The reason I buy Lexus is because I can afford one and if one day I can no longer I'd be more than happy to get a Toyota product. To answer your question. No, I don't have a rebadged Camry. The standard Camry (especially the SE) is pretty good in my book.
Well GM laughed at the first VW cars. Once they were a sucess here, they tried, with the Corvair, to one up VW. The rest is history.
What GM and the other two of the once again, Big 3 domestics need to do is to quit this fixation on trying to be the other person (auto) and make what they do best. Don't believe me? Well look at the CTS and Chrysler 300 and the Mustang. Japan, and Europe are not building such cars. Those are NEW cars, and UNQUIE cars. Ford created the Pony car, and Chrysler the Hemi and the blocky car with the too tall doors, some people crave, while GM gave us the Arts & Science look. A Corvette sells for a good price. It is a consistant effort at being Americas number one sports car.
Why would I look at an Aveo, as there are so many other Korean cars with many models to choose between. What's the difference. Is the Cobalt more than an improvement on the Cavalier? If the Cobalt was a new car, as those described above, it would get 40 MPG or be all electric like the EV-1 or you get the picture, something Japan or Europe is not doing. How about a little car or mid-sized car which looks like a million buck, looks futuristic, or looks like a bit like a retro American built car of days-gone-bye? The Impala may be such a car, as in New. Hope it is New and Unique, and nothing like competition. Let them play catch-up on styling. The Camry style is the Bangle butt rear. They wouldn't dare copy the New Impala though -- well I guess not. For the small trucks, I would dump the current Colorado look in favor of a retro look, just like the '49 trucks or an HHR. Why not have a little fun with stylin' on those baby trucks? Loren
Well GM laughed at the first VW cars. Once they were a success here, they tried, with the Corvair, to one up VW. The rest is history.
If you're saying that GM's rep is worse than VW's in North America, I'm afraid lots of people aren't going to agree with you.
On a personal note, my sister wanted to buy a Passat to replace her new Beetle a few months ago. Loved the car, but the reliability concerns scared her off, even though her awful dealer did get a lot better in the last 2 years of ownership of her VW.
I happened to see a convertible Corvair tooling around this morning btw. :shades:
No, not the current state of affairs. VW is like a deer in the headlights. They need to make a move and seem frozen in time. What I say referring to was historic in nature. What happened during those years of GM vs. VW, when VW won. Heavens, today I just shake my head in wonders, as VW states that 8/10 of a quart per 1k miles is normal oil consumption. I get the feeling, IMHO, that their engines are old school. Maybe GM could interest them in some OHV 3.5 V6s I do love the interior look and feel of the VW product with one exception. My knees hit the steer wheel column on entry / exits. Loren
Reading about the new Dreamliner and Airbus's methods, we could very well see more cross use of completed systems in GM and other manufacturers cars. If that VW DSG transmission is so great, why not ship them to GM to use? Let the assembly line become the final assembly line.
Well GM laughed at the first VW cars. Once they were a sucess here, they tried, with the Corvair, to one up VW. The rest is history
Only if you are a Naderite. They fixed the problem by 1964, and had a retrofit kit for'60-'63. These cars actually sold real well.
In '65 or '66 the order came down to halt ALL development on a 3rd gen 'vair and improving the gen 2 (backlash from the book, maybe). It was then killed in '69.
...goes beyond Nader. I think people simply preferred the more conventional Ford Falcon to the odd rear-engineered Corvair. Personally, I think the Valiant was the most desirable of the Big Three compacts introduced in 1960. The Falcon was boxy and dull and the Corvair was just weird.
"Look at the IS350, after almost 2 years of its debut it is still officially (although many BMW faithful will disagree here) one of the horsepower kings in its class. Why doesn't the 3.6L V6 in the new CTS utilizes duel DI like the 2GR-FSE in the IS350? That technology does make the engine more fuel efficient last I checked."
as I keep saying, it would help if those being critical knew anything about GM products. The 3.6L in the CTS will have DI and produce 302hp. That is only 4hp less than the IS and not enough to mean anything in the real world. I'm still waiting for Toyota to create a V8 with 400hp. BTW, Gm also used DI tech in the 2L turbo 4 used in the Solstice GXP.
