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  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,419
    Your memory would live on forever B)

    fintail said:

    Be like Clint Eastwood and give the neat old car to the neighbor kid.

    The 25 yo kid at work says he wants my Mustang after I'm done with it. I might just will it to him since my kids are afraid of it.
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 14,121
    Thanks for the article @driver100

    I concur...who didn’t predict that. Wonder what the whole NYC move and move back cost the brand? I thought it was a silly move to begin with.

    One would think that with all the marketing, engineering and 116 year history behind it, they’d be able to figure out what to do. From where I sit, the product is good. The execution is dismal.

    Simple questions they need to ask themselves....

    -What does a buyer of $$40K and above vehicles expect?
    -What do luxury buyers want in their vehicles and their experience?
    -How do you relate to those who do buy your vehicles?

    Start there, and build on those answers.

    But, what do I know? I was a customer (a lost customer). But, I also have decades of tech experience, mostly in marketing. I have my people ask similar questions about products, old and new, all the time.
    2024 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD Long Range
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676
    fintail said:

    Another of smug one trick pony DeNysschen's brilliant moves isn't panning out? Color me shocked.

    Don't I recall your commenting to the effect that it was the wrong move from DeNysschen at the time it happened!


    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676
    edited September 2018
    bwia said:

    Thank goodness Cadillac has come to its senses. Now, only if they could make a genuine luxury vehicle that might turn the brand around. 

    So the DT6 and other Cadillacs aren't genuine?

    Or it more going on old impressions without people actually experiencing the vehicles. Just going on what other "experts" say?

    How many here have test driven a Cadillac? I recall @abacomike did drive one. I suspect that people judge by their favorite image of a luxury vehicle and always can find a reason not to consider a different one as up-to-par in my mind: it doesn't have a cup holder in the console or it doesn't have the certain feature here or there. I've sprinkled pickle juice around occasionally because a few are prejudge.

    Amazingly, using numbers of visits to a service department at 134% of the average of vehicles, likely means 3 instead of 2 visits as for another popular brand considered in the "perfect" vehicle virtual image. In my earlier tweaking message on the point someone said, that it really comes down to dealer service for many of us.

    I might have a Cadillac were I closer to a Cadillac store. I'm close to Chevy, Frod, Toyota, Hyundai.
    I'll probably shop Hyundai (Kia) to see if they have the safety nannies I want in my next car available WITH a normal engine without having to buy a premium, high-powered engine. I have lane wander warnings, rear side traffic warning for on the road and in backup mode, and collision alert with brake prep but no auto braking. I want the automatic high speed braking on my next vehicle.




    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,357
    The big caddies seem like classic luxury cars to me, in the American style. The small ones, not the same, but I wouldn’t consider a 3 series a luxury car either. So an ATS and CTS are premium brand cars I guess, at least comparable to Infiniti and Acura (and low line MB and BMW).

    I would never look at a luxury caddy though. Not because of brand name, just too big and too expensive! I could see an ATS though.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,419
    Now that they've undone this, time to undo some of the fakey Germanic alphanumerics. I can see them for the CUVs/SUVs, but I think Cadillac cars should have names. A Fleetwood sounds cooler than a CT6.

    Not a fan of DeNysschen's schtick. He made the same moves at Infiniti.

    Regarding test drives, I haven't, but I rode with a friend on a CT6 test drive. Seriously nice car. Too bad the dealer experience put him off, especially when it came time to talk numbers - he ended up buying (yes, not leasing) a Lincoln. He still likes the CT6 though, and he's in the early 40s professional demographic the brand should target.



    Don't I recall your commenting to the effect that it was the wrong move from DeNysschen at the time it happened!


  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,287


    So the DT6 and other Cadillacs aren't genuine?

    Or it more going on old impressions without people actually experiencing the vehicles. Just going on what other "experts" say?

    How many here have test driven a Cadillac? I recall @abacomike did drive one. I suspect that people judge by their favorite image of a luxury vehicle and always can find a reason not to consider a different one as up-to-par in my mind: it doesn't have a cup holder in the console or it doesn't have the certain feature here or there. I've sprinkled pickle juice around occasionally because a few are prejudge.


    Nothing you can do about those attitudes which you have quite correctly noted. They are an easy target to slag, especially here where one poster had a curiously bad experience that seems rather unique. Same with the comments from many here and elsewhere about the naming convention for their models. It seems it is fine for Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Infiniti and several other brands to use such nomenclature but with Cadillac the armchair experts want them to go back to names from the 1950s. Of course when that failed as it undoubtedly would those same "experts" would be decrying how they remained stuck in the past..

    As for the NYC move, if Detroit was such a great place to run a brand from it is curious why those companies that Cadillac sees as their direct competitors do not have their HQ offices there (except the struggling Lincoln). I imagine a Detroit location is not a positive for attracting top talent.

