What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

ruking1

Well, it sounds like they were trying to get "the quotas" The normal patrols are in Ford Police Explorers. Moveable speed limiters.

gagrice

50 MPH makes sense on that road during a snow storm; it is indefensible on a nice sunny dry day.

Today we drove CA-1 from Ft Bragg and CA-128 to Calistoga. The Speed Limit on most of it is 55 MPH. There is 30 miles of hairpin turns that got me down to 20 MPH in the Touareg. We did run into a lot of motorcycle riders that seemed to enjoy the high limit. Also a half dozen Vintage Alfa roadsters. They looked like this one. Really pretty cars.

ruking1

Isn't it grand being on the open road?

stevedebi

andres3 said:

Hmmm.... Does the EV become more inefficient with time, or simply become lower capacity. In other words, does the maximum charge and use of the battery go down (equivalent to a smaller gas/diesel tank). Or is it really using up the same amount of energy with less range.

The battery loses capacity, which decreases range.

ruking1

The ethanol mix 10% (to a proposed 15%) also decreases mpg & causes more pollution. Indeed the gasser emissions system is NOT designed to mitigate 10% ethanol !!

Indeed E85 products have almost utterly failed to catch on!

Michaell

In the spirit of fairness, I've rebranded another thread to give equal time to EV's:

http://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/43145/kia/soul-ev/what-would-it-take-for-you-to-drive-an-ev#latest

ruking1

Honda, to a lesser extent (% wise, in relation to other OEMs) didn't get the CUX/SUV demand correct, despite having 4/5 segment leaders (2 Acura/3 Honda) . http://www.wsj.com/articles/honda-to-boost-crossover-suv-capacity-to-maintain-u-s-momentum-1476364980

My take: all of them would be better with a diesel option. Honda products gas, gas hybrid, EV, & diesel have not done well in European markets. Despite my long time admiration of Honda, they've not done gangbusters in US markets either.

The other OEMs have miscalculated the CUV/SUV segments also.

But then, here is a WSJ macro look at things? It is as if they felt like we are NOT in a recession NOW?? http://www.wsj.com/articles/economists-believe-a-recession-is-likely-within-next-four-years-1476367202

stever

"Likelihood is, therefore, that Europe’s diesel car sales share will continue to fall in the months ahead. On the plus side, however, as yet the drop in demand has not reached catastrophic proportions. Nevertheless, the diesel car industry, to prevent that from happening, must undertake URGENT steps to restore consumer confidence in diesel virtues. In short, a fact-based auto industry statement that “Clean Diesel” really means what it says.”

In Europe, Diesel Falls Slowly Out Of Favor (Forbes)

ruking1

The easiest thing to do: stop calling ULSD- clean diesel ! Gasoline & 10% ethanol aren't called "CLEAN" nor are either together or separately: look at the market share it has in America, 95 to 97%! Ethanol had to get & be given secret & MASSIVE US emissions & other exemptions to be used.! EV needed the war in Afghanistan to leave the area open for ($ 10 trillion) KEY mineral development & mining for EV by China companies!! It's hard to guess MUCH of China's power needed for EV development is based on coal fired power plants.

Again, the refining realities have both fuels: gasoline/ diesel joined @ the proverbial & literal hip ! 19 gal/13 gals. The so called "decreases" in diesel cars & %'s & increases in gasoline demand should lead to lower diesel prices! I say yippee yahoo!

fintail

I wonder how long a "clean" (I agree, stupid marketing term made to soothe the guilty conscience of lame eco-weenies) diesel would have to run to equal the pollution from battery production in a modern EV.

Modern day Youropeans might fall for it quicker than anyone, huge dose of guilty conscience and misguided save the world ethos there.

ruking1

Yes, I remember when VW came out with that "clean diesel" advertising campaign". My reactions were @ least two fold:

1. LSD was mandated by EPA/CARB to be ULSD (28 to 35 years (LATE) @ Oct 2006
2. (What kind of BS was this, as) gasoline,gas/ethonal, ethanol are / were NOT ever clean.

