Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

henryn

We all like doing things that we are good at. Some people are math whiz's, some are great cooks, and then there are those who are naturals at negotiating a car purchase.

Nothing wrong with that.

28firefighter

I definitely enjoy the chase. 

xwesx

breld said:

This gives me pangs of remorse.

Live and learn.






Well, live, anyway!

qbrozen

breld said:

By the way, wife and I went out browsing on the 4th. She likes to audition replacements for the Polestar, though she's finding that to get the same balance of performance, luxury and character is going to cost a lot. She drove a Jaguar F-Pace and a Golf R that day. For the Jaguar, she started with a nice looking R-sport model, but it had the base 4 cylinder. Power wasn't bad, but it was real jerky in the power delivery. She then took out the "S" model, which solved all that, but obviously at a much higher price point. She really liked the Golf R (it was a new 2018 with a manual). But not so much that she'd want to replace the Polestar with it at this point. Maybe when/if she decides she really had to have a manual again.

So now you are replcing the volvo already, too? Yet she loves the balance of everything it offers and the dealership experience. So are y'all just not happy with being happy?

stickguy

well, when you find the perfect car, you need to sell it. That way you can always regret it, and have to keep buying new ones, trying to replicate the experience.

I think that is how it works!

ab348

breld said:

You know, you'd think buying a car would have some satiating effect, but after buying that Prius last week, I just can't get enough and am craving another transaction. No doubt you all can relate.

Actually, no, we can't.

tommister2

I get you @breld, after years of buying and selling (not quite at your pace but certainly above average) I’m kind of burned out. I sold our Pilot and Tundra figuring I would find a replacement but nothing is really catching my eye yet. Feel like I need something but not finding what I want. 

roadburner

Some of you know that my wife is thinking of getting a two door Wrangler or a Renegade Trailhawk to replace the i3, so I stopped by a Jeep dealer yesterday to check on wait times for an ordered vehicle(that's the only way to get a decently optioned two door Wrangler JL- ditto for a Renegade without a $900 hole in the rood we will never use). Anyway, the wait time for a Wrangler is 8-12 weeks, while the Renegade time is six months.
The sales person explained the long wait was due to it coming from Europe(Italy), but that is just insane. When I worked at BMW we could order one of the trucks built in SC and it would be at our center in 2-3 weeks. European cars took maybe 90 days, tops.

breld

suydam said:

@breid — I’m beginning to wonder if it isn’t the cars, but the process of buying them you like so much.

Oh yes.  This is 100% true.

breld

qbrozen said:

breld said:

By the way, wife and I went out browsing on the 4th. She likes to audition replacements for the Polestar, though she's finding that to get the same balance of performance, luxury and character is going to cost a lot. She drove a Jaguar F-Pace and a Golf R that day. For the Jaguar, she started with a nice looking R-sport model, but it had the base 4 cylinder. Power wasn't bad, but it was real jerky in the power delivery. She then took out the "S" model, which solved all that, but obviously at a much higher price point. She really liked the Golf R (it was a new 2018 with a manual). But not so much that she'd want to replace the Polestar with it at this point. Maybe when/if she decides she really had to have a manual again.

So now you are replcing the volvo already, too? Yet she loves the balance of everything it offers and the dealership experience. So are y'all just not happy with being happy?

Well, no.  We like having a purpose when we look, so she likes to think ahead of the future replacement. Fortunately, she hasn’t been moved by anything nearly enough to consider giving up the Polestar, but it’s a slippery slope for sure.  

That F-pace did little for her.  But she has interest in the Macon and SQ5, which would actually be suitable replacements for her car I’d say.  At least whenever the economics make sense.  

Mr_Shiftright

stickguy said:

I had a few cars in the past where I spent way too much time at the service department (hint: if you walk in and all the mechanics know you, you are there too often! That was the Plymouth dealer when we had a Voyager). I just have no tolerance for that any longer. So try to pick cars where it is not likely to happen but if I get one that does have recurring issues, not likely it will be around long!

Of if you walk in and there's a coffee cup in the break room with your name on it.

breld

stickguy said:

well, when you find the perfect car, you need to sell it. That way you can always regret it, and have to keep buying new ones, trying to replicate the experience. I think that is how it works!

