Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

It was interesting.....is this going to be your next career move?
It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

Is that legal in FL? Can't get away with that in NJ. Not only do you need a dealer's licence, but you are required to have a commercial space with proper signage and office hours. Plus a bunch of other rules. Makes it quite expensive to be an actual legal dealer here.

I assume he at least has a dealer’s license as that’s usually required to get into those auctions.

oldfarmer50

How many of us suffer from this problem?

https://youtu.be/HdgVcGjzgR4

snakeweasel

jmonroe1 said:

andres3 said:

berri said:

Spring break is a tough call for places like Florida. Residents get sick of the rowdiness, but the students bring a lot of money into the economy helping to hold down taxes.

The only places that benefit from spring breakers’ money are the public beach areas along the east coast and the panhandle coast.  But the increased costs of law enforcement negative a lot of that.

Isn't law enforcement a sunk cost? Or is someone trigger-happy on approving overtime.

it's partially a sunk cost. The level of law enforcement goes up greatly during spring break. The normal manpower requirements of the area would be overwhelmed during spring break meaning you would have to have a stronger presence meaning more overtime.

I have to think that by now these popular spring break towns should pretty much know what their police costs are going to be. I know that means these places have to think ahead but complaining every year pretty much points to their incompetence. jmonroe

Here is the point, a relatively quite town doesn't need the same level of police protection every day of the year. It ebbs and  flows. Its cheaper to pay a lot of overtime for two weeks a year than to maintain a force large enough to handle spring break for the other 50 weeks.

ab348

driver100 said:

It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

If you watch the entire video he talks about how cars there require an inspection to be licensed as well. He also says he has two different operations, one for more expensive non-hooptie cars, and one for the inexpensive/as-is market. He would definitely have a dealer license.

Mr_Shiftright

Seems like buying "red light" cars at auction is rather risky. As someone once said: "Every car at an auction is an abandoned car".

imidazol97

snakeweasel said:

jmonroe1 said:

abacomike said:

The Spring Break onslaught of families, college and high school kids and tourists has caused untold havoc on South Beach this year.  It’s so bad, the Miami Beach City Council is considering several measures to stop the public displays of pot smoking and drug sales, fighting, destruction of private and public property, public sexual activity and sales of liquor to minors.

Luckily, higher powers are at play throughout South Florida thanks to a large low pressure system causing gale force winds an 5-7 inches of rain over the next several days.  This should cool off things for a while as the Miami Beach Coty Council considers plans to eliminate this problem.

Hey Mike, let me put in a request on behalf of this site.

Before the kids get their clothes back on and/or the cops put an end to the public display you mentioned, get down there with a fully charged phone and get back to us with some pics, OK? We'll decide how much of a display it really is.

jmonroe

Well here is a picture of a college coed dancing around at spring break with abosluty nothing on at all.




How are you sure that is a coed?

stickguy

He talks about that shifty. Paying $300 for a pig in a poke, if you get burned, part it out, junk the rest, and write off the loss. Very little exposure. The real risk is to dump money into one trying to fix it!

Mr_Shiftright

Oh, well......

tjc78

Happens more than you realize.  

There arw some retailers with pull up parking that deal with this at one of their locations weekly. 

One company actually patented a type of bollard designed to prevent this and absorb much of the impact.  

stickguy

Wawa has such big concrete pillars in the parking spots I get nervous I might bump one. Might not get a Sherman tank through those babies.

Mr_Shiftright

Grandma is on the hot seat it seems.

oldfarmer50

Mr_Shiftright said:

Seems like buying "red light" cars at auction is rather risky. As someone once said: "Every car at an auction is an abandoned car".

The only place that would work is where the state allows “as is” sales. Most state require a dealer to give some sort of warranty. I suppose you could curbstone the real clunkers but that would be illegal here in NY.

jmonroe1

snakeweasel said:

jmonroe1 said:

I bet you Rolls Royce would build you a prescription windshield

Of course, nobody else could drive your car, and people looking into it would find your face kinda funny.

Interesting, how long do you think it will take for Rolls to offer that as an option?

jmonroe

It looks as if Lexus beat them to it.

https://www.core77.com/posts/76125/Lexus-Unveils-Prescription-Windshields-and-DNA-Based-Ignition

Check the date of the posting.