The CTS has keyless entry and start. It has a twist start ignition just like the RL and several other cars. Its virtually the same as push button start.
"Maybe because the base for these cars is so competent, they are seen as awesome fleet cars and good normal cars, rather than the good fleet cars and mediocre normal cars we see here? "
No, I doubt it. There isnt anything too impressive about a base model European car, not even in the US. When you take away the large wheels, navigation, leather seats, HIDS, etc. Euro cars seem pretty pedestrian. In Europe I suspect people dont get offended by their native manufacturers providing cars for use by companies and the government. Only in America do people think its embarrassing for native automakers to provide the vehicles necessary for getting business done. Fleet cars by nature are not "awesome" since they are typically sparesly equipped and have the weakest engine available.
BTW, in Philly we have fleet Pruis' and as some may know one of the rental companies has just committed to a major purchase of Prius'.
cooterbfd: Only if you are a Naderite. They fixed the problem by 1964, and had a retrofit kit for'60-'63. These cars actually sold real well.
A better approach would have been for GM to install the anti-sway bar from day one, which cost less than $15 per car, thus avoiding the need for retrofit kits. It would also not have given Nader any fodder for his book.
GM needed to learn that if something is worth doing, it is worth doing right. Unfortunately, as the Vega and the X-cars proved, GM still hadn't learned that lesson over 20 years later.
...$15 per car, (equivalent to $101 in today's money) was a big sum in 1960. Over the 1960-64 Corvair production of 1,219,110 vehicles you're looking at $18,286,650 or $123,130,110 in today's money.
But if GM had spent that money, it could have avoided a firestorm of bad publicity and a serious black mark on the Chevrolet name. Which was worth a lot more than $18.2 million, or $123.130 million.
GM failed to realize that the Corvair's appeal was not in providing basic, reliable transportation. The Corvair appealed to the enthusiasts who were interested in driving and could really appreciate the rear-engine layout. The success of the Monza coupe should have told GM this. If GM had taken the effort to get the suspension right from day one, the car could have been remembered as a big success.
It all boils down to GM's attitude at the time - that all small cars must be cheap cars. (An attitude that GM hasn't entirely shaken today.)
GM failed to realize what it had in the Corvair, especially the Monza.
"Why twist start when one can just push a button? Cost saving I guess?"
I dont know, Ask Acura. If its good enough for the RL it's good enough for the CTS. Infiniti also has a similar system on some of its models. How lazy can one get anyway? You think twisting a switch is too much work? Push button start is one of the most meaningless gimmicks going right now. I'd rather have remote start than push button start.
The DI in the 3.6L does the same stuff as the Lexus system, trust me. All DI systems increase efficiency- the 3.6 with 302hp is supposed to get better mileage than the normal version.
another member wrote this in the 2008 Malibu forum:
"As for the "Perfection" of foreign cars, in a recent issue of C&D, a long term Acura RL was rated. Problems that occurred? Well, how's a sunroof that refuses to shut at just 6K miles? Electrical problems? Lots of them! Dimmed headlights, screwed up navi. screen, you name it. More than one loose door trim panel. All in less than 40K MILES! Really?!! And they were written off as "minor annoyances" and "a small price to pay for Acura luxury". Can you imagine the fire storm of hatred had that same vehicle been a Caddy or Buick. It would have been totally unacceptable! "No car built in the 21st century should have those problems" they would write. Yet, all is forgiven because it's an Acura. It's not perceived quality, it's sheer bias! That IS unacceptable, let alone the price tag cozies up to 50K. "
Why should I ask Acura? Is this an Acura board? I am just stating a FACT that CTS doesn't have push-button start which now is standard even on the Altima!! Twisting a switch is not too much work but since most of CTS' competitors have them why not the CTS? It is not one of the most meaningless gimmicks right now and I personally would NOT own another car that does NOT have a push-button start. Yes, I am that impressive with the feature. Twist switch will pass in my book but push-botton is preferred.
The DI in the 3.6L is single stage and the 2GR-FSE has duel DI. NOT THE SAME STUFF.
