Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

gsemike · September 2016

North Jersey - how you doing?

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5802040101.html - How the mighty have fallen

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5802014399.html - 440 Dart. Really like the execution

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5781843124.html - 73 Impala. I think this is overpriced by a good amount. Cheapo plastic wheel covers; rattle can detailing under the hood

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5802022104.html - Looks like a decent Elky driver for the money

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5765418142.html - How does VW bus love translate to this?

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5787289320.html - Pimpin aint easy. Go ahead and keep the wheels

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5795953524.html - Looks like a nice Mark V. I like the ruby red

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5801816655.html - Own an AMG for $100k less than when new

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5801630525.html - Professional photos

http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5777399758.html - Affordable mopar. Looks good for the money given the current state of mopar madness

ab348 · September 2016

That '71 Road Runner looks too good to be true for the price.

stickguy · September 2016

I like the road runner. And the dart is one heck of a sleeper. If you can get traction.

bhill2 · September 2016

stickguy said:
I like the road runner. And the dart is one heck of a sleeper. If you can get traction.

Back in the day I would have KILLED for that Dart. While my friends were putting racing stripes and chrome wheels on their cars I was dreaming about putting together a total sleeper like that.

omarman · September 2016

bhill2 said:

stickguy said:
I like the road runner. And the dart is one heck of a sleeper. If you can get traction.
Back in the day I would have KILLED for that Dart. While my friends were putting racing stripes and chrome wheels on their cars I was dreaming about putting together a total sleeper like that.

That 440 Scamp looks like a serious trainer for rear wheel steering. Bigger/heavier Mopars than that can easily get sideways with the torque of a well-tuned 440 RB.

I really like the plum crazy Roadrunner and with that tag it was easy to track down a recent $35K listing.

explorerx4 · September 2016

I have a feeling if you went to look at that purple Roadrunner without some backup, you would end up in the swamps of Jersey.

fintail · September 2016

R129 AMG is cool, but I have a suspicion it is a Japan import - I've read to be careful with that.

steine13 · September 2016

I just got into an argument -- some shoving may have occurred -- with my 17-year-old daughter, who has an inexplicable thing for early Impalas.

This was about the shoulder belts -- they seem to be attached the ceiling in some goofy way, as seen in picture #6 of the ad. Wikipedia says shoulder belts were standard for 1967 models. I say the ones in this car seem like a later add-on.

Can anyone enlighten us what's going on here?
Thanks in advance,
-mathias

js06gv · September 2016

steine13 said:
I just got into an argument -- some shoving may have occurred -- with my 17-year-old daughter, who has an inexplicable thing for early Impalas.

This was about the shoulder belts -- they seem to be attached the ceiling in some goofy way, as seen in picture #6 of the ad. Wikipedia says shoulder belts were standard for 1967 models. I say the ones in this car seem like a later add-on.

Can anyone enlighten us what's going on here?
Thanks in advance,
-mathias

I remember, before shoulder/lap belts were integrated into a single unit, that the shoulder portion was held to the outer edge of the headliner via small clips. I bet they were seldom used or if they were that they weren't folded back up very often. I can't recall what year they got integrated, or if it varied by manufacturer, but my first car was a '74 Torino and the shoulder and lap belts were together. Could be that the '73 Impala we see here was the last year with this setup.

ab348 · September 2016

Shoulder belts were mandated by the US federal gov to become standard on cars made after Jan. 1, 1968. So that means that many early production 1968 models, like my Cutlass, do not have them. I am pretty sure they were not standard on a '67 Impala but were an option that could be ordered.

The design for the first few years of being made standard was pretty crude in most American cars. It was similar to a lap belt of the time - no inertia reel, a separate strap and buckle section that needed to be adjusted via the webbing being pulled tight through the buckle. Once strapped in you had no movement. As a result few people used them and the strap section was typically stored using metal clips installed in the roof rail. In the early '70s manufacturers adopted a 3-point seat-shoulder belt assembly with an inertia reel which is similar to today's setup.

fintail · September 2016

I remember riding in an early 70s Chrysler with that roof rail setup. Obvious as to why that system wasn't popular.

