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Comments
And people are leasing a lot more now..why? My bet is they can't afford to make the higher payments if they were to go to a bank & buy it over the lower leasing costs is the #1 reason. Also, after the lease is over, what do they have? Nothing. No equity, no car..they were renting not true owners.
I also see your point on why some are leasing just as long as the warranty is still on it. So these folks never get out of the cycle of renting..always making payments for as long as they drive. I prefer to have what I have paid for & drive it several years without any payments..while doing this I have a large downpayment on the next vehicle I actually need rather than one I just want.
I'm with you on keeping a rig, as long as it costs less to maintain than replacing it.
Sure! How many independant garages will be able to afford the complex equipment required to service these computerized cars for example.
I wouldn't be suprised if the manufacturers will at some point require the buyer to sign an EULA (End Users Licence Agreement) just like we've been doing with software now for some years. If they don't agree to the manufacturers terms then they void the warranties..think there's no chance of that happening?
That is a pretty ignorant statement. You must have drank 10 gallons of the "big 3 cars suck" kool-aid.
I just got rid of a 96 Saturn that did not have any body rust on it. Actually, it is not possible for it to have body panel rust because they were made of plastic. Still looked fine. Aside from routine maintenance stuff the only problems I had were a broken coolant temperature sensor (fixed for ~$10) and an alternator. That's it. It was ~12 years old with 160k miles on it. Still got 30 mpg.
I currently have an 01 Saturn L200 that has had no problems either. No rust or anything. Taking the time to do simple things like checking the oil, changing the oil, checking and filling the engine coolant. Simple things will prevent a lot of problems down the road.
Yes, I do live in the snowbelt.
So what, almost all makes can last a lot longer than typical results. But what percentage do. A small percentage of those sold, at least in regards to what he/she was talking about... hondas with a half million miles on the orginal engine & tranny etc..typical? Hardly.
Heck, sometimes I even question if Big Three 70's cars were really as bad as I hear they are, since I have three that are still running. Well, okay, so one is currently in the repair shop, and I had to use the second one to jump-start the third.
But the thing that caught my attention was that it got up to 90mpg. Yes 90 is what was quoted. Now I'm not saying we could or should drive something like the Citroen, but how is it if people survived with that vehicle, and yet we "need" on average a 4,000Lb vehicle with 250hp, that gets 25mpg? Are we really putting mpg high on the priority list?
And with modern electronics the efficiency of our engines should be much better than in the 1950's.
Is a 500 mile trip with 3 kids fun in ANY vehicle?
BTW - I'm leaving Saturday on a two-week 3500 mile driving vacation with TWO kids (and the wife).....in a Prius. If you'd like, I can report back on how much 'fun' we had. :shades:
I think once you break the two kid barrier life changes. That's when we moved into a van. With the one having turned 18 and having her own car (a relative term) we almost don't need a van. Were it not for the insurance I think I'd buy something used a little to do most driving in and just use the van when it's appropriate.
My life changed with kid #1. And despite that, we quickly moved on to kid #2.....and holding steady at that count.
Funny thing is, we (I) traded in our SUV for a nice new Odyssey a couple of years ago when we (I) thought we needed more room.......and yet here we are getting ready for a long vacation in a borrowed Prius. Go figure.
btw - check your e-mail.
Message received!
I would think that the vast majority of cars well maintained and taken care of should reach ten years.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Then I am right behind you in my Elantra, going on 8 years with slightly over 140K on it and running strong. I want to keep it a few more years and think it can easily make ten years.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
While I'm generally not a lease sort 15K a year on miles and that money factor is pretty impressive.
I see a lot of 15K leases per year but not that good a money factor.
I never lease myself. My dad did for a decade or better. He seemed to do OK until the lease he's on now. Got hosed on that one. Ticks me off. He had leased three or four DeVilles from these guys and wanted to go into something smaller and landed in a Buick. The payments aren't much less. They just took advantage of a loyal customer who was getting old.
He still has the car but he can't drive now.
The waters are filled with sharks....
We had a lease like that on the last remaining LR3s for 2006.