Hint to GM: When you debut a car 2 years after the competitor, makes sure it measures up on all the features AND SOME.
I just wonder if the Corvair would've been such a failure had Ralph Nader never given the car the bad publicity? I think there is more to it than just the alleged "squirrelly handling" of the first generation model. The reports of "squirrelly handling" was due to American drivers being used to cars that understeer while the Corvair, with its swing-axles, oversteered. I understand a lot of problems also came from people keeping their tires underinflated which exaggerated the "tuck-under" problem. Most of these problems were pretty much tackled with the beautiful second-generation models.
Was having a rear engine really an advantage or just a gimmick? I'm sure the rear-engined car gave great traction in bad weather given the stories I've heard of my Uncle Daniel's 1962 Corvair easily going up a snow-covered hill that left other car stranded. But what about the car having virtually no front-end collision protection or, from what I've heard of the VW Bug - poor heating in the winter. About the only advantage to the rear engine in both the VW and Corvair was that they were air-cooled.
It also seems most people preferred the very conventional Ford Falcon to either the Exner-styled Valiant or the Corvair. Chevrolet noticed this as it introduced its own conventional RWD compact - the Chevy II/Nova in 1962.
That said, at least Cadillac did the right thing, and put the stick in the car. Lexus might as well have just forgone the manual, because it's obvious that they aren't behind the sick to begin with.
Cadillac is playing catch-up, as is GM. The CTS is a thumbnail of where they are in the landscape. Good, but should be better.
I like the looks of the second gen. Corvair. Would be very cool to see a mid-engine Corvair some day. Ralph Nader was correct about the handle character of the car, but then again the VW was exactly the same. Add the new suspension and a different setup for the belt, so they won't fly off the handle, so to speak, and the car was in a way cool. Would be good to see something less expensive than a Porsche Boxster available as a mid-engine. Oh yeah, add more storage space than the MR2 -- what were they thinking? Loren
True. As for car safety, the issues addressed in the 1968 model year for safety saved a lot of lives. Ol' Ralph was right on a lot of car safety issues. Loren
So did ya like the Nova? A Valiant or a Dart, with a slant six may be driving along the highways of American on the original engine. Like the Eveready battery or a Timex watch they keep going and going. John Cameron Swayze would approve of such durability. :shades: Loren
Didn't care too much for the first-generation Nova either. It wasn't as dull and boxy as a Falcon, but that's kind of like saying a Malibu is sexier than a Camry. I really liked the 1968-72 Nova. After that, they became too fat.
Someone emailed me last weekend looking for help with their car that wouldn't start. They were stranded in a NYC parking garage ($$$).
Turns out the key cylinder had worn out and none of the keys were working any more. They were able to get help from a locksmith and saved a tow.
I think I'd rather switch to a button or a device that's electrical instead of mechanical.
My father had a Valiant for a while. It threw a rod in front of a Ford dealership and was traded for a Falcon. If it had been a GM dealer, he probably would have gone back to a Buick. But he was heading to the lake to go fishing and didn't want to shop around - he was a bit irritated when they didn't want to take his check before the bank opened.
Rear engine was a disadvantage to handling. A mid-engine would be good indeed. Safety of frontal crashes should not be an issue, if the car is built correctly.
As for swing-axles, those can be trouble. Wasn't the Tempest, with a swing-axle a bit much for some to handle? Like any car, it is knowing the limits. I take it you have a turn though which appears to be under control, but just a slight way past the limits of hold all hell breaks loose. The rears tucked under is not a good thing. Guess that is why the VW was egg shaped. You roll the car and returns the the driving position again, or you just get a couple of guys to help right ya, and away you fly.... ummm, drive slowly. Loren
i think GM, plus ford and chrysler make decent vehicles now for usually a lower price than toys and hondas...i try to buy north american at least in everything if possible, but i think they are a good value now, especially if you keep your car for 7-8 years...but 15 or more years of average and mediocre products is a reputation they are trying to shake now...back in the 70s, import quality was noticeably superior, but i dont think that is the case now
my neighbors have f150s with over 200,000 miles on them...on wal mart oil(actually a good oil)..my wifes pastor has 99 suburban with 192k...he changes his oil religiously (bad joke!) every 10 k...how bad can the domestics be? i had a used accord i had to retire, engine was great but light switch and ignition switch broke, front end problem, door handle broke, glove compartment handle broke, car wouldnt start again, fenders kept rusting out...granted it was 14 years old but i expected more out of my first [non-permissible content removed] car ...New england winters eventually kill any car with the salt and moisture...engines dont seem to die though
With sort of luck, you should play the lottery. Most people did not find that their X-cars were durable, although they did give good gas mileage and were nicely packaged (for interior room).