I was finally able to open the link. There ain't no way I'm going to lick my steering wheel to start my car. What happens when you want your car parked by the valet? Nah, I ain't licking on top of his spit. Forget that option. Who thinks of this stuff anyway. This might be a hoax altogether. :@

jmonroe

stickguy

you seemed to have missed the instruction to look at the date of the post.

jmonroe1

snakeweasel said:

jmonroe1 said:

snakeweasel said:

andres3 said:

abacomike said:

berri said:

Spring break is a tough call for places like Florida. Residents get sick of the rowdiness, but the students bring a lot of money into the economy helping to hold down taxes.

The only places that benefit from spring breakers’ money are the public beach areas along the east coast and the panhandle coast.  But the increased costs of law enforcement negative a lot of that.

Isn't law enforcement a sunk cost? Or is someone trigger-happy on approving overtime.

it's partially a sunk cost. The level of law enforcement goes up greatly during spring break. The normal manpower requirements of the area would be overwhelmed during spring break meaning you would have to have a stronger presence meaning more overtime.

I have to think that by now these popular spring break towns should pretty much know what their police costs are going to be. I know that means these places have to think ahead but complaining every year pretty much points to their incompetence.

jmonroe

Here is the point, a relatively quite town doesn't need the same level of police protection every day of the year. It ebbs and  flows. Its cheaper to pay a lot of overtime for two weeks a year than to maintain a force large enough to handle spring break for the other 50 weeks.

Like I said, if they are aware of the need for extra police during spring break, they should have that in their budget. The rest of the year they operate as usual. This ain't rocket surgery but for some areas it might be.

jmonroe

jmonroe1

imidazol97 said:

snakeweasel said:

jmonroe1 said:

abacomike said:

The Spring Break onslaught of families, college and high school kids and tourists has caused untold havoc on South Beach this year.  It’s so bad, the Miami Beach City Council is considering several measures to stop the public displays of pot smoking and drug sales, fighting, destruction of private and public property, public sexual activity and sales of liquor to minors.

Luckily, higher powers are at play throughout South Florida thanks to a large low pressure system causing gale force winds an 5-7 inches of rain over the next several days.  This should cool off things for a while as the Miami Beach Coty Council considers plans to eliminate this problem.

Hey Mike, let me put in a request on behalf of this site.

Before the kids get their clothes back on and/or the cops put an end to the public display you mentioned, get down there with a fully charged phone and get back to us with some pics, OK? We'll decide how much of a display it really is.

jmonroe

Well here is a picture of a college coed dancing around at spring break with abosluty nothing on at all.

How are you sure that is a coed?

Count the ribs?

jmonroe

jmonroe1

stickguy said:

you seemed to have missed the instruction to look at the date of the post.

I saw it. A stupid idea is a stupid idea whenever it's proposed.

jmonroe

houdini2

oldfarmer50 said:

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

It was interesting.....is this going to be your next career move?
It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

Is that legal in FL? Can't get away with that in NJ. Not only do you need a dealer's licence, but you are required to have a commercial space with proper signage and office hours. Plus a bunch of other rules. Makes it quite expensive to be an actual legal dealer here.

I assume he at least has a dealer’s license as that’s usually required to get into those auctions.

If you have a friend in the car biz, he can get you into the auctions.

driver100

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

It was interesting.....is this going to be your next career move?
It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

Is that legal in FL? Can't get away with that in NJ. Not only do you need a dealer's licence, but you are required to have a commercial space with proper signage and office hours. Plus a bunch of other rules. Makes it quite expensive to be an actual legal dealer here.

I think almost anything in that way is legal in Florida. People set up fruit stands anywhere, or sell lobsters from a parked pick-up. I saw a guy by the side of the road who had a little table and was selling "make headlights clear - get the yellow out of your headlights" (don't know if he was offering franchises).

I think they get away with it because they are probably on someone's private property, and the police don't want to be bothered. It is like selling a car on CL from your driveway.

driver100

stickguy said:

Driver, to do what that guy is doing you need a real lot, with a garage and detail bay. But don’t need anything elaborate really. Also have to deal in volume to really make money. That and have the dealer license so you can buy at the auctions!

