of rust on the rocker panels and rear wheel wells) but it ran great. Just couldn’t kill that thing. As a guy was looking at it in the driveway Mrs. jmonroe comes to the door and motions to me. I excuse myself, go to the door and she tells me that there is a guy on the phone and he wants to talk to me about the car. I told her to get his number and I’d call him back even if the guy that was there buys it. I go back to the driveway and the guy said, “that was somebody else calling about the car, huh”? I said, “yes but you’re here so you get to say yea or nay”. He said, “I’ll take it. Although this thing isn’t all that pretty it sure does run well. That’s why I want it. You’re asking a fair price and because of that you’re phone is going to ring off the hook”.
He was right; I must have gotten 10 calls that Saturday afternoon and another 10 the next day. This was before the days of answering machines or I would have created a message to handle all of those calls.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
About a year ago I get an almost frantic call from DIL #1. She’s driving Son #1’s ’01 Altima 3.5 V6 and she won’t make it home without having to get gas. She tried to call him but his cell phone if off so she called me. She asks, “is Chevron a brand name gas? He told me not to use a no-name gas in his car because it doesn’t like it. I’m in West VA; we don’t have those stations at home, so I have to know before I put it in”. I said, “yes, but is that car really that finicky”? She said, “you know how he is about these things with cars so I wanted to make sure”.
My ‘09 Genny V8 can run on regular or premium (per the manual) but the premium is supposed to give you 8 more HP (375, I think). So, to play the game, I must have alternated a dozen times when I bought that thing in March of ’09 but I couldn’t tell one iota of difference in how it ran or the MPG so I stop playing the game. Along comes the first cold morning in November and when I stomped on it getting on the PA turnpike I could tell a difference then. I found out that cold air intake trumps premium gas, by a good bit.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
The next day, I had the car cleaned, filled, and ready, and I offered them to look at it, to make sure that this was in fact the one they wanted. They declined, saying that it looked great. Everything went great until two weeks later, when the CSI came in, they gave me a bad score because I "refused to let them drive the one they purchased!"
Come back next week for the man who couldn't drive an automatic!
Just a guess, but could the survey question have been, "Did you test drive the car you purchased?" and they answered honestly without thinking the survey had a hidden agenda.
Before I knew better I did the same thing in the past. If the salesman had told me it wasn't a survey by the manufacturer to improve the customer experience, which is how it appears to the customer, but had told me that to get his full commission it needed to be all 'excellent', 'yes', and '10' I would have filled it out that way.
I still feel guilty about it sometimes even now!
Well, you should have offered them a "test drive". Maybe that's why you're the 'internetguru' now and not on the floor. :confuse:
Anyway, welcome aboard. We lost out last Honda sales guy and we've been looking for a replacement.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Not to get off topic (grin)
but the Kroger gas here is rumored to be Shell gas. That's since their cooperation with the Shell stations to honor the 10 cents per gallon Kroger Card discount at the Shell pumps.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I'm not taking any chances; I get Shell 93 and use the Kroger discount.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
It really sounds like a misunderstanding.....people can't be that dumb. Miscommunication is so easy, especially when there is a language barrier for example, so the question might not have been worded right, or the customer might not have realized how bad that sounds for you.
I think mistakes must have happened, because my dealer tells me very clearly to let them know if there is anything I am not satisfied with, because they really want to get the best scores in the country...makes you feel guilty if you don't give them a good score.
They always washed the car when I took it in for service, but these days they actually clean the mats and clean any dust on the instrument panel.
Nice to have you aboard internetguru, and as was mentioned we don't have a real Honda salesman any more...in fact we don't have any real salesman around any more.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250