Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

qbrozen

stickguy said:

To get you to call of course.

Try Holman in maple shade. I think they actually have some.

That's one of those who told me the advertised car was a customer order.

qbrozen

DROOL. A bit dear for that many miles, though.

stickguy

That is cool.

jmonroe1

qbrozen said:

I know this is under the “well, duh” headline, but I despise when dealers advertise cars they don’t have.

I reached out to several who are showing Broncos “in stock.” All were customer orders. So why the heck are you photographing and advertising customers’’ cars??

It could be that if you go look at it and fall in love with it and give the dealer an unbelievable price to take it off his lot, right now, he just might sell it to you. It wouldn’t be the first time a dealer took a deal on a car that was already sold and then sold it to the guy in front of him, right now, especially when he sees an open wallet.

All I can say is when @stickguy’s Maverick shows up he better be there when it rolls off the truck or we’ll be hearing a tale about that.

jmonroe

explorerx4

Most dealer websites are updated on a periodic basis, they are not real time.

qbrozen

explorerx4 said:

Most dealer websites are updated on a periodic basis, they are not real time.

Yes, but it is deceptive to even take pics of a car that was sold before it even hit the lot. I did come across one dealer site (Malouf Ford) where, although they listed a vehicle that wasn't theirs, they had the decency to state that up front.

This is what shows on a Mach E I found there:
Stock #: SOLD PEREZ
3FMTK1SS3MMA60106
DEALER ORDERED

andres3

Co-worker that was in a very bad crash and managed to survive went from CX-5 that got her injured to a Subaru Outback Wilderness that I think will fare far better for her in the event of a similar collision.

Nice looker too! It's the special blue Subaru color.

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

DROOL. A bit dear for that many miles, though.

He whose name can’t be mentioned has a Celica of that vintage. Give him a call. I bet he’d be cheaper.

jmonroe1

andres3 said:

Co-worker that was in a very bad crash and managed to survive went from CX-5 that got her injured to a Subaru Outback Wilderness that I think will fare far better for her in the event of a similar collision.

Nice looker too! It's the special blue Subaru color.

You didn’t provide any facts but maybe you should have taught her when to take her foot off the long pedal so that she could have better control of her car.

jmonroe

andres3

jmonroe1 said:

andres3 said:

Co-worker that was in a very bad crash and managed to survive went from CX-5 that got her injured to a Subaru Outback Wilderness that I think will fare far better for her in the event of a similar collision.

Nice looker too! It's the special blue Subaru color.

You didn’t provide any facts but maybe you should have taught her when to take her foot off the long pedal so that she could have better control of her car.

jmonroe

It's more of a rear-ended really hard while starting to turn type collision. Everyone needs eyes on the back of their head.

qbrozen

oldfarmer50 said:

qbrozen said:

DROOL. A bit dear for that many miles, though.

He whose name can’t be mentioned has a Celica of that vintage. Give him a call. I bet he’d be cheaper.

eh? Scotty? He sells cars? That would be the most annoying salesperson in the world.

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

oldfarmer50 said:

qbrozen said:

DROOL. A bit dear for that many miles, though.

He whose name can’t be mentioned has a Celica of that vintage. Give him a call. I bet he’d be cheaper.

eh? Scotty? He sells cars? That would be the most annoying salesperson in the world.

He might put your eye out waving his arms around. I think he paid $300 for his Celica. I bet if you offered him $23k he’d have a heart attack…so there’s that.

corvette

oldfarmer50 said:

I bet if you offered him $23k he’d have a heart attack…so there’s that.

*ponders*

qbrozen

@oldfarmer50 said:
He might put your eye out waving his arms around. I think he paid $300 for his Celica. I bet if you offered him $23k he’d have a heart attack…so there’s that.