Stick, you probably do, but, a lot of curbsiders go to the auction and sell cars as if they are private sales. The guy shown has a real business and he is dealing in cars at various levels, but, some guys show up on the judges show.....usually they have a story about how they are selling their mothers car and it was fine when they sold it, but the engine fell out when the buyer was driving home.

driver100

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

If you watch the entire video he talks about how cars there require an inspection to be licensed as well. He also says he has two different operations, one for more expensive non-hooptie cars, and one for the inexpensive/as-is market. He would definitely have a dealer license.

If I was buying a car "as is", I would either want a real mechanic to examine it, or I would have to be an excellent mechanic myself. If someone is selling a car "as is" obviously they don't believe in it. He buys these cars and he doesn't even know if they will start let alone what needs to be done. Not saying it can't be done, I think it can, just that you really have to know what you are doing. And, buying a car "as is" is a huge risk.

driver100

imidazol97 said:

snakeweasel said:

jmonroe1 said:

abacomike said:

The Spring Break onslaught of families, college and high school kids and tourists has caused untold havoc on South Beach this year.  It’s so bad, the Miami Beach City Council is considering several measures to stop the public displays of pot smoking and drug sales, fighting, destruction of private and public property, public sexual activity and sales of liquor to minors.

Luckily, higher powers are at play throughout South Florida thanks to a large low pressure system causing gale force winds an 5-7 inches of rain over the next several days.  This should cool off things for a while as the Miami Beach Coty Council considers plans to eliminate this problem.

Hey Mike, let me put in a request on behalf of this site.

Before the kids get their clothes back on and/or the cops put an end to the public display you mentioned, get down there with a fully charged phone and get back to us with some pics, OK? We'll decide how much of a display it really is.

jmonroe

Well here is a picture of a college coed dancing around at spring break with abosluty nothing on at all.

How are you sure that is a coed?

Guys wouldn't do that dance step.

berri

Heck, I've seen more than a few articles or news clips revealing dealers doing very little, but still tagging the car a "certified" used car. Same with buyers of dealer certified used cars incurring major issues on the vehicle not all that long after purchase. I think it is smart to have a good mechanic go over any used vehicle even if it is "certified".

ruking1

Passenger trains ? Everything old is new again ! https://youtu.be/o8ggBZg7llY

oldfarmer50

houdini2 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

It was interesting.....is this going to be your next career move?
It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

Is that legal in FL? Can't get away with that in NJ. Not only do you need a dealer's licence, but you are required to have a commercial space with proper signage and office hours. Plus a bunch of other rules. Makes it quite expensive to be an actual legal dealer here.

I assume he at least has a dealer’s license as that’s usually required to get into those auctions.

If you have a friend in the car biz, he can get you into the auctions.

Getting in is no problem. I just walked into Mannheim once. To bid you’d need someone with a license. Some with a license advertise on Craigslist to take you in and buy the car of your choice.

stickguy

Driver, it all comes down to price. Guys that do this all the time make judgments by how the car sounds, does it drive through, smoke, etc. And the price they pay reflects that they are taking a gamble. he paid $200-300 for some of those cars. That's the territory where you can turn a profit taking it to the wreaking yard!

Smart guy though, picking cars with current inspection stickers. NH is a state that actually does safety inspections, so it can't be too bad underneath. Plus, probably means he does not have to get it done!

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

If you watch the entire video he talks about how cars there require an inspection to be licensed as well. He also says he has two different operations, one for more expensive non-hooptie cars, and one for the inexpensive/as-is market. He would definitely have a dealer license.

If I was buying a car "as is", I would either want a real mechanic to examine it, or I would have to be an excellent mechanic myself. If someone is selling a car "as is" obviously they don't believe in it. He buys these cars and he doesn't even know if they will start let alone what needs to be done. Not saying it can't be done, I think it can, just that you really have to know what you are doing. And, buying a car "as is" is a huge risk.

But look at his market, people with a refund check burning a hole in their pockets. Those folks are unlikely to think that far ahead.

Personally, on a car that only costs a few thousand I trust my own judgement since the down side is limited. On a car $5k and up I would have a professional check it out.

The other day a young guy at work was telling me he bought an ex police car from a place he trusted. I don’t think he had a mechanic check it out. Next day the check engine light came on and he got a ‘reduced power’ icon. I had him bring it over to the house and we put the code reader on it. Luckily it turned out to be a throttle position sensor (less than $200), not something serious like a blown head gasket.

imidazol97

I passed Air Force One on I70 on the way home from feeding the cats at the son's apartment.

https://airforceone.com/who-we-are/

Michaell

imidazol97 said:

I passed Air Force One on I70 on the way home from feeding the cats at the son's apartment.