Indeed, if ANYBODY ever thought EV were was/remains clean. may I again @ the risk of being repetitive (not that this has ever stopped me before) refer one to:

1. why the Afghanistan war was fought
2. the absolute criticality of coal fired plants in China (70%) and United States (40%)
3. Way more environmental destruction in manufacture.

The governments in Los Angeles, the "most polluted" areas in the nation, have already (defacto) declared, ( I've posted the sites here more than once) N0X mitigation a nonstarter. Just the federal government exemptions guarantees ZERO N0X mitigation!!! Indeed it guarantees total N0X NON compliance! BUT those same governments know to understand that even if federal exemptions& emissions disappear there will STILL be ZERO compliance.

More to the point if they could waive the magic wand and get rid of every affected TDI passenger car, the removal would show no measurement !

andres3

gagrice said:

50 MPH makes sense on that road during a snow storm; it is indefensible on a nice sunny dry day.

Today we drove CA-1 from Ft Bragg and CA-128 to Calistoga. The Speed Limit on most of it is 55 MPH. There is 30 miles of hairpin turns that got me down to 20 MPH in the Touareg. We did run into a lot of motorcycle riders that seemed to enjoy the high limit. Also a half dozen Vintage Alfa roadsters. They looked like this one. Really pretty cars.

55 MPH is the standard default speed limit on a 2-lane highway (one lane each direction) in CA. Absent another speed limit, 55 is the default. 65 is technically the default in CA, since 55 only applies if conditions do not reasonably permit 65 MPH as safe. At 65 MPH you run into the absolute Maximum speed law, and regardless of conditions, you are breaking the law if you go 65.00001 MPH.

I love the Basic Speed Law that applies to all speed limits up to 64.99999 MPH. Unfortunately, most cops think that the numbers on the sign are absolute.

In Court they have to prove that 1) you were going over the speed limit, AND 2) that it was unreasonable and unsafe or hazardous in some manner. #2 generally leads to perjury by the Officer and is tough to fight.

On the other hand, regarding #2, you have to prove as a defense that the prima facie speed limit (posted sign) could reasonably be exceeded given the conditions at the time you exceeded them.

In my opinion both sides should have to prove #1 and #2. Some judges may not require #2 to be proven by the prosecution; keeping the full burden on the defendant. A traffic engineering survey that shows the 85th percentile to be HIGHER than the posted speed limit is a great start!

I have no experience in pointing out when the traffic survey is higher than the speed limit in court though; because every time I use the Discovery process to obtain those records, the officer inevitably fails to show up to defend that indefensible speed limit.

Speed trap laws only apply to radar (or electronic means; like lasers) by the way. They can still speed trap you using old fashioned methods like clocking two points on the roadway.

ruking1

..."Carmakers have kept understandably quiet about the scale of the problem or how they plan to address it. But industry sources shared details of a retreat already underway."...

The auto industry really wanted to KEEP the wraps on this 2.0 L diesel thing. It's forcing them to radically redesign flawed GASSER small engines also. http://finance.yahoo.com/news/exclusive-carmakers-forced-back-bigger-engines-emissions-era-105041893--finance.html!

..."gasoline equivalents lose fuel-efficiency and spew fine particles and carbon monoxide."...

In other news, a fix has been proposed for 15% of the affected 475,000 : the 2015 model year; 71,250 units. http://finance.yahoo.com/news/vw-fix-cheating-diesels-could-171725679.html

ruking1

So we approach the 2025 54.5 mpg targets (7 MY's away) not being able to use efficiency exhausted "smaller" gas, gas hybrid, etc., 10%-15% ethanol, E85 etc., engines. . Larger engines have never been close , ergo the switch to smaller engines. Indeed, EV engines do not currently approach that equivalent gasoline standard. Now keep in mind that is down from 62 mpg as a CAFE wiki chart shows!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Average_Fuel_Economy#

Indeed, one chart shows 42 mpg SHOULD be the 2016 "AVERAGE". Incidentally there are no to very few articles listing what the REAL average MPG is per year !

So here is just one example of the "Alice through the looking glass"- warped being PC,

...". Thus an E85-capable (alternative fuel, which diesel is included- my sic) vehicle that gets 15 mpg on E-85 and 25 mpg on gasoline might logically be rated at 20 mpg. But in fact the average, for CAFE purposes, despite perhaps only one percent of the fuel used in E85-capable vehicles is actually E85, is computed as 100 mpg for E-85 and the standard 25 mpg for gasoline, or 62.5 mpg.[12] "...