The X-cars weren't examples of bad engineering 20 years after the Corvair. We had an 81 Skylark that was great. Good mileage, good room, durable.
Imidazol97, did you have a 4-cyl Skylark or a V-6? The 4-cyl models did tend to be more reliable than the V-6 versions, and by 1983 or so, the 4-cyl models were usually rated "average" by Consumer Reports, which is about the highest a domestic product could hope to achieve back then.
For some reason, the X-car stigma didn't seem to hit the Skylark as badly as it did the Citation, Phoenix, and Omega. The Phoenix/Omega were dropped early, in 1984, with only the Citation and Skylark making it through 1985. In that last year, Buick still managed to sell around 90-100,000 Skylarks, which isn't a bad showing considering they also had the similar Century, and the Somerset Regal had just come onto the scene. The Skylark was the only name to carry on after the X-cars died out, as the other three nameplates had been tarnished too badly.
Still, I think you might have just lucked out and gotten one of the good ones! :P GM did improve the reliability of the X-cars in 1981, but they still had a long way to go.
I dunno though, maybe GM put more effort into the Skylark than the other X-bodies? Back then, it seemed like with the bigger cars, at least, they put more effort into the Buicks and Oldsmobiles than they did with the Chevies and Pontiacs.
It was a 4-cyl and of course a notchback 4-door. Used a trailer hitch to pull a rental trailer moving furniture. Not a perfect car but great for an economy car. And it didn't rust out like the foreign jobbies of that era.
There are still some Citations around. I note one near the school campus that I saw almost daily. It was the coral color that was popular. It was rusted somewhat. I'd love to know how many miles were on it.
The X-cars had a lot going for them. Too bad that GM didn't sweat the details. They offered decent mileage, good room and even nice interiors on the upper-level trim packages. The Omega and Skylark were handsome, in a sort of "shunken big car" sort of way. I also liked the Citation coupe, especially the X-11 version.
Unfortunately, quality was abysmal...they were most recalled cars in history, until the Ford Focus stepped up to claim that "honor."
Every once in awhile, I'll see an early 80's Pontiac Phoenix coupe here at work. It's white with a landau roof, burgundy interior, and wire hubcaps. Looks almost brand-new. At first I thought it was owned by a little old lady. It just had that look about it. But then one day, I saw the driver...a guy in his 30's, maybe early 40's.
So either this dude is like me and has a fetish for cars from an era that most people try to forget...or he inherited it from some deceased relative.
Yeah, I think rear brakes were a major part of the problem. I have a feeling that cruise control sticking in the "resume" position was another. That seemed to be a common one back then. My '82 Cutlass Supreme had that "feature". Basically, what would happen was that when the cruise got cancelled when you hit the brake, it would resume an instant later. Not TOO scary once you get used to it, but if you're not expecting it, some situations, like highway exit ramps, sudden congestion, etc, can suddenly become very exciting! You could still cancel the cruise by turning it completely off.
I have an old Consumer Guide used car book from around 1987, and it has a comprehensive list of the X-body recalls. I'll have to see if I can dig it up tonite when I get home.
Assuming you had the automatic you had just the right combination for an X car if one wanted to avoid recalls and repairs.
A friend of mine had an 80 Citation with a 4 cyl and automatic and he slipped by almost all the recalls. The sixes had a lot of them and 4 cyl with sticks for some reason.
