I'm a current i3 leasee who attempted to get another and 12.5% with those discounts is a good deal. You should take it. I was not able to get close despite trying for 2 weeks or so.
Hi folks - I have the below deal lined up. Given the somewhat lackluster residuals, I feel it is a bit "overpriced". Let me know thoughts please. Thanks
MSRP of $54,845 (2017 Rex)
- Sale price pre incentives w/ $925 acquisition fee - $48,914 (12.5% off msrp)
- Total CAP reduction incentives - $9,000 ($7,500 Fed incentive + $1,500 fleet)
- Adjusted CAP Cost - $40,504 (includes $590 capped taxes)
- MF - .0013 (includes .0002 MF reduction for corp fleet deal)
- Drive off (down at signing) - $346 (first payment only)
- Sales tax - 7%
Monthly payment - $346.08 (includes FL taxes)
24 months, 10k miles per year.
Thanks!
I get the same payment.
A dealer can't really adjust their price to make up for the residual set by the bank.
Looks pretty cheap for a $55K MSRP vehicle, or even relative to a $40K CAP cost.
Thanks! Curious about the capped taxes. Should I have this? It seems excessive as over the entire lease period, I should be paying 7% tax against the monthly payment amount. This $590 seem quite high in comparison.
Hi folks - I have the below deal lined up. Given the somewhat lackluster residuals, I feel it is a bit "overpriced". Let me know thoughts please. Thanks
MSRP of $54,845 (2017 Rex)
- Sale price pre incentives w/ $925 acquisition fee - $48,914 (12.5% off msrp)
- Total CAP reduction incentives - $9,000 ($7,500 Fed incentive + $1,500 fleet)
- Adjusted CAP Cost - $40,504 (includes $590 capped taxes)
- Drive off (down at signing) - $346 (first payment only)
- Sales tax - 7%
Monthly payment - $346.08 (includes FL taxes)
24 months, 10k miles per year.
Thanks!
I get the same payment.
A dealer can't really adjust their price to make up for the residual set by the bank.
Looks pretty cheap for a $55K MSRP vehicle, or even relative to a $40K CAP cost.
Thanks! Curious about the capped taxes. Should I have this? It seems excessive as over the entire lease period, I should be paying 7% tax against the monthly payment amount. This $590 seem quite high in comparison.
Can someone help me out with this? A dealer has given me this offer. For what it's worth, I know this is a terrible offer. Only 5.76% off MSRP and a marked up MF. However, when I plug the numbers into this lease calculator, the pretax monthly payment is $398 compared to $449.74 on the offer sheet. Does it have to do with the "Total cap reduction" on the right side of the sheet?
Can someone help me out with this? A dealer has given me this offer. For what it's worth, I know this is a terrible offer. Only 5.76% off MSRP and a marked up MF. However, when I plug the numbers into this lease calculator, the pretax monthly payment is $398 compared to $449.74 on the offer sheet. Does it have to do with the "Total cap reduction" on the right side of the sheet?
I get 398 pretax, offer sheet has almost 450 pretax.
edit: it's because the lease calculator assumes you are paying the down payment in the drive-off
Instead of adding and subtracting things on the lease calculator, just plug the NET CAP in as the sale price, and leave everything else blank. The calculations are correct.
A lot of what is in the "amount applied upfront" is tax on the CAP cost reduction. (plus acquisition fee, first payment, DMV/doc fees)
Does BMW's alumni fleet program with $1,500 rebate also lower the MF like some of the other fleet programs do? If so, how much or would it vary by school?
Does BMW's alumni fleet program with $1,500 rebate also lower the MF like some of the other fleet programs do? If so, how much or would it vary by school?
Not familiar with all of the programs, but other members have noted that they've received discount of .00020 from the money factor, as well as the $1500.
@kyfdx@Michaell do you have the June MF/RV for the 2017 i3? I'm curious if there was any change or additional rebates to consider in the month of June.
Is 30 months at 12K/yr still 60% and .00015 base MF?
Bonus: Do you know if you place an order at a dealer for an i3, does BMWFS let you lock in the RV/MF at the time the order is placed or do you have to wait till the vehicle is delivered? And in that time if the MF/RV or additional rebates better the deal could you use them instead?