So for a vehicle that allegedly gets 15 mpg, the CAFE calculations rate it @ 100 mpg!!! ???

Using the same rationale/logic and calculations, my TDI's @ anywhere from 50, 40, 36, 33 mpgs get 333, 267, 240, 220 mpgs! No wonder they hate diesels and want to exterminate them. Each and everyone of them far exceeds the 54.5 mpg 2025 standards!!! YESTERDAY!

IF passenger cars will cost substantially more $$'s with no " renaissance/s" in the economies, the US's of primary concern; it's an almost no-brainer that massive layoffs & trickle down effects in the auto industry are inevitable. Right now, the auto industry is one of the linchpins of the American economy ! True (real) unemployment is closer to 42% NOW (138.18 M ) We also have approximately 45 to 47% of house holds of 115.2 M household (329 M population, Siri) paying little to no federal taxes.!

I can't even make this stuff up!

fintail

I've been on the road for a few days. Lots of mountain and hill driving, along with speed (the yellow sign turns here are especially dumb, I can comfortably exceed them by 10-15 mph, and I am not exactly driving a sports car), cut the mpg to around 40, woe is me. I've also noticed in many spots in eastern WA and ID, diesel is the same or a penny or two less than RUG. If this is the new normal, I will take it

Where are the clean gasser claims from those makers? Of course, hybrids and EVs can claim to be clean til the cows come home, as the target marker is fine with exporting pollution.

I also have to say, too much breitbart style economic blathering here. While official unemployment numbers are not wholly accurate (every government and every nation uses creative accounting to paint a rosy picture), we are not in a recession (in the modern trickle down globalized fairytale, recession will likely become a regional ideal, and it sure as hell isn't reality for those in affluent coastal areas), and 42% unemployment has no credible basis. It's funny how the nanny hosts can tacitly kill one thread, and let other stuff ramble on.

kyfdx

Slip in that stuff in the last paragraph. The moderators have nodded off from boredom, by then.

ruking1

Right, I'm sure the "elites" ("baristas") at places like Starbucks with bachelors degrees working on masters degrees, see that 49 year employment there (16 years old to 65 years old & beyond) as a suitable full career opportunity. On second thought, 42% unemployment might be a low ball figure.

But then, I could be persuaded to get the profits from 5/6 of the Starbucks. .

ruking1

kyfdx said:

Slip in that stuff in the last paragraph. The moderators have nodded off from boredom, by then.

Perhaps that's the real point ! I learned for one thing, outside of the lies and damned lies on mpg & emissions, despite over two decades of administration's policy cheerleading, E 85 is only about 1% of the fuel demand. Now 1 % is really misleading in that 15% is gasoline. So the reality is less than 1% ( .85 %) It does pose the question: what would be the percentages of fuel use IF 10 to 15% ethanol were choices rather than mandatory.

fintail

Ethanol, another boondoggle nobody wants to touch. I still have doubts about what that stuff can do to vintage cars, too. So much money put into that, and what has it accomplished?

If you get a MA in comparative cultural multigender underwater basketweaving studies, the barista job might not be so bad Definitely not seeing anything close to those numbers in the region where I live. Maybe those numbers are inflated due to the sheer amount of public sector workers who retire with fat bennies after 25 years, and are able to hang em up before most real world workers, thus being counted as "out of the workforce" or some other far right (but not right) AM radio/lame website talking point babble. Just as maybe the lack of taxpayers includes "smart" people who use creative accounting to "take advantage" of ridiculous trickle down policies.

ruking1

There's a funny thing, even the farmers (i.e., CORN,) don't dare use ethanol (in any %) to run their farm equipment (if one can't guess why, they don't belong on this thread ) . They use biodiesel ! The governments even know this. When was the last time they told us PVF owners?

fintail

I'm in farm country right now. Every farmer here has a diesel pickup. even the fancy farmers who never leave a gravel driveeway. Gassers don't seem to be on the radar.

