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I maintain it all starts at the network size - too big to control and maintain consistency, especially for premium brand. It simply doesn't fit their current volumes, looks like by favtor of three. Also, it seems it's not just those bad dealers, it's GM's relationship with them that appears to be dowright toxic.
I do think in the past, that there was a loyalty to a brand or car company that isn't as strong today. I know my dad was more of a GM man than Ford man and he had a disdain for Chrysler yet his first car was a Plymouth and he told me it served him well. Dad wasn't that keen on Chevys, but he was ok with Pontiac, Olds, or Cadillac. For some reason Buick didn't have any appeal to him. Though there has been the odd Toyota, Datsun, Subaru that have been bought as secondary cars and cars for my sisters to drive for college (early 80's), my parents until retiring their 98 Aurora, have stayed the course with GM products. They currently have a CR-V.
2021 VW Arteon SEL 4-motion, 2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech
I think its simply a matter of age. You gotta reach far back to find most of the Cadillac fans, like my dad and father-in-law, and they aren't buying cars in that pricerange in their golden years. Those same people would NEVER consider a BMW. The BMW faithful, on the other hand, largely have a car history that dates back to the E30-E36 era, and those cars cemented their fandom. Cadillac is now chasing a younger crowd who never previously gave them a 2nd look, while BMW is slowly alienating its fans with softer cars. How will that all pan out? We'll see.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
effectively BMW is aging with their fanbase. Caddy had a head start, and once they "age out" you are kind of stuck. At least BMW is still bringing in younger buyers at the bottom end, even if they are a different type than they used to have!
effectively BMW is aging with their fanbase. Caddy had a head start, and once they "age out" you are kind of stuck. At least BMW is still bringing in younger buyers at the bottom end, even if they are a different type than they used to have!
Apparently they are not interested in "driving dynamics" as much as they used to be -- on the other hand, we'd be hard pressed these days to find virtually any up and coming "customer" to even consider a manual transmission; sport suspensions, too, seem to be largely in the rearview mirror -- I remember when MOST of the cars in stock had sport suspensions, sport seats and at the same time a good many of the cars in stock were manual shift models, replete with Premium pack, power assists, and other options of the day.
Now, the few sticks offered are strippies (often) and for the most part, the cars are -- as noted -- getting squishy, less taught, with less of the performance edge. Although, oddly, HP and torque do continue to climb.
You gives and you gets (sort of).
The Infiniti sales rep remarked "I don't know why anyone would want paddle shifters." What's up with that?
With newer magnetic ride control suspension systems, it seems logical that the "sport" suspension will be more "automatic" along with the softer settings when you want the smoother ride. Just like what happened in the transmission arena.
Mark's comment about GM's quality going to hell in the 70's and 80's and paying a price for that is well taken. During that time I was starting a career and family and money was tight. All I could afford was Chevys and I was satisfied, until my '79 Chevette. It broke down 12 miles from the dealer's showroom the day I picked it up and had to be towed back. That was just the beginning of the problems. I traded it for a Mazda GLC several months later and have owned nothing but Japanese cars since, with 2 reliable Fords in the mix. I now have a Volvo S60, as I mentioned in a prior post and an Outback, my 3rd Subaru.
I wish GM well and would love to be in an ATS or CTS, but I just feel I can get a better car for less money elsewhere. And the crappy dealer experience others have talked about also gives me pause.
So, we arrived in Munich today, was picked up at the Airport in a BMW 750Ld, nice car, great engine, Tri Turbo inline 6 diesel. it makes something like 450lbs of torque. was interesting to watch the drive navigate the highway. We topped 150mph, I've read about about this car, was great to be driven in it. Friday we take delivery of Ricks BMW.
This whole discussion been interesting, GM needed to make room for the ATS, that meant the CTS needed to be price higher then before, GM needed to take a couple of play from the likes of Lexus and Hyundai more content at a lower price, then slowly raise prices I don't think the CTS was moving up the price trail as it was being improved. Now, I have two neighbors who have CTS, both are V6, both have been stone reliable, one is a 2012, then other is a 2013. I remember when the ATS cane out and a couple of people where praising the car, Myself and a couple of others pointed out the biggest issue with the CTS and ATS was simple, their size, they are too small in the segment they are in. Granted some people like that, but the buying public does not and want the size. When GM gets around to increase the size of both cars, the next generation of the 3 and 5 series will be out and be bigger and better. Once again, GM is playing catch up.
This morning a friend called and asked me to take his latest toy for a drive; said toy is a 2007 Mercedes-AMG E63 fitted with the Weistec M156 Power Package 1, meaning it makes 441 hp and 394lb-ft of torque measured at the wheels. He's a bit intimidated by the car and wanted me to wring it out. Now THIS is a car I can truly call fast with a straight face. Stock it would do 0-60 in 4.2 seconds and run the quarter in 12.6 seconds @115 mph. My friend also likes drag racing and he wants me to run it at the local 1/8-mile strip. He's had the car down in the low eight second range but I think the high sevens are entirely possible. Of course, I had to take it down my personal road course test track and the car was pretty much unflappable(the car sports Michelin PSS rubber). I had forgotten how much fun the AMGs of this vintage could be. Oh yeah, it will also do a fairly impressive burnout...
OK, time for the 45,000 mile service on the '14 SQ5. Dropping the car off the night before, picking up a courtesy car for the day and coming back 24 hours later . . . routine.
"I'm sorry, I don't have any SQ5 loaners . . . but I've got this freshly PDR'd car that has 35 miles on it you can have, if you don't mind. It's an A8L. I also have a new A7, but I thought you might like to be the very first customer to drive the A8."
Actually, I had hoped for an A6 -- considering some of our recent "chats" here on edmunds. But, it is so very unlikely we'd ever willingly, knowingly and with our own money go for another A8 (not that we didn't like our previous one), well, why not.
I am a lover and geek on all things Audi, but frankly I just don't spend any time keeping up with the A8 or R8 cars, I needed an edumacation . . . .
This was the L version -- the back seat space is larger than some closets or storage sheds, if the thing wasn't so quiet at speed, you'd need an intercom to speak to the pilot were you seated back there,
Otherwise, we set the drive select to dynamic (the rep looked at my wife who set this parameter after starting the car, and said "go figure" -- my wife is used to an SQ5, after all) and turned on the heads-up display, found some nice tuneage on the sat radio and drove off in eerie silence arriving a triple digits speeds in the blink of an eye. Yikes this thing must be electric it is so quiet and smoooth (and this one had the air suspension, which I suspect is standard and the 20" wheels with summer only rubber.)