That’s strangely true too.  Though the regret sometimes is greater than I wish it were.  

breld

roadburner said:

Some of you know that my wife is thinking of getting a two door Wrangler or a Renegade Trailhawk to replace the i3, so today I stopped by a Jeep dealer yesterday to check on wait times for an ordered vehicle(that's the only way to get a decently optioned two door Wrangler JL- ditto for a Renegade without a $900 hole in the rood we will never use). Anyway, the wait time for a Wrangler is 8-12 weeks, while the Renegade time is six months. The sales person explained the long wait was due to it coming from Europe(Italy), but that is just insane. When I worked at BMW we could order one of the trucks built in SC and it would be at our center in 2-3 weeks. European cars took maybe 90 days, tops.

6 months for a Renegade?  Wow!  

pensfan83

Going to look at a 91 Prelude Si 4WS today. 195K, but motor rebuilt within last 4 years, repainted as well.

Found it on Ebay coincidentally but its local. 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/302795577782

stickguy

nice looking Prelude. if the rebuild was done right, should have lots of life left. Interior looks great.

stickguy

so, getting a serious itch to flip my car since not intending the princess to take it over. Still should have enough trade value to have it make sense.

she has been using it too this week since we returned the jetta. She commented on something that bugs me. The base stereo is way too weak. If you are driving with windows open at speed, even with volume all the way up can barely hear it. I'm sure for enough money can upgrade power and speakers, but that seems to be a waste of resources.

we shall see. will really depend on if I stumble upon a cheap used car I love, or more likely, a more "dream" car pops up with a killer lease. Right now, a TLX or S60 would fit the bill. Though I am seriously considering some sort of small CUV instead, for a bit more comfort and sidewall to deal with our craptastic roads. Would make the wife happy too. Just need one that has some entertainment value.

stickguy

I need to make a list of options. Probably would never sell it to buy something else (odds of finding a cheap old car I want, are not good). So that leaves leasing something I do want.

so, what could possibly work, trying to keep in the $300/month range (maybe up to $325)?

Could be happy with a CX5. Would love a V60 (never hit the price target). An S60 or TLX would be nice.

not thinking a GLA or QX30 would hit the $ bogie. Or an X1.

Probably sticking with sedans would make the payment a whole lot cheaper.

qbrozen

Keeping an eye on the leasehacker forums has been entertaining. You may want to pay a visit and see what catches your eye.

benjaminh

stickguy said:

I need to make a list of options. Probably would never sell it to buy something else (odds of finding a cheap old car I want, are not good). So that leaves leasing something I do want.

so, what could possibly work, trying to keep in the $300/month range (maybe up to $325)?

Could be happy with a CX5. Would love a V60 (never hit the price target). An S60 or TLX would be nice.

not thinking a GLA or QX30 would hit the $ bogie. Or an X1.

Probably sticking with sedans would make the payment a whole lot cheaper.

A little over budget, but what about this San Marino Red 2018 TLX 3.5 with Tech Pkg? If you skip the Tech Pkg you can still get the 3.5 V-6 and then you are probably right in budget. The "base" stereo on the Acura TLX will still be miles beyond a base Elantra set up, but you do need the Tech to get the ELS. The trick is the 2018s are running out at some dealers, and apparently some dealers are already out of them? If you want to be slightly under budget and get higher mpg, maybe a 2.4 TLX could be considered? The 2.4 has enough power for me. But for the true feeling of a sports sedan perhaps the 3.5 is the ticket.

https://www.eliteacura.com/inventory/new-2018-acura-tlx-3-5-v-6-9-at-p-aws-with-technology-package-front-wheel-drive-sedan-19uub2f52ja006521

qbrozen

Kyfdx provided these numbers for a Challenger R/T Plus:
.00004 MF and 64% residual for 24/12
.00007 MF and 57% residual for 36/12
$3000 incentive

you sure you need a sedan?

nyccarguy

qbrozen said:

Kyfdx provided these numbers for a Challenger R/T Plus:
.00004 MF and 64% residual for 24/12
.00007 MF and 57% residual for 36/12
$3000 incentive

you sure you need a sedan?

Friends of mine are in town for a couple of days.  They flew into Westchester County Airport.  My friend reserved a Toyota Corolla.  Got to the counter & the guy asked them if it was just the 2 of them traveling together.  Yes.  Do you mind driving a 2 Door?  No.  They got a band spankin new Challenger R/T.  

Michaell

@breld, @jpp5862 and I met up for lunch, then took a test drive of a CPO TLX. Full report later, when I get home and can use all 10 fingers to type. 

corvette

The Mustang has developed a buzzing sound at highway speeds. It sounds like a trim piece near the windshield is loose and getting hit by the wind and vibrating, but I can't for the life of me find anything off kilter. It's super annoying but I'm not going to plan a service visit until I'm sure it's happening consistently so it can be reproduced.

benjaminh

@stickguy : Would you consider a Cadillac ATS? I'm sure you already knew this, but if you find a BMW CPO 3-series that you like BMW will finance it at 1.9% for up to 5 years, making the payments on a c. 20k car similar to a lease at c.$350 a month.

http://cpo.bmwusa.com/financing-and-special-offers/

I saw a BMW dealer with an ad for a brand new BMW 3 series with a list price of c. $42k that they were leasing for $299 + TTL, but the drive off was c. 4k + I think.

breld

I'll confess I made an attempt, albeit perhaps an overly aggressive one, this morning to swap the Discovery for a nice Q7.

CPO 2018 Q7 3.0T Prestige, well equipped with the driver assistance and, a rarity, the adaptive suspension/4WS. Ink Blue over gray interior.

Here was my thinking - if I had chosen it to begin with, such a Q7 would have cost me another $2-3k over my Discovery. So I offered my car plus $5k, figuring $2-3k is my penalty (trade vs retail) for swapping. That's also consistent with the auction values Q provided - this high level Q7 is probably worth another $2-3k over mine, so mine plus $5k provides a relatively slim profit.

No go, which is what I expected. But I was surprised they came down to a $7k difference and let me walk when I stood by my $5k offer.

If I was desperate for the change, I would consider it more. But getting back in the Discovery is hardly a penalty. The sportier and more responsive drive of the Q7 would be appealing for sure, and the additional features on this Prestige model, like head-up display and cooled seats, would be nice. But there's a lot to like about the Discovery too - and the options for such a swap won't be going away.

breld

I did realize how much I like the current Audi models as I walked their showroom though. They had a blue A5 Sportback that I found very appealing. Of course an S5 would be preferable, but the A5 is no slouch and comes with a nice cost savings. Don't think the thought didn't cross my mind that I could give up the higher seating and third row and walk out with that A5 and several thousand in my pocket.

28firefighter

@qbrozen - it’s addicting, isn’t it?  It’s not the place to have your hand held, but, tons of good information and really experienced folks. 

Of course, @kyfdx and @michaell are famous over there. 

stickguy

qbrozen said:

Keeping an eye on the leasehacker forums has been entertaining. You may want to pay a visit and see what catches your eye.

is that the name of it? If so will do.

Let me know what you see. I am pretty flexible about getting something.

stickguy

so, just skimmed the forums. Could be bad that I did that. First 2 I saw were an S90 for $292/mo + tax, and an A4 for $326 inc tax. Both 0 down. Hmmm.

if i make a move, don't think I am buying something expensive. But I would happily lease an ATS. I like them.

Benjamin, I almost stopped at that dealer today to scope out an RDX with wife and daughter, but did not end up pulling in. But I won't get a TLX or RDX without the Tech package. Has stuff that I don't want to give up if spending a lot of money.

stickguy

and if it was really cheap (a swap lease probably makes more sense) I could go nuts and get a PU. Probably regret it soon after, hence the swap lease idea!

benjaminh

stickguy said:

so, just skimmed the forums. Could be bad that I did that. First 2 I saw were an S90 for $292/mo + tax, and an A4 for $326 inc tax. Both 0 down. Hmmm.

if i make a move, don't think I am buying something expensive. But I would happily lease an ATS. I like them.

Benjamin, I almost stopped at that dealer today to scope out an RDX with wife and daughter, but did not end up pulling in. But I won't get a TLX or RDX without the Tech package. Has stuff that I don't want to give up if spending a lot of money.

A Volvo S90 for 292/month with 0 down?? That sounds like a steal. What's the catch?

Yes, I agree the Acura Tech Pkg has some nice and essential stuff. Blind spot monitoring in the TLX is better than the BLIS in my wife's CRV, because with the TLX the indicators are inside the cabin and easier to see than the mirror set up imho.

If my experience is an indication, once you're at the Acura dealer with your Elantra and title and show a genuine interest in a TLX, but just say you can't afford a payment of above 290, or whatever, they will probably do almost whatever it takes to get you into that car. But you need to be willing to walk away, of course, which seems like something you're able to do if the deal isn't right.

28firefighter

Deal is no longer available. First rule of leasehackr is read through entire threads. 

Those S90 deals required high incentive regions, A-Plan, and a 10% dealer discount. Volvo no longer allows dealers to offer anything more than 6% off when combined with A-Plan. For now, S90s are mid to high 400s++. 

laurasdada

I've had good service experience at both Jag/LR dealers I've dealt with. I predominantly use the family owned dealership all of a mile away from my castle (Swamp Castle...). The SA I've dealt with (recently promoted to manger of the loaner fleet) always mentioned he would have no problem buying/recommending a Jag, but not a LR. Much more shop time, he noted.

I'm not sure why I find it somewhat discouraging that when folks are shopping Jag, they are shopping F-Pace (and maybe now E-Pace and soon I-Pace). I fully understand the automotive demographic of the past several years, but SUV/CUV still just don't float my boat.... Although, and somebody stop me, I have been considering checking out the E and maybe F-Pace. Only because if I want to stay with Jag, and my XF experience gives me no hesitation to do so, I'm just not sure there's a Jag sedan for me. Of course, an F-Type would be just far out, but as at this time in my life, I should(?!) only own one car, a two seat sportster likely ain't the answer. Wow, am I old.

My contrarian nature, however, does have me window shopping Giulia's. I've survived now seven years on her majesty's automotive service (2.5 years of XK, 4.5 years of XF), how much more of a chance would a spicy Italian mistress be? And, contrarian again, the Audi A/S5 are high on my list, but the coupe. Contrarian in that the 5 door hatch seems to be the new preferred setup.

But, the spirit just isn't moving me to abandon my not an Aston Martin yet. It's still shiny, full of wood, leather and aluminium as well just having a lovely GT way about it.

I am a chronic car not buying embarrassment.

breld

tifighter said:

breld said:

What a shame. It is amazing how a poor dealer/service experience will ruin your overall satisfaction. What issues have you had with the Discovery and service dept?

Also, have you given them a bad review when Land Rover corporate calls for the satisfaction survey? I have found that sometimes works as a wake up call.

I have yet to receive any such call, which is surprising, since it seems I always get those with other brands.

It does make me believe Land Rover has a certain attitude that they offer a unique product with little direct competition (which isn't really true given the real-world use of the vehicles), and thus don't have to focus as much on customer satisfaction. That may or may not be true, but that's the feeling I get.

Bummer. I may have built a Td6 HSE Luxury with the capability package that adds the rear e-locker on the LRwebsite. Just for fun.

I got a ride on an off-road course with a similar spec Disco at our local NW Overland Rally last weekend. It was impressive.

I should know better then to flirt with a LR   

Well, I'm sure there are some good LR dealerships and that would certainly make a difference in the overall buying/ownership experience for sure. So I wouldn't discourage you from the Discovery, especially since you would take advantage of its off-road capabilities, which are unique within the class.

In the Denver metro area there are only two dealerships, and I haven't been terribly impressed with either.

benjaminh

@stickguy ....Elite Acura apparently has only one 2018 TLX 2.4 Tech left, in the Fathom Blue Pearl with an ebony interior. That might be a good deal if it's a combo that works for you.

Mr_Shiftright

Maybe here's another way to consider what car to buy?

Ten Most and Least Stolen Vehicles

I wish someone would steal my Mini so they could tell me how they got it started. But alas, looks like I"m safe.

stickguy

benjaminh said:

@stickguy ....Elite Acura apparently has only one 2018 TLX 2.4 Tech left, in the Fathom Blue Pearl with an ebony interior. That might be a good deal if it's a combo that works for you.

fathom blue is probably OK. Not sure if too light in person. And I really hope to avoid a black interior next time. But, sometimes, beggars can't be choosers!

corvette

Mr_Shiftright said:

Maybe here's another way to consider what car to buy?