ruking1

Smart? Far from it! Creative it is not. Breitbart? It's a meaningless but witch hunt type inflammatory label. Indeed it is in the IRS tax law. Open the books, read them, close the books. The majority of the ones who pay no to the least taxes can also have access to all manners of "aid"

But I digressed from the Judges' quote: http://quotes.liberty-tree.ca/quote/learned_hand_quote_6bf7

"Anyone may arrange his affairs so that his taxes shall be as low as
possible; he is not bound to choose that pattern which best pays the
treasury. There is not even a patriotic duty to increase one's taxes.
Over and over again the Courts have said that there is nothing sinister
in so arranging affairs as to keep taxes as low as possible. Everyone
does it, rich and poor alike and all do right, for nobody owes any
public duty to pay more than the law demands."

He started off as a Democrat, with Republican sandwich and ended up a Progressive ! Here is a wiki take on him. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_Hand

ruking1

fintail said:

I'm in farm country right now. Every farmer here has a diesel pickup. even the fancy farmers who never leave a gravel driveeway. Gassers don't seem to be on the radar.

What no E 85 P/U truck %'s ??? I'm clueless why that would be true!

ruking1

At first read, it appeared the CEO was calling for 10% cuts (implication- across-the-board) . On the second read... So unless you know what the materials and overhead percentages are, it's far LESS. With such a limp wrist response, VW is where it needs to be, while trying to show its "hard work".& contrition.

VW would be less than completely wise, if they did not milk "TESLA like" IRS, et al., tax credits/write-offs for their US EV's. (aka, more than the $ 18 B they've set aside for "diesel-gate.)

I can see why Toyota & GM are scrambling. Unless one is allergic to roses, that is what VW is smelling like. ( diesel leader or sans)

houdini1

We have 2 low mileage v8's...so I am set for a while.

fintail

Gasser pickups, E85 or not, do not seem to perform adequately for actual work, or showing off. Diesel is where it's at.

The guilted eco-weenies might eventually make keeping a large V8 an onerous task. I am surprised we haven't reverted to displacement taxes like leading nanny-states.

Only inflammatory if one has something they might be ashamed of. And definitely creative to link business and personal finances, even if legal. Just as trickle down lies are creative, but legal. I think some of the mysteriously bitter set (can't see why they have hard feelings when they have made out like bandits from the historic past 40 years of asset appreciation and public sector perks) want some kind of economic collapse. Just praying for recession or worse.

If one should worship a long-dead talking head, then maybe all of those millions supposedly not paying taxes isn't a problem after all? I suspect most are doing so legally.

ruking1 said:

Smart? Far from it! Creative it is not. Breitbart? It's a meaningless but witch hunt type inflammatory label. Indeed it is in the IRS tax law. Open the books, read them, close the books. The majority of the ones who pay no to the least taxes can also have access to all manners of "aid"

He started off as a Democrat, with Republican sandwich and ended up a Progressive ! Here is a wiki take on him. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_Hand

ruking1

houdini1 said:

We have 2 low mileage v8's...so I am set for a while.

The Cummins 8 cylinder 5.0L (305 cu in,) 560 # ft comes in the Nissan Titan!

Not that it is any of my business, but how many miles do you plan to put on them?

ruking1

fintail said:

Gasser pickups, E85 or not, do not seem to perform adequately for actual work, or showing off. Diesel is where it's at.

The guilted eco-weenies might eventually make keeping a large V8 an onerous task. I am surprised we haven't reverted to displacement taxes like leading nanny-states.

Only inflammatory if one has something they might be ashamed of. And definitely creative to link business and personal finances, even if legal. Just as trickle down lies are creative, but legal. I think some of the mysteriously bitter set (can't see why they have hard feelings when they have made out like bandits from the historic past 40 years of asset appreciation and public sector perks) want some kind of economic collapse. Just praying for recession or worse.

If one should worship a long-dead talking head, then maybe all of those millions supposedly not paying taxes isn't a problem after all? I suspect most are doing so legally.

ruking1 said:

Smart? Far from it! Creative it is not. Breitbart? It's a meaningless but witch hunt type inflammatory label. Indeed it is in the IRS tax law. Open the books, read them, close the books. The majority of the ones who pay no to the least taxes can also have access to all manners of "aid"

He started off as a Democrat, with Republican sandwich and ended up a Progressive ! Here is a wiki take on him. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_Hand

And that indeed are the curse, beauty and utility of the regulations. If one does not want to use them, Do NOT! IF one wants to use them.... Do! Freedom's a wonderful thing! However, the definitions can be different for everybody. " Viva la Difference. "

gagrice

Fintail says: If you get a MA in comparative cultural multigender underwater basketweaving studies, the barista job might not be so bad Definitely not seeing anything close to those numbers in the region where I live.

Interesting story about those under paid MW earners. My son quit his chef job and went back to construction. He was struggling at $15 per hour, while the servers were cutting a fat hog at $9.50 plus tips. He said the turning point was one of the young servers bought a brand new Caddy ATS coupe. Of course he is living at home mooching off the Boomer parents the Millennials like to blame for all the problems.

On a diesel note, I filled twice in Oregon at the Conoco station in Cottage Grove. Diesel $2.19 and RUG was $2.35. Right at 693 miles I quit trying to find cheap diesel in CA and paid $2.99 for Shell. 80 cents a gallon more in CA should tell you something. Shell gave me about 2 MPG less than the Conoco diesel in Oregon. I got 29.03 MPG driving on CA1 & US1 that was very windy roads with many 20 MPH switchbacks. Filled when I got home and the CA Shell diesel only got 27.21 all freeway driving. I am building a good case against CA gas and diesel. IT IS CRAP and designed to sell more to get more taxes. The more fuel you use the more cash they pocket.

ruking1

While most would be tempted to think CARB emissions tests are uniform across the state, that would be almost totally wrong. In CA, fuel is literally a boutique locational product. Each jurisdictional area has different emissions specifications. The resulting lower mpgs are normal. In addition, costs are way higher due to lack of commoditization of a ...commodity.

So with you filling twice in OR, with a resulting 6.23 % mpg LOSS in CA fueling , it is a solid but little noted truth! While I haven't done this in awhile, I suspect it is worse for gassers!!

De facto, (in your example) the eco cons are saying that burning MORE fuel is actually better for the CA environment than burning LESS fuel!!

To (gasser/ethanol) wit, E 85's (like model) are documented to get 25% less mpg than (it's like model) GASSERS. A (like model) TDI will burn FAR LESS . However, ultra low sulfur diesel is demonized and vilified because they don't get enough taxes from it ! They have admitted that (complaints of far lower tax revenues due to better gasser mpg) on the gasser side. My take: little wonder that TDI's are marked for death ! So that is the perfect minority view (3 to 5%) to get them !

ruking1

Given my posting from before, E85 models (15 mpg) get 40% worse than gassers. (25 mpg) So given (my) TDI 33 mpg, that is 32% better. Defacto 22 to 25 mpg is ok with the regulators, for large cars to light trucks.

ULSD gets 120% better mpg than E 85 !

houdini1

ruking1 said:

houdini1 said:

We have 2 low mileage v8's...so I am set for a while.

The Cummins 8 cylinder 5.0L (305 cu in,) 560 # ft comes in the Nissan Titan!

Not that it is any of my business, but how many miles do you plan to put on them?

We are both in our 70's and don't drive much at all any more. Wife drives 4 or 5 thousand miles a year and I drive 7 or 8 thousand miles a year. Her LX only has 12,500 miles on it, and my LS has 35,000, so they should last a while longer. We have owned them for about 4 years. No more than we drive, gas prices and mpg are not an issue.

ruking1

Fuel prices have been only a very small piece of the game. I've only included them on this board for those whom mpg/fuel pricing are issues. I've pretty much have liked driving the torque ! (compared to like model gassers).

I just have to smile thinking if the Touareg TDI posted 560 plus #ft of torque on a V8 !! & put down 30 mpg?? AND to think for roughly 60,000 miles, the 3.0 L V6 Touareg TDI (@ 406 # ft) has been an absolute joy to drive! Hammering it & posting 33 mpg? - ... priceless!

But happy cruising to the both of you! The Lexus V8's are almost bullet proof!

