Considering all of the papers that you have to sign to close a deal, the refusal form doesn't bother me a bit. In fact, it made the process quicker. I simply went in and stated up front that I only wanted the GAP. The FI guy checked it off and I signed that I didn't want the other stuff. We sign waivers all the time for our doctors, the vet, our attorney, etc. What's the big deal with one more waiver?
Compared to me, you ARE young. Like you, our incentive check will be spent. I had planned to save it, but we have decided to put it with some of my consulting money and do new counter tops in the kitchen---not granite according to my research. We're going to use quartz. It is not as porous and it comes in a greater variety of patterns. Also, it is a little cheaper---but not much.
Are you saying that one or more car buyers have sued dealership(s) because they claim after months/years of ownership that their lack of proper maintenance such as wash/wax exterior, clean spills on interior quickly, etc resulted in visual surface damage? And, that that damage could/would have been prevented if they had Mop and Glo installed?
It might not be so much about the mop and glo. I think from what Joel said it was more about service contracts. "I wouldn't have this huge repair bill if I had a service contract. I want the dealership to pay this bill because I wasn't offered this contract."
I don't understand the people who are so worked up about this. Clearly they have either never rented a car or they have always bought ALL the insurance offered to them. You can't rent a car without a) buying the extra insurance or b) indicating that you decline it.
Your brother should have balked at having to buy two new tires since the dealership didn't check it out during those service visits.
He did balk and to hear him tell it, quite a bit but to no avail. He didn’t like it one bit when they gave him the excuse about it being missed but he’d have to pay for tires anyway. :mad: That’s why, as I said in my post, he went so far as to have the GM at the Toyota store sign the turn in report stating that only tires where needed when he was turning it in at the end of the lease when he was given this news about needing tires.
Ask your brother if he is having any problems getting the automatic top up and down.
Coincidentally, I spoke with him last night and since I mentioned yesterday that he was happy with the car, I asked him how the car was doing for them and he said “great”. I have to assume that if the top was giving him a problem he would have said so.
And yes I am a “technical wizard”, I’m also practical. That’s where the towels came in. I hate it when people over engineer something for no explainable reason. Remember, “Form follows function”.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
"Gogi, you have an MR2 T-TOP? tell me about it. What year is it, how many miles, what color,..etc,,etc..how much you want for it. even better, post some pictures!"
Mack--don't you remember, I sent you some jpegs about a month or two ago, but am happy to send some again. It's black, has 60K on the odometer and runs like a top. You're almost as bad as my wife!
Fezo--the 91-95 MR2s have a decent size trunk behind the engine. You can easily get a couple of reasonable size suitcases--I've even gotten my 90mm refractor with equatorial mount, tripod and accessories suitcase in as well as a soft bag or two. There's also a small space in front of the spare tire and a small lock box behind the seats. The mark II generation also came with bags to hold the t-tops either behind the seat or in the trunk.
I've never been a fan of the last generation because it has no trunk (because of the convertible top). I looked at an 05 on the lot of our local Toyota dealership a month or so ago, but it just didn't do it for me.
When we bought our house a couple of years ago my wife insisted on the quartz counter tops in the Kitchen. I was stunned by the cost, but, you know--and I whisper this lest my wife hear--they really are nice--and easy to maintain. From everything I've read, the manufactured quartz is a bit more resilient than natural granite--even though quartz is a significant part of granite.
Alright everyone.... and this is directed at just you Venture and I mean no direspect but....
I usually buy a new car about every year and a half. I have never signed anything saying I didn't want a product the dealer was trying to sell me.
I don't know where you get the idea that a car can't be bought if the paper isn't signed. I have two cars in my garage right now that I bought in the last three years and never signed a thing like that.
Maybe they wrote "customer refused to sign" or something, but take my word for it - I did not sign such a thing.
It just doesn't make sense from the consumer point of view.
You guys are around that stuff every day and I suppose it makes perfect sense to you, but in the real world it just doesn't.
"You guys are around that stuff every day and I suppose it makes perfect sense to you, but in the real world it just doesn't. "
You got a point there Venture. Being in the car biz is a whole different culture. If you listen carefully to two sales persons talking about a deal that just went sour or someone they clubbed like a baby seal, etc,,etc,,you will find it hard to understand what on earth they are talking about.
