Mystery car pix

Michaell

andys120 said:

I believe that's a Lotus, but don't know the model name.

au1994

Elan + 2

bhill2

OK, this isn't exactly a mystery car question, but a mystery car feature question. I need a '50s/60s Ford nerd (or more than one) to improve my understanding of Ford-O-Matics.

• I know that in the early '50s the Ford-O-Matic had three speeds, but it started in second unless Low was specifically engaged.
  
• In '56, Ford added the 'Tip-Toe Shift' feature to the transmission to allow the driver to start out in first by flooring the accelerator from a stop. Otherwise it still started in second.
  
• In '58, Ford came out with the Cruise-O-Matic, which allowed the driver to routinely start in first gear or start in second. Did the Ford-O-Matic, which was available through the early '60s, remain a three-speed with the 'Tip-Toe Shfit'?
  
• To make things more interesting, my folks owned a '60 Falcon with Ford-O-Matic, and it was definitely a two-speed. Nothing happened when you floored the accelerator from a stop (including any noticeable acceleration).
  

Anyway, I am uncertain how that worked, and would appreciate enlightenment.

Mr_Shiftright

I *think* the answer is that you are perhaps confusing the early Fordomatics with the later aluminum case 2-speeds.

bhill2

Mr_Shiftright said:

I *think* the answer is that you are perhaps confusing the early Fordomatics with the later aluminum case 2-speeds.

Well,I figured out that something had changed either over time or between the full-sized Ford and the Falcon. I guess my question is which it is. I could focus the question by asking "if you bought, say, a '60 full-sized Ford with a Fordomatic was it a two-speed like the Falcon or three-speed like the earlier Fords?"

Mr_Shiftright

Near as I can tell, the optional Fordomatic was a 2 speed and the Cruiseomatic was a 3 speed.

tmart

I thought the Fordomatic was alway a two speed until the three speed Cruiseomatic came out. In my 56 I'd start in "L", then around 25-30 shift to "D" and right back to "L" which put in second gear and then back to "D" which put it in third gear.

bhill2

tmart said:

I thought the Fordomatic was alway a two speed until the three speed Cruiseomatic came out. In my 56 I'd start in "L", then around 25-30 shift to "D" and right back to "L" which put in second gear and then back to "D" which put it in third gear.

So, your description indicates that in '56, there were three speeds in the Fordomatic. This corresponds with a feature article on the Sunliner in the latest issue of Hemmings Classic Cars, but I am still confused about when it went to two speeds.. I know the Standard Catalog of American Cars refers to the Fordomatic in its debut year (1951) as "... a torque converter type transmission with a three speed (automatic intermediate gear for starting) planetary gears and a single stage".

texases

Here's a description, does it help?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruise-O-Matic#Fordomatic_two-speed

elias

Identification of my car was not a mystery for the kind photographers in this case:

bhill2

texases said:

Here's a description, does it help?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruise-O-Matic#Fordomatic_two-speed

It most certainly does! Thanks Texases. You gotta love Wikipedia. So after the introduction of Cruise-o-matic in '58, the Ford-o-matic went to two speeds in '59.

tmart

bhill2 said:

tmart said:

I thought the Fordomatic was alway a two speed until the three speed Cruiseomatic came out. In my 56 I'd start in "L", then around 25-30 shift to "D" and right back to "L" which put in second gear and then back to "D" which put it in third gear.

So, your description indicates that in '56, there were three speeds in the Fordomatic. This corresponds with a feature article on the Sunliner in the latest issue of Hemmings Classic Cars, but I am still confused about when it went to two speeds.. I know the Standard Catalog of American Cars refers to the Fordomatic in its debut year (1951) as "... a torque converter type transmission with a three speed (automatic intermediate gear for starting) planetary gears and a single stage".

OK, technically a three speed, but in D it started in second regardless whether floored or not then shifted to third. In L it started in first and stayed there. If in D above 25, I think, and you put it in L it went into second, and then downshifted to first automatically when Yor speed dropped below 25.

stickguy

so much easier to just drive a manual trans. It was always in whatever gear you wanted it to be.

bhill2

stickguy said:

so much easier to just drive a manual trans. It was always in whatever gear you wanted it to be.

I'm with you there. Make mine with overdrive.

kyfdx

elias said:

Identification of my car was not a mystery for the kind photographers in this case:

Bummer

bhill2

kyfdx said:

elias said:

Identification of my car was not a mystery for the kind photographers in this case:

Bummer

Yeah, I hate it when that happens.

Mr_Shiftright

I would challenge a camera ticket just on principle. How do you cross-examine a camera?

I just love the names they used to give to automatic transmissions. It seems like they were always trying to top one another: From "Cruise o matic" to "Flash" to "Ultra", from "flite" to "glide".

berri

I'm not an attorney, so Marsh may understand this better; but I believe a lot of states handle camera tickets outside of other tickets, as a civil matter instead. Ironically, I believe that actually makes it harder to challenge them in court.

fintail

Wow, I bet you feel served and protected! Just don't think about the cut received by the palms-greasing camera operator. Semi-fascist crony capitalism masquerading as safety. It would also be interesting to see an independent audit of that speed limit, probably the same as it was in 1952.

stickguy

I assume this is like a red light camera ticket. I understood it to be like a parking ticket. They are giving the ticket to the registered owner of the car, not the driver. But since they did not even know who was driving, can't assign points, etc. So better than a "real" speeding ticket!

basically just a money grab, if they don't even think it is a dangerous enough situation to pull the speeder over.

stickguy

Car should be easy. But you need the specific model name to get credit for this one!

tmart

stickguy said:

Car should be easy. But you need the specific model name to get credit for this one!

My guess is either an Aspen or Volare. Without the side chrome they're basically the same from the side.

robr2

Plymouth Volare Petty Kit Car.

stickguy

yup. A Volare street kit car.

that did not take long.

there was an Aspen version too, that came in red.

Mr_Shiftright

Looks like something they'd make in Moscow.

fintail

Idaho?

stever

It does look like someone Vandalized that Volare, now that you mention it.

The Idaho Vandals are the intercollegiate athletic teams of the University of Idaho in Moscow.

stickguy

It was the 70's. you had to be there.

all performance was stick-on.

stever

That was a little Idaho joke (see the ellipses).

yeah, yeah, very little.... Maybe one guy in Sandpoint got it.

lostwrench1

Mr_Shiftright said:

I just love the names they used to give to automatic transmissions. It seems like they were always trying to top one another: From "Cruise o matic" to "Flash" to "Ultra", from "flite" to "glide".

lostwrench1

I've heard some automatic transmissions called names which can't be repeated here.

robr2

These Petty Kit Cars were Super Coupes which they bolted on the fender flares and spoiler, removed the hubcaps, added "43" to the doors and roof. They only made about 400 between the Volare and Aspen. They were faster than the Z28 and Corvette L28 of the day.

Between conception and delivery, Petty had switched to GM and let's just say there wasn't much of a demand for the Kit Car.

berri

But those rear window treatments almost make that Volare look like a fastback paddy wagon

stickguy

Metal window straps on the back glass.

stevedebi

berri said:

I'm not an attorney, so Marsh may understand this better; but I believe a lot of states handle camera tickets outside of other tickets, as a civil matter instead. Ironically, I believe that actually makes it harder to challenge them in court.

They did away with them here in LA after too many challenges. Start with asking to see the calibration data for the radar - out here they were not testing them correctly, and the data kept being thrown out. Radar has to be calibrated to be correct. But generally, if it isn't going on your license anyway (and if you really were speeding), probably just best to pay up.

magnette

stickguy said:

I assume this is like a red light camera ticket. I understood it to be like a parking ticket. They are giving the ticket to the registered owner of the car, not the driver. But since they did not even know who was driving, can't assign points, etc. So better than a "real" speeding ticket!

basically just a money grab, if they don't even think it is a dangerous enough situation to pull the speeder over.

I gather that here it is a criminal offence to fail to tell the authorities who is driving the vehicle, and if, for example, the owner is a company then the person to whom the car is assigned is liable (or if there is none then the person in charge of the whole place) so that is meant to make people come forward.

We had a politician here who got jailed when it came to light (following a messy divorce) that he had got his then wife to lie and say she was driving when he got flashed on a motorway and she also got jailed for lying (she had sold her story to the press). Even more stupidly her lawyer had lied about it too and got struck off - and she was a judge...

Lot of cost for a three month ban....

Mr_Shiftright

OK, put your thinking caps on for this one. Bad Misleading Hint: I snapped this photo in Palermo, Sicily.

stickguy

Looks like a bug. Not a VW. A real bug. But. I kind of like it.

Mr_Shiftright

kinda cute, ain't it?

andys120

Looks like one of those screwy Nissans like the Escargot but ain't that a Toyota emblem on the nose?
Something specific to the Euro market?

Mr_Shiftright

Yer gettin warmer but no its not a Nissan.

texases

Not a Toyota, right?  Zoomed in I don't recognize that logo. Is it European?

qbrozen

thought i mighta been a Nissan Micra, like I saw Richard Hammond review on Top Gear once, but I guess not.

Clicked to see the emblem bigger, and I believe that's maybe Daihatsu?

fintail

Daihatsu Copen.

I'll be in Italy in a few weeks, wonder what I'll see.

Mr_Shiftright said:

OK, put your thinking caps on for this one. Bad Misleading Hint: I snapped this photo in Palermo, Sicily.

berri

To quote Christmas Vacation, "she's a beaut...".

Mr_Shiftright

Yes, Daihatsu Copen it is! First one I've ever seen in the wild.

In Italy you're going to see a lot of strange stuff.

magnette

fintail said:

Daihatsu Copen.

I'll be in Italy in a few weeks, wonder what I'll see.





Where are you going in Italy, Fin?

fintail

In the north, Tirol - Milan - Turin area. I am sure I will see some odd stuff, weird Fiats and Vespas being used as economy cars.

magnette said:

Where are you going in Italy, Fin?

berri

I've always liked Northern Italian cuisine - enjoy!

magnette

fintail said:

In the north, Tirol - Milan - Turin area. I am sure I will see some odd stuff, weird Fiats and Vespas being used as economy cars.

Lovely part of Italy - we stayed in Milan and then in Como about five years ago and it was really nice there.
Alfa have their museum in Turin I believe but we didn't go there.