That reminds me, I am pretty sure the seatbelts in the fintail are original to the car. I don't know how well they'd hold up in an impact. Fintails actually have mounting points for owner-installed shoulder belts, hidden under the B-pillar trim. Maybe it was a thing in Europe. IIRC when my dad found his 60 Ford wagon in the early 90s, it had no seatbelts - he installed them himself, using a relatively modern inertia reel setup out of an Oldsmobile, I seem to recall.

uplanderguy · September 2016

That's a '68 Impala in the photo.

EDIT: I see that is precisely what you mentioned, sorry.

Mr_Shiftright · September 2016

ab348 said:
That '71 Road Runner looks too good to be true for the price.

If it were clean and correct, it would sell in the $60,000 range. Not only suspicious, but ludicrous.

stever · September 2016

What $1,800 will get you on Craigslist in Las Cruces.

stickguy · September 2016

so some scrap metal, and a Jeep I want?

stickguy · September 2016

need the link for that one!

stickguy · September 2016

OK, found the link. Not a bad deal, even if the engine is in pieces in boxes.

https://lascruces.craigslist.org/cto/5739378959.html

Mr_Shiftright · September 2016

Why bother? You can buy these all day long for $4000, looking better and running besides.

gsemike · September 2016

texases · September 2016

And that BMW hasn't been on the road since 2010...ooof....

Mr_Shiftright · September 2016

Well if the BMW is now running and registered, that might be an ok buy. The top is a PITA to fix...but for the junkyard-savvy and the creative, it's not a big deal if you know how.

'87 Vette--improved ride but still had the crappy 4+3 manual transmission, so automatic in this case is preferable. Kinda gas hungry but this one appears to be in decent shape. Lotta miles for a C4 but still a good bang for the buck seems to me.

Land Cruiser looks beat.

stickguy · September 2016

the Accord owner at least figured out how to avoid the Takata airbag problem. Remove the steering wheel and airbag entirely.

that car scares me.

The BMW, you would have to be brave, experienced, and real handy. Sounds perfect for QB to pick up cheap for his toy!

qbrozen · September 2016

I could take care of it, but I don't like convertibles.

For some reason, something about the pics is screaming "beware of cheap repaint."

Interior on that Jag looks super clean. Shifty would smack me, but it is about the only thing on that list I actually like.

sda · September 2016

ab348 said:
Shoulder belts were mandated by the US federal gov to become standard on cars made after Jan. 1, 1968. So that means that many early production 1968 models, like my Cutlass, do not have them. I am pretty sure they were not standard on a '67 Impala but were an option that could be ordered.

The design for the first few years of being made standard was pretty crude in most American cars. It was similar to a lap belt of the time - no inertia reel, a separate strap and buckle section that needed to be adjusted via the webbing being pulled tight through the buckle. Once strapped in you had no movement. As a result few people used them and the strap section was typically stored using metal clips installed in the roof rail. In the early '70s manufacturers adopted a 3-point seat-shoulder belt assembly with an inertia reel which is similar to today's setup.

That color interior was pretty when new but didn't age nicely. Looks faded and drab.

ab348 · September 2016

To correct @gsemike 's intro to that Jag, "try to go back to school in style". It might not quite make it there.

Depending on the rust situation, that Bronco could be a deal.

The Scamp would have been a nice deal until all the junk was added.

qbrozen · September 2016

Scamp looks to have serious rust issues

omarman · September 2016

Who's up for the Friday nite GR8 $800 CL Challenge?
$800 car
$800 truck
And something which, "does not run at the present time," but still costs $800

stever · September 2016

Ha, how about a '95 Lumina with 86k miles and just a few leaks?