Here is the REAL agenda for US eco cons, massive use of FOREIGN " dirty" coal fired plants for China/India each @ 72% !!! http://finance.yahoo.com/news/clean-coal-option-india-160000631.html. China's "dirty" coal plants & logistics were long ago negotiated in place by a previous US administration.

Renewables? That's a mirage for the foreseeable future. The narratives of course are completely to the contrary.

fintail

Freedom is a wonderful thing, but for how regulations are created, remember the golden rule, and I don't mean do unto others

I wonder how much more those dirty coal plants emit than clean diesels or gassers, even the cheaters. Oops, exported pollution, doesn't count.

ruking1 said:

And that indeed are the curse, beauty and utility of the regulations. If one does not want to use them, Do NOT! IF one wants to use them.... Do! Freedom's a wonderful thing! However, the definitions can be different for everybody. " Viva la Difference. "

fintail

If he's on the west coast, still plenty of construction jobs for skilled people too - up in the PNW, it's build build build everywhere. Recession? Not here yet. And maybe enabling people to mooch is indeed part of the problem. I am certain nobody is being forced. I could go down a generational warfare path, but I won't

I filled up in Idaho a few days ago at around $2.50 (I think it was a penny or two less than RUG), back in WA now but still plenty of fuel left, might top it off after a long drive planned for tomorrow. Getting around 40 mpg (including city/town driving) in the rolling hills of the Palouse, at least 30% better than the gasser equivalent, no doubt.

gagrice said:

Interesting story about those under paid MW earners. My son quit his chef job and went back to construction. He was struggling at $15 per hour, while the servers were cutting a fat hog at $9.50 plus tips. He said the turning point was one of the young servers bought a brand new Caddy ATS coupe. Of course he is living at home mooching off the Boomer parents the Millennials like to blame for all the problems.

On a diesel note, I filled twice in Oregon at the Conoco station in Cottage Grove. Diesel $2.19 and RUG was $2.35. Right at 693 miles I quit trying to find cheap diesel in CA and paid $2.99 for Shell. 80 cents a gallon more in CA should tell you something. Shell gave me about 2 MPG less than the Conoco diesel in Oregon. I got 29.03 MPG driving on CA1 & US1 that was very windy roads with many 20 MPH switchbacks. Filled when I got home and the CA Shell diesel only got 27.21 all freeway driving. I am building a good case against CA gas and diesel. IT IS CRAP and designed to sell more to get more taxes. The more fuel you use the more cash they pocket.

ruking1

Well yes the ( year round) operation of 1 container ship is equal to the operation of 50 M cars! http://newatlas.com/shipping-pollution/11526/

This article says 15 container ships = the worlds cars 760 M http://www.yachtforums.com/threads/report-pollution-from-15-of-worlds-biggest-ships-equal-that-of-worlds-760m-cars.20003/

So while CA wants to say it's affected VW TDI's are the environmental boogie men, it's totally false ! They can totally remove them and they won't even be able to measure the difference!

So here's hoping that you have a great trip ! Imagine that, 40 mpg instead of 25 mpg!?

houdini1

ruking1 said:

Fuel prices have been only a very small piece of the game. I've only included them on this board for those whom mpg/fuel pricing are issues. I've pretty much have liked driving the torque ! (compared to like model gassers).

I just have to smile thinking if the Touareg TDI posted 560 plus #ft of torque on a V8 !! & put down 30 mpg?? AND to think for roughly 60,000 miles, the 3.0 L V6 Touareg TDI (@ 406 # ft) has been an absolute joy to drive! Hammering it & posting 33 mpg? - ... priceless!

But happy cruising to the both of you! The Lexus V8's are almost bullet proof!

Here is the REAL agenda for US eco cons, massive use of FOREIGN " dirty" coal fired plants for China/India each @ 72% !!! http://finance.yahoo.com/news/clean-coal-option-india-160000631.html. China's "dirty" coal plants & logistics were long ago negotiated in place by a previous US administration.

Renewables? That's a mirage for the foreseeable future. The narratives of course are completely to the contrary.

Thanks for the well wishes. This is my second LS and my wife's third LX. No problems with any of them, knock on wood, and we have an excellent local dealership. I love diesels and have owned one in the past, 1978 240 D. Great car.

fintail

The shipping stuff is the most disturbing. Why won't the bleeding hearts mention it? You had some dopey old hippies nearly in tears about VW (smelling a settlement, no doubt), but they won't say a word about what delivers their iPads, I guess.