Ten Most and Least Stolen Vehicles

I wish someone would steal my Mini so they could tell me how they got it started. But alas, looks like I"m safe.

Yeah, let's all get Mercury Mariners, Saturn Vues, and Chevy Aveos, so they won't get stolen.

Mr_Shiftright

No, I meant use that list to pretty much avoid the cars that even a lowlife thief doesn't want.

stickguy

I think this is nice. I know it does not get much love around here, but if the dealer wanted to lease a demo say really cheap, I would not kick it out of bed. Plus I think the wife would love it!

http://www.eimports4less.com/detail-2018-mercedes~benz-gla-certified_gla250_4matic_awd_blind_spot_pano_camera_nav-used-17581582.html

stickguy

Interesting. My local dealer has basically the exact car I would want (in new inventory). I might be swinging by early next week to see if I like driving one of these.

https://www.cherryhillmercedesbenz.com/inventory/new-2018-mercedes-benz-gla-gla-250-awd-4matic®-suv-wdctg4gb8jj529788

Oh wait. Scratch this. Just realized, even at $40K, it does not have a moonroof apparently. So that would be a deal breaker. Might go check it out anyway!

28firefighter

stickguy said:

Interesting. My local dealer has basically the exact car I would want (in new inventory). I might be swinging by early next week to see if I like driving one of these. https://www.cherryhillmercedesbenz.com/inventory/new-2018-mercedes-benz-gla-gla-250-awd-4matic®-suv-wdctg4gb8jj529788 Oh wait. Scratch this. Just realized, even at $40K, it does not have a moonroof apparently. So that would be a deal breaker. Might go check it out anyway!

Worth a drive but my FIL had one as a rental after his accident recently. Said it was absolutely terrible. 

stickguy

now you got me curious. Probably has a lot to do with what you are used to.

stickguy

I know this is the putt putt engine version, but this seems like a reasonable price for what you get.

https://www.subaruofcherryhill.com/used/INFINITI/2011-INFINITI-G25+Sedan-cherry-hill-nj-6e63f0f60a0e0adf0f6c077071bbf5d2.htm?searchDepth=11:35

corvette

Seems reasonably priced. A 2011 anything is unlikely to have modern infotainment.

tjc78

stickguy said:

so, just skimmed the forums. Could be bad that I did that. First 2 I saw were an S90 for $292/mo + tax, and an A4 for $326 inc tax. Both 0 down. Hmmm. if i make a move, don't think I am buying something expensive. But I would happily lease an ATS. I like them. Benjamin, I almost stopped at that dealer today to scope out an RDX with wife and daughter, but did not end up pulling in. But I won't get a TLX or RDX without the Tech package. Has stuff that I don't want to give up if spending a lot of money.

You would hate an S90, it’s a big car.  

stickguy

I would probably complain about it. But the wife would love it! Darned nice car though.

and of course, I am cheap.

But yes, an S60 is more my size.

benjaminh

stickguy said:

I think this is nice. I know it does not get much love around here, but if the dealer wanted to lease a demo say really cheap, I would not kick it out of bed. Plus I think the wife would love it!

http://www.eimports4less.com/detail-2018-mercedes~benz-gla-certified_gla250_4matic_awd_blind_spot_pano_camera_nav-used-17581582.html

But you already have an SUV. Do you need two? Imho a sports sedan for twisty roads would be more fun. I'm looking forward to experiencing more of my all wheel steering on roads like that.

corvette

benjaminh said:

I think this is nice. I know it does not get much love around here, but if the dealer wanted to lease a demo say really cheap, I would not kick it out of bed. Plus I think the wife would love it! http://www.eimports4less.com/detail-2018-mercedes~benz-gla-certified_gla250_4matic_awd_blind_spot_pano_camera_nav-used-17581582.html

But you already have an SUV. Do you need two? Imho a sports sedan for twisty roads would be more fun. I'm looking forward to experiencing more of my all wheel steering on roads like that.

Don’t do it! You don’t need a Mercedes Rogue. 

stickguy

I have a sports sedan now. a mini hatch (can't really call it an "suv") would be just fine as long as it has enough oomph, and respectable handling. I don't get on fun to drive twisty back roads very often.

If I did get something that could serve as the primary car, it would likely replace the RDX eventually.