As would I because I’m certain his is not a turbo alltrac

stickguy

but it is a manual!

qbrozen

I need some help. I feel like I know the answer but I just want to be SURE.
I buy an EV. At tax time, let’s say, after deductions, the feds say my taxes are $20k, but I have paid $22k through payroll deductions. So they owe me a $2k refund. How does the EV credit then work? Because my tax liability was well beyond 7500, I get a $9500 refund … right?? It is just that I have read things like “it doesn’t increase your refund,” but I don’t think that is what they mean.

stickguy

my first Maverick must have actually run down the production line. there is actually a window sticker produced for it now. So possible it does arrive before Christmas after all. Now just have to decide if I take it or not.

stickguy

qbrozen said:

I need some help. I feel like I know the answer but I just want to be SURE.

I buy an EV. At tax time, let’s say, after deductions, the feds say my taxes are $20k, but I have paid $22k through payroll deductions. So they owe me a $2k refund. How does the EV credit then work? Because my tax liability was well beyond 7500, I get a $9500 refund … right?? It is just that I have read things like “it doesn’t increase your refund,” but I don’t think that is what they mean.

it is a tax credit. meaning it just comes off the bottom line of taxes due. So by definition it has to change your refund. So I would agree with your analysis. Their language does not seem to make any sense.

one reason I like using the tax software. Just plug in the numbers when asked, and you get your bottom line answer. But even doing it by hand, there will be a line tied to a schedule for calculating your credit. Assuming you qualify it should carry over to the 1040 as a deduction.

Maybe Snake the accountant can explain what that line about your refund means.

sda

stickguy said:

my first Maverick must have actually run down the production line. there is actually a window sticker produced for it now. So possible it does arrive before Christmas after all. Now just have to decide if I take it or not.

Does the window sticker match what you selected? I find that exciting, waiting for the new baby.

qbrozen

Already over $10k, but DAYUMMM.
https://carsandbids.com/auctions/3L7qwn1o/1993-bmw-318i-touring

stickguy

sda said:

stickguy said:

my first Maverick must have actually run down the production line. there is actually a window sticker produced for it now. So possible it does arrive before Christmas after all. Now just have to decide if I take it or not.

Does the window sticker match what you selected? I find that exciting, waiting for the new baby.

yes, I checked. they got it right.

I really need to find one of these around here to take the wife to see.

jmonroe1

qbrozen said:

I need some help. I feel like I know the answer but I just want to be SURE.

I buy an EV. At tax time, let’s say, after deductions, the feds say my taxes are $20k, but I have paid $22k through payroll deductions. So they owe me a $2k refund. How does the EV credit then work? Because my tax liability was well beyond 7500, I get a $9500 refund … right?? It is just that I have read things like “it doesn’t increase your refund,” but I don’t think that is what they mean.

I think everyone knows my philosophy about taxes; if the numbers ain’t in your favor…cheat.

jmonroe

stickguy

that wagon is cool. I would worry a bit about having an oddball if you needed parts, at least any wagon specific stuff (no clue if all the normal mechanical stuff is the same as a US spec car).

here is a definitely cheaper, more mainstream E30. I like this, but has some normal needs so a bit of a project. Would not touch this if couldn't DIY everything. Would cost way too much to farm it all out I bet.

https://carsandbids.com/auctions/3LDpmdnR/1987-bmw-325e-sedan

carnaught

My son has a 2022 BMW 2-Series Grand Coupe being produced now. It is phytonic blue with oyster interior and it’s scheduled for the boat to come over within two weeks but who knows when he’ll get it. He will be saying goodbye to his A4 - he’s a chip off the old block.

BTW, I do not think that this should be counted as a punch as he lives on his own I think punches for us should only count if the family member lives in the same home.

benjaminh

@stickguy : You mentioned that you were interested in the new Civic Si, but as you may know it doesn't have a power seat....

"Driver's Seat with Manual Height Adjustment"

https://automobiles.honda.com/civic-si-sedan#

The Si does have a more powerful engine, limited-slip differential, better brakes and tires, upgraded suspension, Bose stereo, etc, but no power seat, and no heated seat either. The Si does have a moonroof though.

jmonroe1

benjaminh said:

@stickguy : You mentioned that you were interested in the new Civic Si, but as you may know it doesn't have a power seat....