The money factor was less then one percent and they gave you enough lease cash to pay your first months payment and all registration fees.
This was a very impressive vehicle. On the outside, a regular RAV4, with same interior, suspension, bodywork, etc....but no tailpipe!
The car "felt like" it had about 150 HP or so. Owners tell me that they can go confidently at least 100 miles on a charge and a re-charge takes 4--8 hours. It runs at highway speeds, acclerated just like a gas car, has AC, heated seats, heated windshield, automatic, power steering (but not power brakes, interestingly).
This one had 58,000 miles on it with no problems reported. Toyota will fix them under warranty but most have had warranty run out. No reason why any Toyota dealer couldn't fix the "normal" parts of the car.
If the batteries die, however, you'd be in deep doo-doo, as Toyota offers no replacements far as I know. Some companies can apparently build batteries for you but it wouldn't be cheap.
These vehicles sell occasionally on eBay in the range of $35,000---$65,000.
MSRP was $42,000 back in the day.
That is a pretty ignorant statement. You must have drank 10 gallons of the "big 3 cars suck" kool-aid.
What are you on drugs or something?! :mad:
I asked a question. What cars do you think will last 10 years. The "that's about it" statement referred to the Subies and th Honda's being eaten by the chemical that's put down on the roads up here. I'm not going to post something about a car I haven't owned. True I haven't owned a Big 3 car since my 1996 Impala SS. But you need to read things a bit more clearly and get that huge chip off your shoulder!
If I knew what cars would last 10 years or more I would have said that the Big 3 suck or something. I did not say that so stop making a problem where there isn't one. If a car is poorly made then it doesn't matter who makes it diba?
Actually, don't think I haven't thought of that, with my New Yorkers! Another possibility I've thought of is going back a few years, and putting an early 70's type setup on it. The '79 New Yorker 360 only put out 150 hp, but in the earlier 70's, the non-leanburn 360 put out around 180 hp just with a 2-bbl, 200 with a 4bbl. And the hot setup, like a Duster 360, put out around 230-245, depending on year.
In the 90's, when the 360 went Magnum, I think the 360 put out around 230-245 hp, depending on the year.
I know this would never be practical from a financial standpoint, but if I took a modern engine and fitted into my '79 NYer, I wonder how it would perform? I'm thinking something smaller, like say a 3.5 V-6 out of a wrecked Charger. I think it's EPA-rated at 19/27 in the Charger. If I grabbed the engine, transmission, and everything else required to make it run, and forced it into my NYer, I wonder if fuel economy would be similar? The NYer body is less aerodynamic, but probably no more frontal area. And by the time the 360 got swapped out for the 3.5, the total weight might actually be less!
After we got our Outlook a couple of weeks ago, they can be seperated. Voila! No more fighting. Put the same kids in my other car (midsize sedan) where they bump against each other for the same trip. Shazam! They fight.
2 adults + 2 kids in a smallish car = fine
2 adults + 3 kids in a smallish car = WWF after 100 miles
Nah...I've pretty much made up my mind with that Intrepid. The moment the engine or transmission, or something else prohibitively expensive dies on it, it's outta here! It's one thing to nurse a car along when all you have to do is put on a rubber band here, a twist tie there, and an occaional ballast resistor, but when modern cars go bad, they seem to do it in a major way.
If I wanted to find something cheap, but still relatively economical, how hard would it be nowadays to keep something like an '83-86 Camry or '82-85 Accord running?
It's still going strong with the guy I sold it to.
I now have a 2k6 Nissan Frontier which I plan on keeping for 15 years.