He only got about 80K out of the car before the repairs got too annoying and he ended up donating it but for maybe four years it did OK.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Rear brakes on the 6-cyl were either too hard or too soft. They adjusted the band material to get more balanced braking. Relatively minor problem fixed by engineering with GM on the offensive! :P
Actually that part was one of those unfortunate pattern that plagued GM for years - putting out a new offering with bugs in it, developing a lousy reputation for the model, fix the bugs so that the car is actually quite nice and then announce the models demise because the early glitches gave it a bad reputation.
I do hope they have overcome that. There are certainly signs that this is so.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
hearts and minds of the reviewers, publishers, and most importantly test equipment of Consumer Reports Auto Reviews.
Furthermore, they have to make more consistently "better than total crap" cars so that the reliability rankings come back positive on CR's annual reports.
If this does not happen GM will cease to exist by 2020.
'18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
"Commentary I've seen from Toyota's execs tells me they have no respect for any of their competitors (OK, maybe HOnda) and do not take them seriously. the big 3 felt the same way in the 70s and we know how that ended up."
Yeah Toyota does repect Honda but they do have respect for Hyundai and GM as well.
Comments
I guess Lexus is just lucky. :P
DrFill
What GM and the other two of the once again, Big 3 domestics need to do is to quit this fixation on trying to be the other person (auto) and make what they do best. Don't believe me? Well look at the CTS and Chrysler 300 and the Mustang. Japan, and Europe are not building such cars. Those are NEW cars, and UNQUIE cars. Ford created the Pony car, and Chrysler the Hemi and the blocky car with the too tall doors, some people crave, while GM gave us the Arts & Science look. A Corvette sells for a good price. It is a consistant effort at being Americas number one sports car.
Why would I look at an Aveo, as there are so many other Korean cars with many models to choose between. What's the difference. Is the Cobalt more than an improvement on the Cavalier? If the Cobalt was a new car, as those described above, it would get 40 MPG or be all electric like the EV-1 or you get the picture, something Japan or Europe is not doing. How about a little car or mid-sized car which looks like a million buck, looks futuristic, or looks like a bit like a retro American built car of days-gone-bye? The Impala may be such a car, as in New. Hope it is New and Unique, and nothing like competition. Let them play catch-up on styling. The Camry style is the Bangle butt rear. They wouldn't dare copy the New Impala though -- well I guess not. For the small trucks, I would dump the current Colorado look in favor of a retro look, just like the '49 trucks or an HHR. Why not have a little fun with stylin' on those baby trucks?
Loren
If you're saying that GM's rep is worse than VW's in North America, I'm afraid lots of people aren't going to agree with you.
On a personal note, my sister wanted to buy a Passat to replace her new Beetle a few months ago. Loved the car, but the reliability concerns scared her off, even though her awful dealer did get a lot better in the last 2 years of ownership of her VW.
I happened to see a convertible Corvair tooling around this morning btw. :shades:
Loren
It was expensive to fix when something broke or didn't work right, but it didn't strand us except when it died for the last time at like 101K miles.
The Dodge was at least 100 times worse than the VW. So in my view, as bad as VW's reputation is, Dodge's is at least 10 times worse.
Reading about the new Dreamliner and Airbus's methods, we could very well see more cross use of completed systems in GM and other manufacturers cars. If that VW DSG transmission is so great, why not ship them to GM to use? Let the assembly line become the final assembly line.
Only if you are a Naderite. They fixed the problem by 1964, and had a retrofit kit for'60-'63. These cars actually sold real well.
In '65 or '66 the order came down to halt ALL development on a 3rd gen 'vair and improving the gen 2 (backlash from the book, maybe). It was then killed in '69.
Nader has played spoiler about a lot of things including a few elections.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
as I keep saying, it would help if those being critical knew anything about GM products. The 3.6L in the CTS will have DI and produce 302hp. That is only 4hp less than the IS and not enough to mean anything in the real world. I'm still waiting for Toyota to create a V8 with 400hp. BTW, Gm also used DI tech in the 2L turbo 4 used in the Solstice GXP.
The CTS has keyless entry and start. It has a twist start ignition just like the RL and several other cars. Its virtually the same as push button start.
Oh, that clears everything up nicely.