Your F-150 may be tough to beat but how about a VW BUS Project BeachBuggy? (The engine was running when it was removed).

explorerx4 · September 2016

Does that VW have a shower rod adapted to be a roll bar?

stever · September 2016

lol, looks more like conduit to me. Pretty sure that's a pallet sided interior too.

qbrozen · September 2016

I'll play.

be comfy for $800:
http://cnj.craigslist.org/cto/5781163025.html

how bout $500? "Just needs compounding." I think he meant impounding:
http://cnj.craigslist.org/cto/5792377996.html

battery not included:
http://cnj.craigslist.org/cto/5792270486.html

talk about wheel gap!
http://cnj.craigslist.org/cto/5782929609.html

Mr_Shiftright · September 2016

I'll see your Saturn and raise you one ratty Honda Civic! $800--apparently needs a radiator.

stickguy · September 2016

$800? slackers.

I'll do it for $300 and take the $500 change in 20's please.

https://southjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5767492472.html

At $800 exactly, this is interesting. I kind of like it. Who cares about rusty frame rails anyway?

https://southjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5807269177.html

uplanderguy · October 2016

That color interior was pretty when new but didn't age nicely. Looks faded and drab.

I agree. I also think the '67 Impala had a much-nicer instrument panel and seat trim.

I grew up on Chevrolets, and if something was added someplace you could see it in a new model year, you could bet something else was removed elsewhere you could also see!

The '68 Impalas added exterior trim standard--body side molding, wheel opening moldings, rocker molding. These costs to me seem like they were taken out of the interior!

Same with the '71's. To my eyes, a much-more expensive-looking car outside than the '70, with a much-cheaper looking interior.

qbrozen · October 2016

stickguy said:

$800? slackers. I'll do it for $300 and take the $500 change in 20's please. https://southjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5767492472.html At $800 exactly, this is interesting. I kind of like it. Who cares about rusty frame rails anyway? https://southjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5807269177.html

$300 is still too much for a nonrunning cavalier. I am thinking they left it that way so you don't find out the engine is toast.

gsemike · October 2016

$800 is pretty tough but...

http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/5806278063.html Eclipse needs water pump. It that is really all, this looks OK and should have life left

http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/5776510381.html 6 cyl Camaro

http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/5802411866.html Infiniti

http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/5802317337.html S10 with a lot of new parts

ab348 · October 2016

uplanderguy said:
That color interior was pretty when new but didn't age nicely. Looks faded and drab.

I agree. I also think the '67 Impala had a much-nicer instrument panel and seat trim.

Well, at least it is an actual color and isn't gray or black.

I grew up on Chevrolets, and if something was added someplace you could see it in a new model year, you could bet something else was removed elsewhere you could also see!

The '68 Impalas added exterior trim standard--body side molding, wheel opening moldings, rocker molding. These costs to me seem like they were taken out of the interior!

Same with the '71's. To my eyes, a much-more expensive-looking car outside than the '70, with a much-cheaper looking interior.

As we have discussed, IMO the '67 Chevy had the nicest interior it would ever get.

The '71s and up models in that generation really cheapened up the Impala interior. It was almost but not quite at a level of the previous BelAir. Typical GM in those days, trying to force you to move upmarket to a Caprice.

Mr_Shiftright · October 2016

Here's a Mercedes 500 SEC going for .30 cents a pound. I guess it wasn't that good an investment after all.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/cto/5787219629.html

2003 Impala for $500. Doesn't look too bad.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/5772555852.html

1992 Toyota Tercel for $250. Actually runs and moves.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/scz/cto/5788118134.html

stickguy · October 2016

this exercise made me realize that I have no real desire to start dealing with cheap old crappy cars again! Some real ratty looking stuff out there.

fintail · October 2016

SEC would be a good parts car. Odd small historical footnote for those too, as those larger engined cars for 84-85 were the bribe MB paid to buy an end to the grey market movement.

uplanderguy · October 2016

The '71s and up models in that generation really cheapened up the Impala interior. It was almost but not quite at a level of the previous BelAir. Typical GM in those days, trying to force you to move upmarket to a Caprice.