"Driver's Seat with Manual Height Adjustment"

https://automobiles.honda.com/civic-si-sedan#

The Si does have a more powerful engine, limited-slip differential, better brakes and tires, upgraded suspension, Bose stereo, etc, but no power seat, and no heated seat either. The Si does have a moonroof though.

Not having electric seats would and has killed car purchases for me. Even when buying used cars. I have my standards going back to my used ‘75 Grand Prix bought in ‘77.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

I need some help. I feel like I know the answer but I just want to be SURE.

I buy an EV. At tax time, let’s say, after deductions, the feds say my taxes are $20k, but I have paid $22k through payroll deductions. So they owe me a $2k refund. How does the EV credit then work? Because my tax liability was well beyond 7500, I get a $9500 refund … right?? It is just that I have read things like “it doesn’t increase your refund,” but I don’t think that is what they mean.

I assume that a tax credit reduces taxes owed so if you owed $20k and got a $7500 credit you would only owe $12.5k regardless of other payments. You would then also calculate the $2 overpayment but one shouldn’t have anything to do with the other.

Where I get confused is what if you owe less than the $7500 credit. Do you have to carry any excess credit over until next year or do you get it as a refund?

corvette

oldfarmer50 said:

Where I get confused is what if you owe less than the $7500 credit. Do you have to carry any excess credit over until next year or do you get it as a refund?

That's where it gets confusing... Unless something changed with the new legislation, unlike some other types of credits, it's not a refundable credit (meaning it's refundable beyond your overall tax liability). So if your tax liability in 2020 was $0, and you purchased an electric car eligible for the full $7,500 credit, you would not get any refund, and it would not carry forward to the next year. If your tax liability was $1,000 that year, you'd only get a $1,000 credit against your tax liability.

kyfdx

qbrozen said:

I need some help. I feel like I know the answer but I just want to be SURE.

I buy an EV. At tax time, let’s say, after deductions, the feds say my taxes are $20k, but I have paid $22k through payroll deductions. So they owe me a $2k refund. How does the EV credit then work? Because my tax liability was well beyond 7500, I get a $9500 refund … right?? It is just that I have read things like “it doesn’t increase your refund,” but I don’t think that is what they mean.

$20000 tax liability
$7500 tax credit
$12500 net tax
$22000 withholding
$9500 refund.

The amount of your withholding has absolutely nothing to do with the tax credit being refundable. The only thing that matters is your tax liability being more than the credit.

kyfdx

Not eligible for a punch, as I'm no longer liable for the cost, but my son and his wife made a deal on a new 2021 Mazda CX-30, today!

It's kind of fun shopping, when you know you don't have to write the check.

Michaell

kyfdx said:

Not eligible for a punch, as I'm no longer liable for the cost, but my son and his wife made a deal on a new 2021 Mazda CX-30, today!

It's kind of fun shopping, when you know you don't have to write the check.

Congrats to them. Nice car!

stickguy

What KY said. I think the confusion was using the term "refund'. Normal people think of that as getting money back because you had too much withholding. To the IRS, that means getting back more than you actually owe in taxes.

stickguy

my daughter is home from Boston. Took the train down, we picked her up in Philly. Now I get to spend the next week with her trying to hustle our only car from us. Good luck with that! she was talking about wanting a new apartment next summer when her lease runs out. Something not quite so perfectly located, but also not nosebleed expensive. Ideally she wants something slightly more resedential, at least enough to have parking with it, so she can get a new car (now that she is starting her new job after Thanksgiving, with a good sized raise). So depending on how this goes, might be shopping next summer for her!

she doesn't need the car normally, but just likes having it for weekends and going home or any other quick trips. Her train home was typical of a trip for her. The Acela was taken out by a deer. Apparently it hit a deer on the tracks about 20 minutes outside of Boston, and somehow an antler broke the lead locomotive. Hard to believe but it happened. Thankfully the rear locomotive worked, so they had to back up to the previous station, and send out a new train to pick them all up. Surprised me that it only added about 1:30 to the trip. Probably still quicker than driving.

jmonroe1

stickguy said:

What KY said. I think the confusion was using the term "refund'. Normal people think of that as getting money back because you had too much withholding. To the IRS, that means getting back more than you actually owe in taxes.