@kyfdx@Michaell do you have the June MF/RV for the 2017 i3? I'm curious if there was any change or additional rebates to consider in the month of June.
Is 30 months at 12K/yr still 60% and .00015 base MF?
Bonus: Do you know if you place an order at a dealer for an i3, does BMWFS let you lock in the RV/MF at the time the order is placed or do you have to wait till the vehicle is delivered? And in that time if the MF/RV or additional rebates better the deal could you use them instead?
Thank you!
We don't have all the numbers, yet.
36/12 - .00150 and 57%; we can extrapolate that 30/12 will be 60% again
No incentive information
You can choose which numbers to use - the program numbers when the order is placed, or the program numbers when you take delivery. You cannot mix and match them
I'm in WA state and have just started looking for a new lease on a 2017 i3 Bev with Giga trim and both packages (which has to be ordered as no-one seems to have the exact build I want). This will be my second i3 (first was in 2015) and i'm getting a bit of a shock at the current pricing compared to my prior lease! I was able to get about a 10% discount off msrp last time around, but this time i'm only seeing 3.4%ish which isn't even as much as the suggested dealer contribution shown on BMW specials page.
I don't have all the details on this screenshot, but this is what i've been offered. I'd like a 36 month lease, but this discount seems really low to me. I questioned the dealer regarding these number and he said the cost of money is higher at the moment and there are less incentives due to low supply. What's your take on these numbers?
I'm in WA state and have just started looking for a new lease on a 2017 i3 Bev with Giga trim and both packages (which has to be ordered as no-one seems to have the exact build I want). This will be my second i3 (first was in 2015) and i'm getting a bit of a shock at the current pricing compared to my prior lease! I was able to get about a 10% discount off msrp last time around, but this time i'm only seeing 3.4%ish which isn't even as much as the suggested dealer contribution shown on BMW specials page.
I don't have all the details on this screenshot, but this is what i've been offered. I'd like a 36 month lease, but this discount seems really low to me. I questioned the dealer regarding these number and he said the cost of money is higher at the moment and there are less incentives due to low supply. What's your take on these numbers?
.00150 MF and 58% residual for 36/10.
$435/mo,.+tax, with $2000 due at signing, assuming that $1777.50 includes all other costs. That's about $478/mo. for 36/10
Do you think "their" $2000 is total due at signing? Or, just the downpayment portion?
You should be shooting for $3000-$3500 discount from MSRP, regardless of what the dealer says. $925 acquisition fee. I'd want an itemization of the rest of the $1777.50. Maybe WA has $850 in fees on a leased car, but that seems high. Verify the money factor being used, and the total amount due at signing.
$435/mo,.+tax, with $2000 due at signing, assuming that $1777.50 includes all other costs. That's about $478/mo. for 36/10
Do you think "their" $2000 is total due at signing? Or, just the downpayment portion?
You should be shooting for $3000-$3500 discount from MSRP, regardless of what the dealer says. $925 acquisition fee. I'd want an itemization of the rest of the $1777.50. Maybe WA has $850 in fees on a leased car, but that seems high. Verify the money factor being used, and the total amount due at signing.
Sorry, I should have mentioned that this dealer claims their lease prices include tax already ("no surprises" !) so that $435 is with tax supposedly. Also, the 2,000 is just the downpayment portion. As far as I can tell, this isn't a good deal as-is and i've asked the dealer to break down the fees + provide their MF and residuals (WA does have a high registration fee of ~800 apparently, i've heard this from multiple dealers).
The good news it that another dealer has stated that they will offer invoice+$500 pricing with base MF and residual (exactly what you quoted: .00150 MF and 58% residual for 36/10). They said that they could do better on pricing for a car which is in-stock, but invoice+$500 was the best they would do on a order. They are also offering $9000 discount (7500 + 1500 fleet discount).
$435/mo,.+tax, with $2000 due at signing, assuming that $1777.50 includes all other costs. That's about $478/mo. for 36/10
Do you think "their" $2000 is total due at signing? Or, just the downpayment portion?