    2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,419
    Regarding names, it's the appearance of following someone else's trend. The Germans have used alphanumerics since before WW2. I can't recall a named MB at any time since the original merger. When someone does it to compete with that trio, IMO it makes them look like a follower or maybe kind of trying too hard. The old names might be passing from old back into somewhat cool, via being different, if anything else.

    If NYC is a great place to run a brand, it's funny that no other major automakers (that I recall) are based there. Many seem to be based in closer to factories and/or maybe in low cost/low amenity areas where they get tax bribes. Goofy moves by DeNysschen, not a fan of some of his ideas or his arrogant thin-skinned rep (not to mention just repeating a similar formula for Caddy as he used at Infiniti, with so-far both less than awesome results), but it might match his background.
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,287
    fintail said:


    If NYC is a great place to run a brand, it's funny that no other major automakers (that I recall) are based there. Many seem to be based in closer to factories and/or maybe in low cost/low amenity areas where they get tax bribes.

    Prior to their establishment of USA assembly plants, most Euro brands were headquartered in and around the NYC area.

    2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,357
    Volvo, VW, Mercedes, Porsche/Audi and BMW were all in the jersey burbs north of the city. Some still are I think. In college, I had a summer job at BMW parts depot, and shifty worked at MB HQ. that was right next to BMW HQ.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • abacomikeabacomike Member Posts: 12,388
    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today. A great day indeed.

    2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger

  • abacomikeabacomike Member Posts: 12,388
    That’s terrific good news, FF.  We both have faced the end process of life and have survived.  Good to hear you are cured! ;)

    2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,419
    Which is the closest world city to Europe?

    No reason for any automaker to base there in 2018. And now Caddy is gone too.
    ab348 said:



    Prior to their establishment of USA assembly plants, most Euro brands were headquartered in and around the NYC area.

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,419
    Awesome. Hope you keep going like that.

    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today.

    A great day indeed.

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481


    Michaell said:

    We've had our Mustang for 27 years. Problem is we have 2 kids and only 1 Mustang.
    It would be hard to sell. Best solution I have come up with for now is if one of wants to buy it, they other one gets the money.

    And if they both want it?

    Flip a coin? Rock-paper-scissors? Cage match?

    That was the problem with the truck. Both my son and my sister's oldest son wanted it.

    You could cut it in half.

    How biblical! You could start up the Saw-zall and raise it above the car. Then one kid intervenes and says "No, father, spare the car and give it to my sibling!". Then you declare that "this one is the true owner".

    Actually, that probably wouldn't go over well in real life.... :p
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    fintail said:

    Now that they've undone this, time to undo some of the fakey Germanic alphanumerics. I can see them for the CUVs/SUVs, but I think Cadillac cars should have names. A Fleetwood sounds cooler than a CT6.

    Not a fan of DeNysschen's schtick. He made the same moves at Infiniti.

    Regarding test drives, I haven't, but I rode with a friend on a CT6 test drive. Seriously nice car. Too bad the dealer experience put him off, especially when it came time to talk numbers - he ended up buying (yes, not leasing) a Lincoln. He still likes the CT6 though, and he's in the early 40s professional demographic the brand should target.




    Don't I recall your commenting to the effect that it was the wrong move from DeNysschen at the time it happened!


    Agreed---for a brand already struggling with an identity crisis, their model nomenclature is baffling. It's possibly that the name "Cadillac" is just too burdened. It doesn't mean anything to the modern buyer.
  • carnaughtcarnaught Member Posts: 3,576
    To my son Cadillac” connotes old, stodgy, I would never have one, mentality.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well let's do the math about Cadillac.

    1. The worst year for Cadillac's reputation: = 1980-81

    2. When most people eligible to buy and drive a car in 1980 were born: = 1962

    3. The average longevity of a person born in 1962 = about 80 years, give or take.

    4. The year when no one will be alive to tell anyone else how bad Cadillac once was: = 2042


    So, yeah, another 20 years or so before Cadillac gets back on its feet. :p
  • suydamsuydam Member Posts: 5,070

    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today.

    A great day indeed.

    That is very great news indeed!
    '24 Kia Sportage PHEV
    '24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676

    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today.

    A great day indeed.

    Great news!

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,593

    fintail said:

    Another of smug one trick pony DeNysschen's brilliant moves isn't panning out? Color me shocked.

    Don't I recall your commenting to the effect that it was the wrong move from DeNysschen at the time it happened!


    I think we all, or almost all agreed it wouldn't accomplish anything. Get inspiration from being located in New York City.....how does that work? Only purpose is to take clients out to some nice restaurants and put it on the expense account, and get to be in New York, at company expense.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • sdasda Member Posts: 7,582
    suydam said:
    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today. A great day indeed.
    That is very great news indeed!
    Wonderful, great news!