Full LED front and rear lighting -- and everything that could be motorized was -- and oh that fantastic, should be mandated by the Feds, Top View monitor (how I miss that one aspect of our 2011 Infiniti).
I finally got the sticker out of the glove box and noted this puppy was a V6 (333HP) -- my S4's V6. Impressive in this size car as it never seemed to want for any bit of power -- there was always plenty on reserve.
Air conditioned seats -- ahhhhh cooling those hot crossed buns -- I had forgotten how nice cool leather can feel, even on a hot summer day.
Here's the real deal, however -- while the car is, even were it free -- too large, it feels not much larger than my S4. Also, I cannot tell a lie, it is not as nimble as an S4, and certainly not as powerful as you would expect with the extra girth the motor had to manage, but it seemed quite capable of convincing perhaps the vast majority of folks that it was a sporting-like sedan, not just a luxo-barge. The top view camera made navigating a tight parking garage this morning easy-peazy.
If you have $92,000 (but this one had a nearly $6,000 Executive package credit, wiping out the Executive package price) laying around burning a hole wanting to be spent on a new luxury but still very much a driver's car vehicle, say no more, look no further. I can't imagine my neighbor's 7 series (also an L) which, by comparison, seems so stark and strident inside -- and which cost over $110K could be more attractive, price weighted.
I don't know how the 2016 A8L 3.0T is thought of by the pros, but this amateur thinks for $86,000 nothing even comes close -- in this class (large luxo-barge).
Of course, had I that much coin to drop on ONE car, I would still "settle" on a full-on great balls of fire S6 Prestige with the custom red leather seats.
Now that would be something to write home about.
Me, I'm looking forward to a slightly larger 2018 S4 with all the cool tech this 2016 A8 has on it.
I wonder if they ever provide RS7's as loaners -- I'd bet not.
$86k? Eh, I'd be looking at a Panamera or Tesla, methinks
I did look at a Panamera -- and with anything even close to the content of the A8, the price would shoot over $100K.
The Audi that I would think much more competitive (in every aspect) with the Panamera is the RS7. This A8L was an ocean-going vessel -- the fact that it felt smaller than its barge like dimensions doesn't make it anything that would be attractive to someone who would look at either an RS7 or Panamera, if you axe me.
While I liked the temporary experience, I wouldn't even consider one, personally. I wonder if the S8 might be more of a Panamera cross-shopper. Don't know . . . and not all that interested in making a comparison, at this point, life's too short. A half step between an A4 and A6 is about the size I find interesting today.
About $58K for my S4 and about $65K for my wife's SQ5 -- what's that come to?" $123K -- for TWO cars. Something just seems "off" about spending that much on ONE car -- but I could be wrong. There comes a point where I read about the $85K Cadillac V or M3 and their accelerations to 62MPH are in the neighborhood of 4 seconds. I then go back in time and find the same magazine's numbers for my "lowly" S4 to be 4.8 seconds (some magazines claim even quicker). I'll keep the $27K for other things and make certain never to challenge an M3 to a drag race at the local traffic light. I'm all for big bad acceleration, etc, but all that money for such a relatively small increase in acceleration is something that I find very difficult to justify, especially since it is so rare I can ever floor my non-tumescent S4 for fear of overtaking and rear ending just about everything else on the road.
I just got into the Q50 so the Tesla will be a few years off. I think I will take you up on a test drive soon, however. I always wanted to experience the car since it became available. I'll let you know if/when I do.
We took my buddy's Mercedes-AMG E63 to the 1/8 mile strip tonight. My best run was 8.12 seconds- which is the fastest the car has gone. Beat a 1970 Buick GS Stage I with a built 455 running slicks and also dispatched a modified Lexus IS F. It was my first visit to the strip since 1976 and I had a ball. The spectators' initial reaction, "What's a Mercedes doing at a drag strip?" changed to "What kind of motor does he have in that thing?"
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
So we picked up Ricks BMW at the Welt, much different experience then when I got my 2005 330 back in 2005. They really treat you like a VIP. We are in southern Germany in a Town called Fussen. We are off to Salzburg for a couple of days. The car looks much better in person then we had thought it would, the Rim's are different then what BMW had showed up, we like these better.
The photo is at the spot where most of people on Bimmerfest take thier in front of the Neuschwanstein Castle, Disney also designed Sleeping beauty's castle from.
We took my buddy's Mercedes-AMG E63 to the 1/8 mile strip tonight. My best run was 8.12 seconds- which is the fastest the car has gone. Beat a 1970 Buick GS Stage I with a built 455 running slicks and also dispatched a modified Lexus IS F. It was my first visit to the strip since 1976 and I had a ball. The spectators' initial reaction, "What's a Mercedes doing at a drag strip?" changed to "What kind of motor does he have in that thing?"
Having two "real muscle cars" from the 60's and 70's, I can say they are fast, but not as fast as cars today... No surprise that the MB was quicker.
I do think in the past, that there was a loyalty to a brand or car company that isn't as strong today. I know my dad was more of a GM man than Ford man and he had a disdain for Chrysler yet his first car was a Plymouth and he told me it served him well. Dad wasn't that keen on Chevys, but he was ok with Pontiac, Olds, or Cadillac. For some reason Buick didn't have any appeal to him. Though there has been the odd Toyota, Datsun, Subaru that have been bought as secondary cars and cars for my sisters to drive for college (early 80's), my parents until retiring their 98 Aurora, have stayed the course with GM products. They currently have a CR-V.
My late Father would not have considered any thing from Europe, Japan....anywhere other than U.S. based brands.
I think his wants/desires were based on the marketing of his era (40s-50s) when U.S. based car companies ruled the market. Just like GM wanted, you started with a Chevy, went to maybe Oldsmobile, then Buick and finally, Cadillac. Ford started you with their namesake, moved you to Mercury, and finally Lincoln. Chrysler started you at Plymouth, then to Dodge, then to Chrysler, and finally to Imperial (yes, my Father had one...no branded Chrysler but Imperial).
Cadillac, Lincoln, Imperial were the pinnacles of automotive excellence during those decades. European, and particularly Japanese brands were viewed with disdain in our household, at the time.
someday, maybe I will be able to do that. another couple of years until college bills are finished. Maybe that will be the treat for us!
also, what is the little red one in the background behind your car? Is that a new 1 series, or a little hatch that I would love but will never make it to the US?
Wouldn't mind a profile shot of the new car either!
About $58K for my S4 and about $65K for my wife's SQ5 -- what's that come to?" $123K -- for TWO cars. Something just seems "off" about spending that much on ONE car -- but I could be wrong. There comes a point where I read about the $85K Cadillac V or M3 and their accelerations to 62MPH are in the neighborhood of 4 seconds. I then go back in time and find the same magazine's numbers for my "lowly" S4 to be 4.8 seconds (some magazines claim even quicker). I'll keep the $27K for other things and make certain never to challenge an M3 to a drag race at the local traffic light. I'm all for big bad acceleration, etc, but all that money for such a relatively small increase in acceleration is something that I find very difficult to justify, especially since it is so rare I can ever floor my non-tumescent S4 for fear of overtaking and rear ending just about everything else on the road.
Oh, I totally agree on the price argument. I would find it very difficult to spend 6 figures on a car unless I had ridiculous money to blow. But, even then, when I think about a lottery-winning wishlist in a 20-car garage, it just makes far more sense to me that I would have 2 or 3 nice classics or retrorods rather than a $100k new car.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
also, what is the little red one in the background behind your car? Is that a new 1 series, or a little hatch that I would love but will never make it to the US?
My wife and I have been to Europe/Germany perhaps twenty to twenty-five times (some trips, not many, didn't include Germany, that is) -- we always fly into Munich, even if our destination is Venice or Zurich or even Vienna. Of all of the European cities we've been to, Munich is the one where I think I could live AND work. Much as we like Verona and Prague, and even Kraków (and what's not to like about London, Paris and even Brussles), Munich is THE city where I think I could work. The train from Munich to Venice, via Innsbruck is the most beautiful ride we've ever taken -- and OMG in winter, as my friend says, "If there is winter in heaven, this is what it MUST look like."
But, as usual, I digress. I really do have a, hopefully legitimate, question for you flightnurse: What would have been the American MSRP of your new BMW and what was the difference due to buying the car via ED? The last time I looked into this, it seemed that the price delta paid for the trip -- and then, if you factor in the cost of renting a car, you actually end up paying only for your hotels and food, making the trip to some of the most beautiful sights on the planet about equal to or less than a trip to the US west coast (from Cincinnati).
Of course, I would agree, if you're in Germany and/or other European countries, you may splurge on restaurants and (if in Italy) clothes and other items unavailable in the US.
To wit: if you two read this and are going to circle back to Munich, our 2nd favorite restaurant on earth is in Munich, it is called Tantris.
Yeah, the ED MSRP is 7 percent off base model US MSRP plus destination and options are priced at US MSRP. It makes base models especially great deals, then as you add options, the discount gets smaller. So for example 50k base plus 5k options plus 900 destination it is 52.4k, or 3.5 grand nominal savings. However, you don't get any additional rebates, like those cash credits or rebates that BMW sometimes throws for the US delivery (disclaimers often specifically exclude ED). You can negotiate the price down from the ED MSRP toward their invoice just the same as US delivery (unlike Benz or Volvo, which have the ED prices price fixed), but many dealers would have none of it. Don't know why, perhaps it's just posturing, but I heard of that several times. I think it may be their way of discouraging of doing it, as they always prefer intant gratification of delivery, so the attitude may be, fine, but I'm not doing a damn thing to incentivise the deal vs. my stock. There are also complications with the trade, if you want to make one, as there is about three month from signing the deal and getting the car. Essentially, you lose any leverage on the trade price, unless you are willing to give the car at time of the signing the deal.
Bottom line, the actual savings depend on the context of its actual going transaction prices for stock Deliveries. For models selling close to MSRP, like say M-models, the savings are great. For those selling closer to invoice, or having extra cash rebates, it is less. However, factoring the extra vacation experience, even if the savings aren't as big as the face value, it's totally worth it. BTW, you can combine ED with so-called Performance Delivery in South Carolina, which makes the experience even more awesome. Paid night at Sheraton, dinner, breakfast, morning at a track, doing quick loops, braking, skip pad (not your car, just one that's a same or similar similar model; they put me in 335), then a factory visit, plus X5 off-road course after lunch. All at no extra charge. If only have a chance, I will do it again.
someday, maybe I will be able to do that. another couple of years until college bills are finished. Maybe that will be the treat for us!
also, what is the little red one in the background behind your car? Is that a new 1 series, or a little hatch that I would love but will never make it to the US?
Wouldn't mind a profile shot of the new car either!
More photo's are to come and it's been stated it's the Europe only Active Tourer, which was to come to the US but BMWNA said no. VERY Roomy !!! Lots of cool cars over here, one thing I noticed is, MB, BMW and Audi's are de-badged of the model, most if not all of the Euro ED cars had no car identifier on the rear, it's on option for them, but BMWNA does not allow US customers to do that...
More photos to come and Video, we are in Salzburg.
US MSRP for the car was 53K sale price was 47K We flew into Frankfurt, then onto Munich the flight to Munich was a trip.. I'll post a lot more about this whole adventure.
Back in the '90s a CCA member I know used ED to get an E34 535i; while in Germany he took it to AC Schnitzer and had the engine's power bumped up considerably. He instructed ACS NOT to add a custom valve cover or any badges, etc. that would give the game away. When the car made it to his dealer the engine had a noticeable lope. The salesman offered to let the Service Department check out the "misfire," but the new owner declined and happily drove away...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
In the mid-1980's, I owned an Audi (what else?) 5000CS turbo quattro, then Audi's top-of-the-line car. Manual transmission, power everything and a new to the market feature (and quite a rare feature on almost any car outside of an Audi, BMW or Mercedes) anti-lock brakes. For some reason I ordered the car with the optional wool covered sports seats, eschewing the standard leather treatments. But that’s not important to my warning and plea to anyone reading this.
This mid-80’s Audi had a permanently mounted voice controlled and activated cellular telephone. While driving, if I uttered the phrase “Turn on telephone” I could “Call home,” “Call office,” or recite a phone number – one number at a time, wait for the phone to repeat the number, and so on until the full number had been spoken, then dial. Hands free, eyes free. It was 1985.
My first Audi S6, a 1996 model was the next Audi I purchased that came with a factory phone (it was hidden in the arm-rest) permitting voice command. This version was updated and allowed me to recite the phone number in single digits without waiting for the phone to parrot my number back to me.
When I then purchased a new 1997 A8, I was somewhat amazed that it came pre-wired for a phone, but without a phone. Of course I ponied up for another voice activated phone. When I got my 2003 allroad it came with a special in-armrest holder for an Audi-branded phone and it also came with On*Star which was also a phone (voice activated) and an email client (that read my emails to me and also allowed me to send emails by speaking). My 2005 A6 was bluetooth equipped and came with a list of phones I could buy from several different providers and also had a special, in-armrest holder/charger that was invisible with the arm-rest cover closed.
My 2009 A4, 2012 Acura TL SH-AWD and my 2014 S4 also are equipped with bluetooth and they also have pig-tails for charging and [iPhone] music connectivity. Every one of these cars I mention, since 1985, has had hand and eyes free phone capability and ever improving voice command capabilities.
I finally have gotten around to keeping my iPhone in my breast pocket, but for years my iPhone often was in the trunk where I put my brief case. The phone works fine when it is in the trunk – and now, since I do use the phone for email and texting (after pulling over), I tend to keep the phone in the cabin.
Every few seconds or minutes someone has a crash or is killed and the “incident” (they are not accidents) causing the property damage or living being damage is attributed to texting or other mobile device distracted driving.
The technology exists to disallow talking and texting in a moving vehicle. I assume no challenge would exist to make the phone work if it is being used via bluetooth hand and eyes free initiation. The clock is ticking backwards, to zero, to a time when we will have no ability to use these communication’s devices in a moving car.
Here’s what confuses me: Since there had been some kind of hand and eyes free, voice-activated communications available since the mid-1980’s, how is it possible that I cannot drive more than one mile out of my rural subdivision without seeing someone driving their ELLPS (and I’ll keep it to ELLPS cars, even though such technology is hardly limited to the Premium class and above) with their phone held up to their ear (requiring one hand)? As I get closer to the Interstate and traffic density increases, I could probably throw a handful of rice into oncoming traffic and hit more cars than not whose drivers are holding their phones – and I am certain many of the rice grains would hit bluetooth equipped vehicles.
Before you respond, here’s another data point, most of the cars have one person in them – the driver.
I get my car serviced, I am provided with a loaner – before I pull out of the dealership, I pair my phone with the loaner’s Bluetooth – if I’m distracted, this takes 30 seconds. My wife actually has the service manager pair her phone with the loaner, figuring it’s part of the Audi Advantage (and the service writer always takes the 30 seconds to do this for her without issue).
I thought, way back there 30 years ago, “I can completely be focussed on driving this stick-shift turbo-charged ‘hot rod’ quattro thanks to my hands and eyes free cellular phone.” Is this technology not “way cool”? And, is this technology not a HUGE safety feature, right up there with seat belts, crumple zones, ESP and ABS, sealed beam headlights, disc brakes and so on?
I do want to be able to call home or the office without touching the phone, without looking at the phone and without pulling over and parking due to the inevitable governmental safety nanny. I want to delay yet another restriction brought on by my fellow drivers who opt for the most dangerous and deadly way I can think of to make a phone call.
Of course, maybe we’ll be allowed to used a phone in the car once cars start driving themselves. Mean time, I’d just like to advocate for voluntary cessation of in-car phone usage if it is not hand and eyes free.
"Don't it always seem to go . . . that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone?" JM
So just to chime on what is is saying about mobile phones, when I first got my job with Sony, I bought a Panasonic "trans mobile" phone. It was the size of text book, you could either mount it in the car or take it with you. OF course I thought I was cool at the time, that was until I got my first bill... After that I used it strictly for work. Mobile phones where just starting to make their way into cars, this was 1987.
The nav system on the BMW can be set to drive only on highways and toll roads or not, so this leg, we didn't want that, we wanted the scenic route, so we entered the address of where we were going to stay (Villa Trapp, you know the Von Trapp Family) and off we went, Rick and I both like the heads up display. About half way there Rick hit the "mode" button on the steering wheel and somehow reset our destination back to Ettal. I wasn't paying attention to this, About an hour later I noticed some of the area looks familiar then I noticed what happened on Nav screen. no problem, reprogram the Nav and off we go.
The country side is amazing, green as far as you can see, NO trash on the side of the roads, no billboards. On the back roads you get a lot of people on bikes, so you have to watch out for them. Overall Cars, motorcycles and bike get along well.
Fast forward arrive at Villa Trapp, looks wonderful outside, inside looked great too, but HOT, we checked in and get to our room, come to find out the room does not have AC, and the room was very hot, and no WiFi past the first floor. I started my Nurse Practitioner program, so I'm in school again so need to be connect. and the bed was a twin, I'm sorry we both wont fit in THAT bed. We go downstairs talk to the lady who checked us in and someone at the Hotel did make a mistake but they are all filled.. We declined got a refunded, I fired up my Sheraton app and booked on points at the Sheraton Salzburg for 12K points a night. When we arrived, the front desk agent told me we had been upgraded to the Presidential Suit, one of the perks for being a 150 night/ yr platinum member. Room is outstanding to say the least.
The photos in order, Small town/villeage
This was the first GT we have seen on our trip, it's a 318d.
In old Salzburg in one of the squares.
Up in the fort over looking Slazburg, too this with my iPhone in Panoramic mode.Over looking old salzburg and the River Salzburg.
At 1650m at Tageserlaubnisschen on our way to the Eagles Nets.
Since this is a car thread what better photo then a Audi R8 and a 66 Mustang Convertible.
Regarding drivers who don't use hands free technology in their luxury or near luxury cars (or any car where that technology is available): IMO most of those folks are either too stupid or too lazy to use it. It's the American way to use the quickest, simplest route. I guess there is the arrogance factor to also consider. Some drivers feel that they can drive safely with the phone in one hand, one eye on the phone and the other on the road.
It's a wonderful part of the world -- enjoy. Five of the seven times I've visited Switzerland and/or Austria, the weather was rainy, snowy or otherwise inclement. Be thankful for the wonderful weather you appear to be ejoying, and thanks for the updates.
It's a wonderful part of the world -- enjoy. Five of the seven times I've visited Switzerland and/or Austria, the weather was rainy, snowy or otherwise inclement. Be thankful for the wonderful weather you appear to be ejoying, and thanks for the updates.
I've never had the pleasure of traveling to Europe, so the stories and pictures FN is posting are really welcome.
Enjoy the rest of your trip, and keep the updates coming!
FN -- I don't know how everyone else feels, but I want you to know you cannot post too many pictures as far as I'm concerned.
I rented a MB in Munich (an E class) -- this was a few years ago -- and it had navigation. The entire thing was in German. Although it offered up arrows and the map, although in German, was easy enough to figure out. I actually got to know the word for left (turn) and for right, so we were able to use the system a great deal of the time. It got a little dicey in town, but when we put in a Hotel (name here) we mostly got close enough for jazz to it.
Is your navigation lady German or English speaking?
Driver of a late model Lexus merges onto I-75 south, immediately moves to the left-most lane, slows to 50 (apparently setting cruise control) and using one free hand, starts holding the phone to his ear -- the conversation apparently goes on for many miles, although I broke protocol after a few miles and committed one of the most vile acts anyone can do behind the wheel . . . I passed on the right after my repeated attempts at turning on my left turn signal were ignored.
I'm all for most freedoms -- really. But, you can't yell fire in a theater (unless there really is one) and expect to be covered by the first amendment. I guess, technically, there is no reason you can't hop onto a major federal highway and drive in the left-most lane at 50 MPH (the speed limit here in Ohio has, in many places, now been bumped to 70); I also assume passing on the right side (or suicide) isn't illegal. But, and it pains me to say this, I would vote for laws that would disallow both of these behaviors, were such items placed on a ballot. But, then again, I am also in the minority that votes.
We're doomed.
Just another reason I can't imagine the frustration of owning/driving an RS7 or M5 or CTS-V, etc, where in wide wide world of sports can such machines be driven using more than a fraction of their engineer-imbued "talents?" Not that a Prius is all of a sudden looking good.
One more note - I would imagine that driving in Italy would be a free-for-all (and Rome, actually, is). But, other than perhaps a slight decrease in speed, the folks driving on the Italian Autobahn (the autostrada, as I recall), behave pretty much exactly like the Germans -- lane discipline, left lane to pass and the lanes get faster the further left you go, period. Folks respond to a wink of your turn signal to get over and, from what I can tell (other than in Rome) there is no road-rage.
Although many of our Interstate road surfaces are pock-marked, I generally think we have a well thought out (mostly) highway system here, that is rendered far less efficient that it could be by either ignorance, stupidity or lack of driver training. Instead, here, we rely, in this order, upon: Enforcement (sort of), Engineering (a somewhat distant second) and Education (a very distant third.) I would think we could drive faster, experience fewer delays, fewer hours lost per person, per year, etc, if we just made getting a driver's license require a bit more rigor. One would think, considering the death-rate, that getting a DL should require no less preparation and education than getting a pilot's license. My wife got her pilot's license before she was old enough to get a driver's license -- and she thinks that getting a DL is about like getting a box-top off of a box of Wheaties.
Something is wrong with that.
One last note: I love test driving all kinds of cars, despite my completely above-board bias toward Audis, German cars and European cars, generally. I have taken so many folks on test drives these past 5-10 years, I can't remember just how many. Not one (other than my wife) has ever had ABS engaged (that they know of -- although I wonder if they just don't know what ABS braking feels like); and the thing is, when I -- in a large deserted parking lot -- get them to engage ABS, the moment the pedal pulsing starts, they [so they say] instinctively know to release the brake to the point the pulsing stops.
I have been through 4-two day Audi Driving Experiences (on ice), 1-two day BMW Driving Experience (not on ice) one Porsche Driving Experience (1-day) and a Cadillac driving experience (also 1-day). Every instructor literally starts the training with the following exercise: accelerate to about 50MPH from a dead stop and when you reach the orange cone laying on its side at the end of the "runway" press the brake pedal "as if" this is a panic stop. To a man/woman instructor, the command is "when the pulsing is felt through the pedal, press the brake as hard as your leg can press -- imagine your goal is to BEND THE BRAKE PEDAL."
The reason given for this "press harder" instruction is always, "braking force will continue to increase the harder you press, even with Brake Assist (which bases braking force somewhat on the speed at which the driver presses down)." I've seen this impact myself on dry, wet and icy pavement.
Yet, when I try to get someone who is testing a new car to brake with any degree of urgency, the instant the pulsing is felt, they release the brake -- which, were this a real emergency could increase the probability of a crash.
We need to license drivers much, much more rigorously. And, despite this old fashion notion, I think knowing how to drive a manual transmission would be helpful too, much in the same way it is said that video games are helpful prerequisites for so many endeavors.
I happen to love my DSG transmission, but in a heartbeat, going back to a six-speed manual wouldn't be anything but fun.
If I'm not mistaken, here in Colorado, you can get ticketed for driving in the left lane on the highway if you're not passing. I'm not so sure how much it is enforced, but I do like that the law is at least there.
It happens everywhere. I see people all the time getting over to the left hand lane although their current lane doesn't have any traffic in it. If they move to the left and are impeding traffic due to their concentration being on their cell phone, I will slowly pass on the right, beep my horn and give the international "hang up the phone" sign so they get they are moving too slowly.
If I'm not mistaken, here in Colorado, you can get ticketed for driving in the left lane on the highway if you're not passing. I'm not so sure how much it is enforced, but I do like that the law is at least there.
Well, that's one. I guess I'm talking about a "national and cultural" mindset that almost literally develops hives or some other nasty rash when contemplating the notion of passing on the right and ignoring a polite three wink left turn-signal.
Perhaps a Federal law is closer (and I shudder at saying that) to what I am talking about.
we have the stay right, pass left law here in NJ. It is rarely obeyed and almost never enforced. The Pennsylvanians on our roads are almost guaranteed to ignore it, from my experience.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
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2018 430i Gran Coupe
2021 VW Arteon SEL 4-motion, 2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Now, the few sticks offered are strippies (often) and for the most part, the cars are -- as noted -- getting squishy, less taught, with less of the performance edge. Although, oddly, HP and torque do continue to climb.
You gives and you gets (sort of).
The Infiniti sales rep remarked "I don't know why anyone would want paddle shifters." What's up with that?
I wish GM well and would love to be in an ATS or CTS, but I just feel I can get a better car for less money elsewhere. And the crappy dealer experience others have talked about also gives me pause.
This whole discussion been interesting, GM needed to make room for the ATS, that meant the CTS needed to be price higher then before, GM needed to take a couple of play from the likes of Lexus and Hyundai more content at a lower price, then slowly raise prices I don't think the CTS was moving up the price trail as it was being improved. Now, I have two neighbors who have CTS, both are V6, both have been stone reliable, one is a 2012, then other is a 2013. I remember when the ATS cane out and a couple of people where praising the car, Myself and a couple of others pointed out the biggest issue with the CTS and ATS was simple, their size, they are too small in the segment they are in. Granted some people like that, but the buying public does not and want the size. When GM gets around to increase the size of both cars, the next generation of the 3 and 5 series will be out and be bigger and better. Once again, GM is playing catch up.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
OK, time for the 45,000 mile service on the '14 SQ5. Dropping the car off the night before, picking up a courtesy car for the day and coming back 24 hours later . . . routine.
"I'm sorry, I don't have any SQ5 loaners . . . but I've got this freshly PDR'd car that has 35 miles on it you can have, if you don't mind. It's an A8L. I also have a new A7, but I thought you might like to be the very first customer to drive the A8."
Actually, I had hoped for an A6 -- considering some of our recent "chats" here on edmunds. But, it is so very unlikely we'd ever willingly, knowingly and with our own money go for another A8 (not that we didn't like our previous one), well, why not.
I am a lover and geek on all things Audi, but frankly I just don't spend any time keeping up with the A8 or R8 cars, I needed an edumacation . . . .
This was the L version -- the back seat space is larger than some closets or storage sheds, if the thing wasn't so quiet at speed, you'd need an intercom to speak to the pilot were you seated back there,
Otherwise, we set the drive select to dynamic (the rep looked at my wife who set this parameter after starting the car, and said "go figure" -- my wife is used to an SQ5, after all) and turned on the heads-up display, found some nice tuneage on the sat radio and drove off in eerie silence arriving a triple digits speeds in the blink of an eye. Yikes this thing must be electric it is so quiet and smoooth (and this one had the air suspension, which I suspect is standard and the 20" wheels with summer only rubber.)
Full LED front and rear lighting -- and everything that could be motorized was -- and oh that fantastic, should be mandated by the Feds, Top View monitor (how I miss that one aspect of our 2011 Infiniti).
I finally got the sticker out of the glove box and noted this puppy was a V6 (333HP) -- my S4's V6. Impressive in this size car as it never seemed to want for any bit of power -- there was always plenty on reserve.
Air conditioned seats -- ahhhhh cooling those hot crossed buns -- I had forgotten how nice cool leather can feel, even on a hot summer day.
Here's the real deal, however -- while the car is, even were it free -- too large, it feels not much larger than my S4. Also, I cannot tell a lie, it is not as nimble as an S4, and certainly not as powerful as you would expect with the extra girth the motor had to manage, but it seemed quite capable of convincing perhaps the vast majority of folks that it was a sporting-like sedan, not just a luxo-barge. The top view camera made navigating a tight parking garage this morning easy-peazy.
If you have $92,000 (but this one had a nearly $6,000 Executive package credit, wiping out the Executive package price) laying around burning a hole wanting to be spent on a new luxury but still very much a driver's car vehicle, say no more, look no further. I can't imagine my neighbor's 7 series (also an L) which, by comparison, seems so stark and strident inside -- and which cost over $110K could be more attractive, price weighted.
I don't know how the 2016 A8L 3.0T is thought of by the pros, but this amateur thinks for $86,000 nothing even comes close -- in this class (large luxo-barge).
Of course, had I that much coin to drop on ONE car, I would still "settle" on a full-on great balls of fire S6 Prestige with the custom red leather seats.
Now that would be something to write home about.
Me, I'm looking forward to a slightly larger 2018 S4 with all the cool tech this 2016 A8 has on it.
I wonder if they ever provide RS7's as loaners -- I'd bet not.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
The Audi that I would think much more competitive (in every aspect) with the Panamera is the RS7. This A8L was an ocean-going vessel -- the fact that it felt smaller than its barge like dimensions doesn't make it anything that would be attractive to someone who would look at either an RS7 or Panamera, if you axe me.
While I liked the temporary experience, I wouldn't even consider one, personally. I wonder if the S8 might be more of a Panamera cross-shopper. Don't know . . . and not all that interested in making a comparison, at this point, life's too short. A half step between an A4 and A6 is about the size I find interesting today.
About $58K for my S4 and about $65K for my wife's SQ5 -- what's that come to?" $123K -- for TWO cars. Something just seems "off" about spending that much on ONE car -- but I could be wrong. There comes a point where I read about the $85K Cadillac V or M3 and their accelerations to 62MPH are in the neighborhood of 4 seconds. I then go back in time and find the same magazine's numbers for my "lowly" S4 to be 4.8 seconds (some magazines claim even quicker). I'll keep the $27K for other things and make certain never to challenge an M3 to a drag race at the local traffic light. I'm all for big bad acceleration, etc, but all that money for such a relatively small increase in acceleration is something that I find very difficult to justify, especially since it is so rare I can ever floor my non-tumescent S4 for fear of overtaking and rear ending just about everything else on the road.
But I'd be interested in your experience from test drive to buy to owning. I'd bet most of us would be interested, too.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
The photo is at the spot where most of people on Bimmerfest take thier in front of the Neuschwanstein Castle, Disney also designed Sleeping beauty's castle from.
Taking delivery at The Welt
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I think his wants/desires were based on the marketing of his era (40s-50s) when U.S. based car companies ruled the market. Just like GM wanted, you started with a Chevy, went to maybe Oldsmobile, then Buick and finally, Cadillac. Ford started you with their namesake, moved you to Mercury, and finally Lincoln. Chrysler started you at Plymouth, then to Dodge, then to Chrysler, and finally to Imperial (yes, my Father had one...no branded Chrysler but Imperial).