You should be shooting for $3000-$3500 discount from MSRP, regardless of what the dealer says. $925 acquisition fee. I'd want an itemization of the rest of the $1777.50. Maybe WA has $850 in fees on a leased car, but that seems high. Verify the money factor being used, and the total amount due at signing.
Sorry, I should have mentioned that this dealer claims their lease prices include tax already ("no surprises" !) so that $435 is with tax supposedly. Also, the 2,000 is just the downpayment portion. As far as I can tell, this isn't a good deal as-is and i've asked the dealer to break down the fees + provide their MF and residuals (WA does have a high registration fee of ~800 apparently, i've heard this from multiple dealers).
The good news it that another dealer has stated that they will offer invoice+$500 pricing with base MF and residual (exactly what you quoted: .00150 MF and 58% residual for 36/10). They said that they could do better on pricing for a car which is in-stock, but invoice+$500 was the best they would do on a order. They are also offering $9000 discount (7500 + 1500 fleet discount).
If you are eligible for fleet, that also reduces the MF by .00020, so the base would then be .00130
Is there a good way to know the invoice price? Edmunds calculator shows me a invoice price of $47,500 based off of a $50,595 msrp. The car I am actually looking to build/order is msrp $49,600 and I have an offer from a dealer who says that the invoice price of the car is $47,750...which is therefore higher than I expecting. How can I know for sure?
Is there a good way to know the invoice price? Edmunds calculator shows me a invoice price of $47,500 based off of a $50,595 msrp. The car I am actually looking to build/order is msrp $49,600 and I have an offer from a dealer who says that the invoice price of the car is $47,750...which is therefore higher than I expecting. How can I know for sure?
If you know the options, you should be able to build the car via Edmunds price tools and determine the invoice price.
If you know the options, you should be able to build the car via Edmunds price tools and determine the invoice price.
Edmunds shows MSRP of $50,595 (with the destination 995 fee) and a invoice price of $47,570. Dealer is telling me the same MSRP but stating that the invoice price is $47,750. I am not sure where the extra $180 difference is coming from.
If you know the options, you should be able to build the car via Edmunds price tools and determine the invoice price.
Edmunds shows MSRP of $50,595 (with the destination 995 fee) and a invoice price of $47,570. Dealer is telling me the same MSRP but stating that the invoice price is $47,750. I am not sure where the extra $180 difference is coming from.
Edmunds invoice won't show regional advertising charges (MACO) or the training fee.
Frankly, using invoice to negotiate with dealers isn't really helpful. You want the lowest price possible, even if that's under invoice. By using invoice in negotiations, you are setting a floor that you might be able to go under, otherwise.
Frankly, using invoice to negotiate with dealers isn't really helpful.
Good advice, thanks
Going back to the quote I had below...one thing I am curious about is where the $995 destination charge is. Most other quotes i've received showed both the MSRP and invoice price increased by $995 and the calculations based are then based on that number. In this quote (and subsequent quotes from the same dealer) i've not seen the $995 mentioned anywhere (fees were broken down into $925 inception fee, 702.50 license, $150 doc fee). Is it likely that they subtracted the $995 from the discount that they were going to give me?
Frankly, using invoice to negotiate with dealers isn't really helpful.
Good advice, thanks
Going back to the quote I had below...one thing I am curious about is where the $995 destination charge is. Most other quotes i've received showed both the MSRP and invoice price increased by $995 and the calculations based are then based on that number. In this quote (and subsequent quotes from the same dealer) i've not seen the $995 mentioned anywhere (fees were broken down into $925 inception fee, 702.50 license, $150 doc fee). Is it likely that they subtracted the $995 from the discount that they were going to give me?
Dealers that break out destination are just trying to confuse the process. Good quotes are for the full MSRP including destination. Selling prices should include it, as well. It's not really something you can separate or exclude.
Dealers that break out destination are just trying to confuse the process. Good quotes are for the full MSRP including destination. Selling prices should include it, as well. It's not really something you can separate or exclude.