The difference is the difference. As long as I get money back, I don’t care what you call it.

jmonroe

jmonroe1

stickguy said:

my daughter is home from Boston. Took the train down, we picked her up in Philly. Now I get to spend the next week with her trying to hustle our only car from us. Good luck with that! she was talking about wanting a new apartment next summer when her lease runs out. Something not quite so perfectly located, but also not nosebleed expensive. Ideally she wants something slightly more resedential, at least enough to have parking with it, so she can get a new car (now that she is starting her new job after Thanksgiving, with a good sized raise). So depending on how this goes, might be shopping next summer for her!

she doesn't need the car normally, but just likes having it for weekends and going home or any other quick trips. Her train home was typical of a trip for her. The Acela was taken out by a deer. Apparently it hit a deer on the tracks about 20 minutes outside of Boston, and somehow an antler broke the lead locomotive. Hard to believe but it happened. Thankfully the rear locomotive worked, so they had to back up to the previous station, and send out a new train to pick them all up. Surprised me that it only added about 1:30 to the trip. Probably still quicker than driving.

I never heard of a locomotive breaking even with a deer. Must be one of those made in China locomotives.

jmonroe

roadburner

jmonroe1 said:

benjaminh said:

@stickguy : You mentioned that you were interested in the new Civic Si, but as you may know it doesn't have a power seat....

"Driver's Seat with Manual Height Adjustment"

https://automobiles.honda.com/civic-si-sedan#

The Si does have a more powerful engine, limited-slip differential, better brakes and tires, upgraded suspension, Bose stereo, etc, but no power seat, and no heated seat either. The Si does have a moonroof though.

Not having electric seats would and has killed car purchases for me. Even when buying used cars. I have my standards going back to my used ‘75 Grand Prix bought in ‘77.

jmonroe

The only time I want power seats is when they offer more adjustments than the non-power seats.. Only the 2er and X1 have them in my garage.

stickguy

that is why I want them. I don't actually care on something like an Si, as long as I can get the seat adjusted the way I want it to be. the problem usually is that manual seats these days usually are too level without enough front cushion tilt. and if you raise the seat with the ratchet, it also pitches you forward (which I really don't understand why they do that).

benjaminh

Well, if you can wait several months the new Integra is sure to have power seats with three-level heating. Probably will cost about $3k more or so, but you also get the hatchback for that price.

stickguy

benjaminh said:

Well, if you can wait several months the new Integra is sure to have power seats with three-level heating. Probably will cost about $3k more or so, but you also get the hatchback for that price.

likely an easier sell to my wife too! My guess is the seats will be a lot more comfy. The last Si I test drove a couple of times, was a lot of fun but the seats were not comfortable for me. Tight bolster and hard cushion IIRC. one reason I did not get one (probably also decided it wasn't a good time to get a stick again either).

I'll ask Monday if they will take a deposit for one at Sticker even if not showing up for many months. Who knows, they just might! But probably not.

benjaminh

This person says that by April things should start getting better for chip supply/vehicle supply, and by July even better than that he predicts. By November of 2022 maybe more or less back to normal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsRoDkaFaWU

stickguy

actually, the Integra should be interesting case. It has been hammered on the internet forum comments and Youtube, but that seems to be overwhelmingly fanboys who likely were never buying one anyone. So is that a minority, and plenty of other people will judge it as a car, and not what they dreamed of the name being?

corvette

@stickguy - from my brief visit, parking in Boston is pretty terrible. I would not own a car there if I didn't have dedicated parking at my residence. You can get a street parking permit if you live there, but finding a space is another matter. It's a neat city, but definitely shows its roots as being built out before the automobile was commonplace.

nyccarguy

@stickguy said:
actually, the Integra should be interesting case. It has been hammered on the internet forum comments and Youtube, but that seems to be overwhelmingly fanboys who likely were never buying one anyone. So is that a minority, and plenty of other people will judge it as a car, and not what they dreamed of the name being?