    2021 VW Arteon SEL 4-motion, 2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,593

    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today.

    A great day indeed.

    Congratulations and continued success.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,593
    RE: Giving Cadillac a fair chance.
    One of Driver's Important Rules in Life is if it ain't broke, don't fix it. If someone calls and offers a 10% discount on my car insurance I say, I am happy with my current supplier, if I become unhappy, I will give you a call.

    Same with cars. I have had only excellent pleasing results with my BMW and Mercedes cars, even the Audi was a great car to drive........why would I ever switch? I would be thinking the grass is greener....and it usually isn't. Cadillac probably makes a great car, I have been in them and like them, but, I don't want to take an unnecessary risk, especially when spending big bucks!

    Names seem to be follow the leader. That is another problem, Cadillac is trying to emulate the experience a BMW or Mercedes owner wants........usually the original is the one that has the superior product....the others are wannabes trying to catch up - in most cases. The only way to do it is on price point, and they don't want to do that or they can't do it.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191

    Well let's do the math about Cadillac.

    1. The worst year for Cadillac's reputation: = 1980-81

    2. When most people eligible to buy and drive a car in 1980 were born: = 1962

    3. The average longevity of a person born in 1962 = about 80 years, give or take.

    4. The year when no one will be alive to tell anyone else how bad Cadillac once was: = 2042


    So, yeah, another 20 years or so before Cadillac gets back on its feet. :p

    This assumes Years 1981 till say 2018 were great and all fantastic cars. They weren't. Cimarron 1982-1988, Catera 1997-2001 are prime examples.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    I'm surprised nobody mentioned SEC suing Tesla and Elon Musk. This is big deal. If this protracts, Tesla won't be able to acquire new capital on public markets and considering their cashburn rate and the convertible debt due, this could be a true disaster, all the way to BK. I'm sure they can find a way out, but reports are saying Musk actually scuttled a settlement last minute, which only confirms the man has major psychological issues.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Best possible results would be a big fat fine, quickly settled, and him still being allowed to run a publicly owned company, Musk gets on with life. Worse case, criminal charges, him kicked out as CEO--then I think the whole thing collapses.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676
    This is our $4,900,000 in tax dollars at work.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Member Posts: 9,331

    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today.

    A great day indeed.

    That is very good news. But how are you going to celebrate your new-found health? I have a suggestion that I am sure you won't object to, get a new car. When I retired in early 2015, I decided to get myself a retirement present. After all if Mrs. j could celebrate my retirement by going on a cruise (with me of course) I could buy a car and I did. That's how I came by the '15 Genny. Just be sure that the car you get is a car worth keeping so you can pass it on to Sam when he is ready to drive. Let him know early on that the car will be his one day so he'll gladly help you take care of it. Start him off at about 4 or 5 washing it then when he gets good at that in a couple years let him start waxing it. By the time he's driving, that car will have the nicest shine in the neighborhood. You'll never be sorry that you gave him car responsibility at an early age. It's all in your hands now.

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis Ultimate just like jmonroe's.
    '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • 28firefighter28firefighter Member Posts: 9,827
    Haha! I leased the Stelvio about a month ago now and I still have the Saab Viggen. The Viggen is only temporary as my Dad is planning to hand down his Porsche 968 at some point in the future, and that will be a forever car that I will hold onto for Sam.

    For what it's worth, I was washing cars with my Dad starting when I was 4 or 5 years old. It was a weekend ritual for us to wash the family cars, make runs to the auto parts store, etc. Even now when I go home, it is something we make time for.
    2025 Jetta GLI Autobahn, 2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4xE
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,723
    edited September 2018
    @28ff,
    Great news that you are off medication, means you're healthy.
    If you are like me, just not taking any medication is its' own reward.
    We have to save some for Abacomike. :)

    So you are driving the Viggen as a backup to the Stelvio?
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Member Posts: 9,331
    dino001 said:

    I'm surprised nobody mentioned SEC suing Tesla and Elon Musk. This is big deal. If this protracts, Tesla won't be able to acquire new capital on public markets and considering their cashburn rate and the convertible debt due, this could be a true disaster, all the way to BK. I'm sure they can find a way out, but reports are saying Musk actually scuttled a settlement last minute, which only confirms the man has major psychological issues.

    Surprising that you mention Tesla. I went out to lunch today with a group of about 15 guys I worked with who are also retired. One guy has a year old Tesla S, nice looking Burgundy color too. :@ I asked him how he liked it and he said he's had a few problems with it like power windows (twice) and locks, tires and something else I can't remember. I asked him if he'd get another one and without wavering he said, HELL NO. He was in a hurry so he couldn't take me for a ride but said, "next time we get together I'll take you for a ride, IF I still have it". Nice looking car in that color though. :@ :@

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis Ultimate just like jmonroe's.
    '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,723
    Bears in the back yard annoy me.