Thanks. So in that quote above, i'm confused as the MSRP is exactly what's shown on BMW Build site (49,600) which is supposedly the MSRP before including the destination fee of $995. I don't see the $995 included in the selling price above either (looks like just the 49,600 - rebate/discount). When I asked the dealer about this he said: "The destination is inlcuded as part of the vehicle cost". Sorry for my confusion...it's just that everyone else (literally 3 other dealers) are showing me a MSRP of 50,595 and explaining that it's 49,600+995.
Here are two (more or less final) quotes which I received for the exact same build of i3 (which has 49,600 MRSP on BMW USA) but I am having a problem understanding a couple of things with offer #1. I'm planning to take offer #2, but it's still like it understand what happened with offer #1 to make it end up so much higher.
The fees on #1 are supposedly higher because they include the $925 acquisition fee, which I believe offer #2 is having me pay up front rather than rolling into the lease. Both quotes indicate the drive off is $2,000 from me and offer #1 claims to have a better MF. Both quotes indicate the monthly payment is all inclusive. The tax line ($780) which is only shown on offer #1 is a bit weird to me.
Here are two (more or less final) quotes which I received for the exact same build of i3 (which has 49,600 MRSP on BMW USA) but I am having a problem understanding a couple of things with offer #1. I'm planning to take offer #2, but it's still like it understand what happened with offer #1 to make it end up so much higher.
The fees on #1 are supposedly higher because they include the $925 acquisition fee, which I believe offer #2 is having me pay up front rather than rolling into the lease. Both quotes indicate the drive off is $2,000 from me and offer #1 claims to have a better MF. Both quotes indicate the monthly payment is all inclusive. The tax line ($780) which is only shown on offer #1 is a bit weird to me.
The $780 is tax on the rebate.
Offer #1 might be for a different car, as the MSRP is different. As the one dealer noted, all prices should include destination. Stop separating it, and your decisions will become easier.
"Drive off" and "cash down" do not have the same definition. It appears that #1 is including more info, and it also appears that #2 due at signing amount might be much greater than $2000. It's important to compare apples to apples, though dealers might not always help you do it.
Offer #1 might be for a different car, as the MSRP is different. As the one dealer noted, all prices should include destination. Stop separating it, and your decisions will become easier.
"Drive off" and "cash down" do not have the same definition. It appears that #1 is including more info, and it also appears that #2 due at signing amount might be much greater than $2000. It's important to compare apples to apples, though dealers might not always help you do it.
The MSRP shown on that page is $49,600* (with the * saying that it doesn't include the $995 destination fee). Edmunds shows $50,595 as the MSRP with destination:
So that's the first difference. Offer #1 "retail price" is missing the destination fee, while Offer #2's has it included. As I mentioned, when questioned the dealer for Offer #1 said that "The destination is included as part of the vehicle cost". Either way...after their discount/rebate calculations, the adjusted price is close enough...so moving on...
Both dealers are saying that the $2,000 shown is the full due at signing amount. I've asked bluntly and they have both told me that I will only pay $2,000 at signing and that the lease price shown is the actual monthly payment I will receive. Based on that, I simply can't work out how Offer #2 came out with that lower lease price and I am also not clear why there is no tax on the rebate shown (as you pointed out, #1 shows the $780 tax).
I have a 3rd offer arriving today which should be very comparable to Offer #2 in terms of all factors, so it will be interesting to see what they calculate the final lease price and cash due at signing to be...
Take away - this whole process is even more confusing than I expected
Offer #1 might be for a different car, as the MSRP is different. As the one dealer noted, all prices should include destination. Stop separating it, and your decisions will become easier.
"Drive off" and "cash down" do not have the same definition. It appears that #1 is including more info, and it also appears that #2 due at signing amount might be much greater than $2000. It's important to compare apples to apples, though dealers might not always help you do it.
The MSRP shown on that page is $49,600* (with the * saying that it doesn't include the $995 destination fee). Edmunds shows $50,595 as the MSRP with destination:
So that's the first difference. Offer #1 "retail price" is missing the destination fee, while Offer #2's has it included. As I mentioned, when questioned the dealer for Offer #1 said that "The destination is included as part of the vehicle cost". Either way...after their discount/rebate calculations, the adjusted price is close enough...so moving on...