I posted some of the words used a while back. Some of my fellow posters in the biz added a few of their own.
That's the car being tested in Germany at the Neurenberg (sp) testing grounds. The concept was shown at the Detroit auto show in January. This is much better IMHO. Still has some of the lines of the concept but it is more refined. It will be a hybrid with a 3.5L V6 and the Hybrid Synergy Drive system. Pretty much the same power train that's in the Lexus GS 400H. It's said to do 0-60 in less than 5 seconds and will be priced around the Nissan GT-R.
I'm glad that you like the quartz. The granite was going to be around $5,000, but the quartz will be around $3,800. We have much counter space including a large island. I was surprised that some granite owners had a problem with food poisoning. Evidently, you have to clean well after putting food on the counters. Also, the quartz is more resistant to wine, olive oil, cranberry juice, etc. It's the percentage of polyester in the quartz. I've done a great deal of reading and talking with dealers. Something else interesting that I saw---black concrete counter tops. A friend of ours in Charlotte decided on the concrete. It looks really good. I've also seen the stainless counter tops. They say that every fingerprint shows. There are just so many choices.
To stay on topic: I wonder if granite or quartz would look nice on the dash boards of cars? :P
What Oby should mention that he lives in Hawaii so theres only so many dealers there and the lowball, ADM, and killer dealer add on fees are a way of life!
I test drove a vehicle I'm interested in at a local dealership, and then gathered quotes on the same vehicle from other dealers via the web. A couple of the internet prices were just below invoice, and the local dealership agreed to match their price. That's great for me as a buyer. But what about the salesman? Does he typically make any money on a deal like this?
I want to get a good price on the new vehicle, but I don't like the idea of the guy who invested a fair amount of his time (test drives, demoing features, talking about available packages, etc.) to end up with the sale, but no money in his pocket.
If this has been asked before, I apologize. I'm new to this discussion and didn't see anything mentioned.
This was brought up recently. I think some people mentioned that salesperson would get a mini (varies by store, but it's between $100~$250 I think?). The buyer who posted said that they gave the salesperson a gift card or something like that.
A sale at or below invoice would contribute to the salespersons monthy bonus quota and increase his tax liability. A couple of Benjamin Franklins passed to him as you leave should more than compensate him for his time. That is assuming you don't send him a 1099 at years end.
I want to get a good price on the new vehicle, but I don't like the idea of the guy who invested a fair amount of his time (test drives, demoing features, talking about available packages, etc.) to end up with the sale, but no money in his pocket.
If you're that concerned the salesman make money on the deal, why not just pay asking price?
Most of the guys here make six figures, that's not including the penny column either. And I've yet to be approached to donate money to the used car salesman charity fund. So, get your best deal and don't worry about it.
gogiboy and richard: due to fact my wife is getting ready to look into granite countertops....I checked out the "quartz tops" also. Did you know that you CANNOT put hot pans on the quartz without useing hot pads? The granite you can plop a hot frying pan on with no effect.
A couple of the internet prices were just below invoice, and the local dealership agreed to match their price.
I want to get a good price on the new vehicle, but I don't like the idea of the guy who invested a fair amount of his time (test drives, demoing features, talking about available packages, etc.) to end up with the sale, but no money in his pocket.
This can be looked at a several ways. You either slip the salesman a bill or two, a gift card to a restaurant/department store or you keep your savings.
I’m just curious if the dealer that spent time with you gave you a price while you were there. If they did and it was high enough that you weren’t willing to buy at that price and chose to shop around, why do you feel guilty about having that dealer match someone else’s price? If you had taken his price do you think he would have been concerned about you paying more than you should have?
I know this seems callus but it’s the way this business is run. We’ve been told here that a salesman’s job is to maximize profits for his store and to feed their families. The saying was, “if you don’t ask you don’t get”. It looks like you asked and you got.
If you feel you got too much there is no law that says you can’t give some of it back. But like I said, would it work the other way around?
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
"A sale at or below invoice would contribute to the sales persons monthly bonus quota and increase his tax liability. A couple of Benjamin Franklins passed to him as you leave should more than compensate him for his time. That is assuming you don't send him a 1099 at years end."
As far as I can tell, it would only increase his tax liability to the extent that it increased his income. How is that a bad thing? :confuse:
Your comment regarding the "Benjamins" and 1099s makes me think that you are implying that car sales persons would engage in tax fraud. Are we contributing to the negative stereotyping that the pros here complain so bitterly about? :surprise:
"...Does he typically make any money on a deal like this?..."
Didn't you know? Nobody makes any money on car deals today. Didn't you ever have a salesperson tell you "and at that price I'm not making a penny on the deal"? He's telling the truth. You see, car dealerships are kind of like charity organizations these days. They are happy to lose money all day long just to make your life better.
Nothing gives a car dealer more pleasure than to see you leave his lot in a car that he had to chip in a few hundred out of his own pocket for. It's sort of like missionary work, he gets his reward in heaven...I think it's a four pounder.
So don't bother to slip a salesman any money, he'll just give it away to make the next customer happy.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Comments
Richard
Richard
LOL!!! You can't even keep this bunch on topic! :P
Richard
LOL!!! And this is a man who uses towels over floor mats! :P
Richard
U.S. News has paid staff who will do that for him. Still, if he wants to negotiate a price with me--- :P
Richard
It might not be so much about the mop and glo. I think from what Joel said it was more about service contracts. "I wouldn't have this huge repair bill if I had a service contract. I want the dealership to pay this bill because I wasn't offered this contract."
I don't understand the people who are so worked up about this. Clearly they have either never rented a car or they have always bought ALL the insurance offered to them. You can't rent a car without a) buying the extra insurance or b) indicating that you decline it.
Mack
He did balk and to hear him tell it, quite a bit but to no avail. He didn’t like it one bit when they gave him the excuse about it being missed but he’d have to pay for tires anyway. :mad: That’s why, as I said in my post, he went so far as to have the GM at the Toyota store sign the turn in report stating that only tires where needed when he was turning it in at the end of the lease when he was given this news about needing tires.
Ask your brother if he is having any problems getting the automatic top up and down.
Coincidentally, I spoke with him last night and since I mentioned yesterday that he was happy with the car, I asked him how the car was doing for them and he said “great”. I have to assume that if the top was giving him a problem he would have said so.
And yes I am a “technical wizard”, I’m also practical. That’s where the towels came in. I hate it when people over engineer something for no explainable reason. Remember, “Form follows function”.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Nice to meet you.
even better, post some pictures!"
Mack--don't you remember, I sent you some jpegs about a month or two ago, but am happy to send some again. It's black, has 60K on the odometer and runs like a top. You're almost as bad as my wife!
Fezo--the 91-95 MR2s have a decent size trunk behind the engine. You can easily get a couple of reasonable size suitcases--I've even gotten my 90mm refractor with equatorial mount, tripod and accessories suitcase in as well as a soft bag or two. There's also a small space in front of the spare tire and a small lock box behind the seats. The mark II generation also came with bags to hold the t-tops either behind the seat or in the trunk.
I've never been a fan of the last generation because it has no trunk (because of the convertible top). I looked at an 05 on the lot of our local Toyota dealership a month or so ago, but it just didn't do it for me.
Gogiboy
:confuse: :sick:
"Well your honor, I "sensed" he didn't want it
LOL. I'd pay to see something like that.
the way of the Jedi yoda
When we bought our house a couple of years ago my wife insisted on the quartz counter tops in the Kitchen. I was stunned by the cost, but, you know--and I whisper this lest my wife hear--they really are nice--and easy to maintain. From everything I've read, the manufactured quartz is a bit more resilient than natural granite--even though quartz is a significant part of granite.
Gogiboy
I actually use the "Nautica" crewneck undershirt as my seat covers.
They are pretty cool. The Weathertecs fit like a glove. I put them on day one and haven't taken them out.
:shades: :sick: :P
Duh....they quote and then refuse to honor their own quote????
Mack
:shades:
P.S. top secret for your eyes only! The new Toyota Supra!
I usually buy a new car about every year and a half. I have never signed anything saying I didn't want a product the dealer was trying to sell me.
I don't know where you get the idea that a car can't be bought if the paper isn't signed. I have two cars in my garage right now that I bought in the last three years and never signed a thing like that.
Maybe they wrote "customer refused to sign" or something, but take my word for it - I did not sign such a thing.
It just doesn't make sense from the consumer point of view.
You guys are around that stuff every day and I suppose it makes perfect sense to you, but in the real world it just doesn't.
I'm done with this until the next time.
2025 Forester Limited, 2024 Subaru Legacy Sport
Is that the actual production car or a concept?
I'm just about ready for a new car. If it's the real thing, maybe I'll make a trip to VA Beach.
EDIT: After nosing around a little it looks like it's a 2010 model??
2025 Forester Limited, 2024 Subaru Legacy Sport
You got a point there Venture. Being in the car biz is a whole different culture. If you listen carefully to two sales persons talking about a deal that just went sour or someone they clubbed like a baby seal, etc,,etc,,you will find it hard to understand what on earth they are talking about.
I posted some of the words used a while back. Some of my fellow posters in the biz added a few of their own.
Mack
Here's another look:
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
To stay on topic: I wonder if granite or quartz would look nice on the dash boards of cars? :P
Richard
LOL!!! That is priceless!
Richard
Richard
What Oby should mention that he lives in Hawaii so theres only
so many dealers there and the lowball, ADM, and killer dealer add on
fees are a way of life!
Not so fast. Mack is gonna make you sign a Refusal Form for that beauty and the ADM will kill ya. :shades:
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I test drove a vehicle I'm interested in at a local dealership, and then gathered quotes on the same vehicle from other dealers via the web. A couple of the internet prices were just below invoice, and the local dealership agreed to match their price. That's great for me as a buyer. But what about the salesman? Does he typically make any money on a deal like this?
I want to get a good price on the new vehicle, but I don't like the idea of the guy who invested a fair amount of his time (test drives, demoing features, talking about available packages, etc.) to end up with the sale, but no money in his pocket.
If this has been asked before, I apologize. I'm new to this discussion and didn't see anything mentioned.
The average is $100.... You can get $250 as a mini at high line store.
GP
huh what where you can? Don't mind me just complaining.
Our minis are 150 but a couple of years back they were only 75 dollars.
If you're that concerned the salesman make money on the deal, why not just pay asking price?
Most of the guys here make six figures, that's not including the penny column either. And I've yet to be approached to donate money to the used car salesman charity fund. So, get your best deal and don't worry about it.
I want to get a good price on the new vehicle, but I don't like the idea of the guy who invested a fair amount of his time (test drives, demoing features, talking about available packages, etc.) to end up with the sale, but no money in his pocket.
This can be looked at a several ways. You either slip the salesman a bill or two, a gift card to a restaurant/department store or you keep your savings.
I’m just curious if the dealer that spent time with you gave you a price while you were there. If they did and it was high enough that you weren’t willing to buy at that price and chose to shop around, why do you feel guilty about having that dealer match someone else’s price? If you had taken his price do you think he would have been concerned about you paying more than you should have?
I know this seems callus but it’s the way this business is run. We’ve been told here that a salesman’s job is to maximize profits for his store and to feed their families. The saying was, “if you don’t ask you don’t get”. It looks like you asked and you got.
If you feel you got too much there is no law that says you can’t give some of it back. But like I said, would it work the other way around?
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
enemas or enemies?????
PS I know it's wrong to club a baby seal, but each time you guys use that phrase, it just cracks me up.
As far as I can tell, it would only increase his tax liability to the extent that it increased his income. How is that a bad thing? :confuse:
Your comment regarding the "Benjamins" and 1099s makes me think that you are implying that car sales persons would engage in tax fraud. Are we contributing to the negative stereotyping that the pros here complain so bitterly about? :surprise:
james :shades:
Didn't you know? Nobody makes any money on car deals today. Didn't you ever have a salesperson tell you "and at that price I'm not making a penny on the deal"?
He's telling the truth. You see, car dealerships are kind of like charity organizations these days. They are happy to lose money all day long just to make your life better.
Nothing gives a car dealer more pleasure than to see you leave his lot in a car that he had to chip in a few hundred out of his own pocket for. It's sort of like missionary work, he gets his reward in heaven...I think it's a four pounder.
So don't bother to slip a salesman any money, he'll just give it away to make the next customer happy.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible