Are you a current Michigan-based car shopper? A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/2 for details.
What is the selling price and/or adjusted CAP on the new deal?
This was a quote over the phone so I didn't get the full numbers rundown. Thought it could be reverse calculated. Should have it soon. Selling 54000, Net Cap 53494.95
What is the selling price and/or adjusted CAP on the new deal?
This was a quote over the phone so I didn't get the full numbers rundown. Thought it could be reverse calculated. Should have it soon. Selling 54000, Net Cap 53494.95
+$925 acquisition fee minus $1500 loyalty rebate? Payment looks about right. No markup to the money factor. But, we've seen bigger discounts on the 2019 reported in this discussion, if you want to scroll back.
Not that impressed with the previous deal. Looks like they might have marked up the money factor, before giving you the MSD reduction.
Just left a dealer and came back a little more confused. Can someone explain why a dealer would be insistent on not giving me base MF? They are willing to discount the sale price to roughly the equivalent of the base MF only. Bottom line, if this is my only concern, does a good deal come down to me being comfortable with the monthly payment this gives me? There are so many moving parts in a lease that I don't fell 100% confident in all the areas. Any feedback is much appreciated!
+$925 acquisition fee minus $1500 loyalty rebate? Payment looks about right. No markup to the money factor. But, we've seen bigger discounts on the 2019 reported in this discussion, if you want to scroll back.
Not that impressed with the previous deal. Looks like they might have marked up the money factor, before giving you the MSD reduction.
Just left a dealer and came back a little more confused. Can someone explain why a dealer would be insistent on not giving me base MF? They are willing to discount the sale price to roughly the equivalent of the base MF only. Bottom line, if this is my only concern, does a good deal come down to me being comfortable with the monthly payment this gives me? There are so many moving parts in a lease that I don't fell 100% confident in all the areas. Any feedback is much appreciated!
Dealers are becoming more savvy on lease negotiations - you can either get a big discount in price but an inflated MF, or the base MF and a smaller discount.
You'll have to run the numbers both ways, to see which results in the better deal.
Politely tell them you won't sign a deal where the MF has been inflated; they know what the base rate is.
Have you shopped other dealers? Generally, a dealer won't negotiate themselves.
They are discounting the MSRP by 7.14% with the inflated MF. So if the numbers come out ok then should it be fine to keep inflated MF? Looks like it's a $10/month difference if it is changed to the base. Just not sure why they are being insistent about keeping it inflated. I have shopped around and everyone is very comparable on prices, and others have offered base MF. This dealer also at one point offered base, but changes all numbers every time I have circled back.
Another thing-she refused to give me the lease worksheet she worked up last night because "people are just taking them to other dealerships and getting better deals" but she has sent two before.
They are discounting the MSRP by 7.14% with the inflated MF. So if the numbers come out ok then should it be fine to keep inflated MF? Looks like it's a $10/month difference if it is changed to the base. Just not sure why they are being insistent about keeping it inflated. I have shopped around and everyone is very comparable on prices, and others have offered base MF. This dealer also at one point offered base, but changes all numbers every time I have circled back.
Another thing-she refused to give me the lease worksheet she worked up last night because "people are just taking them to other dealerships and getting better deals" but she has sent two before.
1) How much is the markup? 2) Another thing? Tell her that is unacceptable. When the info stops, you go somewhere else.
She has it marked up to the max, and the reason being they "can't let people borrow money for free." Although base MF is quite high as an interest rate equivalent, and I let her know that.
Good point! I found that to be strange, but that was my point in the conversation where I got up and left.
It seems that it can be common for people to get a heavy discount and base MF, so I'm wondering if I should keep shopping around or just accept the deal. I'm just not seeing a heavy discount (at least 7% off) plus base MF in my area very much.
She has it marked up to the max, and the reason being they "can't let people borrow money for free." Although base MF is quite high as an interest rate equivalent, and I let her know that.
Good point! I found that to be strange, but that was my point in the conversation where I got up and left.
It seems that it can be common for people to get a heavy discount and base MF, so I'm wondering if I should keep shopping around or just accept the deal. I'm just not seeing a heavy discount (at least 7% off) plus base MF in my area very much.
I wouldn't say it's common. It's possible, but it takes persistence. You definitely need to shop more than one dealer.
"can't let people borrow money for free." Kids say the cutest things...
I am shopping a few, but this deal and vehicle seemed to be the best match. I have tried to negotiate the best rates via email with them before going in last night, but I was asked to come in and talk to finance to get the true best deal. I know it's normal practice to negotiate vehicle deals, but for some reason I find it awkward to ask for money, essentially. Ha! Maybe there's a sentence or two I can find on google that tells what to say because everything I've done so far hasn't worked.
And yes, it took a lot in me to bite my tongue at that statement...
I am shopping a few, but this deal and vehicle seemed to be the best match. I have tried to negotiate the best rates via email with them before going in last night, but I was asked to come in and talk to finance to get the true best deal. I know it's normal practice to negotiate vehicle deals, but for some reason I find it awkward to ask for money, essentially. Ha! Maybe there's a sentence or two I can find on google that tells what to say because everything I've done so far hasn't worked.
And yes, it took a lot in me to bite my tongue at that statement...
Get exactly what you want down on paper:
MSRP Selling price (use their price if you are happy with it) money factor (.00182 MF) Term/mileage (36/12?)
Itemized amount due at signing. (use their offer as a template)
Calculated payment.
Write it down, give it to them..... "I have my checkbook ready to sign, right now.. but, that's the exact deal I want. Don't add even a penny to it, and we have a deal."
One last question: How low can I expect for them to go off of MSRP when I bring in this paper for the exact deal I want? I don't know the threshold of how low they'll go in my "requirement" of what I will pay.
Is it a good idea or not to tell them to get my lease payments to x amount/month instead?
One last question: How low can I expect for them to go off of MSRP when I bring in this paper for the exact deal I want? I don't know the threshold of how low they'll go in my "requirement" of what I will pay.
Is it a good idea or not to tell them to get my lease payments to x amount/month instead?
If you negotiate the payment, it gives the dealer the opportunity to pad it with junk fees. If you negotiate the selling price, and understand all the moving parts going into the deal, you'll know what the payment should be.
And, if it doesn't match the dealer quote, you can figure out why.
Makes sense, thank you. Not sure if each state has different fees (I'm in Texas) that we are more or less required to pay but there is the following on the deal: $150 doc fee, $925 acquisition fee, $118.25 license fee, $19.75 cap fees, and upfront charges of $333.25 (said it was another type of doc fee which I found bogus). Seem normal to pay?
Makes sense, thank you. Not sure if each state has different fees (I'm in Texas) that we are more or less required to pay but there is the following on the deal: $150 doc fee, $925 acquisition fee, $118.25 license fee, $19.75 cap fees, and upfront charges of $333.25 (said it was another type of doc fee which I found bogus). Seem normal to pay?
Most dealers in TX charge an inventory tax, even though it's technically their tax, not yours. It's under $200, though.
Are you sure the upfront charges don't include the items you listed? (other than the acquisition fee). $300-$400 total dealer/DMV fees looks about right for TX.
On the lease worksheet under Capitalization column (far left) is where those fees are listed, but under the Payment column (far right) is where the $333.25 "Upfront Charges" are listed. Not sure?? The mileage isn't correct on the attached worksheet, as this is one of the first ones I was sent, and they won't send an up to date one, as I mentioned earlier.
Is it too bold to ask for $44k before incentives for a 50,795 MSRP? They have offered a $1,000 incentive regardless. I have not found offers this low in my area.
On the lease worksheet under Capitalization column (far left) is where those fees are listed, but under the Payment column (far right) is where the $333.25 "Upfront Charges" are listed. Not sure?? The mileage isn't correct on the attached worksheet, as this is one of the first ones I was sent, and they won't send an up to date one, as I mentioned earlier.
Is it too bold to ask for $44k before incentives for a 50,795 MSRP? They have offered a $1,000 incentive regardless. I have not found offers this low in my area.
Looks to me that the two items with check marks are part of the upfront charges in the right hand column.
The base rate saves you $30/mo. As does every $1000 lower in sale price.
I can't tell you what an individual dealer might do.
Those two checked numbers total $268.75, so I'm not sure. When I asked about the $333 'Upfront Charges' she fumbled on words about it being another type of doc. fee. in which I said well there's a $925 doc. fee already applied.
Thank you for this info.
I'll try and be bold and not fumble on my own words when asking for that sale price.
UPDATE: This evening they changed the selling price (raised it another ~1%) and MF (to .00202) on me for the 4th or 5th time since first speaking to them. I feel like my experience isn't like many others, and I'm not sure why. But I'm worn out. They also told me that someone wondering about my deal brought into them a screenshot of my lease worksheet I uploaded here a week or two ago. I'm at a loss on what to do at this point but find a new vehicle altogether maybe.
Those two checked numbers total $268.75, so I'm not sure. When I asked about the $333 'Upfront Charges' she fumbled on words about it being another type of doc. fee. in which I said well there's a $925 doc. fee already applied.
Thank you for this info.
I'll try and be bold and not fumble on my own words when asking for that sale price.
UPDATE: This evening they changed the selling price (raised it another ~1%) and MF (to .00202) on me for the 4th or 5th time since first speaking to them. I feel like my experience isn't like many others, and I'm not sure why. But I'm worn out. They also told me that someone wondering about my deal brought into them a screenshot of my lease worksheet I uploaded here a week or two ago. I'm at a loss on what to do at this point but find a new vehicle altogether maybe.
Getting a new car should not be this much work. I would recommend stepping away from the process for a few days or a week, gather your thoughts, and decide if you want to continue working with this dealer. I'm guessing they have a car in stock that you really want, to put up with the hassle.
I agree with you. I'm not sure if they just targeted me to try and take advantage of, but it's a little unbelievable how many times they've changed the numbers around in just the two weeks I've communicated with them.
Yes, they do, but I am looking around again as there are a few options for dealers in my area. Thanks so much for all of your help and advice.
I agree with you. I'm not sure if they just targeted me to try and take advantage of, but it's a little unbelievable how many times they've changed the numbers around in just the two weeks I've communicated with them.
Yes, they do, but I am looking around again as there are a few options for dealers in my area. Thanks so much for all of your help and advice.
I'd guess it has nothing to do with you, and all about the dealership trying to pad their profit margin.
I think that I have the most odd occurrences throughout this new car leasing process...which leads me to: Is it normal practice for a salesman to not provide a stock # to a car at a sister dealership, where the car is also not listed? Basically, I have only received cell phone pictures of the car and have never seen a viable listing online, nor know the stock/vin # to search for it.
I think that I have the most odd occurrences throughout this new car leasing process...which leads me to: Is it normal practice for a salesman to not provide a stock # to a car at a sister dealership, where the car is also not listed? Basically, I have only received cell phone pictures of the car and have never seen a viable listing online, nor know the stock/vin # to search for it.
It's possible that the car is in transit, or they've found it at another dealership, and have to trade for it. Who knows? Ask the salesperson directly for the information you want. If they aren't forthcoming, that might not be a person you want to do business with.
They've told me roundabout what you say, too, and I'm waiting on a last request for stock/vin. Just wanted to check and to see if I'm suspicious for no reason. Thank you!
Hi guys. This is my latest offer/comparison, and hopefully my last for this vehicle. I was able to have the selling price at $45k, from $46,795. This is for a 36/12 and MF of .00182. This dealer sends these types of sheets instead of full numbers listed out, so I don't know what entails the amounts arriving at each different monthly payment. Do these make sense? Seems the cash down amounts and what they are yielding are off, when comparing the two deals. I'm told I won't have itemized due at signing until it goes to finance. Either way, I appreciate any feedback if the $45k deal and numbers seem like a good deal!
Hi guys. This is my latest offer/comparison, and hopefully my last for this vehicle. I was able to have the selling price at $45k, from $46,795. This is for a 36/12 and MF of .00182. This dealer sends these types of sheets instead of full numbers listed out, so I don't know what entails the amounts arriving at each different monthly payment. Do these make sense? Seems the cash down amounts and what they are yielding are off, when comparing the two deals. I'm told I won't have itemized due at signing until it goes to finance. Either way, I appreciate any feedback if the $45k deal and numbers seem like a good deal!
The quote is missing the $925 acquisition fee
If I add that to the total, I'm within $2/mo. of the quote with just first payment due at signing.
Ok, they sent over the full listing of numbers, and, call me crazy, but is the selling price now changed to $46k suddenly? LOL. I quit. Also, I thought excessive mileage is .20/mile, not .25?
Ok, they sent over the full listing of numbers, and, call me crazy, but is the selling price now changed to $46k suddenly? LOL. I quit. Also, I thought excessive mileage is .20/mile, not .25?
$46K minus the $1000 rebate. Exactly what you had before.
Is there certain terminology I should use when talking about lease price/selling price/out the door price, etc.? Do these all mean the same?
For example, using the lease calculator on edmunds.com I calculated total monthly payments by using a selling price of $45k, plus acquisition and document fee (are there additional fees we should pay?), to get gross cap. cost. Then I took away any incentives and rebates from this total, to get net cap. cost. So when I tell a dealer I want a selling price of $45k do you think they interpret that as selling price plus fees & TTL, including incentives, or before incentives? I want to be sure I'm saying it right and calculating right.
Comments
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and let us know! Post a pic of your new purchase or lease!
MODERATOR
2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
That surprises me that it won't stack with Grad, but I can see the logic behind it.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
2019 X3 36/12k MSRP 57370 in 60076. Offer: Taxes upfront, 0 down, 725/mo, driveoff 3255 = 2209 taxes + 725 1st month + 145 plates + 176 doc fee
And for context, how good was this deal (attached) from them on 12/31/2015?
2016 X3 36/12k RV 57%. MSRP 52645, Sale 49335. 676/mo driveoff 1990
What was the MSRP on the old deal?
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
This was a quote over the phone so I didn't get the full numbers rundown. Thought it could be reverse calculated. Should have it soon.Selling 54000, Net Cap 53494.95 52645
Thanks so much
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Payment looks about right. No markup to the money factor.
But, we've seen bigger discounts on the 2019 reported in this discussion, if you want to scroll back.
Not that impressed with the previous deal. Looks like they might have marked up the money factor, before giving you the MSD reduction.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Okay I will read on more.
Thats what I thought.
Thanks again!
You'll have to run the numbers both ways, to see which results in the better deal.
Politely tell them you won't sign a deal where the MF has been inflated; they know what the base rate is.
Have you shopped other dealers? Generally, a dealer won't negotiate themselves.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and let us know! Post a pic of your new purchase or lease!
MODERATOR
2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
Another thing-she refused to give me the lease worksheet she worked up last night because "people are just taking them to other dealerships and getting better deals" but she has sent two before.
2) Another thing? Tell her that is unacceptable. When the info stops, you go somewhere else.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Good point! I found that to be strange, but that was my point in the conversation where I got up and left.
It seems that it can be common for people to get a heavy discount and base MF, so I'm wondering if I should keep shopping around or just accept the deal. I'm just not seeing a heavy discount (at least 7% off) plus base MF in my area very much.
"can't let people borrow money for free."
Kids say the cutest things...
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
And yes, it took a lot in me to bite my tongue at that statement...
MSRP
Selling price (use their price if you are happy with it)
money factor (.00182 MF)
Term/mileage (36/12?)
Itemized amount due at signing. (use their offer as a template)
Calculated payment.
Write it down, give it to them..... "I have my checkbook ready to sign, right now.. but, that's the exact deal I want. Don't add even a penny to it, and we have a deal."
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Is it a good idea or not to tell them to get my lease payments to x amount/month instead?
And, if it doesn't match the dealer quote, you can figure out why.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and let us know! Post a pic of your new purchase or lease!
MODERATOR
2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
It's under $200, though.
Are you sure the upfront charges don't include the items you listed? (other than the acquisition fee).
$300-$400 total dealer/DMV fees looks about right for TX.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Is it too bold to ask for $44k before incentives for a 50,795 MSRP? They have offered a $1,000 incentive regardless. I have not found offers this low in my area.
The base rate saves you $30/mo.
As does every $1000 lower in sale price.
I can't tell you what an individual dealer might do.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Thank you for this info.
I'll try and be bold and not fumble on my own words when asking for that sale price.
UPDATE: This evening they changed the selling price (raised it another ~1%) and MF (to .00202) on me for the 4th or 5th time since first speaking to them. I feel like my experience isn't like many others, and I'm not sure why. But I'm worn out. They also told me that someone wondering about my deal brought into them a screenshot of my lease worksheet I uploaded here a week or two ago. I'm at a loss on what to do at this point but find a new vehicle altogether maybe.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and let us know! Post a pic of your new purchase or lease!
MODERATOR
2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
Yes, they do, but I am looking around again as there are a few options for dealers in my area. Thanks so much for all of your help and advice.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
.00182 MF and 56% residual
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
No markup to the money factor.
If you are happy with the selling price, then there is nothing else to worry about.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and let us know! Post a pic of your new purchase or lease!
MODERATOR
2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
If I add that to the total, I'm within $2/mo. of the quote with just first payment due at signing.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
I'm pretty sure it's been $0.25 for a few years.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
I must have been looking at something else to do with mileage where it shows .20. Thanks!!
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
For example, using the lease calculator on edmunds.com I calculated total monthly payments by using a selling price of $45k, plus acquisition and document fee (are there additional fees we should pay?), to get gross cap. cost. Then I took away any incentives and rebates from this total, to get net cap. cost. So when I tell a dealer I want a selling price of $45k do you think they interpret that as selling price plus fees & TTL, including incentives, or before incentives? I want to be sure I'm saying it right and calculating right.