I agree. The “base” Integra is going to be a tough sell. Not only will it compete with the Civic Si, WRX, & GTI for sales, but for a few thousand more there will be the Civic Type R. I’m sure Acura will come out with an Integra Type S too. The “base” Integra might become the red headed step child of the lineup and maybe the one that sits on dealer lots the longest once the original hype dies down and all the “1st in lines” are ready to trade theirs’ in.

Michaell

I’m so annoyed by the comments on the Integra. For almost 20 years, the internet commentariat bitched and griped about Acura using meaningless alphabetic nomenclature.

Now they switch back to an actual name, and they whine about that as well.

Sheesh.

nyccarguy

@Michaell said:
I’m so annoyed by the comments on the Integra. For almost 20 years, the internet commentariat bitched and griped about Acura using meaningless alphabetic nomenclature.

Now they switch back to an actual name, and they whine about that as well.

Sheesh.

Exactly - if even one half of 1 percent of the people that said over the past 20 years “I don’t understand why Acura doesn’t come out with a new Integra” actually buy one, it will be a smashing success. Do these people honestly want an exact replica of what was sold here from 1994 - 2001? These are the same people who complained in 1998 that “they can’t believe Acura isn’t changing the car after 4 years like every other Honda.” Just like the people who wanted a new Supra for years and then moan about how it’s a BMW and not a Supra. Again, you have a choice; Toyota body over BMW engine/chassis/transmission or no Supra.

I know not everybody loves Doug DeMuro, but he had a great review of an Integra Type R a few years ago. I should probably insert a link here, but I’m too lazy.

All these enthusiast cars got discontinued at 1 point or another because they didn’t sell. Car manufacturers are in the business of selling cars (and being profitable at doing so).

We should all be thankful that Acura is giving us a new Integra with 3 pedals.

corvette

nyccarguy said:

All these enthusiast cars got discontinued at 1 point or another because they didn’t sell. Car manufacturers are in the business of selling cars (and being profitable at doing so).

Yup... my neighbor has a late-1990s Camry, which she bought when it was a couple years old, and is looking for another late model Camry to replace it. I hate that she's having to shop in this environment--I told her to look at Carvana.

stickguy

yeah, they claim to want a slightly modernized version of the type R. Which was always a low volume, expensive niche car. But going back to the last Integra (renamed RSX), that went away because nobody was buying it.

and I would bet the vast majority of people complaining online, if Acura did release a 2+2 hatch with unusable back seat, with expensive underpinnings and charged the $40K it would cost, wouldn't buy one anyway.

all through it's life, most of the Integra sales were more base models anyway, and though I don't have the numbers, would not surprise me at all if the 4 door outsold the 2 door, certainly once you got into the 2nd gen.

At least they used the Si Civic, and not the base car, as the entry level. Which is probably going to be quicker than almost every Integra that came before it!

I guess though with so many people wanting a small 2 door hatch with tiny back seats, the new BRZ/AE86 are going to sell like hotcakes!

qbrozen

Not having much luck getting a Ford dealer to sell me a Mach E. Why are things overly difficult now? I got one still with an open recall they can’t sell. Another who keeps bugging me to buy a more expensive one than I want. Two who keep emailing me “we haven’t heard from you” when, in fact, they have but no real human has reached out. And one today who called and said “yes we have that in stock. Yes it is just msrp.” Ok, great, so sell it to me. “When can you come in to talk?” We’re talking now. I’ll take it. “Uhhh…ummm….I’ll have a sales associate call you Monday to go over your options.” Huh?? You have a car and a price and I have money and will pay what you are asking. This is classic case of talking yourself out of a sale. Close me! Now! No, I have to wait. WTH?

corvette

28firefighter

@corvette said:

Oh. My. Goodness. Some days, the internet giveth.