Exactly how fast is your car?

And, what was Air Force 1 doing on the interstate?

imidazol97

There was a long interview about Fisker coming out with a $30000 vehicle in a year or so on cable news recently.

Then today I see a headline that sick days were 3 times as great at the Tesla plant in 2018.

What's up there. Is Tesla 3 going to make it? Or will the competition kill it.

I see the occasional Testla 3 around the shopping center where we catch lunch. There's an unusual shape to them from some viewing angles, but it's not off putting. It's just unusual. It's like some of the older Golf's that I'd see until I sorted out the older ones and newer models. Something about the taillights from some angles.

Mr_Shiftright

The Tesla 3 is in a tough market--the fast disappearing sedan class. That's why they are humping the Model Y to get it out the door--but everyone else no doubt already have EV mid-size CUVs in the works. The Kona EV is already out and reviews are good.

driver100

stickguy said:

Driver, it all comes down to price. Guys that do this all the time make judgments by how the car sounds, does it drive through, smoke, etc. And the price they pay reflects that they are taking a gamble. he paid $200-300 for some of those cars. That's the territory where you can turn a profit taking it to the wreaking yard!

Smart guy though, picking cars with current inspection stickers. NH is a state that actually does safety inspections, so it can't be too bad underneath. Plus, probably means he does not have to get it done!

Stick...he seems pleasantly surprised when the cars start. Does that mean they don't actually get to inspect them before the auction......as in sit in it and start the engine? Can you look it over before bidding begins?

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

If you watch the entire video he talks about how cars there require an inspection to be licensed as well. He also says he has two different operations, one for more expensive non-hooptie cars, and one for the inexpensive/as-is market. He would definitely have a dealer license.

If I was buying a car "as is", I would either want a real mechanic to examine it, or I would have to be an excellent mechanic myself. If someone is selling a car "as is" obviously they don't believe in it. He buys these cars and he doesn't even know if they will start let alone what needs to be done. Not saying it can't be done, I think it can, just that you really have to know what you are doing. And, buying a car "as is" is a huge risk.

But look at his market, people with a refund check burning a hole in their pockets. Those folks are unlikely to think that far ahead.

Personally, on a car that only costs a few thousand I trust my own judgement since the down side is limited. On a car $5k and up I would have a professional check it out.

The other day a young guy at work was telling me he bought an ex police car from a place he trusted. I don’t think he had a mechanic check it out. Next day the check engine light came on and he got a ‘reduced power’ icon. I had him bring it over to the house and we put the code reader on it. Luckily it turned out to be a throttle position sensor (less than $200), not something serious like a blown head gasket.

OF, I can see a few decades ago where you could get under a car and fix most things yourself....well, not me but some people could. Some cars are probably like that, but with all the electronics, catalytic converters, turbos, and engines you shouldn't even be messing with is it a good idea to buy a car "as is" with 160k miles on it. And, it seems to me, in a lot of cases, the people who do buy these cars are the people who should not be buying these cars....they often know nothing about cars!

stickguy

they can check them out before the auction out in the lot. Then they drive through the lane so they know they start. Sounds like they leave the keys in them and sometimes it kills the battery.

stickguy

so, quick poll question for the experts. What are the best after market wiper blades? I probably should have just kept the original arms and kept getting refills for the RDX, but they were getting pretty beat up so a few years back I started putting new sets on. Current ones are old (and never worked all that great I don't think).

Any strong opinions out there?

ruking1

If the OE wiper blades lasted a long time, what factors made you switch to current set up? I just had the dealer after 4.5 years change the OE wiper blades set.

stickguy

I don't recall now. I switched to the frameless style that I liked on my other car. Might actually have the old frames still. But they were pretty faded and tired looking.

ruking1

Then I would suggest the frameless ones like you had for your other cars. Evidemtly you felt at the time that you were getting good service from them.

https://youtu.be/0JDoll8OEFE

Michaell

Hey folks!

I'm looking for a little help from you all.

I'm compiling information about doc fees, taxes and DMV costs for each state, to help with the advice I give folks who ask questions about leasing.

Since we have people scattered all about the country, I'd like to pick your brain about some of this.