I'll provide a real world example. In 2003 I leased a brand new Honda Accord 6 cyl EX. MSRP was $27,000. I negotiated a purchase price of $25,500. The dealer gave me $3,500 for my trade-in so I'm down to $22,000 for a purchase price. I told the salesman that I was going to lease this vehicle through my credit union. I called them up and told them that $22,000 was the capitalization cost. As I previously stated, there is no tax or tags since this credit union has a federal charter, whatever that means. They multiplied the MSRP ($27,000) by 51% and arrived at $13,770 for the residual value. The interest rate at the time was 3.9%, which comes out to a money factor of 0.001625. At this point the math becomes simple. The depreciation cost was $22,000 - $13,770 = $8,230. Divide by 36 months and you have $228.61. The money cost was ($22,000 + $13,770) * .001625 = $58.12 per month. Add the two numbers and you've got $286.73 for a monthly lease payment. That's what I paid, no hidden costs. At the end of the lease in 2006 I purchased the vehicle outright for the residual value since that was below wholesale. At that time I did have to pay tax and title but it was on a much lower value.
What's not to like about this deal? BTW, since that time the interest rate on a 36 month lease has gone up to 4.4%, which is a money factor of 0.00183, still very good. They will assign a residual value based on a percentage of MSRP, typically between 48 and 52 percent. There are no hidden costs. So at this point all the other numbers are determined by you and the salesman. And as far as the salesman is concerned this is a cash sale so he has no need to manipulate the price to offset some special lease terms.
If you could get 4.4% it would make sense as you could leave your money in a bank CD at 5.5%. I also like the no sales tax factor.
I'm assuming you mean interest rate, not money factor because all money factors are less than 1%. The money factor is simply the interest rate divided by 2400.
4.4% is very good for a financial institution that is making no money on car sales. Also, they don't require any money down. You will have to make your first month's lease payment at the time you take delivery of the vehicle. If you can get less than 1% it is part of some incentive program. They're losing money on the lease but maybe offered this in lieu of a cash rebate. So if you are offered a choice between an attractive lease or a rebate you've got to crunch the numbers to see which saves you the most money.
Also, the credit union that I use assigns a fairly low residual value. This has it's good and bad aspects. It increases your depreciation costs but lowers your money costs. Overall it will result in a higher lease payment, which is bad if you have no intention of purchasing this vehicle at the end of the lease. If you think you might want to keep the car then its good because it will cost you less to buy it at the end of the lease.
Leases are actually very simple if you focus on just three numbers. Capitalization cost, residual value, and money factor. Plug these numbers into a calculator and you'll get your monthly payment. If it doesn't agree with what they are trying to charge you then it's time to investigate.
That doesn't sound right even at 6.9%. It should have come out to $331. Maybe that calculator is automatically adding the tax to the sales price, in which case your number is pretty close.
While you are normally right about low financing vs rebate most European makes do not offer rebates. They might offer marketing support of some kind but you probably won't have any idea about that as it is not normally available to the public. The only incentive you are going to get is a enhanced leasing program. Just go look at a BMW or Merc sometime. You can get a killer deal on a lease but if you want to purchase the same car through traditional financing you get no joy.
My uncle was quoted about $1500 by the dealer to replace the catalytic converter on his '03 Corolla. He still hasn't gotten around to having it replaced yet. There's a local muffler shop that can do it cheaper, I'm sure. I had them do an exhaust system on my pickup, from the converter back, for about $240 back in December, and they did an entire dual exhaust for my '68 Dart back in '93 for about $300.
Unfortunately, there are things on modern cars that total them when they fail...things that hadn't even been invented yet back in the day!
That's sound in theory. However, how many people really have an extra $20K lying around that they can sock away and invest? Plus, that has to be money that you can afford to put away and forget about. It's not going to earn 10% consistently. It might earn 15% one year, lose 10% the next, lose another 20% the following year, then finally turn around and gain 30% the following, and so forth. Over the long haul, you might average 10%, or even better, depending on how it's invested. But if you get stuck having to pull out money during a downturn, you're going to be screwed.
Lemko or somebody else once mentioned a smart way to pay down a car loan. Take it out for a fairly long term, like 5 years, so that if you ever get laid off, you won't have too huge of a monthly payment to come up with. But in the meantime, while you can afford it, go ahead and add to the principal, and get the thing paid down early.
I need to get my uncle to start using my Mom's address in Southern MD as his mailing address. They don't have emissions testing down there...yet! I guess another way to get around it might be to get one of those code readers that can reset the codes. As long as the SES light stays off long enough to get you through the emissions test!