Both dealers are saying that the $2,000 shown is the full due at signing amount. I've asked bluntly and they have both told me that I will only pay $2,000 at signing and that the lease price shown is the actual monthly payment I will receive. Based on that, I simply can't work out how Offer #2 came out with that lower lease price and I am also not clear why there is no tax on the rebate shown (as you pointed out, #1 shows the $780 tax).
I have a 3rd offer arriving today which should be very comparable to Offer #2 in terms of all factors, so it will be interesting to see what they calculate the final lease price and cash due at signing to be...
Take away - this whole process is even more confusing than I expected
Obviously, there is incomplete and/or missing information. Of course, once you see the completed rental contract, all should become clear. That doesn't help you choose or shop effectively, though.
Obviously, there is incomplete and/or missing information. Of course, once you see the completed rental contract, all should become clear. That doesn't help you choose or shop effectively, though.
So it turned out that the lower quote was correct. Apparently, in WA state, if the total of the payments and cap reduction is less than $32k, then the i3 is totally tax free. When I questioned all of the other dealers about this (i.e. why do your quotes have tax?) they said it was a mistake and corrected their quotes to remove the tax. Bizarre, but good for WA folks.
Obviously, there is incomplete and/or missing information. Of course, once you see the completed rental contract, all should become clear. That doesn't help you choose or shop effectively, though.
So it turned out that the lower quote was correct. Apparently, in WA state, if the total of the payments and cap reduction is less than $32k, then the i3 is totally tax free. When I questioned all of the other dealers about this (i.e. why do your quotes have tax?) they said it was a mistake and corrected their quotes to remove the tax. Bizarre, but good for WA folks.
The i3 is my first lease so I'm curious where the annual property tax bill will be sent. Does BMWFS get the bill or do I ? If BMWFS gets it, will they direct draft it from my checking account like the monthly payment ?
The i3 is my first lease so I'm curious where the annual property tax bill will be sent. Does BMWFS get the bill or do I ? If BMWFS gets it, will they direct draft it from my checking account like the monthly payment ?
In my state, we have to pay the bill when we renew registration, so no matter who it's sent to, when you go register your car, you have to pay it. At lease end, if there is an outstanding property tax bill, some banks will forward you the bill, or they will pay it, and add it to your lease end charges.
If you have direct billing from your checking account, I can't tell you what will happen.
But, either way, the charges are yours to pay, even if the state sends the bill to the car's owner (BMWFS).
Comments
Thanks! Curious about the capped taxes. Should I have this? It seems excessive as over the entire lease period, I should be paying 7% tax against the monthly payment amount. This $590 seem quite high in comparison.
That is the tax on the incentives.
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Is it .00150 and 61%? Just basing it off the 12k numbers
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This is the lease calculator I used.
https://leasehackr.com/calculator/
MSRP: 52045
Sales price: 49045
Taxed incentives: 7500
Down payment: 2500 (from CA CVRP credit)
Acquisition fee: 925
Miles: 10,000
Residual: 58
Months: 36
MF: .00180
I get 398 pretax, offer sheet has almost 450 pretax.
edit: it's because the lease calculator assumes you are paying the down payment in the drive-off
A lot of what is in the "amount applied upfront" is tax on the CAP cost reduction. (plus acquisition fee, first payment, DMV/doc fees)
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Is 30 months at 12K/yr still 60% and .00015 base MF?
Bonus: Do you know if you place an order at a dealer for an i3, does BMWFS let you lock in the RV/MF at the time the order is placed or do you have to wait till the vehicle is delivered? And in that time if the MF/RV or additional rebates better the deal could you use them instead?
Thank you!
36/12 - .00150 and 57%; we can extrapolate that 30/12 will be 60% again
No incentive information
You can choose which numbers to use - the program numbers when the order is placed, or the program numbers when you take delivery. You cannot mix and match them
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I don't have all the details on this screenshot, but this is what i've been offered. I'd like a 36 month lease, but this discount seems really low to me. I questioned the dealer regarding these number and he said the cost of money is higher at the moment and there are less incentives due to low supply. What's your take on these numbers?