What I'm looking for, specifically:

1. How are leases taxed? (monthly payment, the full selling price, or the sum of the payments collected up front)
2. Dealer doc fees? (what's typical, is it capped)
3. DMV fees? (how much, is there a formula, one year or multiple years)
4. Any other state specific information you think might help me

If you have information for multiple states, I'd very much appreciate it.

snakeweasel

jmonroe1 said:

stickguy said:

you seemed to have missed the instruction to look at the date of the post.

I saw it. A stupid idea is a stupid idea whenever it's proposed.

jmonroe

Even when it's proposed just in time for April fools day?

qbrozen

NJ:
6.625% taxed on the total of depreciation, rent charge, dealer and bank fees (not DMV), and rebates. Can be paid up front or rolled in. Luxury tax of 0.4% applies on vehicles sold for more than $45k. So basically sum of payments plus tax on incentives and down payment MINUS DMV.

DMV fees vary based on class. They now come with 3-yr or 4-yr tags paid up front. $59/yr for vehicles under 3500 lb and $84/yr for those over. 

Doc fee. No cap that I am aware of and definitely varies pretty widely. I have seen $199 to $699 personally. Definitely needs to be known ahead and taken into consideration.

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

It would be hard to do at home, cars would need a safety inspection probably.
I go by this spot on the highway on my way to tennis, and there are always 3 cars parked with a sign in the window. It is probably a guy like this.

If you watch the entire video he talks about how cars there require an inspection to be licensed as well. He also says he has two different operations, one for more expensive non-hooptie cars, and one for the inexpensive/as-is market. He would definitely have a dealer license.

If I was buying a car "as is", I would either want a real mechanic to examine it, or I would have to be an excellent mechanic myself. If someone is selling a car "as is" obviously they don't believe in it. He buys these cars and he doesn't even know if they will start let alone what needs to be done. Not saying it can't be done, I think it can, just that you really have to know what you are doing. And, buying a car "as is" is a huge risk.

But look at his market, people with a refund check burning a hole in their pockets. Those folks are unlikely to think that far ahead.

Personally, on a car that only costs a few thousand I trust my own judgement since the down side is limited. On a car $5k and up I would have a professional check it out.

The other day a young guy at work was telling me he bought an ex police car from a place he trusted. I don’t think he had a mechanic check it out. Next day the check engine light came on and he got a ‘reduced power’ icon. I had him bring it over to the house and we put the code reader on it. Luckily it turned out to be a throttle position sensor (less than $200), not something serious like a blown head gasket.

OF, I can see a few decades ago where you could get under a car and fix most things yourself....well, not me but some people could. Some cars are probably like that, but with all the electronics, catalytic converters, turbos, and engines you shouldn't even be messing with is it a good idea to buy a car "as is" with 160k miles on it. And, it seems to me, in a lot of cases, the people who do buy these cars are the people who should not be buying these cars....they often know nothing about cars!

Well, first of all I wouldn’t be buying a car with 160k miles under any circumstances. While I do agree that modern cars have a plethora of complex systems they also have sensors for each system to tell you if something is wrong. A cheap code reader can tell you if there is trouble with the systems. You can also “feel” a lot of problems during a test drive.

In the end though, buying a $1500 car is a crap shoot. I don’t know of any vehicle at that price that wouldn’t have SOMETHING wrong with it.

When I bought my cargo van for $1800 all I required was that it ran and drove. I knew the AC had a leak so it didn’t cool and the transmission felt glitchy. I gambled and got lucky that the tranny just needed a couple of electronic switches. I’m in the third year of ownership and it’s still running. It’s not perfect but it does what I need it to do.

oldfarmer50

Michaell said:

Hey folks!

I'm looking for a little help from you all.

I'm compiling information about doc fees, taxes and DMV costs for each state, to help with the advice I give folks who ask questions about leasing.

Since we have people scattered all about the country, I'd like to pick your brain about some of this.

What I'm looking for, specifically:

1. How are leases taxed? (monthly payment, the full selling price, or the sum of the payments collected up front)
2. Dealer doc fees? (what's typical, is it capped)
3. DMV fees? (how much, is there a formula, one year or multiple years)
4. Any other state specific information you think might help me

If you have information for multiple states, I'd very much appreciate it.

I think in NY sales tax is collected upfront on the total of lease payments. DMV fees are collected like with a purchase. (Two year registration, plates) on a purchase there’s a $50 title fee and I suspect you get nailed for that too. Doc is limited to $75.