No, I doubt it. There isnt anything too impressive about a base model European car, not even in the US. When you take away the large wheels, navigation, leather seats, HIDS, etc. Euro cars seem pretty pedestrian. In Europe I suspect people dont get offended by their native manufacturers providing cars for use by companies and the government. Only in America do people think its embarrassing for native automakers to provide the vehicles necessary for getting business done. Fleet cars by nature are not "awesome" since they are typically sparesly equipped and have the weakest engine available.
BTW, in Philly we have fleet Pruis' and as some may know one of the rental companies has just committed to a major purchase of Prius'.
I know the 3.6L will have DI but I said duel DI. The purpose of the duel DI is not to increase the HP but to make the engine more fuel efficient.
The Toyota 400HP V8 is coming soon (late 07' or early 08'), it'll debut with the 2008 IS-F. A 500HP V10 is also coming with the LF-A.
Why twist start when one can just push a button? Cost saving I guess? :confuse:
A better approach would have been for GM to install the anti-sway bar from day one, which cost less than $15 per car, thus avoiding the need for retrofit kits. It would also not have given Nader any fodder for his book.
GM needed to learn that if something is worth doing, it is worth doing right. Unfortunately, as the Vega and the X-cars proved, GM still hadn't learned that lesson over 20 years later.
$123,130,110 in today's money.
GM failed to realize that the Corvair's appeal was not in providing basic, reliable transportation. The Corvair appealed to the enthusiasts who were interested in driving and could really appreciate the rear-engine layout. The success of the Monza coupe should have told GM this. If GM had taken the effort to get the suspension right from day one, the car could have been remembered as a big success.
It all boils down to GM's attitude at the time - that all small cars must be cheap cars. (An attitude that GM hasn't entirely shaken today.)
GM failed to realize what it had in the Corvair, especially the Monza.
I dont know, Ask Acura. If its good enough for the RL it's good enough for the CTS. Infiniti also has a similar system on some of its models. How lazy can one get anyway? You think twisting a switch is too much work? Push button start is one of the most meaningless gimmicks going right now. I'd rather have remote start than push button start.
The DI in the 3.6L does the same stuff as the Lexus system, trust me. All DI systems increase efficiency- the 3.6 with 302hp is supposed to get better mileage than the normal version.
"As for the "Perfection" of foreign cars, in a recent issue of C&D, a long term Acura RL was rated. Problems that occurred? Well, how's a sunroof that refuses to shut at just 6K miles? Electrical problems? Lots of them! Dimmed headlights, screwed up navi. screen, you name it. More than one loose door trim panel. All in less than 40K MILES! Really?!! And they were written off as "minor annoyances" and "a small price to pay for Acura luxury". Can you imagine the fire storm of hatred had that same vehicle been a Caddy or Buick. It would have been totally unacceptable! "No car built in the 21st century should have those problems" they would write. Yet, all is forgiven because it's an Acura. It's not perceived quality, it's sheer bias! That IS unacceptable, let alone the price tag cozies up to 50K. "
My sentiments exactly.
The DI in the 3.6L is single stage and the 2GR-FSE has duel DI. NOT THE SAME STUFF.
Hint to GM: When you debut a car 2 years after the competitor, makes sure it measures up on all the features AND SOME.
Was having a rear engine really an advantage or just a gimmick? I'm sure the rear-engined car gave great traction in bad weather given the stories I've heard of my Uncle Daniel's 1962 Corvair easily going up a snow-covered hill that left other car stranded. But what about the car having virtually no front-end collision protection or, from what I've heard of the VW Bug - poor heating in the winter. About the only advantage to the rear engine in both the VW and Corvair was that they were air-cooled.
It also seems most people preferred the very conventional Ford Falcon to either the Exner-styled Valiant or the Corvair. Chevrolet noticed this as it introduced its own conventional RWD compact - the Chevy II/Nova in 1962.
Cadillac is playing catch-up, as is GM. The CTS is a thumbnail of where they are in the landscape. Good, but should be better.
DrFill
Loren
Loren
The Corvair was strange car for the Midwest. Lots sold but they drove completely differently.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
:shades:
Loren
Just trying to be thrifty, Loren.
Someone emailed me last weekend looking for help with their car that wouldn't start. They were stranded in a NYC parking garage ($$$).
Turns out the key cylinder had worn out and none of the keys were working any more. They were able to get help from a locksmith and saved a tow.
I think I'd rather switch to a button or a device that's electrical instead of mechanical.
My father had a Valiant for a while. It threw a rod in front of a Ford dealership and was traded for a Falcon. If it had been a GM dealer, he probably would have gone back to a Buick. But he was heading to the lake to go fishing and didn't want to shop around - he was a bit irritated when they didn't want to take his check before the bank opened.
As for swing-axles, those can be trouble. Wasn't the Tempest, with a swing-axle a bit much for some to handle? Like any car, it is knowing the limits. I take it you have a turn though which appears to be under control, but just a slight way past the limits of hold all hell breaks loose. The rears tucked under is not a good thing. Guess that is why the VW was egg shaped. You roll the car and returns the the driving position again, or you just get a couple of guys to help right ya, and away you fly.... ummm, drive slowly.
Loren
At least in the compact SUV segment.
I would buy a Tacoma before a Colorado though. Rework the small truck.
Loren
Imidazol97, did you have a 4-cyl Skylark or a V-6? The 4-cyl models did tend to be more reliable than the V-6 versions, and by 1983 or so, the 4-cyl models were usually rated "average" by Consumer Reports, which is about the highest a domestic product could hope to achieve back then.
For some reason, the X-car stigma didn't seem to hit the Skylark as badly as it did the Citation, Phoenix, and Omega. The Phoenix/Omega were dropped early, in 1984, with only the Citation and Skylark making it through 1985. In that last year, Buick still managed to sell around 90-100,000 Skylarks, which isn't a bad showing considering they also had the similar Century, and the Somerset Regal had just come onto the scene. The Skylark was the only name to carry on after the X-cars died out, as the other three nameplates had been tarnished too badly.
Still, I think you might have just lucked out and gotten one of the good ones! :P GM did improve the reliability of the X-cars in 1981, but they still had a long way to go.
I dunno though, maybe GM put more effort into the Skylark than the other X-bodies? Back then, it seemed like with the bigger cars, at least, they put more effort into the Buicks and Oldsmobiles than they did with the Chevies and Pontiacs.
There are still some Citations around. I note one near the school campus that I saw almost daily. It was the coral color that was popular. It was rusted somewhat. I'd love to know how many miles were on it.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Unfortunately, quality was abysmal...they were most recalled cars in history, until the Ford Focus stepped up to claim that "honor."
So either this dude is like me and has a fetish for cars from an era that most people try to forget...or he inherited it from some deceased relative.
I see a 1985 Skyhawk in a med metallic blue driven by an older lady. Runs great. Don't see any rust without checking closer.
A friend of ours drives only older cars. Buys them from estates, etc.; I don't think any of his even have airbags they're that old.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Man, had I not known, this really sounds like a Toyota board.
I disagree with your position but I'll save my reasons for an appropriate board.
I have an old Consumer Guide used car book from around 1987, and it has a comprehensive list of the X-body recalls. I'll have to see if I can dig it up tonite when I get home.
A friend of mine had an 80 Citation with a 4 cyl and automatic and he slipped by almost all the recalls. The sixes had a lot of them and 4 cyl with sticks for some reason.
He only got about 80K out of the car before the repairs got too annoying and he ended up donating it but for maybe four years it did OK.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Actually that part was one of those unfortunate pattern that plagued GM for years - putting out a new offering with bugs in it, developing a lousy reputation for the model, fix the bugs so that the car is actually quite nice and then announce the models demise because the early glitches gave it a bad reputation.
I do hope they have overcome that. There are certainly signs that this is so.
Interesting you are ascribing that to GM only. Do you think there are foreign-based brands today that have done that?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Furthermore, they have to make more consistently "better than total crap" cars so that the reliability rankings come back positive on CR's annual reports.
If this does not happen GM will cease to exist by 2020.
Yeah Toyota does repect Honda but they do have respect for Hyundai and GM as well.