    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Member Posts: 9,331
    There went your weekend cook-out. :'(

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis Ultimate just like jmonroe's.
    '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,723
    @jmonroe1,
    Bad thing is, I need to mow the lawn tomorrow or Sunday and will have to look out for bear poop. :(
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Member Posts: 9,331

    @jmonroe1,
    Bad thing is, I need to mow the lawn tomorrow or Sunday and will have to look out for bear poop. :(

    So, I guess when someone says to you, "does a bear poop in the woods"? You can say, "and in my backyard too". To be honest, I'd be more concerned about the bear coming back than what it left behind.

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis Ultimate just like jmonroe's.
    '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,593
    Big Bear Stew:
    In a large mixing bowl combine flour, oregano, salt and pepper. Place bear meat in the bowl a little at a time and coat well.
    Heat oil and butter in a large skillet. Fry the bear meat until browned. Let drain on paper towels.
    Fill a large Dutch oven with 2 to 3 quarts water. Add bear meat, onions, beef broth, bay leaves, potatoes, mushrooms carrots and turnips. Cook on medium-high heat for 2 to 3 hours. Add more water as needed.

    Nutrition Facts
    Per Serving: 585 calories; 28.1 g fat; 30.9 g carbohydrates; 51.2 g protein; 0 mg cholesterol; 618 mg sodium.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • 28firefighter28firefighter Member Posts: 9,827
    edited September 2018
    @28ff, Great news that you are off medication, means you're healthy. If you are like me, just not taking any medication is its' own reward. We have to save some for Abacomike. :) So you are driving the Viggen as a backup to the Stelvio?
    Yep about the Viggen. A weekend cruiser and periodic daily driver.

     I do still have medication I’m on for my Crohn’s disease, but I’ve been on it for over a decade and it works just fine with no side effects, so no huge burden. 
    2025 Jetta GLI Autobahn, 2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4xE
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,723
    @jomonroe1,
    Better that bear than this one.

    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Member Posts: 9,331
    WHOA, cleaning up after that one with give you back problems. :'(

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis Ultimate just like jmonroe's.
    '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • jwm40517jwm40517 Member Posts: 303
    Our daughter just got back from a trip to Montana & Canada with lots of pictures and videos. One video was of a bear in the woods and the caption was " I guess that answers the question" .
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    edited September 2018
    Most of you will remember that I was pretty sick last summer and nearly died in the ICU at UW. Happy to report that as of today I have been deemed officially cured. I'm able to stop all my medications today. A great day indeed.
    Great news indeed.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    fintail said:
    Which is the closest world city to Europe? 
    Wouldn't that be Jerusalem?

    As for U.S. cities it would be Boston.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676
    edited September 2018
    jmonroe1 said:

    So, I guess when someone says to you, "does a bear poop in the woods"? You can say, "and in my backyard too". To be honest, I'd be more concerned about the bear coming back than what it left behind. jmonroe

    A haunting question bears on my mind: if a bear attacks @jmonroe or @jmonroe1 while he's mowing a yard, is that counted as 1 or 2 people that the bear attacked?

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    carnaught said:
    To my son Cadillac” connotes old, stodgy, I would never have one, mentality.
    Funny you should say that as yesterday I got stuck behind a cliche, an old man with a white (or any other very light colored) baseball cap) driving an old boat of a Cadillac who slowly creeped up to 5 or so under the speed limit and cruised at that speed. 

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676
    edited September 2018
    Amazingly, I've seen that same stereotype here. AND not only Cadillacs and Buicks, but Camrys, Hondas, and MBs. A CRv or Rav4 are most likely now to be driven, in this area, by older folks who seem lacking in some faculties. They bought those as a replacement for their Buicks.

    I saw a Prius poking at 45 on 3-lane I70 which is 70 mph with heavy truck traffic at 70 and up and vehicular traffic at 75-80. Yes it was 40 or 45. I was stunned.

    So I guess I should point out for a while a lot of Buicks got traded for Piouses Priuses. Now it's CRvs and Rav4s.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    dino001 said:
    I'm surprised nobody mentioned SEC suing Tesla and Elon Musk. This is big deal. If this protracts, Tesla won't be able to acquire new capital on public markets and considering their cashburn rate and the convertible debt due, this could be a true disaster, all the way to BK. I'm sure they can find a way out, but reports are saying Musk actually scuttled a settlement last minute, which only confirms the man has major psychological issues.
    Could it also mean that the SEC's case isn't as strong as it appears, or it's falling apart?

    Can't say one way or the other as I am not following it, just presenting another reason why he scuttled the agreement.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676
    Facebook has been breached--50 million accounts at risk.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    @jomonroe1, Better that bear than this one.
    I used to live in Kodiak Alaska, you should have seen the bears we had up there.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

This discussion has been closed.