NY has a more complicated lease system because years ago the lawyers started suing the car makers for accidents caused by leased cars. I wouldn’t lease in this state.

stickguy

No rules limiting doc fees in NJ and they have been going up lately. I’m seeing $399 as quite common now. A few years ago it was more like $199. Q certainly knew the tax rules (he should!) but it’s calculated up front, not applied to the payment so if you roll it in, you are paying interest on the tax. Other than that, a few junk fees ($1.5 per tire, stuff like that).

Sales tax is at state level, so doesn’t matter where you live, it’s the same rate.

dino001

Michaell said:

Hey folks!

I'm looking for a little help from you all.

I'm compiling information about doc fees, taxes and DMV costs for each state, to help with the advice I give folks who ask questions about leasing.

Since we have people scattered all about the country, I'd like to pick your brain about some of this.

What I'm looking for, specifically:

1. How are leases taxed? (monthly payment, the full selling price, or the sum of the payments collected up front)
2. Dealer doc fees? (what's typical, is it capped)
3. DMV fees? (how much, is there a formula, one year or multiple years)
4. Any other state specific information you think might help me

If you have information for multiple states, I'd very much appreciate it.

Florida, as you might have heard is a proverbial dealer fee paradise. No legal limits, no restrictions, charge whatever you want, how much you want, call it whatever you want, invent anything you want. One alleged legal requirement is you charge "the same amount to everybody" to avoid discriminatory charges and have to show that fee as a sticker on the car, so you see typically a small piece of paper attached near the main sticker stating the fee and its amount.

Since there are no limits, it's all up to dealer's management imagination, there are somewhat distinct tiers:

1. Japanese "Big Three" and "Korean Two" brand dealers - biggest fee pushers, currently exceeding total of $1000. BTW, that still does not include the supervalue Toyoguard packages (and similar mop&go) pushed on people.
2. Other brands - typically $500-$800.
3. "No fee" dealers - those take a point in their advertising that they don't charge "dealer fees". As you may imagine, their nominal prices are most likely higher. Hard to say who is actually cheaper and I'm sure that's they want to keep it this way.

I also saw some dealer (I believe it was Fitzgerald) having tiered fee depending on the price of a used car (stepping up with price of the vehicle), giving some "break" to cheap car buyers. I saw another dealer (Honda) having three separate positions listed and printed on their contract, something like $899 ("prep"), $99 (doc), $9.99 (don't remember, but lets call it f__ you, we just will add another 10 bucks, because we can).

That's on top of DMV registration fees, which are generally government pass-through from charges, but I don't know if there is a markup on them, too.

dino001

Here is another one. So 2 oil changes, roadside, rental car assistance (only in case of a breakdown), tire rotations, and paint sealant come in supervalue price at $699. What's worse they are actually part of a car sticker (installed at the port), so customer is made to think there is no opt-out (and there may not be, depending on how rigid the dealer is in final pricing).

stickguy

They are so cheap to only give you less than 1/2 tank of gas, and rub it in by putting on the sticker? At least they don’t charge $5/gal like hertz.

snakeweasel

dino001 said:
One alleged legal requirement is you charge "the same amount to everybody" to avoid discriminatory charges 

I have to call BS on that one. Why is it discrimination to charge different people different doc fees but not discrimination to charge different people different prices on the same car, or to discount certain things during negotiations?

graphicguy

oldfarmer50 said:

Interesting video on the low end car business:

https://youtu.be/41X3PCQ7TKk

OF...cool video. That business is kind of what I expected it to be.

Side note, last year, for a brief period of time, I was dating a lady whose “ex” owned a Buy Here/Pay Here lot. But, he was using it to launder money for some unsavory types, got caught and went to prison. She left him. Kind of weird, as she said she had no idea what he was doing. Hard to fathom someone being that naive.

graphicguy

@Michaell ...

Cincinnati area...some of the fees I’m unfamiliar with as I usually purchase.

DOC FEE....capped at $250. But, I don’t figure that into my deal. Sometimes the dealer will lower the negotiated price but still show the DOC FEE on paperwork. Sometimes, they just cross the DOC FEE out when final paperwork is done.

Lease tax I believe is the amount you pay monthly.....i.e. if you have a $200/mo lease payment, you’d pay an additional 6% or $12 in taxes every month.

License fees are fixed and set by the state.