Cadillac, Lincoln, Imperial were the pinnacles of automotive excellence during those decades. European, and particularly Japanese brands were viewed with disdain in our household, at the time.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
also, what is the little red one in the background behind your car? Is that a new 1 series, or a little hatch that I would love but will never make it to the US?
Wouldn't mind a profile shot of the new car either!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
But, as usual, I digress. I really do have a, hopefully legitimate, question for you flightnurse: What would have been the American MSRP of your new BMW and what was the difference due to buying the car via ED? The last time I looked into this, it seemed that the price delta paid for the trip -- and then, if you factor in the cost of renting a car, you actually end up paying only for your hotels and food, making the trip to some of the most beautiful sights on the planet about equal to or less than a trip to the US west coast (from Cincinnati).
Of course, I would agree, if you're in Germany and/or other European countries, you may splurge on restaurants and (if in Italy) clothes and other items unavailable in the US.
To wit: if you two read this and are going to circle back to Munich, our 2nd favorite restaurant on earth is in Munich, it is called Tantris.
Tantris, Munich: - http://www.tantris.de/home.php
Note the tie in with Audi on the page that is displayed at the link.
Bon Appétite! (I had to misspell this to prevent the nanny from suppressing it. . .'cmon now!)
Bottom line, the actual savings depend on the context of its actual going transaction prices for stock Deliveries. For models selling close to MSRP, like say M-models, the savings are great. For those selling closer to invoice, or having extra cash rebates, it is less. However, factoring the extra vacation experience, even if the savings aren't as big as the face value, it's totally worth it. BTW, you can combine ED with so-called Performance Delivery in South Carolina, which makes the experience even more awesome. Paid night at Sheraton, dinner, breakfast, morning at a track, doing quick loops, braking, skip pad (not your car, just one that's a same or similar similar model; they put me in 335), then a factory visit, plus X5 off-road course after lunch. All at no extra charge. If only have a chance, I will do it again.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2024 Audi Q8 e-tron - 2017 911 C4S - 2025 BRZ - 2023 A6 Allroad - 2024 Genesis GV60 - 2019 Cayman
More photos to come and Video, we are in Salzburg.
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
This mid-80’s Audi had a permanently mounted voice controlled and activated cellular telephone. While driving, if I uttered the phrase “Turn on telephone” I could “Call home,” “Call office,” or recite a phone number – one number at a time, wait for the phone to repeat the number, and so on until the full number had been spoken, then dial. Hands free, eyes free. It was 1985.
My first Audi S6, a 1996 model was the next Audi I purchased that came with a factory phone (it was hidden in the arm-rest) permitting voice command. This version was updated and allowed me to recite the phone number in single digits without waiting for the phone to parrot my number back to me.
When I then purchased a new 1997 A8, I was somewhat amazed that it came pre-wired for a phone, but without a phone. Of course I ponied up for another voice activated phone. When I got my 2003 allroad it came with a special in-armrest holder for an Audi-branded phone and it also came with On*Star which was also a phone (voice activated) and an email client (that read my emails to me and also allowed me to send emails by speaking). My 2005 A6 was bluetooth equipped and came with a list of phones I could buy from several different providers and also had a special, in-armrest holder/charger that was invisible with the arm-rest cover closed.
My 2009 A4, 2012 Acura TL SH-AWD and my 2014 S4 also are equipped with bluetooth and they also have pig-tails for charging and [iPhone] music connectivity. Every one of these cars I mention, since 1985, has had hand and eyes free phone capability and ever improving voice command capabilities.
I finally have gotten around to keeping my iPhone in my breast pocket, but for years my iPhone often was in the trunk where I put my brief case. The phone works fine when it is in the trunk – and now, since I do use the phone for email and texting (after pulling over), I tend to keep the phone in the cabin.
Every few seconds or minutes someone has a crash or is killed and the “incident” (they are not accidents) causing the property damage or living being damage is attributed to texting or other mobile device distracted driving.
The technology exists to disallow talking and texting in a moving vehicle. I assume no challenge would exist to make the phone work if it is being used via bluetooth hand and eyes free initiation. The clock is ticking backwards, to zero, to a time when we will have no ability to use these communication’s devices in a moving car.
Here’s what confuses me: Since there had been some kind of hand and eyes free, voice-activated communications available since the mid-1980’s, how is it possible that I cannot drive more than one mile out of my rural subdivision without seeing someone driving their ELLPS (and I’ll keep it to ELLPS cars, even though such technology is hardly limited to the Premium class and above) with their phone held up to their ear (requiring one hand)? As I get closer to the Interstate and traffic density increases, I could probably throw a handful of rice into oncoming traffic and hit more cars than not whose drivers are holding their phones – and I am certain many of the rice grains would hit bluetooth equipped vehicles.
Before you respond, here’s another data point, most of the cars have one person in them – the driver.
I get my car serviced, I am provided with a loaner – before I pull out of the dealership, I pair my phone with the loaner’s Bluetooth – if I’m distracted, this takes 30 seconds. My wife actually has the service manager pair her phone with the loaner, figuring it’s part of the Audi Advantage (and the service writer always takes the 30 seconds to do this for her without issue).
I thought, way back there 30 years ago, “I can completely be focussed on driving this stick-shift turbo-charged ‘hot rod’ quattro thanks to my hands and eyes free cellular phone.” Is this technology not “way cool”? And, is this technology not a HUGE safety feature, right up there with seat belts, crumple zones, ESP and ABS, sealed beam headlights, disc brakes and so on?
I do want to be able to call home or the office without touching the phone, without looking at the phone and without pulling over and parking due to the inevitable governmental safety nanny. I want to delay yet another restriction brought on by my fellow drivers who opt for the most dangerous and deadly way I can think of to make a phone call.
Of course, maybe we’ll be allowed to used a phone in the car once cars start driving themselves. Mean time, I’d just like to advocate for voluntary cessation of in-car phone usage if it is not hand and eyes free.
"Don't it always seem to go . . . that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone?" JM
The nav system on the BMW can be set to drive only on highways and toll roads or not, so this leg, we didn't want that, we wanted the scenic route, so we entered the address of where we were going to stay (Villa Trapp, you know the Von Trapp Family) and off we went, Rick and I both like the heads up display. About half way there Rick hit the "mode" button on the steering wheel and somehow reset our destination back to Ettal. I wasn't paying attention to this, About an hour later I noticed some of the area looks familiar then I noticed what happened on Nav screen. no problem, reprogram the Nav and off we go.
The country side is amazing, green as far as you can see, NO trash on the side of the roads, no billboards. On the back roads you get a lot of people on bikes, so you have to watch out for them. Overall Cars, motorcycles and bike get along well.
Fast forward arrive at Villa Trapp, looks wonderful outside, inside looked great too, but HOT, we checked in and get to our room, come to find out the room does not have AC, and the room was very hot, and no WiFi past the first floor. I started my Nurse Practitioner program, so I'm in school again so need to be connect. and the bed was a twin, I'm sorry we both wont fit in THAT bed. We go downstairs talk to the lady who checked us in and someone at the Hotel did make a mistake but they are all filled.. We declined got a refunded, I fired up my Sheraton app and booked on points at the Sheraton Salzburg for 12K points a night. When we arrived, the front desk agent told me we had been upgraded to the Presidential Suit, one of the perks for being a 150 night/ yr platinum member. Room is outstanding to say the least.
The photos in order, Small town/villeage
This was the first GT we have seen on our trip, it's a 318d.
In old Salzburg in one of the squares.
Up in the fort over looking Slazburg, too this with my iPhone in Panoramic mode.Over looking old salzburg and the River Salzburg.
At 1650m at Tageserlaubnisschen on our way to the Eagles Nets.
Since this is a car thread what better photo then a Audi R8 and a 66 Mustang Convertible.
Enjoy the rest of your trip, and keep the updates coming!
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
I rented a MB in Munich (an E class) -- this was a few years ago -- and it had navigation. The entire thing was in German. Although it offered up arrows and the map, although in German, was easy enough to figure out. I actually got to know the word for left (turn) and for right, so we were able to use the system a great deal of the time. It got a little dicey in town, but when we put in a Hotel (name here) we mostly got close enough for jazz to it.
Is your navigation lady German or English speaking?
Driver of a late model Lexus merges onto I-75 south, immediately moves to the left-most lane, slows to 50 (apparently setting cruise control) and using one free hand, starts holding the phone to his ear -- the conversation apparently goes on for many miles, although I broke protocol after a few miles and committed one of the most vile acts anyone can do behind the wheel . . . I passed on the right after my repeated attempts at turning on my left turn signal were ignored.
I'm all for most freedoms -- really. But, you can't yell fire in a theater (unless there really is one) and expect to be covered by the first amendment. I guess, technically, there is no reason you can't hop onto a major federal highway and drive in the left-most lane at 50 MPH (the speed limit here in Ohio has, in many places, now been bumped to 70); I also assume passing on the right side (or suicide) isn't illegal. But, and it pains me to say this, I would vote for laws that would disallow both of these behaviors, were such items placed on a ballot. But, then again, I am also in the minority that votes.
We're doomed.
Just another reason I can't imagine the frustration of owning/driving an RS7 or M5 or CTS-V, etc, where in wide wide world of sports can such machines be driven using more than a fraction of their engineer-imbued "talents?" Not that a Prius is all of a sudden looking good.
One more note - I would imagine that driving in Italy would be a free-for-all (and Rome, actually, is). But, other than perhaps a slight decrease in speed, the folks driving on the Italian Autobahn (the autostrada, as I recall), behave pretty much exactly like the Germans -- lane discipline, left lane to pass and the lanes get faster the further left you go, period. Folks respond to a wink of your turn signal to get over and, from what I can tell (other than in Rome) there is no road-rage.
Although many of our Interstate road surfaces are pock-marked, I generally think we have a well thought out (mostly) highway system here, that is rendered far less efficient that it could be by either ignorance, stupidity or lack of driver training. Instead, here, we rely, in this order, upon: Enforcement (sort of), Engineering (a somewhat distant second) and Education (a very distant third.) I would think we could drive faster, experience fewer delays, fewer hours lost per person, per year, etc, if we just made getting a driver's license require a bit more rigor. One would think, considering the death-rate, that getting a DL should require no less preparation and education than getting a pilot's license. My wife got her pilot's license before she was old enough to get a driver's license -- and she thinks that getting a DL is about like getting a box-top off of a box of Wheaties.
Something is wrong with that.
One last note: I love test driving all kinds of cars, despite my completely above-board bias toward Audis, German cars and European cars, generally. I have taken so many folks on test drives these past 5-10 years, I can't remember just how many. Not one (other than my wife) has ever had ABS engaged (that they know of -- although I wonder if they just don't know what ABS braking feels like); and the thing is, when I -- in a large deserted parking lot -- get them to engage ABS, the moment the pedal pulsing starts, they [so they say] instinctively know to release the brake to the point the pulsing stops.
I have been through 4-two day Audi Driving Experiences (on ice), 1-two day BMW Driving Experience (not on ice) one Porsche Driving Experience (1-day) and a Cadillac driving experience (also 1-day). Every instructor literally starts the training with the following exercise: accelerate to about 50MPH from a dead stop and when you reach the orange cone laying on its side at the end of the "runway" press the brake pedal "as if" this is a panic stop. To a man/woman instructor, the command is "when the pulsing is felt through the pedal, press the brake as hard as your leg can press -- imagine your goal is to BEND THE BRAKE PEDAL."
The reason given for this "press harder" instruction is always, "braking force will continue to increase the harder you press, even with Brake Assist (which bases braking force somewhat on the speed at which the driver presses down)." I've seen this impact myself on dry, wet and icy pavement.
Yet, when I try to get someone who is testing a new car to brake with any degree of urgency, the instant the pulsing is felt, they release the brake -- which, were this a real emergency could increase the probability of a crash.
We need to license drivers much, much more rigorously. And, despite this old fashion notion, I think knowing how to drive a manual transmission would be helpful too, much in the same way it is said that video games are helpful prerequisites for so many endeavors.
I happen to love my DSG transmission, but in a heartbeat, going back to a six-speed manual wouldn't be anything but fun.
We really are doomed!
2024 Audi Q8 e-tron - 2017 911 C4S - 2025 BRZ - 2023 A6 Allroad - 2024 Genesis GV60 - 2019 Cayman
Perhaps a Federal law is closer (and I shudder at saying that) to what I am talking about.
Pass the Epsom Salts, please.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S