I suspect the average for this trip, around 1000 miles, will be 40 mpg. If diesel averages around $2.50-$2.60, that's fairly economical motoring.

ruking1 said:

Well yes the ( year round) operation of 1 container ship is equal to the operation of 50 M cars! http://newatlas.com/shipping-pollution/11526/

This article says 15 container ships = the worlds cars 760 M http://www.yachtforums.com/threads/report-pollution-from-15-of-worlds-biggest-ships-equal-that-of-worlds-760m-cars.20003/

So while CA wants to say it's affected VW TDI's are the environmental boogie men, it's totally false ! They can totally remove them and they won't even be able to measure the difference!

So here's hoping that you have a great trip ! Imagine that, 40 mpg instead of 25 mpg!?

ruking1

Not only is it economical motoring, you are actually using 37.5% LESS fuel for the same 1000 miles! It's an absolute fairy tale eco cons cling to, that using 40 gals of fuel emits less/ better than using 25 gals!!

This might be old news, but Mercedes Benz invested some big bucks into developing the next GEN TDI. http://www.topgear.com/car-news/insider/qa-can-mercedes-new-engine-save-diesel#1

So if VW doesn't want the leadership in TDI's, the Mercedes Benz next gen sounds great! Some time ago I posted that diesels are good for 1 M miles. This new one was a champ after 25,000 hours! So @ 55 mph that translates to 1.375 M miles!.

gagrice

Fintail: I suspect the average for this trip, around 1000 miles, will be 40 mpg. If diesel averages around $2.50-$2.60, that's fairly economical motoring.


When we hit the road here in San Diego on October 1st I topped off with local Sinclair diesel at $2.69 CC. That afternoon 649 miles from home in Red Bluff, CA we filled with Shell $2.57 per gallon. We averaged 67 MPH for that trip and 28.4 MPG. Buying Cononco diesel in CG for $2.19 was great. Those two tanks netted 1398 miles. My record to date 704 miles on a tank with 70 miles reserve according to the computer. That may be optimistic as it took 24.426 gallons to fill it. Though Oregon station attendants don't go passed the first click off. Worst price was in the CA valley where $2.99 was the low price. Overall for my 3186 mile trip diesel cost was 8.8 cents a mile. Well below my 39k mile average since new of 11.8 cents a mile. By comparison the 2007 Sequoia averaged 20.9 cents per mile over the 36K miles it had on it when we sold it to my wife's granddaughter.

gagrice

Just got the 40k mile complete service by dealer. I assumed the service was included in the extended warranty I bought. It was not. So complete service including oil change, oil & fuel filter, Hepa filter, Air filter and alignment was $323. It was somewhat out of alignment, and they had a $49 special, so I let them do it. Tires now have 24k miles on them and 7/32nds depth all around. Discount Tire is very good about rotating and balancing around 5k miles.

I don't think they topped off the AdBlue. They told me last time the Urea warning came on and I took it in that they don't fill it, only dump in a 2.5 gallon jug. That is to avoid spilling and making a mess. So I have no way of knowing how many miles I get on AdBlue. When the 2k mile warning comes on again, I will buy from the cheapest place and fill it, so I can see what that costs per mile. I see my local Sam's Club has Peak Def Blue for 10.98 for 2.5 gallons. I will snag 5 gallons and top off and start keeping track.

ruking1

There is almost no other logical conclusion that the regulators wants one to pay as high a cost per mile driven: fuel in the PVF segment one chooses. 20.9 cents per mile driven vs 8.8 cents per mile driven: fuel is proof in the pudding.

gagrice

ruking1 said:

There is almost no other logical conclusion that the regulators wants one to pay as high a cost per mile driven: fuel in the PVF segment one chooses. 20.9 cents per mile driven vs 8.8 cents per mile driven: fuel is proof in the pudding.

Not to mention a much more powerful engine in the Touareg than the Sequoia. I set the cruise on 75 MPH on Interstate 5, which with the bigger tires is about 78 MPH. The RPMs are at 1900. Up and down hills and it does not vary or down shift. The beauty of low RPM torque. Did I mention 700+ miles between fuel stops? At about half the fuel cost of owning a comparable gas powered SUV.

Like I told the service manager at VW, I don't know what I will buy if VW takes back the Touareg like they are the small engine diesels. Whatever it is will be diesel powered.

ruking1

According to a former Obamanite, you'll never guess the biggest producer of N0x is? http://blogs.wsj.com/experts/2016/10/16/how-agriculture-can-reduce-greenhouse-gas-emissions/

Keep in mind there are app 60 M of the B's & 150 M of the P's in the USA.

5.7 L= 343 cu in.

3.0 L = (the old school measurement of app) 183 cu in.

Funny how Toyota ( so does any other engine maker) has to make the engine 90% larger & with far less torque & FAR worse mpg!

fintail

Maybe MB can take over the diesel reins, indeed. It has the bank accound, and is also investing heavily in EVs and related material, to soothe the greenie conscience.

The ag article is interesting. Makes one wonder how logical people can feel guilty about their modern ICE vehicle (or feel better about an EV/hybrid).

texases

Only about 20% of US GHG emissions are from cars/light trucks. You could shut all US cars/light trucks off, wouldn't make a major dent in world GHG emissions. But they're an easy target...

ruking1

texases said:

Only about 20% of US GHG emissions are from cars/light trucks. You could shut all US cars/light trucks off, wouldn't make a major dent in world GHG emissions. But they're an easy target...

The EPA. gov site did us a serious disservice by NOT breaking down the cars & light trucks portion ((US PVF) . But by inference it's like 13% or LESS! So defacto @ 3 to 5% TDI less than .65%., half of that being passenger CARS, less than .325%

Telling is the following ..."Relatively low amounts of ... nitrous oxide are emitted during fuel combustion"...

"Miniscule" is a gross overstatement!

https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/sources-greenhouse-gas-emissions

You can't even make this stuff up!! (like I've been saying all along)

ruking1

It appears the Keystone cops (lawyers) working for the NY Attorney General are on the Exxon case! (climate change) http://www.wsj.com/articles/how-the-exxon-case-unraveled-1472598472

Diesel-gate news!

VW A e-mailed/acknowledged receipt of the (my) complete required documentation . Words to the effect, the claim is in evaluation.

The 2009 VW Jetta TDI died while in operation. VW road assist towed it to the dealer. It was a faulty relay in steering wheel area. It is not a diesel issue.

ruking1

In other news... SOS/DD trek to South Lake Tahoe, CA. So if you "have to retire in CA.... Of course, Gagrice lives in # 7. http://www.businessadvicesource.com/10-best-places-california-retirees/5/

http://www.greatplacestoretire.com/south-lake-tahoe.php

This article makes me wonder how many & %' in this US group (70M 1/5= 20%) will be buying new 2017 cars? http://finance.yahoo.com/news/social-security-recipients-tiny-increase-benefits-070940393--finance.html After all, under BHO, the raise is .3 % ! For the average payment of $1238. they say it's four dollars per month, for $48 a year !

So ( hi ho, hi ho, it's off to work we go) despite the long hours, it's a blast being part of the Silicon Valley's goings on! (madness in comparison to retirement) Stuff like: a cure for Hep C, Apple Computers, too many start ups to mention. etc, etc.

gagrice

Ruking: So if you "have to retire in CA.... Of course, Gagrice lives in # 7.

I would say the definitive word is HAVE to retire in CA. I could not recommend any city on that list for a retired couple with less than $100k a year guaranteed income. Several of them you need to be closer to $200k per year.
I was through 6 of them in the last 2 months, one I did not realize existed, Rio Vista. I must have blinked driving on 12 from Napa to I5. I do love Lake Tahoe. For tax purposes I would make sure I bought on the NV side of the lake. Whoever wrote that has never been to Eureka, CA. That has to be the armpit of the CA coast. That said my increase in SS will not come close to covering the $550 my Property taxes increased this year. I am wondering if you have to have a permanent residence in any place? A diesel Sprinter motorhome is looking better all the time. Or maybe buy a chassis and build my own.