The seat trim was OK; I would actually put it above concurrent Pontiac Catalinas. Door trim OK. Instrument panel--lots of black crinkle plastic, ugh.

In '72, the Bel Air--and even the Biscayne--came with a smallish rocker molding standard. The Impala had no rocker molding available at any cost, but had a standard chrome side molding (vinyl insert optional). Impala also had drip moldings and side window reveal moldings as they called them--all available at extra cost on a Biscayne or Bel Air. A Bel Air or Biscayne so-equipped would actually have more trim than an Impala!

berri · October 2016

The one thing I liked about the 71/72 Impala was that sport coupe hardtop greenhouse

ab348 · October 2016

I never liked the seats in the Impalas of that generation. I guess I was thinking of this, which came along later in the run:

uplanderguy · October 2016

That was the '76 cloth interior, a no-cost option. A knit cloth was also available. I will say I remember seeing a '76 Impala wagon in Firethorn Metallic and it had the above interior with red (I mean RED!) vinyl and accent cloth in the material, and I liked it!

I couldn't find a pic of '72 Impala cloth trim, but here's the vinyl trim as original:

http://www.classic-carauction.com/upload/Auction/49_286_1972_CHEVROLET_IMPALA CVTBLE_3.jpg

If I found a really nice '71 or '72 Impala, I'd want one with black interior so all the instrument panel black didn't just slap me in the face, LOL.

I never liked the '71-73 Sport Coupe roofline--to me, looked too small for the car. My parents did have a '74 Sport Coupe though--it gained the general quarter-window shape of the previous year's Custom Coupe.

One small thing I liked about the '71 big Chevys is when they came with small hub caps, the wheels were painted silver, which dressed the base cars up I think. That was gone for '72.

ab348 · October 2016

uplanderguy said:
That was the '76 cloth interior, a no-cost option. A knit cloth was also available. I will say I remember seeing a '76 Impala wagon in Firethorn Metallic and it had the above interior with red (I mean RED!) vinyl and accent cloth in the material, and I liked it!

That must have been a mid-season addition - the '76 brochure online says the sport cloth was only available in buckskin.

uplanderguy · October 2016

Here's the red sport cloth in the wagons brochure--maybe it was only available on the Impala wagon.

I have to admit, I still like it in red!

http://paintref.com/cgi-bin/brochuredisplay.cgi?year=1976&manuf=GM&model=Chevrolet&smod=Wagons&page=3&scan=66

The '74 and '75 Impala sport cloth was like a herringbone sport coat--I liked that look too but I don't think it wore real well. I remember seeing older ones and the colors tended to bleed together. I don't think that would be an issue with the plaid, but who knows.

ab348 · October 2016

My eyes!

We had the black/gray herringbone sport cloth in our '74 Impala. I didn't like it much but I didn't like the lack of color or the sewing pattern either. It had a funny sort of feel to it so I can understand your comment on how it wore over time.

uplanderguy · October 2016

Our '74 Impala had a light, spring-green like pattern cloth interior, with the pattern having sort-of a satiny sheen to it. It looked nice IMHO. The instrument cluster was still black but by this time at least it had a green steering wheel and column!

sda · October 2016

Beginning in '71, one thing that really cheapened the look of the interiors of the full size GM cars was the 2/3 door panel that was molded plastic. Some had a carpet kick pad, others just ribbed plastic that looked like it was missing something, like carpet. If I recall only the high line Olds, Buicks and Cadillacs escaped that cheap look.

uplanderguy · October 2016

Agreed, but I do like how the integrated armrests looked compared to Ford and Mopar products. Even Chryslers had a tacked on (well, screwed on) door armrest and that always bugged me by that time.

Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

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