$435/mo,.+tax, with $2000 due at signing, assuming that $1777.50 includes all other costs.
That's about $478/mo. for 36/10
Do you think "their" $2000 is total due at signing? Or, just the downpayment portion?
You should be shooting for $3000-$3500 discount from MSRP, regardless of what the dealer says.
$925 acquisition fee. I'd want an itemization of the rest of the $1777.50. Maybe WA has $850 in fees on a leased car, but that seems high.
Verify the money factor being used, and the total amount due at signing.
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The good news it that another dealer has stated that they will offer invoice+$500 pricing with base MF and residual (exactly what you quoted: .00150 MF and 58% residual for 36/10). They said that they could do better on pricing for a car which is in-stock, but invoice+$500 was the best they would do on a order. They are also offering $9000 discount (7500 + 1500 fleet discount).
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Frankly, using invoice to negotiate with dealers isn't really helpful. You want the lowest price possible, even if that's under invoice. By using invoice in negotiations, you are setting a floor that you might be able to go under, otherwise.
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Going back to the quote I had below...one thing I am curious about is where the $995 destination charge is. Most other quotes i've received showed both the MSRP and invoice price increased by $995 and the calculations based are then based on that number. In this quote (and subsequent quotes from the same dealer) i've not seen the $995 mentioned anywhere (fees were broken down into $925 inception fee, 702.50 license, $150 doc fee). Is it likely that they subtracted the $995 from the discount that they were going to give me?
Good quotes are for the full MSRP including destination. Selling prices should include it, as well. It's not really something you can separate or exclude.
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The fees on #1 are supposedly higher because they include the $925 acquisition fee, which I believe offer #2 is having me pay up front rather than rolling into the lease. Both quotes indicate the drive off is $2,000 from me and offer #1 claims to have a better MF. Both quotes indicate the monthly payment is all inclusive. The tax line ($780) which is only shown on offer #1 is a bit weird to me.
Offer #1 might be for a different car, as the MSRP is different. As the one dealer noted, all prices should include destination. Stop separating it, and your decisions will become easier.
"Drive off" and "cash down" do not have the same definition. It appears that #1 is including more info, and it also appears that #2 due at signing amount might be much greater than $2000. It's important to compare apples to apples, though dealers might not always help you do it.
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https://www.bmwusa.com/byo.html#!/build/summary/ddbf0t3d
The MSRP shown on that page is $49,600* (with the * saying that it doesn't include the $995 destination fee). Edmunds shows $50,595 as the MSRP with destination:
So that's the first difference. Offer #1 "retail price" is missing the destination fee, while Offer #2's has it included. As I mentioned, when questioned the dealer for Offer #1 said that "The destination is included as part of the vehicle cost". Either way...after their discount/rebate calculations, the adjusted price is close enough...so moving on...
Both dealers are saying that the $2,000 shown is the full due at signing amount. I've asked bluntly and they have both told me that I will only pay $2,000 at signing and that the lease price shown is the actual monthly payment I will receive. Based on that, I simply can't work out how Offer #2 came out with that lower lease price and I am also not clear why there is no tax on the rebate shown (as you pointed out, #1 shows the $780 tax).
I have a 3rd offer arriving today which should be very comparable to Offer #2 in terms of all factors, so it will be interesting to see what they calculate the final lease price and cash due at signing to be...
Take away - this whole process is even more confusing than I expected
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$7500 lease credit
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.00150 and 60%
$7500 lease credit
2. What are the June numbers for a 36/12?
3. I'm guessing no one has any idea what these numbers are in July, yes?
THANKS!!
36/12: .00150 MF and 57% residual
New program starts July 1st, and correct.. no one knows.
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Thanks.
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If BMWFS gets it, will they direct draft it from my checking account like the monthly payment ?
At lease end, if there is an outstanding property tax bill, some banks will forward you the bill, or they will pay it, and add it to your lease end charges.
If you have direct billing from your checking account, I can't tell you what will happen.
But, either way, the charges are yours to pay, even if the state sends the bill to the car's owner (BMWFS).
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Looking at 36 months 12k/year
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Thank you, so to confirm, July MF has increased from .00150 to .00151?
That is correct
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige